Dad in our friend group had a mental break and threatened to kill another child in the friend group, advice needed

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I don't think you need to delete anything. People are so weird about trying to protect the privacy of a batshit crazy drunk threatening to kill an elementary schooler. Won't somebody thing of the Good Guy With A Gun (tm)???

As far as your actions going forward, I'd make sure your kids know that those three girls are welcome at your house but that your kids are never to go to their house. Avoid the dad, take him out of the group text threads, and work as a group to make sure that there's always another parent around at the bus stop (hopefully a sane dad) in case he shows up. Report any further threats to the police, even though you can see that they're useless, because a paper trail could come in handy.

I hate to exclude the kids, but of the dad becomes unstable and his kids are seeking refuge at your house, you and your family are now in his cross hairs.

[Anonymous]

This is crazy

[Anonymous]

OP,

This man is in an advanced state of paranoia, and he's in a very dangerous state of mind. This might be brought about by untreated bipolar disorder, schizophrenia, and a host of other psychiatric disorders. Episodes can also be triggered or worsened by cannabis, alcohol or other drugs.

The wife is in great danger if she leaves her husband, and she puts the lives of her children at risk as well if she leaves without them.

I don't think many posters on this thread understand this. She will be the first to be shot if she counters him in any way, because he likely views her as "his property", and he will not accept remonstrations or "abandonment" from that quarter.

This is the classic scenario of a deeply paranoid male, and femicides the world over attest to the risk this mother faces.

So shame on all the posters criticizing this woman.

That being said, yes, it would be great if this man was diagnosed, treated with medication and then, when he's less of a danger to himself, if his wife could leave him (because he's never going to be well). But this is fraught. Most people who suffer from paranoid delusions refuse treatment, and it's practically impossible to get an involuntary psychiatric hold and forced medications.

So you can ask the woman closest to her, to have a talk with her about this options. Or you can make a coffee appointment with her to walk her through this: she would need to consult and attorney and a psychiatrist. But the reality is that she's stuck really badly and it will take monstrous effort on her part to get out with her girls safely.

What you can do is control your own life and that of your family.

I would persuade the other families to send some representatives to see the school Principal, and ask that this man be barred from the school grounds. That his photo be memorized by front desk staff and that security protocols be reinforced in terms of door locks and enforcing that no one holds the door open for anyone else. No exterior door can be left propped open, even when it's hot. Everyone needs to be buzzed in separately, and go to the office first. They need to practice mass shooter drills if they haven't already.

If the mother is not willing to persuade her husband to seek psychiatric help, and the school seems lax in enforcing security protocols, then I would consider changing schools. Historically, men like these tend not to show up at your single family home to shoot you. They go to schools and commit mass murder, or they murder-suicide their families at home. This means you can continue to live in your house, as long as your kids don't go to that school. I hope the people specifically named by him get a restraining order, but it won't stop a delusional person from shooting.

Best of luck navigating this. You're going to need it.

[Anonymous]

Get a TRO.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I have started this post so many times and I kept erasing it because it was so fresh and raw this week that I wasn't even sure what kind of advice to ask for but I'm still floundering and would appreciate some insight from others. I'll try to make this long story short but I apologize in advance for the length. I will also say that we no longer live in the DC area so I am not concerned about any identifying information in this post.

We live in a neighborhood where there are about 15 families in our close friend group with kids ages 1-12 all of whom but the two youngest go to the same private school (the two families that have the young ones also have other kids who are school-aged). Our neighborhood has smaller lots and much common greenspace (also pool, gym, clubhouse, etc.), and we all live within five blocks of each other and can walk to anyone's house in 5 minutes and see each other out regularly. We do parties/get togethers as a large group a lot and kids are always in and out of each other's houses. The kids also all ride the bus together to and from school.

One of the dads in the group has always held some pretty intense political and other beliefs that are different from the rest of us (although one family is mildly in agreement with him on some issues). He will regularly go off on rants in person or via text (mostly on the dads' text chain) about various things and we usually just ignore him. He has always had a problematic relationship with alcohol and has many times been exceedingly drunk and out of control. Many parents in the group drink when we're together at functions but no one ever gets drunk or acts inappropriately except for him.

