Dmv muslims, what do you think about what’s going on in Hamtramck

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My husband grew up in a Muslim family and he still talks about how traumatizing it was to see a lamb sacrificed as a child. I’m a meat eater and still find meat factories traumatizing. Animals to be eaten are generally not treated well.

At least the Muslims got their hands dirty and weren't hypocrites about it.

It’s not even just that. It’s the method.

The animal’s neck is slit, not enough to kill it, just enough to make it bleed. Then the alive animal lays there until it is completely bled out with spectators celebrating.

A slow, torturous death. Think about that when you’re eating someplace with halal meat.

Please stop making things up, this is not true. The animal is killed with a swift cut instantly to prevent any pain. Islam forbids torturing animals and requires kindness to all animals. Yes, we eat meat but it is no different than any other people, except vegetarians. I find it disturbing when people like you try to vilify Muslims for eating meat, the rules are similar to kosher. If you have a problem with Muslims eating meat then you should have a problem with anyone eating meat.

They're not villifying people for eating meat. They're expressing their disgust with slitting an animal's throat in public.

This is plain and simply antisemtic and islamaphobic to denounce kosher/halal methods of slaughter over other methods. No wonder our food system is full of toxins. Eating blood is not good for you.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My husband grew up in a Muslim family and he still talks about how traumatizing it was to see a lamb sacrificed as a child. I’m a meat eater and still find meat factories traumatizing. Animals to be eaten are generally not treated well.

At least the Muslims got their hands dirty and weren't hypocrites about it.

It’s not even just that. It’s the method.

The animal’s neck is slit, not enough to kill it, just enough to make it bleed. Then the alive animal lays there until it is completely bled out with spectators celebrating.

A slow, torturous death. Think about that when you’re eating someplace with halal meat.

Please stop making things up, this is not true. The animal is killed with a swift cut instantly to prevent any pain. Islam forbids torturing animals and requires kindness to all animals. Yes, we eat meat but it is no different than any other people, except vegetarians. I find it disturbing when people like you try to vilify Muslims for eating meat, the rules are similar to kosher. If you have a problem with Muslims eating meat then you should have a problem with anyone eating meat.

They're not villifying people for eating meat. They're expressing their disgust with slitting an animal's throat in public.

This is plain and simply antisemtic and islamaphobic to denounce kosher/halal methods of slaughter over other methods. No wonder our food system is full of toxins. Eating blood is not good for you.

Cite?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2023/jun/17/hamtramck-michigan-muslim-council-lgbtq-pride-flags-banned

- first in the United States to elect a Muslim-majority city council.
They viewed the power shift and diversity as a symbolic but meaningful rebuke of the Islamophobic rhetoric that was a central theme of then Republican presidential candidate Donald Trump’s campaign.

- same council voted to ban pride flags on city property

- Muslims said to be proud of being in a “fa9 less city”

- historical polish community feels backstabbed

“ There’s a sense of betrayal,” said the former Hamtramck mayor Karen Majewski, who is Polish American. “We supported you when you were threatened, and now our rights are threatened, and you’re the one doing the threatening.”

— Muslim city council passéd law allowing “backyard animal sacrifice”

*do dmv Muslims do this?

- white, Christian-majority city council in 2005 created an ordinance to allow the Muslim call to prayer to be broadcast from the city’s mosques five times daily. It did so over objections of white city residents, and Majewski said she didn’t see the same reciprocity with roles reversed.

So what bothers me is this call to prayers broadcast over the city and not
accomodating others different from them (lgbtq/polish residents). So hypocritical.

This issue has nothing to do with liberal/conservative as some on here propose and that just diverts from the real issue which is the intolerance shown in that town.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My husband grew up in a Muslim family and he still talks about how traumatizing it was to see a lamb sacrificed as a child. I’m a meat eater and still find meat factories traumatizing. Animals to be eaten are generally not treated well.

At least the Muslims got their hands dirty and weren't hypocrites about it.

