Stigma against "young moms"?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I used to judge young moms. Assumed it was an accidental pregnancy or she wasn't interested in working.

Then I had kids of my own - first at 32 - and totally understand why a woman would choose to have children earlier. If I could do it all over again, I would not have waited. I am glad her op-ed can help normalize early marriage and pregnancy.

To me it’s really the early marriage/relationship piece. It’s not like it’s really within the control of individual women to find a partner to settle down with early. If you do, then I agree it should be supported. In my life I thought it was very ironic how I went from feeling like everyone disapproved of the seriousness of my relationship with my HS boyfriend; to everyone wondering when I was going to settle down. When the truth was, my HS boyfriend was probably one of the best people I ever dated, and we had a great relationship in many ways. If there had been a cultural
model for sustaining an early relationship, who knows what would have happened. OTOH there’s also plenty of research showing older marriages are more stable, and children of older moms prosper. At the end of the day, women’s relationship and reproductive choices should not be turned into a referendum on “the culture” or morality.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Young moms seem to adapt to parenting better. Maybe because they're so young they don't realize what they're giving up yet and so it doesn't feel like as much of a sacrifice?

But the ones I meet almost always seem to cheerful and well adjusted. They seem very go with the flow. They're not the harried, stressed out moms I know in their thirties or forties.

I wonder what it is. Less need for sleep?

Not the ones I've met. They're usually stressed for money, their jobs aren't as flexible and kids spend more time in daycare. I even think less patient.

Then again, the moms I know who had kids in their 30s aren't harried or stressed out. We have good spouses and strong savings.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:The only judgement I think is that they should have spent a few more years enjoying their spouse before kids. I think a strong, loving, enjoyable marriage is key to raising kids. DH and I spent almost a decade together (married for 5) before kids and I think it's helped us immensely as we transitioned to parents. We are together facing all the parenting challenges and managing our kids together. We understand each other without talking and we are best friends.

well Elizabeth Bruenig has been with her husband since she was sixteen so I think she knows him pretty well.

Probably most young moms are just women who were lucky enough to meet the love of their life at a very early age.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Young moms seem to adapt to parenting better. Maybe because they're so young they don't realize what they're giving up yet and so it doesn't feel like as much of a sacrifice?

But the ones I meet almost always seem to cheerful and well adjusted. They seem very go with the flow. They're not the harried, stressed out moms I know in their thirties or forties.

I wonder what it is. Less need for sleep?

I think the physiology of it has got to be a big factor. But also if they aren’t trying to scramble to balance a career with motherhood.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Young moms seem to adapt to parenting better. Maybe because they're so young they don't realize what they're giving up yet and so it doesn't feel like as much of a sacrifice?

But the ones I meet almost always seem to cheerful and well adjusted. They seem very go with the flow. They're not the harried, stressed out moms I know in their thirties or forties.

I wonder what it is. Less need for sleep?

Not the ones I've met. They're usually stressed for money, their jobs aren't as flexible and kids spend more time in daycare. I even think less patient.

Then again, the moms I know who had kids in their 30s aren't harried or stressed out. We have good spouses and strong savings.

Yes it probably depends on where you live. I'm in LA and the young moms I meet are rich. The older moms are UMC or rich depending.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Young moms seem to adapt to parenting better. Maybe because they're so young they don't realize what they're giving up yet and so it doesn't feel like as much of a sacrifice?

But the ones I meet almost always seem to cheerful and well adjusted. They seem very go with the flow. They're not the harried, stressed out moms I know in their thirties or forties.

I wonder what it is. Less need for sleep?

Not the ones I've met. They're usually stressed for money, their jobs aren't as flexible and kids spend more time in daycare. I even think less patient.

Then again, the moms I know who had kids in their 30s aren't harried or stressed out. We have good spouses and strong savings.

This is my experience as well, with the added point that the dads are rarely in the picture. But the young moms I know are late teens/early twenties who got unexpectedly pregnant by a boyfriend, not married women with at least a bachelor's under their belt. I could see women like the latter group being better rested/well-adjusted because they're not yet in the sandwich-generation position which is what contributes to the stress in your late 30s/early 40s.

[Anonymous]

It is unusual. I assume the 20 somethings are the nannies not the moms

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:It is unusual. I assume the 20 somethings are the nannies not the moms

Lol me too.

It wouldn’t be my choice to be a young mom (I was terrified of getting pregnant in my 20s) but I know it’s other people’s choice to be young parents. They have their reasons and I have mine. No judgment either way.

[Anonymous]

I had my first at 26 and I have wondered if the more upper class people I run into judge me, but I can never be sure. They also might have been judging me for my thrift-store clothes (I don’t dress classy at all) or zip code or other class markers. The people I’m friends with don’t judge me at all.

I am so glad I know so many chill people. I have met all my friends here at the playground at our south Arlington school and my husband’s job and he works for a really down-to-earth law firm.

Anyway! Yes, the PP who said it’s all misogyny is correct. You can never win with the patriarchy so you might as well quit trying.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Young moms seem to adapt to parenting better. Maybe because they're so young they don't realize what they're giving up yet and so it doesn't feel like as much of a sacrifice?

But the ones I meet almost always seem to cheerful and well adjusted. They seem very go with the flow. They're not the harried, stressed out moms I know in their thirties or forties.

I wonder what it is. Less need for sleep?

