Van Hollen in El Salvador

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This whole thing is about due process. He was sent to a prison in El Salvador without being given due process. He needs to return here so that he can go through the due process. The Supreme Court voted 9-0 that he needs to be returned for God's sake. Do you think that the SCOTUS does not understand the laws of this country? Every single one of them voted the same way. Let that sink in.

People can make all kinds of conjectures about his gang membership or whatever, but the fact remains that he was ILLEGALLY sent to El Salvador. He was not "deported". He was merely sent there based on no evidence. This is ILLEGAL. It is FAR more important to hold our government to account than any details of this case. If we let our government do this, we are looking at a government that can do whatever it wants with people. No day in court folks. You are just sent into a black hole somewhere.

Ok. Then they should correct the paperwork errors that made this illegal and send his no good, violent, ugly, gangster self back to the country where he is an actual citizen.

You don't have to be so nasty about someone you don't even know. Says some things about you as a person.

But yes, if we keep our noses clean by following due process, that's all we ask.

Are you at all familar with MS-13? They kill babies. I personally know one family whose daughter got wrapped up in MS-13 and they sent her back to El Salvador to keep her safe. But the gang made some calls back to the Homeland. They kidnapped her and cut her in half in the middle. Made her parents pay for each part of her.

And I'm nasty for calling evil what it is. You're naive as hell.

No, you are letting your biases cloud any critical thinking. We don't know for certain he's part of MS13. Even if he were, he's still entitled to due process by our government.

I'm intimately familiar with gangs. I work in public safety locally and have been threatened by a gang (not that gang).

Gang affiliation itself is not illegal. People have freedom to associate. Imagine a younger brother getting a ride from his gang member older brother. Imagine a teen just making some poor friendship choices. It happens.

However, Maryland has a gang validation process for broader reasons. Not just for investigating crimes, but also to address custody and security issues when someone is arrested. The jails can't keep gang members in the same cells, for example. They can't keep rival gang members in the same cells either. These housing determinations are for safety and security of all incarcerated individuals.

The determination process is a point system, and there needs to be reasonable suspicion that a person is gang-affiliated in at least two areas. That's what the PG County cop (now possibly discredited) was doing when he identified Abrego Garcia as gang-affiliated. In itself, it's not legal evidence for committing a crime. It's one element in determining if a crime has been committed, and if so, whether the crime was a gang-motivated crime.

Also, these gang affiliation determinations need to be recent, because people's status in gangs can and does change. And for Abrego Garcia, the determination was made back in 2019 by a PG County cop whose word is questionable. Even if Abrego Garcia had been in a gang in 2019, that determination is far too old to have bearing on today's circumstances. The government needs to step up its game.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This whole thing is about due process. He was sent to a prison in El Salvador without being given due process. He needs to return here so that he can go through the due process. The Supreme Court voted 9-0 that he needs to be returned for God's sake. Do you think that the SCOTUS does not understand the laws of this country? Every single one of them voted the same way. Let that sink in.

People can make all kinds of conjectures about his gang membership or whatever, but the fact remains that he was ILLEGALLY sent to El Salvador. He was not "deported". He was merely sent there based on no evidence. This is ILLEGAL. It is FAR more important to hold our government to account than any details of this case. If we let our government do this, we are looking at a government that can do whatever it wants with people. No day in court folks. You are just sent into a black hole somewhere.

Ok. Then they should correct the paperwork errors that made this illegal and send his no good, violent, ugly, gangster self back to the country where he is an actual citizen.

Exactly. If his case is presented in court and he is PROVEN to be a member of MS-13, then fine - send him back. The reason the Trump is resisting Garcia’s return is because they don’t have any proof that would stand up in court.

Again, this isn’t about one person, it’s about preserving due process. Trump isn’t shy about his intent to deport political opponents; this is just a test case.

Why use an alleged terrorist, found with known terrorists, and a wife beater as the test case? Serious question.

Nobody would pick me up on a corner hanging with known terrorists. This guy was not found with choir boys. MS 13 is a designated terror organization. It's not a mere street crew.

The dummies in the current administration chose him by sending him.

