Help settle an argument: with 2 under 5, doing errands is a break

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I’m going to disagree and say it’s not really a break. But DH and I agreed early on that we both deserve downtime and that running errands or getting a haircut or whatever doesn’t count. However, he also doesn’t hog all the errand running. And a lot of times, one of us will take a kid along to get them out of the house. Our 3 y/o wears a mask and sits in a shopping cart just fine so why not get him out of the house while grabbing groceries and taking the car through the wash? The other parent stays home and gets dinner started or some laundry done (our 6 y/o is old enough to entertain herself). And then we arrange time for each of us to get a real hour or two each weekend (obviously depends on what else is going on) to nap, read, etc. I’d be upset if I got home from errands and my DH told me he was handing off the kids so he could have a break — like when would my break be if all I do is errands and childcare?

And FWIW I responded to the first page of people saying it does count as a break. I see OP has other issues with her husband. But as a general rule, I don’t think errands or managing basic self care should count as a break.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:For sure. Can you flip a coin or alternate staying home/doing errands?

Yep. Running errands definitely a break. I love to be by myself, listening to podcasts or my own breathing, away from the kids periodically.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I’m going to disagree and say it’s not really a break. But DH and I agreed early on that we both deserve downtime and that running errands or getting a haircut or whatever doesn’t count. However, he also doesn’t hog all the errand running. And a lot of times, one of us will take a kid along to get them out of the house. Our 3 y/o wears a mask and sits in a shopping cart just fine so why not get him out of the house while grabbing groceries and taking the car through the wash? The other parent stays home and gets dinner started or some laundry done (our 6 y/o is old enough to entertain herself). And then we arrange time for each of us to get a real hour or two each weekend (obviously depends on what else is going on) to nap, read, etc. I’d be upset if I got home from errands and my DH told me he was handing off the kids so he could have a break — like when would my break be if all I do is errands and childcare?

And FWIW I responded to the first page of people saying it does count as a break. I see OP has other issues with her husband. But as a general rule, I don’t think errands or managing basic self care should count as a break.

I don’t think it counts as a break as in “you got to go to target so I get to go golfing or you went grocery shopping so I get a break to get a pedicure” but I do think it serves as partially relaxing down time.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:For sure. Can you flip a coin or alternate staying home/doing errands?

Yep. Running errands definitely a break. I love to be by myself, listening to podcasts or my own breathing, away from the kids periodically.

+1. Grab a coffee, listen to some music in the car, it’s nice to step away from the home and the many needs of the kids for a couple hours.

[Anonymous]

OP you have a lot of problems and errands are just the top of the iceberg. For one I think he’s jealous of your sister with the rich DH. Also way too controlling of the neatness factor. Nursing is the best excuse he ever has to keep you home. He’s not that into the kids. He’s VERY manipulative. Maybe marriage counseling would help. Does he have some kind of mental problem because it sounds like it.

[Anonymous]

Love the rare DCUM consensus on this one - absolutely it's a break!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I think you have much bigger issues than you even realize. This level of controlling is pretty problematic.

This. Your husband sucks. Stick up for yourself. I don’t get why so many moms and wives just roll over and take this crap. He’s texting you? Put your phone on silent. Leave it in the car. Good grief.

[Anonymous]

Stop nursing. Don’t let him control you. If he fumes or complains, let him. And go to therapy to deal with this and solo since he refuses to go to marriage counseling. If things don’t get better, seriously consider an exit strategy while you consult an attorney.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Stop nursing. Don’t let him control you. If he fumes or complains, let him. And go to therapy to deal with this and solo since he refuses to go to marriage counseling. If things don’t get better, seriously consider an exit strategy while you consult an attorney.

I sort of disagree with this suggestion a lot of PPs are making. Nurse if you enjoy it! Just bc DH sucks, it's unfair to have this taken away from you.

I think he is using Covid as a way to be more controlling. You're being put on an impossible position with his "standards" and refusing to get paid help.