It’s not even just that. It’s the method.

The animal’s neck is slit, not enough to kill it, just enough to make it bleed. Then the alive animal lays there until it is completely bled out with spectators celebrating.

A slow, torturous death. Think about that when you’re eating someplace with halal meat.

Please stop making things up, this is not true. The animal is killed with a swift cut instantly to prevent any pain. Islam forbids torturing animals and requires kindness to all animals. Yes, we eat meat but it is no different than any other people, except vegetarians. I find it disturbing when people like you try to vilify Muslims for eating meat, the rules are similar to kosher. If you have a problem with Muslims eating meat then you should have a problem with anyone eating meat.

They're not villifying people for eating meat. They're expressing their disgust with slitting an animal's throat in public.

This is plain and simply antisemtic and islamaphobic to denounce kosher/halal methods of slaughter over other methods. No wonder our food system is full of toxins. Eating blood is not good for you.

You know what? I'm going to make a video of several animal slaughters that happen this week during Eid so that you can see exactly what it looks like. I will take a street video of how the animals are treated pre-slaughter, some of the young boys mocking, pestering, and hurting tied up animals for fun, and then a shot of the half-stripped heads, entrails, and pools of fly-covered congealed blood stinking in the streets in the days after. Then you can explain how humane and healthy the process is.

Otherwise, I'm going to assume you are an armchair do-gooder who has never seen any of this happen and prefer to form and defend your opinions with no evidence. Luckily Eid begins this this Tuesday evening. I'll post the link to my video in this thread. Can't wait to hear what you think!

[Anonymous]

Have you seen a slaughterhouse in Iowa or witnessed an industrial chicken coop in Sonoma? I have. They are gross and disgusting and that’s why I cut down on my meat consumption. Most of the world doesn’t eat meat every day especially in the developing world. You clearly are not well traveled. Why are you intent on posting videos of Muslims and Jews slaughtering animals as if they are the only ones to do so? I’m out of this discussion because it’s clear what you are…..

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Do you really think tbis is a coincidence? The Republican Party is making a play for the Muslim vote in MI and VA.

This is what you don’t get. It’s not like republicans made Muslims conservative. It’s that Muslims and conservatives share similar values. Majority of Muslims voted democrat. But now that progressives are forcing their values on Muslims, Muslims feel threatened and are voting republican. The problem is with progressives shoving their values down down everyone’s throats. I am an economically liberal socially conservative muslim. I believe in Medicare for all, unions, breaking up monopolies, an anti-war, etc. I am pro choice and support gay marriage. But now that progressives are pushing their values on my kids in schools, I am no longer voting democrat (not going to vote for republicans either). Democrats only have themselves to blame.

What you don't get is that cooler heads would have told these Muslims that they can't just run roughshod over their neighbors who are not like them. The same grace that they wanted when they first arrived. That this is the hallmark of America. It is the louder voices these day who argue that they get to strike out at things that are not of their religion. That this behavior is even possible in a municipality.
NP

Your response has nothing to do with my comment. I was commenting on how PP said that whatever is happening is no surprise because republicans are courting Muslims. It’s as if Muslims don’t have their own values and brains and are just following republicans. That’s simply not true. The reason that Muslims are voting republican is because of what progressives are doing and not because republicans are courting them.

Oh you mean the GOP that was so recently anti-Muslim has decided to give you a seat at the table because it serves their ends?

I suppose that is flattering to assume inclusion and finding that you have soooo much in common with them (conservative values etc.) Too bad Muslims are little voting blocks the GOP can use to brownish their agenda. Meanwhile, the backbone of their support comes from yhe Evangelicals for whom they will bend over backwards to support. And what do Evangelicals think of Muslims?
https://berkleycenter.georgetown.edu/responses/confronting-christian-islamophobia

You seem to be confused. No one likes the GOP. Muslims aren’t stupid and don’t need YOU to tell them how racist some republicans and evangelicals are. We experienced their racism and are under no illusions. The issue is progressives are pushing Muslims out of the Democratic Party by imposing their values on them. Muslims realize that they are part of a country where different people had different values. Even though Islam is against gay marriage for example you barely heard any opposition from the Muslim community. In fact many Muslims support gay marriage and the equality act with the rationale that we need to support the rights of other minorities because we are a minority. But now it’s gotten to the point where tolerance isn’t enough and progressive values are being forced upon us with no choice and forced on our kids. So yes as a result some Muslims have voted for the GOP as the lesser of the two evils.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:There is a slaughterhouse in Alexandria City. I think it’s inhumane and just invites issues.