They are dummies but I also think they know who to persecute so their cult members don't notice how they are violating basic human rights.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This whole thing is about due process. He was sent to a prison in El Salvador without being given due process. He needs to return here so that he can go through the due process. The Supreme Court voted 9-0 that he needs to be returned for God's sake. Do you think that the SCOTUS does not understand the laws of this country? Every single one of them voted the same way. Let that sink in.

People can make all kinds of conjectures about his gang membership or whatever, but the fact remains that he was ILLEGALLY sent to El Salvador. He was not "deported". He was merely sent there based on no evidence. This is ILLEGAL. It is FAR more important to hold our government to account than any details of this case. If we let our government do this, we are looking at a government that can do whatever it wants with people. No day in court folks. You are just sent into a black hole somewhere.

Ok. Then they should correct the paperwork errors that made this illegal and send his no good, violent, ugly, gangster self back to the country where he is an actual citizen.

You don't have to be so nasty about someone you don't even know. Says some things about you as a person.

But yes, if we keep our noses clean by following due process, that's all we ask.

Are you at all familar with MS-13? They kill babies. I personally know one family whose daughter got wrapped up in MS-13 and they sent her back to El Salvador to keep her safe. But the gang made some calls back to the Homeland. They kidnapped her and cut her in half in the middle. Made her parents pay for each part of her.

And I'm nasty for calling evil what it is. You're naive as hell.

No, you are letting your biases cloud any critical thinking. We don't know for certain he's part of MS13. Even if he were, he's still entitled to due process by our government.

I'm intimately familiar with gangs. I work in public safety locally and have been threatened by a gang (not that gang).

Gang affiliation itself is not illegal. People have freedom to associate. Imagine a younger brother getting a ride from his gang member older brother. Imagine a teen just making some poor friendship choices. It happens.

However, Maryland has a gang validation process for broader reasons. Not just for investigating crimes, but also to address custody and security issues when someone is arrested. The jails can't keep gang members in the same cells, for example. They can't keep rival gang members in the same cells either. These housing determinations are for safety and security of all incarcerated individuals.

The determination process is a point system, and there needs to be reasonable suspicion that a person is gang-affiliated in at least two areas. That's what the PG County cop (now possibly discredited) was doing when he identified Abrego Garcia as gang-affiliated. In itself, it's not legal evidence for committing a crime. It's one element in determining if a crime has been committed, and if so, whether the crime was a gang-motivated crime.

Also, these gang affiliation determinations need to be recent, because people's status in gangs can and does change. And for Abrego Garcia, the determination was made back in 2019 by a PG County cop whose word is questionable. Even if Abrego Garcia had been in a gang in 2019, that determination is far too old to have bearing on today's circumstances. The government needs to step up its game.

Look, I was a Maryland liberal too. I looked to nuance and understanding while the community became unsafe, real estate values stalled out relative to DC and VA, and MS-13 started hacking up teenage girls. Now I see all this nuance as a distraction. I have total moral clarity now: people who are violent criminals or are part of a murderous criminal organization dont belong in our communities. Period.

So the government screwed up the paperwork? It happens. All the time. Van Hollen chose THIS SPECIFIC GUY, a wife beating gangster, to highlight as his charity case. And he's using Maryland taxpayer money to it!

You and I are philosophically opposed. You prioritize the rights of criminals over the right of a community to have a government that represents them and works to ensure their safety by removing offenders. There's no point continuing to debate because I will never align with MS-13 and you will never align with innocent communities.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:As a former Marylander, Van Hollen is way off base here. MS-13 is inside the schools, girls are being kidnapped and trafficked, rival teens are being lured into the woods and stabbed to death. A poor kid was murdered at Lake Forest mall for the crime of wearing a shirt the wrong color. This gang has gutted the once thriving communities of Montgomery Village, Germantown, and much of Gaithersburg. Who exactly is Van Hollen appealing to or protecting? The vast majority of the victims of MS-13 are Hispanic teens. This isn't a white vs POC thing. This is a criminal vs peaceful person thing. He needs to get a clue and talk to Maryland parents who've had pieces of their children returned to them in bags.

