Cliquey parents

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I have been totally surprised to see how competitive BOY moms are. I was expecting the girl moms to be difficult but they’re all very chill. The boy moms are terrible.

It's not a boy mom or girl mom thing, I promise. It's just a person by person thing.

I have found that something that really helps reduce competition among parents is when your kids are different. So for example, I have an artsy DD who is into reading, writing, and dance. The mom I am closest to has a boy who is sporty and more STEM focused. Our kids actually get along pretty well, but they don't do any activities together and I don't think really even interact at school at all (there's a lot of segregation of boys and girls at this point). But our families feel super comfortable hanging out, and I think it's because there's not really much comparison, either between the kids or the adults. This is the only mom I feel comfortable telling when my kid is struggling or having issues at school, because I know there won't be any judgment, just empathy. And I do the same for her.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Im the mom of one boy who had social struggles in early elementary and wasn’t super athletic. I was friendly with some other moms but in general I was taken aback and how cliquish the moms of kids in his grade seemed to be, and felt sort of left out of many things. Then in rolled my second kid with his easy confidence and his superior athleticism and the moms of kids in HIS grade were so surprisingly friendly! We were invited to everything! Everyone was so welcoming! I was added to so many group chats!

I knew better though. If my second kid had been my first kid I would have thought our school was just so welcoming and nice and then I’d have been devastated when my second kid rolled in and we were shut out of stuff in his grade. I also know those moms will drop me as soon as my kid decides he actually doesn’t want to do travel soccer anymore he wants to do the chess club. So I stay above the drama. I recommend it

This. I went through this with just one kid. She was the "weird", small, awkward kid who was bad at sports and really limited social skills until 4th grade. She struggled to make friends and the other moms avoided me or talked to me with pity in their voices because they felt bad for us. Then in 4th, DD, who is actually an awesome kid who happened to be socially awkward, started winning every academic award the school offered and the other kids discovered she plays the piano and violin really well. Suddenly the kids liked and respected her and started inviting her to things, and the other moms got much more friendly. But my kid didn't change and neither did I. It's just the way they viewed us changed because they discovered my kid has hidden talents when they'd assumed we were all just losers.

I was never impolite and of course I encouraged my kid to accept those offers of friendship. But I also recognized it all for what it was -- shallow. People tell on themselves every single day.

Why is it shallow? Honest question- if my kids aren’t friends with a kid at school, I don’t invite them to play dates and activities. Just like other families don’t invite my kid to stuff. But then kids change, become friends with different kids, etc. So then I would invite someone to that.

It’s completely obvious how shallow it is. I showed up at a new school, I’m cute and my kid is good looking and the mom cohort acted like I was some kind of celebrity welcoming me. Then at the first basketball practice my son is the worst on the team and burst into tears at one point. (I had no idea the other kids would be so skilled or I wouldn’t have encouraged him to join!) After that they acted like I had leprosy. Three years later they completely ignore me.
My second kid is better socially and I’m on all the group chats and invited to everything.

You need to get over yourself about being welcome like a celebrity.

I’m good looking and so are my kids. We were also welcomed but not like celebrities. Both my boys are very athletic. My one kid does play basketball. My kid improved, made the travel, AAU and high school teams. When I see parents from his elementary basketball team, we say hi and friendly.

They probably don’t like you for some other reason. Being full of yourself might be it.

DP but it seems like you misread the PP. She didn't sound full of herself at all. They go treated "like a celebrity" because they were a new family and physically attractive. But then her son wound up on a basketball team with a group of much more skilled kids, had a horrible practice and cried, and the same parents ignored her and avoided them. Neither of those responses were based on her or her kid's actual value as a person, they were just kind of knee-jerk responses to stimuli. Her point is that both responses are shallow and not to be taken personally.