Reenactment isn’t necessary

Oh and I am not sure where people get these ideas that conservative muslims are somehow liberals.

But factory farmed meat is somehow more humane.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Op, what exactly is “backyard animal sacrifice”? Killing your dog and roasting it?

I live in a Muslim country for my job. They routinely sacrifice animals for the Eid holidays; there are two Eid holidays per year. At least one of the Eid sacrifices has to do with God asking Abraham to sacrifice his son Isaac. I don't know if the second, summer Eid celebrates the same thing, but they do also sacrifice animals. Coincidentally, Eid begins on June 27, so we've been talking about this in our house.

I teach at an international school and we have a lot of kids from the host country and surrounding Muslim countries in addition to the Western expats. I had to ask my students never to talk to me about their Eid animals and how they are treated and killed because it upsets me so much. What happens is that a family will go buy a lamb or sheep or goat or camel, treat it what they think is well for a few weeks, and then kill it with the family watching. On the one hand, some Muslims here have told me the animals' deaths are "painless", but on the other hand I've heard a lot of kids (who don't understand yet how this is interpreted by non-Muslims) talking about what it actually looked like and how the animal was actually handled. I find it sickening and won't describe it here.

In wealthier areas of the Middle East, this takes place among families and is largely not visible to non-Muslims. You won't see anything to do with it as an expat in Dubai, for example, though it is happening behind the scenes. In nearby places in the region that are poorer and don't have or cater to a Western expat community, like Karachi, where I've also spent time, one sees heads and piles of innards rotting in the streets around this time (I have photos I took of this, but don't know how to post them and it probably isn't appropriate here, but it is gruesome).

I had no idea this was allowed in the US. I'm kind of appalled it happens there. I do see a culture of callousness and what we would call casual cruelty and disregard of animal welfare in general (not just the Eid sacrifices, but even the way street cats and pets are treated here), and I do think it is related. I do not think it is a good thing to expose children to violent, bloody killing of an animal during a fun celebration.

I sure hope you're vegan, because if not, boy do I have news for you.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My husband grew up in a Muslim family and he still talks about how traumatizing it was to see a lamb sacrificed as a child. I’m a meat eater and still find meat factories traumatizing. Animals to be eaten are generally not treated well.

At least the Muslims got their hands dirty and weren't hypocrites about it.

It’s not even just that. It’s the method.

The animal’s neck is slit, not enough to kill it, just enough to make it bleed. Then the alive animal lays there until it is completely bled out with spectators celebrating.

A slow, torturous death. Think about that when you’re eating someplace with halal meat.

Please stop making things up, this is not true. The animal is killed with a swift cut instantly to prevent any pain. Islam forbids torturing animals and requires kindness to all animals. Yes, we eat meat but it is no different than any other people, except vegetarians. I find it disturbing when people like you try to vilify Muslims for eating meat, the rules are similar to kosher. If you have a problem with Muslims eating meat then you should have a problem with anyone eating meat.

They're not villifying people for eating meat. They're expressing their disgust with slitting an animal's throat in public.

This is plain and simply antisemtic and islamaphobic to denounce kosher/halal methods of slaughter over other methods. No wonder our food system is full of toxins. Eating blood is not good for you.