On Sunday afternoon, while texting about the W football game, he went off on another rant but this time it turned into threats to kill all of us who disagreed with him coupled with pictures of his loaded gun sitting on the kitchen counter. His wife was out of town for the weekend for a birthday party with college friends so he was home alone with his three daughters, ages 3, 6, and 9. He said we were all threats to him and he was going to take us out. One of the dads called the police and requested a wellness check. The police came but he refused to open the door and they said they couldn't do anything else. Around the same time his daughters FaceTimed their mom and said daddy was threatening to kill their friend and burn their house down with them in it. The mom called a mom in the neighborhood and asked her to go get her girls.

That mom and her husband went to the house to get the girls and the dad came to the door with a cocked gun in his hand, waving it around, and ranting that he was going to end it all, he had checked his life insurance policy and his wife would get the money, that he had been getting messages from Heaven that he was the light that was going to solve the world's problems, that he had been told we were all demons, etc. The other dad was able to get the gun away from him and convince him to let the girls go. Several hours later, in the middle of the night, the dad began calling and texting the family that had his girls saying they had kidnapped them and stolen his guns and he was going to kill them. They called the police again and this time he answered the door when they came. He said he wasn't a threat to himself or anyone else so they left.

Meanwhile, the mom who was out of town said she wasn't going to try to come back earlier from her trip (was planned to return Tuesday morning) and turned her phone off so she could get some sleep. When the family who had her children was calling her in the middle of the night it went straight to voicemail. Meanwhile, the children were traumatized and wouldn't stop crying and saying they couldn't go back to their house and were afraid of their dad. On Monday morning, the mom turned her phone back on and said the dad had slept and showered and was fine so they should return the girls to the house with him and she'd be home the next morning. The family didn't want to do so but was afraid of what would happen if they didn't so they sent the hysterical girls back to the house (this was after calling the cops again and confirming that they would not do anything further and that they had no legal right to keep the kids and could call CPS but it would be a slow process).

Mom came home Tuesday morning and acted like nothing happened. People have said that this kind of brushing it under the rug is common for trauma victims but we are all in shock. The family of the girl he threatened to kill (who is a classmate of his oldest daughter) has luckily been out of town this whole week and returns tomorrow. We have been driving our kids to school all week because the dad is usually the one who comes to the bus stop morning and afternoon (he works from home) and we didn't want ourselves or our children to be near him. The friend who took the kids is the only one who has been in contact with the mom, and she asked her to promise that the dad wouldn't be near any of the bus stops for the rest of the school year (she just started a job where she works from home). She agreed, but no one believes that she is actually going to take it seriously.

The school knows, the guidance counselors have been pulling the girls from class (per the reports of kids in their classes), and CPS was called both by a mom and by the school. We're pretty sure CPS showed up Tuesday night because there were multiple police cars outside their house that night. The family of the threatened child has sought legal advice. We had to tell our kids that this dad is no longer safe and their house is no longer a safe spot (they know which houses to go to in the event of an emergency and this used to be one). My kids love those three girls and are very upset that we're allowing them to stay in the house with their dad if he's not safe so we told them he wouldn't hurt his own kids but that we just need to give him space right now.

So I guess what I'm asking you all now is - how would you move forward with this? I feel terrible for those kids and I am angry with the mom's cavalier attitude about all of this but I understand that she has likely long been a victim of abuse and her response is one of trauma. However, I don't particularly trust her to take this as seriously as we all do because she's clearly heard these kind of threats from him for years. But he threatened to kill another child, a nine-year old, in our friend group, and I honestly don't know how to ever get over that. Am I being dramatic? What would you want to see happen before you would be willing to be near him again? Could you ever move past this?

And this is why cops are useless.

