Being Counseled Out

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Agree with PP. if anyone would be kind enough to share schools it could save some of us

It happens at all schools.

Exactly. Every private school has counseled students out. Still, it’s relatively rare.

School administrators aren’t looking for bad PR and know that parents talk to each other. Counseling out usually is a last resort after trying in-school interventions and asking families to seek outside academic or behavioral help.

Yes, but in the manner OP describes? No warning. No counseling. No discussion. When the admissions cycle is nearly over so the child has limited opportunity to apply out? Is that normal? Are the schools all so cold?

This is the issue here - if this is related to behavior incident in Dec why not communicate it in Dec if there was no coming back from the incident? If it is academics why not earlier?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Agree with PP. if anyone would be kind enough to share schools it could save some of us

It happens at all schools.

Exactly. Every private school has counseled students out. Still, it’s relatively rare.

School administrators aren’t looking for bad PR and know that parents talk to each other. Counseling out usually is a last resort after trying in-school interventions and asking families to seek outside academic or behavioral help.

Yes, but in the manner OP describes? No warning. No counseling. No discussion. When the admissions cycle is nearly over so the child has limited opportunity to apply out? Is that normal? Are the schools all so cold?

The kids I know who were asked to leave did things like: throw chairs in the cafeteria, bring a weapon, touch other kids inappropriately. They were instantly dismissed. There really isn't any counseling or discussion that makes those things ok.

[Anonymous]

One incident is enough for a private school which is in demand.

[Anonymous]

It doesn’t sound like OP’s child did any of those things

[Anonymous]

There's probably some missing information here. If you are new to private school, what happened at the previous school? How serious was the incident in Dec? Maybe after the break they had time to gather more information and get a full picture of the situation and make a decision.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:It doesn’t sound like OP’s child did any of those things

These decisions are not taken lightly. Would love to know what actually happened.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Agree with PP. if anyone would be kind enough to share schools it could save some of us

It happens at all schools.

Exactly. Every private school has counseled students out. Still, it’s relatively rare.

School administrators aren’t looking for bad PR and know that parents talk to each other. Counseling out usually is a last resort after trying in-school interventions and asking families to seek outside academic or behavioral help.

Yes, but in the manner OP describes? No warning. No counseling. No discussion. When the admissions cycle is nearly over so the child has limited opportunity to apply out? Is that normal? Are the schools all so cold?

OP said “In terms of the counseling out, it is that they are holding the contract and will come up with a plan.” So while this may be the first they’ve heard of it, it sounds like it’s the start of a discussion, not a one-and-done “your kid is out” meeting.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We are new to private schools. Is it unusual for a school to just start a conversation about a school not being a good fit a few weeks before reenrollment contracts go out? Never had an indication it was a thought until a meeting today. There were no prior meetings indicating it was a possibility. Wondering if this is normally how the process works? I would think they would try to let families know in time to apply other places? Just wondering other experiences. Thanks in advance.

Yes. And for some kids towards the end of the year. In my kids’ lower school 2 families were counseled out of improper fit. One because the child needed more support (LDs) than the school could reasonably supply. The other because the parents made some racist comments about Jews - they were Arabic but not Palestinian (Pakistani). The kid told some Jewish kids terrible things and the parents sent him to school on a free dress day with a Palestine shirt. The school wasn’t a good fit for him and his family. In our upper school the only kids I know that were counseled out had reputations for being “druggies”.

The above bolded comments are racist 1) Arabic is a language Arab is an ethnicity 2) Palestinians and Pakistanis are not confused for one another and 3) Pakistani’s do not speak Arabic nor are they Arab they are Pakistani and speak Arabic. Maybe the school should council you out as your comments are extremely offensive, racist and frankly stupid.

DP here. I lived in Pakistan for a few years for my job, and I know the culture well. Many Pakistanis who are religious and grew up there or in another Muslim country DO know at least some Arabic because their holy book is written in it and people who receive a formal education in the Quran learn Arabic. The mullahs know Arabic. The imams know Arabic. Many families pay for their children to receive religious instruction, which includes Arabic. A middle or upper middle class Pakistani family paying for private school in DC most likely does pay for their children to receive religious instruction/"Quran lessons", so yes, the kids will know at least some Arabic.

The anti-Semitism that is deeply entrenched in Pakstani culture/society was horrifying. People would causally say the most hateful things about "the Jews", and I was shocked more than once when a different Pakistani colleague I considered Westernized (university in the West, etc) would just casually trot out the most racist/anti-Semitic things. It is very plausible that kids would hear such things from parents who were born there, even in the West, and we know kids often repeat things even when told not to do so, so yeah. I believe this happened.

I am sure now someone will tell me I am wrong, but I lived there and you did not.

Um, no. Most Pakistanis do not speak Arabic. Most Muslims who are devout or have religious schooling do memorize Quranic verses in Arabic, which is the original language of the Quran. But that does not mean they actually know Arabic. They rote memorize and may (emphasis on *may*) learn the meaning of the verses in their native tongue.

You really don’t know what you’re talking about. And the mullahs do not represent the people.

Moreover, many Pakistanis are illiterate. You think they’re going to dabble in multiple languages? In fact in the countryside, a lot of them speak their regional languages (Pashto, Sindhi, Pahari, etc.) and they don’t speak Urdu very well.

-An American of Pakistani descent who happens to speak Urdu and Arabic only because I studied Arabic in college on the East Coast

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Agree with PP. if anyone would be kind enough to share schools it could save some of us

It happens at all schools.

Exactly. Every private school has counseled students out. Still, it’s relatively rare.

School administrators aren’t looking for bad PR and know that parents talk to each other. Counseling out usually is a last resort after trying in-school interventions and asking families to seek outside academic or behavioral help.