You know what? I'm going to make a video of several animal slaughters that happen this week during Eid so that you can see exactly what it looks like. I will take a street video of how the animals are treated pre-slaughter, some of the young boys mocking, pestering, and hurting tied up animals for fun, and then a shot of the half-stripped heads, entrails, and pools of fly-covered congealed blood stinking in the streets in the days after. Then you can explain how humane and healthy the process is.

Otherwise, I'm going to assume you are an armchair do-gooder who has never seen any of this happen and prefer to form and defend your opinions with no evidence. Luckily Eid begins this this Tuesday evening. I'll post the link to my video in this thread. Can't wait to hear what you think!

And will you also post videos of the animal slaughterhouses we have here in the US where thousands upon thousands of helpless animals are slaughtered every day for American consumption? Such hypocracy!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Do you really think tbis is a coincidence? The Republican Party is making a play for the Muslim vote in MI and VA.

This is what you don’t get. It’s not like republicans made Muslims conservative. It’s that Muslims and conservatives share similar values. Majority of Muslims voted democrat. But now that progressives are forcing their values on Muslims, Muslims feel threatened and are voting republican. The problem is with progressives shoving their values down down everyone’s throats. I am an economically liberal socially conservative muslim. I believe in Medicare for all, unions, breaking up monopolies, an anti-war, etc. I am pro choice and support gay marriage. But now that progressives are pushing their values on my kids in schools, I am no longer voting democrat (not going to vote for republicans either). Democrats only have themselves to blame.

What you don't get is that cooler heads would have told these Muslims that they can't just run roughshod over their neighbors who are not like them. The same grace that they wanted when they first arrived. That this is the hallmark of America. It is the louder voices these day who argue that they get to strike out at things that are not of their religion. That this behavior is even possible in a municipality.
NP

Your response has nothing to do with my comment. I was commenting on how PP said that whatever is happening is no surprise because republicans are courting Muslims. It’s as if Muslims don’t have their own values and brains and are just following republicans. That’s simply not true. The reason that Muslims are voting republican is because of what progressives are doing and not because republicans are courting them.

Oh you mean the GOP that was so recently anti-Muslim has decided to give you a seat at the table because it serves their ends?

I suppose that is flattering to assume inclusion and finding that you have soooo much in common with them (conservative values etc.) Too bad Muslims are little voting blocks the GOP can use to brownish their agenda. Meanwhile, the backbone of their support comes from yhe Evangelicals for whom they will bend over backwards to support. And what do Evangelicals think of Muslims?
https://berkleycenter.georgetown.edu/responses/confronting-christian-islamophobia

You seem to be confused. No one likes the GOP. Muslims aren’t stupid and don’t need YOU to tell them how racist some republicans and evangelicals are. We experienced their racism and are under no illusions. The issue is progressives are pushing Muslims out of the Democratic Party by imposing their values on them. Muslims realize that they are part of a country where different people had different values. Even though Islam is against gay marriage for example you barely heard any opposition from the Muslim community. In fact many Muslims support gay marriage and the equality act with the rationale that we need to support the rights of other minorities because we are a minority. But now it’s gotten to the point where tolerance isn’t enough and progressive values are being forced upon us with no choice and forced on our kids. So yes as a result some Muslims have voted for the GOP as the lesser of the two evils.

It's a 2 party system. So it's one or the other. So for you GOP is the lesser evil?

And I don't know what to tell you?
Hamtramck is embedded in Detroit, nestled in Wayne Country and is firmly in Southeastern Michigan. So unless you are going to airlift your city to Macomb or Western Michigan, you are going to get more pushback regarding these actions than those who are out in rural Michigan.

We'll see what comes out of this.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Do you really think tbis is a coincidence? The Republican Party is making a play for the Muslim vote in MI and VA.

This is what you don’t get. It’s not like republicans made Muslims conservative. It’s that Muslims and conservatives share similar values. Majority of Muslims voted democrat. But now that progressives are forcing their values on Muslims, Muslims feel threatened and are voting republican. The problem is with progressives shoving their values down down everyone’s throats. I am an economically liberal socially conservative muslim. I believe in Medicare for all, unions, breaking up monopolies, an anti-war, etc. I am pro choice and support gay marriage. But now that progressives are pushing their values on my kids in schools, I am no longer voting democrat (not going to vote for republicans either). Democrats only have themselves to blame.

