9yo DD left off invitation WWYD?

[Anonymous]

OP, obviously you and your family can do what you want, but please understand that your friends did not intend to slight your daughter at all. As others have said, the bar mitzvah party is usually considered a party for two groups --13 yo friends of the BM boy or girl (many of whom are there without parents) and friends/relatives of the parents. Sometimes if there is an older or younger sibling the family will invite a few kids of that age to hang out with the sibling. Other non-relatives are usually not invited except for very close friends who may be included as a whole family. Many people do not invite their friends' kids unless they are close with the BM kid, which is obviously the case with your son. Because this is the totally normal practice, your friends would not think that this was something that would upset you because undoubtedly it has happened to them many times and they think nothing of it. (and having gone to many of these, 9 year olds with no buddies to hang out with usually do not enjoy it at all).

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I agree that it's poor form to invite a whole family except one child. It's just.... unkind. However if you like these people, I would take my son and leave my husband home with my daughter as others suggested.

But if you get there and there are other 9 YO girls in attendance? I'd be pissed. Probably wouldn't get over that.

Those other 9 year old girls might be FAMILY or from longterm childhood friends of the family. There are 2 relationships: son and adult friends.

Or out of town guests. Only dh and I were invited to the BM of the daughter of one of my closest college friends when we all lived in same town. We moved out of state and kids were included in friend's second child's BM. If I were the mitzvah parent's, I would have invited Op's whole family. But op shouldn't be mad at her neighbor.

[Anonymous]

BAR, not BAT - perhaps THAT'S the difference?

Anonymous wrote:Any thought on how to handle this situation?
Our neighbors are terrific, nice people. Our DS and their DS are close in age and have been buddies since they were 6 years old. We just got an invite from the neighbor for the son's Bar Mitzvah. It was specifically addressed to DH, DS and me. Our 9yo DD was not on the invite. When their older son had his Bar Mitzvah our DD was not invited (the neighbor told me she would not be inviting her as she was only 2yo at the time and 'there will be nothing for her to do there'). I was fine with that, she was barely 2 and its not like she would have a great time.

However, this time she is 9, she saw the invitation as soon as it came, she read it and is now really excited to be going, she loves the neighbor kid, she's talking about getting a new dress, and looking forward to going.

1) I feel uncomfortable asking the neighbor to include her, I would feel like she would be compelled to tell me to bring her but if they wanted her there in the first place they would have invited her.
2) I do feel a little slighted that the whole family was invited except her (like I said, I understood last time, she was really young
3) If we don't go, my neighbor's feelings will be hurt, the boys are really close
4) DH will be furious and won't go without DD, it will certainly impact the friendship we have with the neighbors. In our culture (DH is not American born), this is a huge slight and insult.

I don't know if I should talk to her, just make up an excuse to not go, or what.
Any thoughts?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Why is NO ONE listening to the Jewish people on this thread?

People are listening to the Jewish people on the thread. That does not mean that people have to do things exactly the way the Jewish posters say they would do it.

Inviting the parents may be intended as an honor, but one is allowed to decline an honor. It's an honor to be proposed to. Doesn't mean you have to marry the person who asked.

The husband should stop sulking, but he should be given a pass if he decides he'd rather do something with his daughter than go to the BM.

[Anonymous]

Yes. But to say that OP should feel offended or should tell the host that DD is offended and ask for an invitation for her is completely out of line and truly a slap in the face for what was truly an invitation of honor. It's a cultural thing that OP is missing and taking as a slight. Very unfortunate. This is a learning experience. So sad that people automatically look for the bad instead of the good...

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Why is NO ONE listening to the Jewish people on this thread?

Customs don't trump rudeness .

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Why is NO ONE listening to the Jewish people on this thread?

Customs don't trump rudeness .

But it's not rude if it's the accepted norm in the culture/religion of this ceremony. This isn't a birthday party--it's a very very important religious ritual to specifically observe a child changing into an adult. If you're offended it's because you can't look outside your own ideas of how YOUR culture does things. But that's ridiculous. You'd probably be offended if a Muslim came over during Ramadan and turned up his nose at the lovely food you offered. This is a religious occasion and I bet a zillion dollars that none of the "offended" PPs are Jewish.

If you and/or your DH want to decline the invitation, go right ahead. Nobody is saying you have to go. But it would be very ignorant to nurse a grudge over this.

[Anonymous]

I am not Jewish but it seems the Jewish PPs are pretty much all in agreement that this is how Mitzvahs are. No personal offense intended at all to OP - just the way they are done. OP and family can choose to go or not go but they shouldn't be put out or offended by something that happens to just be culturally different than what they are used to.