Yes, but in the manner OP describes? No warning. No counseling. No discussion. When the admissions cycle is nearly over so the child has limited opportunity to apply out? Is that normal? Are the schools all so cold?

OP said “In terms of the counseling out, it is that they are holding the contract and will come up with a plan.” So while this may be the first they’ve heard of it, it sounds like it’s the start of a discussion, not a one-and-done “your kid is out” meeting.

Agree that this is probably start and that you should start looking elsewhere during next year's admission cycle. Is your child in a grade near the end of LS or MS where it may be an easier time to transition out? Also, take it as a sign that they are going to be watching your kid more closely and have less tolerance for even minor infractions. That happened to my kid and even though we weren't asked to leave decided that the pressure of having to be perfect was too much.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Agree with PP. if anyone would be kind enough to share schools it could save some of us

It happens at all schools.

Exactly. Every private school has counseled students out. Still, it’s relatively rare.

School administrators aren’t looking for bad PR and know that parents talk to each other. Counseling out usually is a last resort after trying in-school interventions and asking families to seek outside academic or behavioral help.

Yes, but in the manner OP describes? No warning. No counseling. No discussion. When the admissions cycle is nearly over so the child has limited opportunity to apply out? Is that normal? Are the schools all so cold?

The kids I know who were asked to leave did things like: throw chairs in the cafeteria, bring a weapon, touch other kids inappropriately. They were instantly dismissed. There really isn't any counseling or discussion that makes those things ok.

This doesn’t sound like that sort of incident, does it? If it was, why wait weeks - until contracts are offered?

[Anonymous]

There are three kids I know of (including my own) who are in counsel out discussions at our “Big 3” school. Despite how the school portrays itself, it’s not a good place. Communication is terrible. My child’s mental health has been totally destroyed. I’m excited for next year. I wish I could name it but we need to play nice until we have contracts signed somewhere else. Once the school offers you a contract I would ask very specific questions about how many kids are counseled out each year.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Agree with PP. if anyone would be kind enough to share schools it could save some of us

It happens at all schools.

Exactly. Every private school has counseled students out. Still, it’s relatively rare.

School administrators aren’t looking for bad PR and know that parents talk to each other. Counseling out usually is a last resort after trying in-school interventions and asking families to seek outside academic or behavioral help.

Yes, but in the manner OP describes? No warning. No counseling. No discussion. When the admissions cycle is nearly over so the child has limited opportunity to apply out? Is that normal? Are the schools all so cold?

It's not that unusual. But having been down this road (though not actually counseled out), two things - 1) Sometimes schools bring things up obliquely or downplay them to the parents and only later do you come to realize it was actually a bigger deal than it was presented, or the school said it in "school-ese" which can be hard for parents to interpret, and 2) it's usually possible to get in somewhere else off-cycle. Generally you are looking at that point for a school that is more SN-leaning, and those schools are used to this. The current school will usually help make that work. I know several families who were counseled out of our private and they all landed at other schools.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Agree with PP. if anyone would be kind enough to share schools it could save some of us

It happens at all schools.

Exactly. Every private school has counseled students out. Still, it’s relatively rare.

School administrators aren’t looking for bad PR and know that parents talk to each other. Counseling out usually is a last resort after trying in-school interventions and asking families to seek outside academic or behavioral help.

Yes, but in the manner OP describes? No warning. No counseling. No discussion. When the admissions cycle is nearly over so the child has limited opportunity to apply out? Is that normal? Are the schools all so cold?

OP said “In terms of the counseling out, it is that they are holding the contract and will come up with a plan.” So while this may be the first they’ve heard of it, it sounds like it’s the start of a discussion, not a one-and-done “your kid is out” meeting.

Agree that this is probably start and that you should start looking elsewhere during next year's admission cycle. Is your child in a grade near the end of LS or MS where it may be an easier time to transition out? Also, take it as a sign that they are going to be watching your kid more closely and have less tolerance for even minor infractions. That happened to my kid and even though we weren't asked to leave decided that the pressure of having to be perfect was too much.

Agree - except ours was for academic and somewhat unexpected.

School asked us to get testing done in May of last year, we did over the summer ($6K). Report said child may be dyslexic, so the school set up a support plan. Three months in and our child's reading has improved to basically grade level, but right after break, they asked for a meeting and suggested we look at other schools. Definitely felt unexpected given testing and progress after short term intervention (school specialist said dyslexia would have been considered very mild and did not think we needed to pull our child from the school). In my mind, if they couldn’t support even mild needs they should have said so and not required us to pay for private testing. In the end we are actively looking for other schools -- while our school has a lot of pluses, I do not want to keep my child in a school that sees my child as a burden or broken. I have no issue with them being honest about what they are willing and not willing to do, but it could have been handled far better.

And sadly ours is not the only experience at this school - I am four families who experienced the same (did not leave) including one who has been alerted to a kindergarten students reading challenges and suggested the child was a burden, which is crazy b/c kids in kindergarten don't always know how to read right away. And four kids is a lot since class sizes are in the 16-20 range.

All that to say, I think this happens more than people realize. I wish I had known enough to ask questions about the school's posture towards potential academic support but was definitely not on my list of questions in pre-K – probably would not sting as bad as it does if I had been prepared or may not have chosen the school.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:As someone trying to decide which schools to apply to, it’s disappointing that no one name schools. Understandable but it seems other families and children could be saved these experiences if they knew how schools handle these situations and which ones to avoid.

Some schools manage this more compassionately than others but it is pretty wrenching for families to go through regardless. At the same time, when kids aren't a good fit for the capabilities and staffing of the school, it's terrible for them, and it's problematic for the rest of the class too and diminishes their experience.

[Anonymous]

For PP who said you’ve been done this road but not counseled out what did you end up doing?