A girl's body was found along the C&O Canal in the vicinity of Chain Bridge a few years ago. She was Hispanic. Her body had been cut up into pieces. A young man was also found murdered and dismembered along the C&O Canal a few years ago. Law enforcement found MS-13 insignia in the woods close to where this young man's body was found. Any reasonable person with their head screwed on straight understands the animals who committed these crimes do not belong in our communities.

MS-13 is a murderous gang known for drug dealing and human trafficking. The manner in which the two above young people were murdered indicates at the very least extreme psychopathy. They are a public menace.

I am not happy with a lot of Trump's actions, but deporting brutal gang members should not disturb anyone.

Person dominating thread with a hundred silly arguments is likely an MS-13 member tasked with defending this man.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:As a former Marylander, Van Hollen is way off base here. MS-13 is inside the schools, girls are being kidnapped and trafficked, rival teens are being lured into the woods and stabbed to death. A poor kid was murdered at Lake Forest mall for the crime of wearing a shirt the wrong color. This gang has gutted the once thriving communities of Montgomery Village, Germantown, and much of Gaithersburg. Who exactly is Van Hollen appealing to or protecting? The vast majority of the victims of MS-13 are Hispanic teens. This isn't a white vs POC thing. This is a criminal vs peaceful person thing. He needs to get a clue and talk to Maryland parents who've had pieces of their children returned to them in bags.

A girl's body was found along the C&O Canal in the vicinity of Chain Bridge a few years ago. She was Hispanic. Her body had been cut up into pieces. A young man was also found murdered and dismembered along the C&O Canal a few years ago. Law enforcement found MS-13 insignia in the woods close to where this young man's body was found. Any reasonable person with their head screwed on straight understands the animals who committed these crimes do not belong in our communities.

MS-13 is a murderous gang known for drug dealing and human trafficking. The manner in which the two above young people were murdered indicates at the very least extreme psychopathy. They are a public menace.

I am not happy with a lot of Trump's actions, but deporting brutal gang members should not disturb anyone.

Person dominating thread with a hundred silly arguments is likely an MS-13 member tasked with defending this man.

DP. For the 100th time (excuse the shouting), NO ONE IS AGAINST DEPORTING ACTUAL GANG MEMBERS!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:As a former Marylander, Van Hollen is way off base here. MS-13 is inside the schools, girls are being kidnapped and trafficked, rival teens are being lured into the woods and stabbed to death. A poor kid was murdered at Lake Forest mall for the crime of wearing a shirt the wrong color. This gang has gutted the once thriving communities of Montgomery Village, Germantown, and much of Gaithersburg. Who exactly is Van Hollen appealing to or protecting? The vast majority of the victims of MS-13 are Hispanic teens. This isn't a white vs POC thing. This is a criminal vs peaceful person thing. He needs to get a clue and talk to Maryland parents who've had pieces of their children returned to them in bags.

A girl's body was found along the C&O Canal in the vicinity of Chain Bridge a few years ago. She was Hispanic. Her body had been cut up into pieces. A young man was also found murdered and dismembered along the C&O Canal a few years ago. Law enforcement found MS-13 insignia in the woods close to where this young man's body was found. Any reasonable person with their head screwed on straight understands the animals who committed these crimes do not belong in our communities.

MS-13 is a murderous gang known for drug dealing and human trafficking. The manner in which the two above young people were murdered indicates at the very least extreme psychopathy. They are a public menace.

I am not happy with a lot of Trump's actions, but deporting brutal gang members should not disturb anyone.

Person dominating thread with a hundred silly arguments is likely an MS-13 member tasked with defending this man.

DP. For the 100th time (excuse the shouting), NO ONE IS AGAINST DEPORTING ACTUAL GANG MEMBERS!

Yet the left is doing a full press court to defend an actual gang member who was here illegally. With all the issues that Van Hollen could be focused on, and could spend taxpayer money on, he is choosing THIS. So explain why defending this guy is more important than anything else.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This whole thing is about due process. He was sent to a prison in El Salvador without being given due process. He needs to return here so that he can go through the due process. The Supreme Court voted 9-0 that he needs to be returned for God's sake. Do you think that the SCOTUS does not understand the laws of this country? Every single one of them voted the same way. Let that sink in.

