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[quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous]This whole thing is about due process. He was sent to a prison in El Salvador without being given due process. He needs to return here so that he can go through the due process. The Supreme Court voted 9-0 that he needs to be returned for God's sake. Do you think that the SCOTUS does not understand the laws of this country? Every single one of them voted the same way. Let that sink in.

People can make all kinds of conjectures about his gang membership or whatever, but the fact remains that he was ILLEGALLY sent to El Salvador. He was not "deported". He was merely sent there based on no evidence. This is ILLEGAL. It is FAR more important to hold our government to account than any details of this case. If we let our government do this, we are looking at a government that can do whatever it wants with people. No day in court folks. You are just sent into a black hole somewhere. [/quote]

Ok. Then they should correct the paperwork errors that made this illegal and send his no good, violent, ugly, gangster self back to the country where he is an actual citizen. [/quote]

You don't have to be so nasty about someone you don't even know. Says some things about you as a person.

But yes, if we keep our noses clean by following due process, that's all we ask. [/quote]

Are you at all familar with MS-13? They kill babies. I personally know one family whose daughter got wrapped up in MS-13 and they sent her back to El Salvador to keep her safe. But the gang made some calls back to the Homeland. They kidnapped her and cut her in half in the middle. Made her parents pay for each part of her.

And I'm nasty for calling evil what it is. You're naive as hell. [/quote]

No, you are letting your biases cloud any critical thinking. We don't know for certain he's part of MS13.  Even if he were, he's still entitled to due process by our government.

I'm intimately familiar with gangs. I work in public safety locally and have been threatened by a gang (not that gang).

Gang affiliation itself is not illegal. People have freedom to associate. Imagine a younger brother getting a ride from his gang member older brother. Imagine a teen just making some poor friendship choices.  It happens.

However, Maryland has a gang validation process for broader reasons.  Not just for investigating crimes, but also to address custody and security issues when someone is arrested.  The jails can't keep gang members in the same cells, for example.  They can't keep rival gang members in the same cells either.  These housing determinations are for safety and security of all incarcerated individuals.

The determination process is a point system, and there needs to be reasonable suspicion that a person is gang-affiliated in at least two areas. That's what the PG County cop (now possibly discredited) was doing when he identified Abrego Garcia as gang-affiliated. In itself, it's not legal evidence for committing a crime. It's one element in determining if a crime has been committed, and if so, whether the crime was a gang-motivated crime.

Also, these gang affiliation determinations need to be recent, because people's status in gangs can and does change.  And for Abrego Garcia, the determination was made back in 2019 by a PG County cop whose word is questionable. Even if Abrego Garcia had been in a gang in 2019, that determination is far too old to have bearing on today's circumstances.  The government needs to step up its game.

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Look, I was a Maryland liberal too. I looked to nuance and understanding while the community became unsafe, real estate values stalled out relative to DC and VA, and MS-13 started hacking up teenage girls. Now I see all this nuance as a distraction. I have total moral clarity now: people who are violent criminals or are part of a murderous criminal organization dont belong in our communities. Period.

So the government screwed up the paperwork? It happens. All the time. Van Hollen chose THIS SPECIFIC GUY, a wife beating gangster, to highlight as his charity case. And he's using Maryland taxpayer money to it!

You and I are philosophically opposed.  [b]You prioritize the rights of criminals over the right of a community to have a government that represents them and works to ensure their safety by removing offenders. [/b]There's no point continuing to debate because I will never align with MS-13 and you will never align with innocent communities. [/quote]

This is a false dichotomy. It's a failure of critical thinking. Or it's deliberate intent to obfuscate the issue.

The true challenge here is about defending everyone's rights.  Not picking or choosing who is worthy of rights and who is not, because everyone is.  Of course government should work hard to remove offenders. But government needs to do it legally. They don't get a pass to do shady stuff because they are lazy, stupid, or because people think the people in question are garbage. That's not how Constitutional rights work.

How many witches did we kill early in our history because we just KNEW they were evil and harming our communities? We just knew.

Our Constitution demands equal application of the law to all. Period. It's not a political issue but a human rights issue.

The work often isn't easy. And we have screwed up royally in the past. That doesn't mean we just give up.  Again, it's a reflection of us as a society, not the people subjected to our actions.

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