BTW my kid and I are not objectively that attractive, and some people are welcoming and kind when she starts at a new school or team, but most people are not. They aren't mean, but people don't instantly gravitate to us the way they would to really physically attractive people. But in some ways I think this benefits us in the long run because what happens is that people get to know us over time and then those that choose to befriend us are clearly doing it because of something other than just being photogenic or popular. I think the good looking, athletic, outgoing kids often have a lot of offers for friendships but many are just based on kids wanting to catch some the reflected glory, which is not the best foundation for a friendship. Sometimes it's useful to skate under the radar.

Pp here. My kid is good at basketball but we are not really a basketball family. I find the very talented (very few) are the kindest and more humble. The kids on the periphery are often the jerks. Perhaps they feel threatened. Maybe they need to feel superior. Who knows?

If you are friendly and well liked, more people like you. All my kids are well liked. DH and I are social and have a lot of friends. My kids all have a lot of friends. Our social calendar is very full. I’m sure some people may have given us the could shoulder but we are too busy to notice.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I have been totally surprised to see how competitive BOY moms are. I was expecting the girl moms to be difficult but they’re all very chill. The boy moms are terrible.

It's not a boy mom or girl mom thing, I promise. It's just a person by person thing.

I have found that something that really helps reduce competition among parents is when your kids are different. So for example, I have an artsy DD who is into reading, writing, and dance. The mom I am closest to has a boy who is sporty and more STEM focused. Our kids actually get along pretty well, but they don't do any activities together and I don't think really even interact at school at all (there's a lot of segregation of boys and girls at this point). But our families feel super comfortable hanging out, and I think it's because there's not really much comparison, either between the kids or the adults. This is the only mom I feel comfortable telling when my kid is struggling or having issues at school, because I know there won't be any judgment, just empathy. And I do the same for her.

Random anecdote

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Im the mom of one boy who had social struggles in early elementary and wasn’t super athletic. I was friendly with some other moms but in general I was taken aback and how cliquish the moms of kids in his grade seemed to be, and felt sort of left out of many things. Then in rolled my second kid with his easy confidence and his superior athleticism and the moms of kids in HIS grade were so surprisingly friendly! We were invited to everything! Everyone was so welcoming! I was added to so many group chats!

I knew better though. If my second kid had been my first kid I would have thought our school was just so welcoming and nice and then I’d have been devastated when my second kid rolled in and we were shut out of stuff in his grade. I also know those moms will drop me as soon as my kid decides he actually doesn’t want to do travel soccer anymore he wants to do the chess club. So I stay above the drama. I recommend it

This. I went through this with just one kid. She was the "weird", small, awkward kid who was bad at sports and really limited social skills until 4th grade. She struggled to make friends and the other moms avoided me or talked to me with pity in their voices because they felt bad for us. Then in 4th, DD, who is actually an awesome kid who happened to be socially awkward, started winning every academic award the school offered and the other kids discovered she plays the piano and violin really well. Suddenly the kids liked and respected her and started inviting her to things, and the other moms got much more friendly. But my kid didn't change and neither did I. It's just the way they viewed us changed because they discovered my kid has hidden talents when they'd assumed we were all just losers.

I was never impolite and of course I encouraged my kid to accept those offers of friendship. But I also recognized it all for what it was -- shallow. People tell on themselves every single day.

Why is it shallow? Honest question- if my kids aren’t friends with a kid at school, I don’t invite them to play dates and activities. Just like other families don’t invite my kid to stuff. But then kids change, become friends with different kids, etc. So then I would invite someone to that.

It’s completely obvious how shallow it is. I showed up at a new school, I’m cute and my kid is good looking and the mom cohort acted like I was some kind of celebrity welcoming me. Then at the first basketball practice my son is the worst on the team and burst into tears at one point. (I had no idea the other kids would be so skilled or I wouldn’t have encouraged him to join!) After that they acted like I had leprosy. Three years later they completely ignore me.
My second kid is better socially and I’m on all the group chats and invited to everything.

You need to get over yourself about being welcome like a celebrity.