People can make all kinds of conjectures about his gang membership or whatever, but the fact remains that he was ILLEGALLY sent to El Salvador. He was not "deported". He was merely sent there based on no evidence. This is ILLEGAL. It is FAR more important to hold our government to account than any details of this case. If we let our government do this, we are looking at a government that can do whatever it wants with people. No day in court folks. You are just sent into a black hole somewhere.

Ok. Then they should correct the paperwork errors that made this illegal and send his no good, violent, ugly, gangster self back to the country where he is an actual citizen.

The folks here arguing in favor of Garcia are trying to make the larger point about not deporting without due process. However, due process was not followed when such individuals entered the country illegally. I wonder where all of these folks were when Biden let in millions of illegal aliens in violation of US law?

Beyond all of this, I ask all of the folks demanding full due process would be okay with banning anyone who entered the country illegally from:

NEVER being allowed to vote,

NOT counted as part of the census (which allocates Congressional seats and Electoral College votes)

NEVER receiving any federal or state benefits

IMMEDIATE deportation if they commit any crime (after serving whatever incarceration period is required - probation gets deportation And a bar from reentry until probation period ends).

If illegal aliens want these things, they will have to self deport and seek to emigrate to the US legally.

Wtf are you even talking about? Due process has to do with the government *taking away* freedoms, property, legal rights, etc. without the opportunity for a full and fair hearing to be held.

Citizens are entitled to due process even for things like applying for SS benefits, traffic tickets, eminent domain, etc.

It has nothing to do with people coming into the country illegally. Biden wasn’t taking anything away from an individual. You may not like his actions, but you are clearly uneducated when it comes to the basics of our constitution.

Like it or not, PP is making an argument that will resonate with many voters: Trump has no choice but to deny due process to deal with an emergency Biden created.

The MAGA trolls here are absolutely wild.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This whole thing is about due process. He was sent to a prison in El Salvador without being given due process. He needs to return here so that he can go through the due process. The Supreme Court voted 9-0 that he needs to be returned for God's sake. Do you think that the SCOTUS does not understand the laws of this country? Every single one of them voted the same way. Let that sink in.

People can make all kinds of conjectures about his gang membership or whatever, but the fact remains that he was ILLEGALLY sent to El Salvador. He was not "deported". He was merely sent there based on no evidence. This is ILLEGAL. It is FAR more important to hold our government to account than any details of this case. If we let our government do this, we are looking at a government that can do whatever it wants with people. No day in court folks. You are just sent into a black hole somewhere.

Ok. Then they should correct the paperwork errors that made this illegal and send his no good, violent, ugly, gangster self back to the country where he is an actual citizen.

The folks here arguing in favor of Garcia are trying to make the larger point about not deporting without due process. However, due process was not followed when such individuals entered the country illegally. I wonder where all of these folks were when Biden let in millions of illegal aliens in violation of US law?

Beyond all of this, I ask all of the folks demanding full due process would be okay with banning anyone who entered the country illegally from:

NEVER being allowed to vote,

NOT counted as part of the census (which allocates Congressional seats and Electoral College votes)

NEVER receiving any federal or state benefits

IMMEDIATE deportation if they commit any crime (after serving whatever incarceration period is required - probation gets deportation And a bar from reentry until probation period ends).

If illegal aliens want these things, they will have to self deport and seek to emigrate to the US legally.

Wtf are you even talking about? Due process has to do with the government *taking away* freedoms, property, legal rights, etc. without the opportunity for a full and fair hearing to be held.

Citizens are entitled to due process even for things like applying for SS benefits, traffic tickets, eminent domain, etc.

It has nothing to do with people coming into the country illegally. Biden wasn’t taking anything away from an individual. You may not like his actions, but you are clearly uneducated when it comes to the basics of our constitution.

Like it or not, PP is making an argument that will resonate with many voters: Trump has no choice but to deny due process to deal with an emergency Biden created.

The MAGA trolls here are absolutely wild.

