MIL move in to memory care next week- advised to lie to her

[Anonymous]

OP? Any news?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:They know what typically works for most and what helps the transition go more smoothly. They also know many will be unable to heed the advise, and make the transition much more difficult for all involved.

They're trying to make their own jobs easier by lying to a patient. It's deeply unethical. There's no way I would lie to my loved one, even if she had dementia. I would also visit as I felt necessary. I would start my regular, planned visitation schedule and get into a routine.

Let me guess -- you're someone who will keep correcting their parent with dementia, and making sure they understand exactly the truth of what is going on. Because that's what good people do, instead of any shade of lying.

My 90 year old mother thinks her brother, who died when I was in high school, is still alive. I tried to correct her once and she cried as though he had just died that day. By this logic, not lying to her, should I keep correcting her when she asks when Arnold is coming to visit by saying "Oh, he isn't. He's dead." We usually just say "In a little while, he's having car trouble." It seems like lying to her is a lot less cruel than telling her every fifteen minutes that her brother is dead.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:They know what typically works for most and what helps the transition go more smoothly. They also know many will be unable to heed the advise, and make the transition much more difficult for all involved.

They're trying to make their own jobs easier by lying to a patient. It's deeply unethical. There's no way I would lie to my loved one, even if she had dementia. I would also visit as I felt necessary. I would start my regular, planned visitation schedule and get into a routine.

Let me guess -- you're someone who will keep correcting their parent with dementia, and making sure they understand exactly the truth of what is going on. Because that's what good people do, instead of any shade of lying.

My 90 year old mother thinks her brother, who died when I was in high school, is still alive. I tried to correct her once and she cried as though he had just died that day. By this logic, not lying to her, should I keep correcting her when she asks when Arnold is coming to visit by saying "Oh, he isn't. He's dead." We usually just say "In a little while, he's having car trouble." It seems like lying to her is a lot less cruel than telling her every fifteen minutes that her brother is dead.

I 100% agree. People with dementia are very much in the moment. If you can give them equilibrium and a sense of well-being (especially if their short-term memory is gone) on any given moment, then that’s a good thing. It’s not cruel to fib.

[Anonymous]

.*in any given moment ^^

[Anonymous]

As dementia progresses, the most important thing to focus on is your loved one's mood. Don't create unnecessary conflict.

[Anonymous]

OP, I hope it went well.

FWIW, I would totally lie to my mom and not feel bad about it. If it were helpful, I would limit my visits at first to improve her chances of settling in.

I don’t lack empathy but I’m putting her best shot at ongoing care first. I would check in with the facility, though.

[Anonymous]

OP here- it went as well as it could, which is well overall.

FIL, SIL, DH and caregiver (since Oct 2023) took MIL to facility for another "lunch." Once they arrived, MIL was taken to participate in an activity in another area (this place has activities every 30 mins from 8 am breakfast to 8 pm evening prayer time)
This gave DH and the rest time to go put more items in MIL's new room.
Lunch time and they all sat together for the meal. One by one, they excused themselves gradually from the table. The only one left with MIL was her caregiver, Then, two aides came to table, one to tell caregiver she was needed elsewhere and the other to sit with MIL. And that was the drop off. Lots of redirection and distraction.

FIL called director this morning and MIL did have a rough night but eventually slept. Initially didn't want to go to breakfast but did, and ate. Didn't want to join in morning activity so aide sat with her in main area and they watched a movie. She may have joined the walking club for a stroll afterwards.

So, a slightly bumpy transition but these folks know what they are doing. We are looking forward to seeing her in her new place when it is the best time for her. We don't want to do anything to upset her, because she is in a great place. It is the best of a sad situation (dementia.)
Thanks for all the well wishes and info here!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I would let father-in-law tell her what he wants to tell her. They have been married for decades.

I would not want a family member in a facility in which the family was not told to visit for a week.

Understand memory care is essentially a lockdown facility like prison.

Memory care is Not like a prison. Yes, it is (and should be ) a locked down facility so nobody can sneak out and get lost. But it can (and should be ) a bright warm place, where there is lots to do, an outdoor area that is safe (Typically it's a courtyard between the buildings, so no vision/fence to outside so you don't even think "I am in prison")

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:They know what typically works for most and what helps the transition go more smoothly. They also know many will be unable to heed the advise, and make the transition much more difficult for all involved.

What they “know” is that witnesses are troublesome. Anybody who wants to control a helpless individual, young or old, by getting them out of the sight of family members, is acting for their own benefit, not the benefit of the helpless person.

Do you have any experience with Dementia/Memory care? They can become combative and difficult to deal with. Being reminded daily of their family and possibly their outside life (pre arrival at the memory care facility) can be traumatic.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:They know what typically works for most and what helps the transition go more smoothly. They also know many will be unable to heed the advise, and make the transition much more difficult for all involved.

They're trying to make their own jobs easier by lying to a patient. It's deeply unethical. There's no way I would lie to my loved one, even if she had dementia. I would also visit as I felt necessary. I would start my regular, planned visitation schedule and get into a routine.

Have you ever had a close relative with dementia? Lying is not "unethical" they often cannot remember that you visited the day before or who you are some days. So you tell them what is needed to keep them calm and happiest. It's actually the sane thing to do in a difficult situation

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Some yes, some no. No contact for a week is cruel.

That would be a huge red flag to me. I have never encountered that and would not choose a facility that wanted that.