What you don't get is that cooler heads would have told these Muslims that they can't just run roughshod over their neighbors who are not like them. The same grace that they wanted when they first arrived. That this is the hallmark of America. It is the louder voices these day who argue that they get to strike out at things that are not of their religion. That this behavior is even possible in a municipality.
NP

Your response has nothing to do with my comment. I was commenting on how PP said that whatever is happening is no surprise because republicans are courting Muslims. It’s as if Muslims don’t have their own values and brains and are just following republicans. That’s simply not true. The reason that Muslims are voting republican is because of what progressives are doing and not because republicans are courting them.

Oh you mean the GOP that was so recently anti-Muslim has decided to give you a seat at the table because it serves their ends?

I suppose that is flattering to assume inclusion and finding that you have soooo much in common with them (conservative values etc.) Too bad Muslims are little voting blocks the GOP can use to brownish their agenda. Meanwhile, the backbone of their support comes from yhe Evangelicals for whom they will bend over backwards to support. And what do Evangelicals think of Muslims?
https://berkleycenter.georgetown.edu/responses/confronting-christian-islamophobia

You seem to be confused. No one likes the GOP. Muslims aren’t stupid and don’t need YOU to tell them how racist some republicans and evangelicals are. We experienced their racism and are under no illusions. The issue is progressives are pushing Muslims out of the Democratic Party by imposing their values on them. Muslims realize that they are part of a country where different people had different values. Even though Islam is against gay marriage for example you barely heard any opposition from the Muslim community. In fact many Muslims support gay marriage and the equality act with the rationale that we need to support the rights of other minorities because we are a minority. But now it’s gotten to the point where tolerance isn’t enough and progressive values are being forced upon us with no choice and forced on our kids. So yes as a result some Muslims have voted for the GOP as the lesser of the two evils.

It's a 2 party system. So it's one or the other. So for you GOP is the lesser evil?

And I don't know what to tell you?
Hamtramck is embedded in Detroit, nestled in Wayne Country and is firmly in Southeastern Michigan. So unless you are going to airlift your city to Macomb or Western Michigan, you are going to get more pushback regarding these actions than those who are out in rural Michigan.

We'll see what comes out of this.

I am PP. I live in DC not Michigan. I don’t vote GOP. I am simply explaining what’s happening in the Muslim community politically.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Do you really think tbis is a coincidence? The Republican Party is making a play for the Muslim vote in MI and VA.

This is what you don’t get. It’s not like republicans made Muslims conservative. It’s that Muslims and conservatives share similar values. Majority of Muslims voted democrat. But now that progressives are forcing their values on Muslims, Muslims feel threatened and are voting republican. The problem is with progressives shoving their values down down everyone’s throats. I am an economically liberal socially conservative muslim. I believe in Medicare for all, unions, breaking up monopolies, an anti-war, etc. I am pro choice and support gay marriage. But now that progressives are pushing their values on my kids in schools, I am no longer voting democrat (not going to vote for republicans either). Democrats only have themselves to blame.

What you don't get is that cooler heads would have told these Muslims that they can't just run roughshod over their neighbors who are not like them. The same grace that they wanted when they first arrived. That this is the hallmark of America. It is the louder voices these day who argue that they get to strike out at things that are not of their religion. That this behavior is even possible in a municipality.
NP

Your response has nothing to do with my comment. I was commenting on how PP said that whatever is happening is no surprise because republicans are courting Muslims. It’s as if Muslims don’t have their own values and brains and are just following republicans. That’s simply not true. The reason that Muslims are voting republican is because of what progressives are doing and not because republicans are courting them.

Oh you mean the GOP that was so recently anti-Muslim has decided to give you a seat at the table because it serves their ends?