Yeah, they want gang members deported and dont want politicians flying around the world giving aid and support to members of designated terrorist organizations. So wild.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:As a former Marylander, Van Hollen is way off base here. MS-13 is inside the schools, girls are being kidnapped and trafficked, rival teens are being lured into the woods and stabbed to death. A poor kid was murdered at Lake Forest mall for the crime of wearing a shirt the wrong color. This gang has gutted the once thriving communities of Montgomery Village, Germantown, and much of Gaithersburg. Who exactly is Van Hollen appealing to or protecting? The vast majority of the victims of MS-13 are Hispanic teens. This isn't a white vs POC thing. This is a criminal vs peaceful person thing. He needs to get a clue and talk to Maryland parents who've had pieces of their children returned to them in bags.

A girl's body was found along the C&O Canal in the vicinity of Chain Bridge a few years ago. She was Hispanic. Her body had been cut up into pieces. A young man was also found murdered and dismembered along the C&O Canal a few years ago. Law enforcement found MS-13 insignia in the woods close to where this young man's body was found. Any reasonable person with their head screwed on straight understands the animals who committed these crimes do not belong in our communities.

MS-13 is a murderous gang known for drug dealing and human trafficking. The manner in which the two above young people were murdered indicates at the very least extreme psychopathy. They are a public menace.

I am not happy with a lot of Trump's actions, but deporting brutal gang members should not disturb anyone.

Person dominating thread with a hundred silly arguments is likely an MS-13 member tasked with defending this man.

DP. For the 100th time (excuse the shouting), NO ONE IS AGAINST DEPORTING ACTUAL GANG MEMBERS!

Yet the left is doing a full press court to defend an actual gang member who was here illegally. With all the issues that Van Hollen could be focused on, and could spend taxpayer money on, he is choosing THIS. So explain why defending this guy is more important than anything else.

We know you don't understand. You'll never recognize that throughout history these types of fights are exactly what has preserved your freedom. The rest of us can only hope there are enough people paying attention and awake enough right now to save our freedoms this time.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:As a former Marylander, Van Hollen is way off base here. MS-13 is inside the schools, girls are being kidnapped and trafficked, rival teens are being lured into the woods and stabbed to death. A poor kid was murdered at Lake Forest mall for the crime of wearing a shirt the wrong color. This gang has gutted the once thriving communities of Montgomery Village, Germantown, and much of Gaithersburg. Who exactly is Van Hollen appealing to or protecting? The vast majority of the victims of MS-13 are Hispanic teens. This isn't a white vs POC thing. This is a criminal vs peaceful person thing. He needs to get a clue and talk to Maryland parents who've had pieces of their children returned to them in bags.

A girl's body was found along the C&O Canal in the vicinity of Chain Bridge a few years ago. She was Hispanic. Her body had been cut up into pieces. A young man was also found murdered and dismembered along the C&O Canal a few years ago. Law enforcement found MS-13 insignia in the woods close to where this young man's body was found. Any reasonable person with their head screwed on straight understands the animals who committed these crimes do not belong in our communities.

MS-13 is a murderous gang known for drug dealing and human trafficking. The manner in which the two above young people were murdered indicates at the very least extreme psychopathy. They are a public menace.

I am not happy with a lot of Trump's actions, but deporting brutal gang members should not disturb anyone.

Person dominating thread with a hundred silly arguments is likely an MS-13 member tasked with defending this man.

DP. For the 100th time (excuse the shouting), NO ONE IS AGAINST DEPORTING ACTUAL GANG MEMBERS!

Yet the left is doing a full press court to defend an actual gang member who was here illegally. With all the issues that Van Hollen could be focused on, and could spend taxpayer money on, he is choosing THIS. So explain why defending this guy is more important than anything else.

We know you don't understand. You'll never recognize that throughout history these types of fights are exactly what has preserved your freedom. The rest of us can only hope there are enough people paying attention and awake enough right now to save our freedoms this time.

Sir, this is a Wendy's. It was literally a paperwork due process issue. These are not rare things, they happen relatively frequently and are corrected with... more paperwork. You will not inspire people to your cause with this.