I think the physiology of it has got to be a big factor. But also if they aren’t trying to scramble to balance a career with motherhood.

Yes, my sister had kids at 24 and 26, and was a SAHM with a reasonably successful DH. She seemed to manage pretty well. I had kids in my 30's and it was a more difficult adjustment and I was trying to work at the same time, so I felt a lot more stressed.

[Anonymous]

I definitely probably looked down at young moms when I was in my 20s. Now I’m in my 40s and don’t care when someone has a baby. I know many more women who seem to have been unable to find a partner or divorced their partner. People’s personal and family choices are none of my business.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:It's unquestionably a thing in the highly educated, UMC, elite professional circles that people like Liz Bruenig run in

This.

And if you were in a different socio-economic bracket in a different part of the country, having your kids in your mid to late 30s would be a thing.

It's not personal. You're just going against the herd a bit in terms of timing and people will endlessly comment on people who are outside the norm because it makes insecure people feel forced to question their own decision making. If everyone does the same thing, it feels safer.

OP here. I get this but it's weird that people still feel the need to comment on it to me at 39 because I have a thirteen year old and they maybe have a toddler or baby. I sometimes feel like saying, look I'm sorry you're stuck in the parenting trenches right now but you'll come out on the other side too, lol. It doesn't stay that hard forever.

That's kind of rude.

Unless the people who have the toddler or baby are rude to you, like saying "oh, well, you must not have gone to college" or something similar, there's no reason to be flippant to them. Being surprised that you have a 13-year old when you're 39 isn't rude in and of itself.

You don't think it's rude and invasive to aggressively question people about their age and reproductive choices in a professional setting?? I'm honestly amazed at how many people have thought it was appropriate to say something to me about my age and my children's ages at work. Including asking me if my pregnancies were intended and if I was religious! (and also joking if I know how babies are made )

Yeah, that's exactly what I said.

Go back and read the post before the one I commented on.

You said her thought (which she didn't express) was rude but the people questioning her are the rude ones imo. How about we just stop commenting on women's reproductive choices, bodies, ages, choices about aging, period? It does blow my mind what people think is normal to say.

She said they COMMENTED on it, not QUESTIONED her. I could comment on how beautiful your house is, but I guess you'd find that rude?

"You have a THIRTEEN year old?" "How old are you again??" "Did you grow up religious??"

You do realize you're making stuff up to fit your narrative, correct? I've got your number, you always have to be right. So ok, you win. Feel better now?

[Anonymous]

People just hate Elizabeth Bruenig and look for ways to attack her.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:There is stigma against young mothers. There is stigma against older mothers. There is stigma against working moms. There is stigma against SAHMs. There is stigma against women who chose not to become a mother. There is stigma against women who struggle to become moms (though weirdly it’s started to feel like this is the one woman we’re ok with because she wants to be a mom but hasn’t achieved it — we feel sorry for her but don’t hate her, lucky her).

So often these conversations wind up falling apart as women argue over their choices and options and how they are treated by other women... there is no way to resolve it among ourselves. Women are set up to compete with each other and them criticized when we do.

It’s misogyny. All of it. And the best thing we as women could do is simply support and defend each other against it, rather than seizing an opportunity to position ourselves as “one of the good women who made the right choices.” You see, there are no right choices. Half the time, what is treated as choice is not.

I love young moms and old moms and women who are not moms and working women and trans women and tired women and happy women and all the women. You are all doing great. Let’s make sure we all have access to healthcare (including abortions and birth control), access to economic independence, and freedom from harassment and assault. Everything else is immaterial.

+1,000,000


I’ve lived 50 years now, from being teased by the neighborhood boys when I was only 7 that I must be a women’s libber (I had never said anything about women’s lib, I was only 7 - I suppose they were parroting conversations between parents at home) to harassment in the workplace as a peon to harassment in academia to harassment as the top lawyer of a jurisdiction. And all along the way, beginning with my own mother, the reality that so many of my sisters would put pleasing the male gaze above supporting another female.

Misogyny is sickening, and most sickening when it is internalized. It is deeply internalized even in a great many feminists. And a great many of us are raising the next generation of entitled lazy men who will harass and take advantage of our daughters for decades to come.

All mothers and all women are judged, most harshly by other women. The truth is that women have a great deal of power in society, if they’d only exercise it. Patriarchy only succeeds because of the willing participation of women.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:There is stigma against young mothers. There is stigma against older mothers. There is stigma against working moms. There is stigma against SAHMs. There is stigma against women who chose not to become a mother. There is stigma against women who struggle to become moms (though weirdly it’s started to feel like this is the one woman we’re ok with because she wants to be a mom but hasn’t achieved it — we feel sorry for her but don’t hate her, lucky her).

So often these conversations wind up falling apart as women argue over their choices and options and how they are treated by other women... there is no way to resolve it among ourselves. Women are set up to compete with each other and them criticized when we do.

It’s misogyny. All of it. And the best thing we as women could do is simply support and defend each other against it, rather than seizing an opportunity to position ourselves as “one of the good women who made the right choices.” You see, there are no right choices. Half the time, what is treated as choice is not.

I love young moms and old moms and women who are not moms and working women and trans women and tired women and happy women and all the women. You are all doing great. Let’s make sure we all have access to healthcare (including abortions and birth control), access to economic independence, and freedom from harassment and assault. Everything else is immaterial.

THIS.