I’m good looking and so are my kids. We were also welcomed but not like celebrities. Both my boys are very athletic. My one kid does play basketball. My kid improved, made the travel, AAU and high school teams. When I see parents from his elementary basketball team, we say hi and friendly.

They probably don’t like you for some other reason. Being full of yourself might be it.

DP but it seems like you misread the PP. She didn't sound full of herself at all. They go treated "like a celebrity" because they were a new family and physically attractive. But then her son wound up on a basketball team with a group of much more skilled kids, had a horrible practice and cried, and the same parents ignored her and avoided them. Neither of those responses were based on her or her kid's actual value as a person, they were just kind of knee-jerk responses to stimuli. Her point is that both responses are shallow and not to be taken personally.

BTW my kid and I are not objectively that attractive, and some people are welcoming and kind when she starts at a new school or team, but most people are not. They aren't mean, but people don't instantly gravitate to us the way they would to really physically attractive people. But in some ways I think this benefits us in the long run because what happens is that people get to know us over time and then those that choose to befriend us are clearly doing it because of something other than just being photogenic or popular. I think the good looking, athletic, outgoing kids often have a lot of offers for friendships but many are just based on kids wanting to catch some the reflected glory, which is not the best foundation for a friendship. Sometimes it's useful to skate under the radar.

Pp here. My kid is good at basketball but we are not really a basketball family. I find the very talented (very few) are the kindest and more humble. The kids on the periphery are often the jerks. Perhaps they feel threatened. Maybe they need to feel superior. Who knows?

If you are friendly and well liked, more people like you. All my kids are well liked. DH and I are social and have a lot of friends. My kids all have a lot of friends. Our social calendar is very full. I’m sure some people may have given us the could shoulder but we are too busy to notice.

Ok? The point is that the PP was not relishing being treated "like a celebrity." She was acknowledging that sometimes the things that make a kid or family seem desirable to others are shallow or even arbitrary.

I'm so glad your family is so busy and popular and has lots of friends and everyone is so liked. That must be very reassuring for you.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I have been totally surprised to see how competitive BOY moms are. I was expecting the girl moms to be difficult but they’re all very chill. The boy moms are terrible.

It's not a boy mom or girl mom thing, I promise. It's just a person by person thing.

I have found that something that really helps reduce competition among parents is when your kids are different. So for example, I have an artsy DD who is into reading, writing, and dance. The mom I am closest to has a boy who is sporty and more STEM focused. Our kids actually get along pretty well, but they don't do any activities together and I don't think really even interact at school at all (there's a lot of segregation of boys and girls at this point). But our families feel super comfortable hanging out, and I think it's because there's not really much comparison, either between the kids or the adults. This is the only mom I feel comfortable telling when my kid is struggling or having issues at school, because I know there won't be any judgment, just empathy. And I do the same for her.

Random anecdote

Either you have poor reading comprehension or you don't know what "random" means or both.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Im the mom of one boy who had social struggles in early elementary and wasn’t super athletic. I was friendly with some other moms but in general I was taken aback and how cliquish the moms of kids in his grade seemed to be, and felt sort of left out of many things. Then in rolled my second kid with his easy confidence and his superior athleticism and the moms of kids in HIS grade were so surprisingly friendly! We were invited to everything! Everyone was so welcoming! I was added to so many group chats!

I knew better though. If my second kid had been my first kid I would have thought our school was just so welcoming and nice and then I’d have been devastated when my second kid rolled in and we were shut out of stuff in his grade. I also know those moms will drop me as soon as my kid decides he actually doesn’t want to do travel soccer anymore he wants to do the chess club. So I stay above the drama. I recommend it

This. I went through this with just one kid. She was the "weird", small, awkward kid who was bad at sports and really limited social skills until 4th grade. She struggled to make friends and the other moms avoided me or talked to me with pity in their voices because they felt bad for us. Then in 4th, DD, who is actually an awesome kid who happened to be socially awkward, started winning every academic award the school offered and the other kids discovered she plays the piano and violin really well. Suddenly the kids liked and respected her and started inviting her to things, and the other moms got much more friendly. But my kid didn't change and neither did I. It's just the way they viewed us changed because they discovered my kid has hidden talents when they'd assumed we were all just losers.