[Anonymous]

There was recently an advice column addressing a culture that expected all the relatives (and relatives to be) to chip in to pay for the wedding. Something can be acceptable in one culture and rude in another, and I don't see why you have to accede to another culture to prove that you are sensitive to it. I don't expect anyone to fast during my culture's times of fasting; I also don't expect them to come over and demand lunch.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Why is NO ONE listening to the Jewish people on this thread?

Customs don't trump rudeness .

But it's not rude if it's the accepted norm in the culture/religion of this ceremony. This isn't a birthday party--it's a very very important religious ritual to specifically observe a child changing into an adult. If you're offended it's because you can't look outside your own ideas of how YOUR culture does things. But that's ridiculous. You'd probably be offended if a Muslim came over during Ramadan and turned up his nose at the lovely food you offered. This is a religious occasion and I bet a zillion dollars that none of the "offended" PPs are Jewish.

If you and/or your DH want to decline the invitation, go right ahead. Nobody is saying you have to go. But it would be very ignorant to nurse a grudge over this.

I'm Jewish and I was the first person to say I think this is an outrageous thing for the host family to do. I didn't realize I was supposed to preface my response by stating "Jewish Poster HERE!!!!!"

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Yes. But to say that OP should feel offended or should tell the host that DD is offended and ask for an invitation for her is completely out of line and truly a slap in the face for what was truly an invitation of honor. It's a cultural thing that OP is missing and taking as a slight. Very unfortunate. This is a learning experience. So sad that people automatically look for the bad instead of the good...

This is OP, I am not looking for the bad, nor am I out of line. I was asking as this TOTALLY different from what I would do. We are Greek. To invite 3/4 of a family is, in our culture, a slap in the face. It is an insult and if you were to do this, the family receiving the invitation would assume that the uninvited person must have done something HORRIBLE to you, otherwise, they would not be left out. Moreover, it would likely mean your relationship with that family wouldn't be the same from that point forward. Family is family, we invite children, even young ones, to weddings and baptisms. I did not realize that Bar Mitzvah's are only for 13 year old children and a handful of adults. So that's why I asked. At the older son's baptism there were a lot of neighbors there (the parents have no nieces, nephews or cousins). I assumed the only reason DD was not invited to the older kids party was because of her age, because that is what I was told. Now that she is older, I assumed (when my neighbor was sharing her planning and talking about it) that our whole family would be invited. Now that I know its only for 13 year olds, I understand why she was not invited. I will likely take DS and DH will stay home with DD. She will be sad, yes... she has been involved with helping the neighbor's son with his project which is another reason I thought she would be included. Its not a huge deal - now that I understand.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Yes. But to say that OP should feel offended or should tell the host that DD is offended and ask for an invitation for her is completely out of line and truly a slap in the face for what was truly an invitation of honor. It's a cultural thing that OP is missing and taking as a slight. Very unfortunate. This is a learning experience. So sad that people automatically look for the bad instead of the good...

This is OP, I am not looking for the bad, nor am I out of line. I was asking as this TOTALLY different from what I would do. We are Greek. To invite 3/4 of a family is, in our culture, a slap in the face. It is an insult and if you were to do this, the family receiving the invitation would assume that the uninvited person must have done something HORRIBLE to you, otherwise, they would not be left out. Moreover, it would likely mean your relationship with that family wouldn't be the same from that point forward. Family is family, we invite children, even young ones, to weddings and baptisms. I did not realize that Bar Mitzvah's are only for 13 year old children and a handful of adults. So that's why I asked. At the older son's baptism there were a lot of neighbors there (the parents have no nieces, nephews or cousins). I assumed the only reason DD was not invited to the older kids party was because of her age, because that is what I was told. Now that she is older, I assumed (when my neighbor was sharing her planning and talking about it) that our whole family would be invited. Now that I know its only for 13 year olds, I understand why she was not invited. I will likely take DS and DH will stay home with DD. She will be sad, yes... she has been involved with helping the neighbor's son with his project which is another reason I thought she would be included. Its not a huge deal - now that I understand.