And not to give you any hints, but you do realize the economy is an actual dumpster fire right now? Trillions lost from the stock market. And here you are fixating on this. Politically tone deaf.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:As a former Marylander, Van Hollen is way off base here. MS-13 is inside the schools, girls are being kidnapped and trafficked, rival teens are being lured into the woods and stabbed to death. A poor kid was murdered at Lake Forest mall for the crime of wearing a shirt the wrong color. This gang has gutted the once thriving communities of Montgomery Village, Germantown, and much of Gaithersburg. Who exactly is Van Hollen appealing to or protecting? The vast majority of the victims of MS-13 are Hispanic teens. This isn't a white vs POC thing. This is a criminal vs peaceful person thing. He needs to get a clue and talk to Maryland parents who've had pieces of their children returned to them in bags.

A girl's body was found along the C&O Canal in the vicinity of Chain Bridge a few years ago. She was Hispanic. Her body had been cut up into pieces. A young man was also found murdered and dismembered along the C&O Canal a few years ago. Law enforcement found MS-13 insignia in the woods close to where this young man's body was found. Any reasonable person with their head screwed on straight understands the animals who committed these crimes do not belong in our communities.

MS-13 is a murderous gang known for drug dealing and human trafficking. The manner in which the two above young people were murdered indicates at the very least extreme psychopathy. They are a public menace.

I am not happy with a lot of Trump's actions, but deporting brutal gang members should not disturb anyone.

Person dominating thread with a hundred silly arguments is likely an MS-13 member tasked with defending this man.

DP. For the 100th time (excuse the shouting), NO ONE IS AGAINST DEPORTING ACTUAL GANG MEMBERS!

Yet the left is doing a full press court to defend an actual gang member who was here illegally. With all the issues that Van Hollen could be focused on, and could spend taxpayer money on, he is choosing THIS. So explain why defending this guy is more important than anything else.

We know you don't understand. You'll never recognize that throughout history these types of fights are exactly what has preserved your freedom. The rest of us can only hope there are enough people paying attention and awake enough right now to save our freedoms this time.

Sir, this is a Wendy's. It was literally a paperwork due process issue. These are not rare things, they happen relatively frequently and are corrected with... more paperwork. You will not inspire people to your cause with this.

And not to give you any hints, but you do realize the economy is an actual dumpster fire right now? Trillions lost from the stock market. And here you are fixating on this. Politically tone deaf.

Yeah we're going to have to agree to disagree

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:As a former Marylander, Van Hollen is way off base here. MS-13 is inside the schools, girls are being kidnapped and trafficked, rival teens are being lured into the woods and stabbed to death. A poor kid was murdered at Lake Forest mall for the crime of wearing a shirt the wrong color. This gang has gutted the once thriving communities of Montgomery Village, Germantown, and much of Gaithersburg. Who exactly is Van Hollen appealing to or protecting? The vast majority of the victims of MS-13 are Hispanic teens. This isn't a white vs POC thing. This is a criminal vs peaceful person thing. He needs to get a clue and talk to Maryland parents who've had pieces of their children returned to them in bags.

A girl's body was found along the C&O Canal in the vicinity of Chain Bridge a few years ago. She was Hispanic. Her body had been cut up into pieces. A young man was also found murdered and dismembered along the C&O Canal a few years ago. Law enforcement found MS-13 insignia in the woods close to where this young man's body was found. Any reasonable person with their head screwed on straight understands the animals who committed these crimes do not belong in our communities.

MS-13 is a murderous gang known for drug dealing and human trafficking. The manner in which the two above young people were murdered indicates at the very least extreme psychopathy. They are a public menace.

I am not happy with a lot of Trump's actions, but deporting brutal gang members should not disturb anyone.

Person dominating thread with a hundred silly arguments is likely an MS-13 member tasked with defending this man.

DP. For the 100th time (excuse the shouting), NO ONE IS AGAINST DEPORTING ACTUAL GANG MEMBERS!

Yet the left is doing a full press court to defend an actual gang member who was here illegally. With all the issues that Van Hollen could be focused on, and could spend taxpayer money on, he is choosing THIS. So explain why defending this guy is more important than anything else.