I was never impolite and of course I encouraged my kid to accept those offers of friendship. But I also recognized it all for what it was -- shallow. People tell on themselves every single day.

Why is it shallow? Honest question- if my kids aren’t friends with a kid at school, I don’t invite them to play dates and activities. Just like other families don’t invite my kid to stuff. But then kids change, become friends with different kids, etc. So then I would invite someone to that.

It’s completely obvious how shallow it is. I showed up at a new school, I’m cute and my kid is good looking and the mom cohort acted like I was some kind of celebrity welcoming me. Then at the first basketball practice my son is the worst on the team and burst into tears at one point. (I had no idea the other kids would be so skilled or I wouldn’t have encouraged him to join!) After that they acted like I had leprosy. Three years later they completely ignore me.
My second kid is better socially and I’m on all the group chats and invited to everything.

You need to get over yourself about being welcome like a celebrity.

I’m good looking and so are my kids. We were also welcomed but not like celebrities. Both my boys are very athletic. My one kid does play basketball. My kid improved, made the travel, AAU and high school teams. When I see parents from his elementary basketball team, we say hi and friendly.

They probably don’t like you for some other reason. Being full of yourself might be it.

DP but it seems like you misread the PP. She didn't sound full of herself at all. They go treated "like a celebrity" because they were a new family and physically attractive. But then her son wound up on a basketball team with a group of much more skilled kids, had a horrible practice and cried, and the same parents ignored her and avoided them. Neither of those responses were based on her or her kid's actual value as a person, they were just kind of knee-jerk responses to stimuli. Her point is that both responses are shallow and not to be taken personally.

BTW my kid and I are not objectively that attractive, and some people are welcoming and kind when she starts at a new school or team, but most people are not. They aren't mean, but people don't instantly gravitate to us the way they would to really physically attractive people. But in some ways I think this benefits us in the long run because what happens is that people get to know us over time and then those that choose to befriend us are clearly doing it because of something other than just being photogenic or popular. I think the good looking, athletic, outgoing kids often have a lot of offers for friendships but many are just based on kids wanting to catch some the reflected glory, which is not the best foundation for a friendship. Sometimes it's useful to skate under the radar.

Pp here. My kid is good at basketball but we are not really a basketball family. I find the very talented (very few) are the kindest and more humble. The kids on the periphery are often the jerks. Perhaps they feel threatened. Maybe they need to feel superior. Who knows?

If you are friendly and well liked, more people like you. All my kids are well liked. DH and I are social and have a lot of friends. My kids all have a lot of friends. Our social calendar is very full. I’m sure some people may have given us the could shoulder but we are too busy to notice.

So which one is your kid?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Im the mom of one boy who had social struggles in early elementary and wasn’t super athletic. I was friendly with some other moms but in general I was taken aback and how cliquish the moms of kids in his grade seemed to be, and felt sort of left out of many things. Then in rolled my second kid with his easy confidence and his superior athleticism and the moms of kids in HIS grade were so surprisingly friendly! We were invited to everything! Everyone was so welcoming! I was added to so many group chats!

I knew better though. If my second kid had been my first kid I would have thought our school was just so welcoming and nice and then I’d have been devastated when my second kid rolled in and we were shut out of stuff in his grade. I also know those moms will drop me as soon as my kid decides he actually doesn’t want to do travel soccer anymore he wants to do the chess club. So I stay above the drama. I recommend it

This. I went through this with just one kid. She was the "weird", small, awkward kid who was bad at sports and really limited social skills until 4th grade. She struggled to make friends and the other moms avoided me or talked to me with pity in their voices because they felt bad for us. Then in 4th, DD, who is actually an awesome kid who happened to be socially awkward, started winning every academic award the school offered and the other kids discovered she plays the piano and violin really well. Suddenly the kids liked and respected her and started inviting her to things, and the other moms got much more friendly. But my kid didn't change and neither did I. It's just the way they viewed us changed because they discovered my kid has hidden talents when they'd assumed we were all just losers.