[Anonymous]

Only you can figure out if your husband has a mental health issue, is a controlling jackass or both. But, if he refuses to change, you don’t have to out up with this. This sounds like emotional abuse, and it sounds like you are scared to stand up to him. This is no way to live.

If this is anxiety and he actually seeks help, there might be some hope here. But it sounds like this isn’t a guy that will seek help — and the problem may really just be who he is.

You need a plan on how to get out of this. Your kids don’t deserve to grow up in a home like this. And it will only get harder to leave, the longer you stay. This guy is going to beat you down emotionally.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:It’s absolutely a break. We would bicker about who got to go to buy groceries.

Is to. We fight over who gets to grocery shopping because it is a break from the kids. You’re husband knows and that’s why he is demanding to be the error and guy!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Only you can figure out if your husband has a mental health issue, is a controlling jackass or both. But, if he refuses to change, you don’t have to out up with this. This sounds like emotional abuse, and it sounds like you are scared to stand up to him. This is no way to live.

If this is anxiety and he actually seeks help, there might be some hope here. But it sounds like this isn’t a guy that will seek help — and the problem may really just be who he is.

You need a plan on how to get out of this. Your kids don’t deserve to grow up in a home like this. And it will only get harder to leave, the longer you stay. This guy is going to beat you down emotionally.

This this this. This is not normal “two burned out pandemic parents” stuff OP. Sending you a big hug.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Stop nursing. Don’t let him control you. If he fumes or complains, let him. And go to therapy to deal with this and solo since he refuses to go to marriage counseling. If things don’t get better, seriously consider an exit strategy while you consult an attorney.

+. No catering to his neurosis

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP, if I were in your position — two kids who don’t sleep well, husband who wants things to be nice around the house and wants sex and wants sleep and doesn’t want anyone else in the house because of germs — here’s what I would say:

“Larlo, I just don’t have the bandwidth to do my job plus nursing in the night plus doing fifty percent of all the work to keep the house to the standard you want. I’m exhausted. I know you are, too. We need to change something, and I’m open to a lot of options about what that should be — maybe we should switch to formula, maybe we should see if we can move to a lower COL area or one of us can find a higher paying job so the other one can stay home, maybe we should relax standards about housekeeping or relax standards about covid, I don’t know. But the status quo isn’t working for me, and it doesn’t seem like it’s working for you either. We’re both burned out, and we need to make some changes. Can we tackle this together, you and me vs. the world?”

This might not work for you like it would for me because your husband sounds like he’s made this a you vs. him thing, but if you can’t try to solve your problems as a team I think your marriage is in serious trouble.

Thank you. I wish I could approach this with him like a team. We’ve been together 15 years and unfortunately very slowly over many years the balance has just shifted to him controlling more and more household decisions. He will adamantly deny this, or say that it’s my fault because I’m indecisive or I cede decision making to him, but frequently when I do make decisions or take action he routinely criticizes me so I feel like I cannot. Like if I put Larlo in shorts for school (when he normally gets her dressed) he will say, why did you put Larla in shorts, it’s too cold for that, and go change her. Or if I make dinner and it’s not ready by 6:45 he starts complaining about how the kids are now going to go to bed late because dinner isn’t ready (but it’s totally ok for him to get dinner on the table after 7, or even 7:30). Or when we took Larla to a new pediatrician and I did all the work to get the appointment, research the doctor, get the medical records transferred (multiple calls to the original pediatrician, new pediatrician, and records company due to some issues) pack a bag with everything for the visit, nurse Larla before we go, etc. But then when we are in the car on the way there and get there it’s not clear where to park when we arrive he starts peppering me with questions - where are we supposed to park? Do they validate parking? How are we supposed to get from the parking garage to the building? And honestly, I hadn’t figured it out. I was just going to wing it. But he takes the opportunity to say, “when I do things like this, I handle it. I take care of all the details. And you don’t. And now you’re just handing me a problem.” (In this case, apparently the 3 minutes it took me to look on the website and Google maps the parking garage were unacceptable to him and me handing him a problem.). I sometimes wish people could watch this dynamic and I could get a gut check on who is the one being unreasonable because he makes me feel like I am responsible when my gut tells me he’s the one who is being overly controlling and particular.