I suppose that is flattering to assume inclusion and finding that you have soooo much in common with them (conservative values etc.) Too bad Muslims are little voting blocks the GOP can use to brownish their agenda. Meanwhile, the backbone of their support comes from yhe Evangelicals for whom they will bend over backwards to support. And what do Evangelicals think of Muslims?
https://berkleycenter.georgetown.edu/responses/confronting-christian-islamophobia

You seem to be confused. No one likes the GOP. Muslims aren’t stupid and don’t need YOU to tell them how racist some republicans and evangelicals are. We experienced their racism and are under no illusions. The issue is progressives are pushing Muslims out of the Democratic Party by imposing their values on them. Muslims realize that they are part of a country where different people had different values. Even though Islam is against gay marriage for example you barely heard any opposition from the Muslim community. In fact many Muslims support gay marriage and the equality act with the rationale that we need to support the rights of other minorities because we are a minority. But now it’s gotten to the point where tolerance isn’t enough and progressive values are being forced upon us with no choice and forced on our kids. So yes as a result some Muslims have voted for the GOP as the lesser of the two evils.

It's a 2 party system. So it's one or the other. So for you GOP is the lesser evil?

And I don't know what to tell you?
Hamtramck is embedded in Detroit, nestled in Wayne Country and is firmly in Southeastern Michigan. So unless you are going to airlift your city to Macomb or Western Michigan, you are going to get more pushback regarding these actions than those who are out in rural Michigan.

We'll see what comes out of this.

I am PP. I live in DC not Michigan. I don’t vote GOP. I am simply explaining what’s happening in the Muslim community politically.

Also pre Bush, lots of Arabs and Muslims would vote GOP. The GOP was viewed as better on foreign policy and friendlier to small businesses. Things changed with 9/11. Seems like now there is a lot of movement again to the GOP. This isn’t just with Muslims but with minorities in general… Hispanics… Black men etc

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:My husband grew up in a Muslim family and he still talks about how traumatizing it was to see a lamb sacrificed as a child. I’m a meat eater and still find meat factories traumatizing. Animals to be eaten are generally not treated well.

My 7yo is a huge animal lover and is vegetarian because she loves farm animals like pigs and sheep. She would be absolutely traumatized if she saw our neighbor killing a lamb or a goat.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My husband grew up in a Muslim family and he still talks about how traumatizing it was to see a lamb sacrificed as a child. I’m a meat eater and still find meat factories traumatizing. Animals to be eaten are generally not treated well.

At least the Muslims got their hands dirty and weren't hypocrites about it.

It’s not even just that. It’s the method.

The animal’s neck is slit, not enough to kill it, just enough to make it bleed. Then the alive animal lays there until it is completely bled out with spectators celebrating.

A slow, torturous death. Think about that when you’re eating someplace with halal meat.

Please stop making things up, this is not true. The animal is killed with a swift cut instantly to prevent any pain. Islam forbids torturing animals and requires kindness to all animals. Yes, we eat meat but it is no different than any other people, except vegetarians. I find it disturbing when people like you try to vilify Muslims for eating meat, the rules are similar to kosher. If you have a problem with Muslims eating meat then you should have a problem with anyone eating meat.

They're not villifying people for eating meat. They're expressing their disgust with slitting an animal's throat in public.

This is plain and simply antisemtic and islamaphobic to denounce kosher/halal methods of slaughter over other methods. No wonder our food system is full of toxins. Eating blood is not good for you.

DP I don't eat any meat and I can call out whatever barbaric practices I want, thanks.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My husband grew up in a Muslim family and he still talks about how traumatizing it was to see a lamb sacrificed as a child. I’m a meat eater and still find meat factories traumatizing. Animals to be eaten are generally not treated well.

My 7yo is a huge animal lover and is vegetarian because she loves farm animals like pigs and sheep. She would be absolutely traumatized if she saw our neighbor killing a lamb or a goat.

Well she wouldn't even if you lived in Hamtramck