Agree, what will they be doing that they don’t want you to see? Ignoring her until she is complacent? Memory care should welcome visitors as it brightens up the place. My mom’s memory care - they loved seeing family visit as much as possible.

And so does this place, most likely, just not the first few days a new patient is adjusting to their new environment.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No contact for a week is pretty standard. I am wondering if the people reacting like this is the most cruel thing ever have received or acted on this advice before?

What is actually cruel is to do is to string someone along who is adjusting and force them to re-start every day or half day. A week allows them to adjust to a new normal and acclimate to what is NOW their LIFE in a healthy and real way.

It's like if you have a kindergartener who didn't like being at kindergarten all day. The school would not let you go visit twice a day because...every day would be a miserable re-start and would hamper their adjustment and affect other kids. Same for residents.

If she is adjusting well, believe me, no one will bar you from entry or discourage you from visiting. They just want you to prepare for being a cooperative partner in her care by employing this best practice that is difficult but ultimately, humane, and it works.

Best of luck, OP. They will likely have her pretend she works there in some capacity, give her jobs to do. It's actually a really fortunate set up that she's old hat. They know her history, right?

Thank you for providing the alternative perspective. I don't know if I agree, but, I do understand a bit better. I don't think it is quite like Kindergarten because you are not lying to kids.

But you don't lie to a K because they can understand and comprehend what you are telling them. The adult in memory care cannot anymore. So if you saying "I'll be back tomorrow" makes them happier for the rest of today, and then tomorrow they cannot even remember you had visited, are you really harming them? Seems like you are helping them all the way around

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:You would never leave your young child in a place that didn't allow you to check on them at will. Why would you leave an equally vulnerable elder with no checks for a week?

I have seen amazing care in relatively spartan SNFs with a lot of medicaid beds, and I've seen bad stuff in very pricey facilities, and the other way around. It doesn't matter how good you think they are, or how good they were last month. Things change. Someone needs to be watching carefully, because unfortunately you just cannot trust "the facility."

Most daycares and preschools do not want parents just showing up during the day to visit with their kid. Why? Because it's distracting to that kid and all the others. So while they may say "you can stop by and visit" for the first few months, they dont' really want you to. The kid needs to get used to their routine.

I say this as a parent of a kid who cried like the world was coming to an end at drop-off for preschool. By the time I pulled out of the driveway, the tears were wiped away, big smile and kid was happily playing. (this was confirmed to me by parents who dropped off after me). My kid was just a good manipulator and knew from age 9 months how to turn on the tears for effect and off when they got what they wanted (we tested it with a cookie one time at about 10 months----tears stopped in 2 seconds and kid went to immediately happy and cheerful when given the damn cookie).
I knew my kid was safe, I knew they were just a big manipulator and were happy once I left. Had I kept stopping back during the day, the same scenario would have happened, disrupting everyone at school as well.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:They know what typically works for most and what helps the transition go more smoothly. They also know many will be unable to heed the advise, and make the transition much more difficult for all involved.

They're trying to make their own jobs easier by lying to a patient. It's deeply unethical. There's no way I would lie to my loved one, even if she had dementia. I would also visit as I felt necessary. I would start my regular, planned visitation schedule and get into a routine.

Let me guess -- you're someone who will keep correcting their parent with dementia, and making sure they understand exactly the truth of what is going on. Because that's what good people do, instead of any shade of lying.

My 90 year old mother thinks her brother, who died when I was in high school, is still alive. I tried to correct her once and she cried as though he had just died that day. By this logic, not lying to her, should I keep correcting her when she asks when Arnold is coming to visit by saying "Oh, he isn't. He's dead." We usually just say "In a little while, he's having car trouble." It seems like lying to her is a lot less cruel than telling her every fifteen minutes that her brother is dead.

it is! You tell them whatever lie works (he's gone to grocery store, whatever works) and if it keeps them happy, that is most often for the best.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP here- it went as well as it could, which is well overall.

FIL, SIL, DH and caregiver (since Oct 2023) took MIL to facility for another "lunch." Once they arrived, MIL was taken to participate in an activity in another area (this place has activities every 30 mins from 8 am breakfast to 8 pm evening prayer time)
This gave DH and the rest time to go put more items in MIL's new room.
Lunch time and they all sat together for the meal. One by one, they excused themselves gradually from the table. The only one left with MIL was her caregiver, Then, two aides came to table, one to tell caregiver she was needed elsewhere and the other to sit with MIL. And that was the drop off. Lots of redirection and distraction.

FIL called director this morning and MIL did have a rough night but eventually slept. Initially didn't want to go to breakfast but did, and ate. Didn't want to join in morning activity so aide sat with her in main area and they watched a movie. She may have joined the walking club for a stroll afterwards.

So, a slightly bumpy transition but these folks know what they are doing. We are looking forward to seeing her in her new place when it is the best time for her. We don't want to do anything to upset her, because she is in a great place. It is the best of a sad situation (dementia.)
Thanks for all the well wishes and info here!

Glad it went relatively well, all things considered! Must be a relief for you and your DH.

And yes, this demonstrates exactly why the staff recommended "not visiting" for a week. She had a rough time adjusting that first night and first morning. Any gains made, would be set back by family showing up to visit. Give her time to adjust, and start participating in activities and then she will be better suited for changes in her day/visitors. The staff obviously care and know what they are dealing with