Your neighbors aren't Greek so why would you expect them to follow your cultural norms and traditions. They probably have no idea how offensive you feel this to be in your culture any more than you had no idea what was culturally appropriate for them. You can't feel slighted because a different culture has different norms and traditions. That is great that your daughter helped with a project - likely the parents aren't even thinking about that in making their decision..they haven't listed what every child has done for their son, added up points and invited accordingly. It is their party, to invite whom they wish and culturally for them it is not offensive to not invite every member of the family, particularly younger children. It is far better to explain it to your daughter from a position of cultural differences then to make her feel sad that she was excluded.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Yes. But to say that OP should feel offended or should tell the host that DD is offended and ask for an invitation for her is completely out of line and truly a slap in the face for what was truly an invitation of honor. It's a cultural thing that OP is missing and taking as a slight. Very unfortunate. This is a learning experience. So sad that people automatically look for the bad instead of the good...

This is OP, I am not looking for the bad, nor am I out of line. I was asking as this TOTALLY different from what I would do. We are Greek. To invite 3/4 of a family is, in our culture, a slap in the face. It is an insult and if you were to do this, the family receiving the invitation would assume that the uninvited person must have done something HORRIBLE to you, otherwise, they would not be left out. Moreover, it would likely mean your relationship with that family wouldn't be the same from that point forward. Family is family, we invite children, even young ones, to weddings and baptisms. I did not realize that Bar Mitzvah's are only for 13 year old children and a handful of adults. So that's why I asked. At the older son's baptism there were a lot of neighbors there (the parents have no nieces, nephews or cousins). I assumed the only reason DD was not invited to the older kids party was because of her age, because that is what I was told. Now that she is older, I assumed (when my neighbor was sharing her planning and talking about it) that our whole family would be invited. Now that I know its only for 13 year olds, I understand why she was not invited. I will likely take DS and DH will stay home with DD. She will be sad, yes... she has been involved with helping the neighbor's son with his project which is another reason I thought she would be included. Its not a huge deal - now that I understand.

Your neighbors aren't Greek so why would you expect them to follow your cultural norms and traditions. They probably have no idea how offensive you feel this to be in your culture any more than you had no idea what was culturally appropriate for them. You can't feel slighted because a different culture has different norms and traditions. That is great that your daughter helped with a project - likely the parents aren't even thinking about that in making their decision..they haven't listed what every child has done for their son, added up points and invited accordingly. It is their party, to invite whom they wish and culturally for them it is not offensive to not invite every member of the family, particularly younger children. It is far better to explain it to your daughter from a position of cultural differences then to make her feel sad that she was excluded.

Well, I kinda see OP's point.
Culture or not, its obvious the families are close and have been for years.
Would it have killed them to invite the little girl?
I like the idea of just saying "DS and I will attend, since Jane is not invited, DH will be staying home with her". I still think it may be an oversight.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP, obviously you and your family can do what you want, but please understand that your friends did not intend to slight your daughter at all. As others have said, the bar mitzvah party is usually considered a party for two groups --13 yo friends of the BM boy or girl (many of whom are there without parents) and friends/relatives of the parents. Sometimes if there is an older or younger sibling the family will invite a few kids of that age to hang out with the sibling. Other non-relatives are usually not invited except for very close friends who may be included as a whole family. Many people do not invite their friends' kids unless they are close with the BM kid, which is obviously the case with your son. Because this is the totally normal practice, your friends would not think that this was something that would upset you because undoubtedly it has happened to them many times and they think nothing of it. (and having gone to many of these, 9 year olds with no buddies to hang out with usually do not enjoy it at all).

I don't think this is about cultural norms, per se. It is about OP feeling like she and her family are very close friends to the neighbor's family and it turns out that the neighbors view this relationship as -- the boys are friends and we as their parents get along. I can see being hurt when someone doesn't view you as close/important as how you view them; if it was just that the boys were friends, they could see each other at school, soccer or wherever - not have the son almost living at her house in the summer, completely his project with her family's help etc. Presumably when the son is over at the house all the time, he interacts with the whole family, not just his 13 yr old buddy.

It depends on what you want this friendship to be. If you now want to pull back a little because they don't seem to want to be that close, I would just have your son go; he will have plenty of friends to hang out with and it won't matter to him whether you're there or not since he'll want to hang out with his friends anyway. If you believe that this is just how it is and don't want to hurt the friendship with the parents, then both of you should go if practical; or one of you stay home if necessary to babysit.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Ok I am one for not inviting kids to weddings and all but this is fucked up.

You do NOT invite an entire family and leave one child out. OP your neighbor is cheap and being an asshole. How would they feel if they all got invited to something and one of their children was left out.

The proper thing to do would have been to invite your DS only. What assholes.

I agree completely. Who would leave out only one person from a neighbor family that has practically treated the BM boy as their own?