Is this source "the left" ?
https://www.nationalreview.com/bench-memos/stephen-millers-brazen-misrepresentation-of-abrego-garcia-ruling/

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:As a former Marylander, Van Hollen is way off base here. MS-13 is inside the schools, girls are being kidnapped and trafficked, rival teens are being lured into the woods and stabbed to death. A poor kid was murdered at Lake Forest mall for the crime of wearing a shirt the wrong color. This gang has gutted the once thriving communities of Montgomery Village, Germantown, and much of Gaithersburg. Who exactly is Van Hollen appealing to or protecting? The vast majority of the victims of MS-13 are Hispanic teens. This isn't a white vs POC thing. This is a criminal vs peaceful person thing. He needs to get a clue and talk to Maryland parents who've had pieces of their children returned to them in bags.

A girl's body was found along the C&O Canal in the vicinity of Chain Bridge a few years ago. She was Hispanic. Her body had been cut up into pieces. A young man was also found murdered and dismembered along the C&O Canal a few years ago. Law enforcement found MS-13 insignia in the woods close to where this young man's body was found. Any reasonable person with their head screwed on straight understands the animals who committed these crimes do not belong in our communities.

MS-13 is a murderous gang known for drug dealing and human trafficking. The manner in which the two above young people were murdered indicates at the very least extreme psychopathy. They are a public menace.

I am not happy with a lot of Trump's actions, but deporting brutal gang members should not disturb anyone.

Person dominating thread with a hundred silly arguments is likely an MS-13 member tasked with defending this man.

DP. For the 100th time (excuse the shouting), NO ONE IS AGAINST DEPORTING ACTUAL GANG MEMBERS!

Yet the left is doing a full press court to defend an actual gang member who was here illegally. With all the issues that Van Hollen could be focused on, and could spend taxpayer money on, he is choosing THIS. So explain why defending this guy is more important than anything else.

Is this source "the left" ?
https://www.nationalreview.com/bench-memos/stephen-millers-brazen-misrepresentation-of-abrego-garcia-ruling/

WFB Jr's son took over NR when he died and NR stopped being considered a fully right wing medium.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This whole thing is about due process. He was sent to a prison in El Salvador without being given due process. He needs to return here so that he can go through the due process. The Supreme Court voted 9-0 that he needs to be returned for God's sake. Do you think that the SCOTUS does not understand the laws of this country? Every single one of them voted the same way. Let that sink in.

People can make all kinds of conjectures about his gang membership or whatever, but the fact remains that he was ILLEGALLY sent to El Salvador. He was not "deported". He was merely sent there based on no evidence. This is ILLEGAL. It is FAR more important to hold our government to account than any details of this case. If we let our government do this, we are looking at a government that can do whatever it wants with people. No day in court folks. You are just sent into a black hole somewhere.

Ok. Then they should correct the paperwork errors that made this illegal and send his no good, violent, ugly, gangster self back to the country where he is an actual citizen.

You don't have to be so nasty about someone you don't even know. Says some things about you as a person.

But yes, if we keep our noses clean by following due process, that's all we ask.

Are you at all familar with MS-13? They kill babies. I personally know one family whose daughter got wrapped up in MS-13 and they sent her back to El Salvador to keep her safe. But the gang made some calls back to the Homeland. They kidnapped her and cut her in half in the middle. Made her parents pay for each part of her.

And I'm nasty for calling evil what it is. You're naive as hell.

No, you are letting your biases cloud any critical thinking. We don't know for certain he's part of MS13. Even if he were, he's still entitled to due process by our government.

I'm intimately familiar with gangs. I work in public safety locally and have been threatened by a gang (not that gang).

Gang affiliation itself is not illegal. People have freedom to associate. Imagine a younger brother getting a ride from his gang member older brother. Imagine a teen just making some poor friendship choices. It happens.

However, Maryland has a gang validation process for broader reasons. Not just for investigating crimes, but also to address custody and security issues when someone is arrested. The jails can't keep gang members in the same cells, for example. They can't keep rival gang members in the same cells either. These housing determinations are for safety and security of all incarcerated individuals.