I was never impolite and of course I encouraged my kid to accept those offers of friendship. But I also recognized it all for what it was -- shallow. People tell on themselves every single day.

Why is it shallow? Honest question- if my kids aren’t friends with a kid at school, I don’t invite them to play dates and activities. Just like other families don’t invite my kid to stuff. But then kids change, become friends with different kids, etc. So then I would invite someone to that.

It’s completely obvious how shallow it is. I showed up at a new school, I’m cute and my kid is good looking and the mom cohort acted like I was some kind of celebrity welcoming me. Then at the first basketball practice my son is the worst on the team and burst into tears at one point. (I had no idea the other kids would be so skilled or I wouldn’t have encouraged him to join!) After that they acted like I had leprosy. Three years later they completely ignore me.
My second kid is better socially and I’m on all the group chats and invited to everything.

You need to get over yourself about being welcome like a celebrity.

I’m good looking and so are my kids. We were also welcomed but not like celebrities. Both my boys are very athletic. My one kid does play basketball. My kid improved, made the travel, AAU and high school teams. When I see parents from his elementary basketball team, we say hi and friendly.

They probably don’t like you for some other reason. Being full of yourself might be it.

DP but it seems like you misread the PP. She didn't sound full of herself at all. They go treated "like a celebrity" because they were a new family and physically attractive. But then her son wound up on a basketball team with a group of much more skilled kids, had a horrible practice and cried, and the same parents ignored her and avoided them. Neither of those responses were based on her or her kid's actual value as a person, they were just kind of knee-jerk responses to stimuli. Her point is that both responses are shallow and not to be taken personally.

BTW my kid and I are not objectively that attractive, and some people are welcoming and kind when she starts at a new school or team, but most people are not. They aren't mean, but people don't instantly gravitate to us the way they would to really physically attractive people. But in some ways I think this benefits us in the long run because what happens is that people get to know us over time and then those that choose to befriend us are clearly doing it because of something other than just being photogenic or popular. I think the good looking, athletic, outgoing kids often have a lot of offers for friendships but many are just based on kids wanting to catch some the reflected glory, which is not the best foundation for a friendship. Sometimes it's useful to skate under the radar.

Pp here. My kid is good at basketball but we are not really a basketball family. I find the very talented (very few) are the kindest and more humble. The kids on the periphery are often the jerks. Perhaps they feel threatened. Maybe they need to feel superior. Who knows?

If you are friendly and well liked, more people like you. All my kids are well liked. DH and I are social and have a lot of friends. My kids all have a lot of friends. Our social calendar is very full. I’m sure some people may have given us the could shoulder but we are too busy to notice.

So which one is your kid?

My kids all excel at the activity they are passionate about. My basketball kid genuinely felt bad for his friends who didn’t make the team in high school. My other kid is also good at his sports. My kids are not D1 college level recruit type kids. They are just HS varsity kids.

[Anonymous]

The only people that notice or think about this are those that want to be in the perceived “cliques” but aren’t, then feel the need to bash others because they feel rejected.

I have three kids and have my own friends whose children go to various other schools. If there are parent cliques at my children’s schools, I’ve never taken notice.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I have been totally surprised to see how competitive BOY moms are. I was expecting the girl moms to be difficult but they’re all very chill. The boy moms are terrible.

This has not been my experience at all. Mean girls usually come from mean moms and we have plenty of them at our school.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:The only people that notice or think about this are those that want to be in the perceived “cliques” but aren’t, then feel the need to bash others because they feel rejected.

I have three kids and have my own friends whose children go to various other schools. If there are parent cliques at my children’s schools, I’ve never taken notice.

What?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:The only people that notice or think about this are those that want to be in the perceived “cliques” but aren’t, then feel the need to bash others because they feel rejected.