[Anonymous]

Despacito

[Anonymous]

Like some others said I would stay away and move asap. I won’t risk my own kids and family’s life.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Assuming this story is true (honestly, it sounds like that show about a neighborhood of swingers), consider your friend group/neighborhood/social life to be over.

If you exclude this family, the dad will retaliate. If you don't, you're putting yourselves in danger. The only option is move.

+1 This is my thought as well.

You should move. He is a danger to all around him.

[Anonymous]

I get that you like your neighborhood and house, but as long as he’s there, you can’t enjoy what you’ve always enjoyed about it anyway. You can’t send your kids out without worry. You can’t have parties all the time because you’ll be worried he’s going to show up and do something horrible.

Yeah - the mom doesn’t get a pass. You can’t turn off your cellphone when your kids are in danger and get any sympathy.

[Anonymous]

Move. Next time, don’t drink with the neighbors.

[Anonymous]

Not sure what state you're in, but as others have said, I would use the collective strength and resources of the FOURTEEN families to at least understand what is needed for this man to get taken in by the police. Is his children fearing for their life not enough? What evidence is needed and do all of you have bits and pieces to eventually build a case?

My heart breaks for those three girls. I cant imagine. But as others have said, if I really thought my family was in danger and nothing could be done, I would move.

[Anonymous]

I would not move. There are crazy people everywhere and you are unlikely to be targeted.

That said, I would get a gun, keep it safe, and know how to use it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You should not have called the police for a "welfare check", you should have called saying he has threatened you/someone with a gun.

You have the text - that is a threat
He has the ability to carry it out - picture of a gun.

That is against the law.

He gets arrested, is forced to get help.

I didn't call the police but another dad called because of his text threats and pictures of the gun but he was mostly concerned because the girls were in the house with a loaded gun sitting on the countertop. It might not have been termed a welfare check, I don't know since I didn't call. If I said the wrong thing I'm sorry.

And unfortunately while I agree with you that threatening someone in writing is a felony, the police seemed very nonchalant about it. We definitely would have thought especially after multiple calls that he would have been taken in but he was not.

You can skip the police you can go and asked to file a report. You go to the police station file a report. They are required to refer to the state attorney’s office.

Also, you can go straight to the courts and ask for a restraining order.

Ok, thanks. I didn't know we could file a report ourselves. Honestly we thought the police would take it more seriously than they did.

One of the dads did go to the 24-hour magistrate to discuss an RO because Monday was Veteran's Day and the courts were closed.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:We had a domestic homicide in our immediate family and had done the restraining order. It made no difference. If more people the murderer had animosity towards had been present or his guns hadn't been confiscated earlier, more would have died. The local police were of no help. The combination of substance abuse, mental illness and a deadly weapon is very dangerous. All the police told us with the restraining order was to call them when he showed up. They were called twice and took half an hour to get there but our family member was killed between the first 911 call and the second when he forced his way in. We were just one family but if 14 families combine your efforts with the school and law enforcement, you will get more attention. One person should not be terrorizing all these families.

I am so, so sorry for what you went through. One of the cops did say to call back if he ended up shooting someone and the person who had called was horrified. He was like how is what we've shown you not enough? At the very least to take his guns away.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don't think you need to delete anything. People are so weird about trying to protect the privacy of a batshit crazy drunk threatening to kill an elementary schooler. Won't somebody thing of the Good Guy With A Gun (tm)???

As far as your actions going forward, I'd make sure your kids know that those three girls are welcome at your house but that your kids are never to go to their house. Avoid the dad, take him out of the group text threads, and work as a group to make sure that there's always another parent around at the bus stop (hopefully a sane dad) in case he shows up. Report any further threats to the police, even though you can see that they're useless, because a paper trail could come in handy.

I hate to exclude the kids, but of the dad becomes unstable and his kids are seeking refuge at your house, you and your family are now in his cross hairs.

I think it the kids truly came to us in an emergency we would take them in but would then leave our house with them and go to a hotel or something. The thought of not helping those kids makes me feel sick. I don't know if my husband would actually turn them away but he does not want them here for play dates or anything.