The determination process is a point system, and there needs to be reasonable suspicion that a person is gang-affiliated in at least two areas. That's what the PG County cop (now possibly discredited) was doing when he identified Abrego Garcia as gang-affiliated. In itself, it's not legal evidence for committing a crime. It's one element in determining if a crime has been committed, and if so, whether the crime was a gang-motivated crime.

Also, these gang affiliation determinations need to be recent, because people's status in gangs can and does change. And for Abrego Garcia, the determination was made back in 2019 by a PG County cop whose word is questionable. Even if Abrego Garcia had been in a gang in 2019, that determination is far too old to have bearing on today's circumstances. The government needs to step up its game.

Look, I was a Maryland liberal too. I looked to nuance and understanding while the community became unsafe, real estate values stalled out relative to DC and VA, and MS-13 started hacking up teenage girls. Now I see all this nuance as a distraction. I have total moral clarity now: people who are violent criminals or are part of a murderous criminal organization dont belong in our communities. Period.

So the government screwed up the paperwork? It happens. All the time. Van Hollen chose THIS SPECIFIC GUY, a wife beating gangster, to highlight as his charity case. And he's using Maryland taxpayer money to it!

You and I are philosophically opposed. You prioritize the rights of criminals over the right of a community to have a government that represents them and works to ensure their safety by removing offenders. There's no point continuing to debate because I will never align with MS-13 and you will never align with innocent communities.

This is a false dichotomy. It's a failure of critical thinking. Or it's deliberate intent to obfuscate the issue.

The true challenge here is about defending everyone's rights. Not picking or choosing who is worthy of rights and who is not, because everyone is. Of course government should work hard to remove offenders. But government needs to do it legally. They don't get a pass to do shady stuff because they are lazy, stupid, or because people think the people in question are garbage. That's not how Constitutional rights work.

How many witches did we kill early in our history because we just KNEW they were evil and harming our communities? We just knew.

Our Constitution demands equal application of the law to all. Period. It's not a political issue but a human rights issue.

The work often isn't easy. And we have screwed up royally in the past. That doesn't mean we just give up. Again, it's a reflection of us as a society, not the people subjected to our actions.

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Anonymous wrote:As a former Marylander, Van Hollen is way off base here. MS-13 is inside the schools, girls are being kidnapped and trafficked, rival teens are being lured into the woods and stabbed to death. A poor kid was murdered at Lake Forest mall for the crime of wearing a shirt the wrong color. This gang has gutted the once thriving communities of Montgomery Village, Germantown, and much of Gaithersburg. Who exactly is Van Hollen appealing to or protecting? The vast majority of the victims of MS-13 are Hispanic teens. This isn't a white vs POC thing. This is a criminal vs peaceful person thing. He needs to get a clue and talk to Maryland parents who've had pieces of their children returned to them in bags.

A girl's body was found along the C&O Canal in the vicinity of Chain Bridge a few years ago. She was Hispanic. Her body had been cut up into pieces. A young man was also found murdered and dismembered along the C&O Canal a few years ago. Law enforcement found MS-13 insignia in the woods close to where this young man's body was found. Any reasonable person with their head screwed on straight understands the animals who committed these crimes do not belong in our communities.

MS-13 is a murderous gang known for drug dealing and human trafficking. The manner in which the two above young people were murdered indicates at the very least extreme psychopathy. They are a public menace.

I am not happy with a lot of Trump's actions, but deporting brutal gang members should not disturb anyone.

Person dominating thread with a hundred silly arguments is likely an MS-13 member tasked with defending this man.

DP. For the 100th time (excuse the shouting), NO ONE IS AGAINST DEPORTING ACTUAL GANG MEMBERS!

Yet the left is doing a full press court to defend an actual gang member who was here illegally. With all the issues that Van Hollen could be focused on, and could spend taxpayer money on, he is choosing THIS. So explain why defending this guy is more important than anything else.

Is this source "the left" ?
https://www.nationalreview.com/bench-memos/stephen-millers-brazen-misrepresentation-of-abrego-garcia-ruling/

WFB Jr's son took over NR when he died and NR stopped being considered a fully right wing medium.

Oh, conservatives still gotta bend the knee