I have three kids and have my own friends whose children go to various other schools. If there are parent cliques at my children’s schools, I’ve never taken notice.

This is true with cliques when there aren't kids involved, but in a school community cliques can have negative impacts for kids whose parents aren't in the clique, and that's why people notice.

I have zero interest in being part of the parent clique in my kid's school. It's a group of parents who live in the same part of the neighborhood and are very similar to each other and like doing stuff that I don't like doing, so it's never occurred to me to be jealous of their friendship or wish they would invite me to their gatherings. I wouldn't have fun! They are really into alcohol and sports, and I don't drink and don't play sports. So that's not the issue.

The problem is that my DD became buddies at school with one of their DDs, and me not being a member of that clique is basically killing this friendship. The parents don't want to set up playdates or facilitate the girls getting together outside of school because they only want their kid to socialize with their friend's kids. The few times we've been able to get the girls together, the parents have been kind of weird and acted like they were doing us a favor, which made no sense because we hosted and their daughter was very enthusiastic (she literally runs up to me at school and asks when she can come over next).

I just feel bad for my kid that the first friend she has made organically on her own is never available to hang out and her parents don't seem interested in their DD bing friends with mine at all. My kid has other friends, but this is her closest friend in her grade at school. It's just a shame.

[Anonymous]

^ when parents feel the way you describe they are making the whole school experience about them. It should be hardly at all about them

[Anonymous]

My child was known at school. I wasn't known that well. It felt like it was as it should be. It was such a source of pride when I visited the school. Teachers/Administrators would say, "oh! you're Mary's Mom!"

Other Moms had this experience. The kid would hear, "oh! you're Jane's daughter"

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:^ when parents feel the way you describe they are making the whole school experience about them. It should be hardly at all about them

Thank you, you just perfectly articulated what I don't like about our school's culture. It feels like this is the guiding ethos of the PTA and that adult activities and relationships overshadow what's happening with the kids. There's a lot of emphasis on facilitating social opportunities for adults, even to the point of encouraging professional networking. Even events that seem like they are supposed to be for kids or at least for families often have elements that are very adult-focused, like raffles for adults.

We only have a couple years left at this school so at this point I just try to ignore the stuff I don't care for and focus on supporting my kid. But I think this is why I've just never felt great about the school. It's just a philosophical difference about what the focus of elementary school should be.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The only people that notice or think about this are those that want to be in the perceived “cliques” but aren’t, then feel the need to bash others because they feel rejected.

I have three kids and have my own friends whose children go to various other schools. If there are parent cliques at my children’s schools, I’ve never taken notice.

This is true with cliques when there aren't kids involved, but in a school community cliques can have negative impacts for kids whose parents aren't in the clique, and that's why people notice.

I have zero interest in being part of the parent clique in my kid's school. It's a group of parents who live in the same part of the neighborhood and are very similar to each other and like doing stuff that I don't like doing, so it's never occurred to me to be jealous of their friendship or wish they would invite me to their gatherings. I wouldn't have fun! They are really into alcohol and sports, and I don't drink and don't play sports. So that's not the issue.

The problem is that my DD became buddies at school with one of their DDs, and me not being a member of that clique is basically killing this friendship. The parents don't want to set up playdates or facilitate the girls getting together outside of school because they only want their kid to socialize with their friend's kids. The few times we've been able to get the girls together, the parents have been kind of weird and acted like they were doing us a favor, which made no sense because we hosted and their daughter was very enthusiastic (she literally runs up to me at school and asks when she can come over next).

I just feel bad for my kid that the first friend she has made organically on her own is never available to hang out and her parents don't seem interested in their DD bing friends with mine at all. My kid has other friends, but this is her closest friend in her grade at school. It's just a shame.

I still don’t understand the problem. So what if they don’t invite your kid over afterschool/weekends. Most people aren’t inviting any other kids over at all. That is not necessary for kids to be friends. You can invite her kid over when you feel like it. Or don’t and they can just continue friendship at school.