You’re a better woman than I. I would take that phone and instead of Googling the directions, I’d repeatedly bash him over the head with it, while screaming “F**K YOU, F**K YOU” over and over and over. Then I’d get out of the car, run away, use my credit cards to buy a one-way ticket to Palm Springs, Puerto Rico, or similar, and come home whenever my sweet ass felt like it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Only you can figure out if your husband has a mental health issue, is a controlling jackass or both. But, if he refuses to change, you don’t have to out up with this. This sounds like emotional abuse, and it sounds like you are scared to stand up to him. This is no way to live.

If this is anxiety and he actually seeks help, there might be some hope here. But it sounds like this isn’t a guy that will seek help — and the problem may really just be who he is.

You need a plan on how to get out of this. Your kids don’t deserve to grow up in a home like this. And it will only get harder to leave, the longer you stay. This guy is going to beat you down emotionally.

This this this. This is not normal “two burned out pandemic parents” stuff OP. Sending you a big hug.

Thank you. The thing is, to most everyone except for maybe my mom and his mom and dad who have visited for long enough to see what an ass he can be, he appears to be such a great, engaged father. And the issue is not that he’s got anxiety or other mental health problems, it’s just that he’s gotten more and more controlling over the years, and his progressive, egalitarian perspective towards women and marriage I feel has basically shifted, imperceptibly at times, much more toward a traditional perspective of mom doing more the parenting and being the default parent. Except he doesn’t give me the benefit as the default parent of running things my way or getting my own routine going or making autonomous decisions, because it’s his routine I’m expected to follow, he wants me “on” whenever he decides he’s not up for parenting and decides to go out for errands or take on a household project, and then he over parents and is very passive aggressive to me the moment he returns and decides to dial back in (he will quiz me about if the kids had a snack and scold me if I didn’t give them one right at 4 pm, or say loudly stuff like “oh did mommy keep you in a wet diaper,” to the baby, or ask me how long the older kid has been watching TV and then lecture me about how we need to get kid 1 off the tv and outside to burn energy).

It’s so hard because he didn’t used to always be like this, truly. But over time he’s developed these insane standards of how everything should be done (eg dishwasher loaded a certain way, only the right amount and kinds of groceries can be bought, laundry has to be sorted and washed a particular way). He’s gotten mad at me for doing things like drying in the dryer a pair of his favorite Bird dog shorts that he likes to line dry, but which the label says can be put on the drier so I put them in the drier. When he discovered my mistake he was like, why are you trying to ruin my clothes? I don’t do this to you. Don’t ever wash my clothes again. It’s just these insane reactions and he will blame me for it saying I was defensive and I was careless and not paying attention to how I wash his clothes and he always is careful with my clothes so it’s my fault he gets mad. And he is always on my case about how I load dishes. He gets mad if I don’t prewash every dish, or load the way he likes (bowls have to be loaded back to front, at an angle, starting from the right side). When I counter by saying there’s many ways to do things and not just one right way, he insists that there is one right way to do something and I’m just being obstinate and oppositional.

His treatment of me over the years has just eroded to a point that these totally unacceptable behaviors that I would have never imagined he’d have 10 or 15 years ago, are commonplace. He’s not a physically violent or abusive, but when he gets angry he frequently loses his cool and yells and as a result I feel like the entire environment of the home is based on if he is in a good mood or not. But he’s so masterful at blaming me and making me feel like I’m the problem that he says it’s me and my moods are the problem, that I yell just as much as he does, that I’m the one who doesn’t treT him
Well and I never have sex with him, etc.. I feel I am being gaslighted regularly, and maybe even experiencing emotional abuse, but I don’t even know how to sort it out. Like, he will yell at me and our older kid, and then say it’s our fault he yells because we don’t listen to him unless yells. Stuff like that...

I feel very trapped and we cannot afford a divorce. As it is our budget is insanely tight.