Elon vs U of Richmond

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:I'll be an outlier here and say Elon. Richmond has a better name but the crime is an issue.

U of Richmond is practically in a gated community. If you've ever been there you know, it's in the suburbs and surrounded by gorgeous mansions. Yes you can go into Richmond proper but trust me, not much crime is happening out near the campus.

I said Richmond 100% and I am not the least bit threatened by Elon, it's a perfectly good school for the good students (like 4.0 W) at our high school. I know several people there. It's small and boring and I know more than one kid who had alot of trouble finding a job after graduating so seemed to me that they didn't go a great job preparing their students for post grad life.

Yeah, and I know a student who went to Elon and just graduated from med school. Anecdotal evidence doesn't mean much.

Anecdotal evidence, data, common sense. Don’t let any of this get in the way of thinking Elon is the best college ever!

Btw acceptance rate is 78 percent. Richmond is 29 pct.

Elon is 2x as big as UR and has 1/10th the endowment.

Despite this hyperbole, nobody has claimed Elon is the best college ever. Similarly, the argument that UR is superior seems weak as acceptance rates can be gamed and restricted endowments don't affect the average student.

OMG, this is like arguing with a child. Nevertheless, I persist. I see what you are doing here. You are making one absurd claim (Elon is the best school ever) and equating it to another entirely reasonable claim (UR is superior to Elon) in a weak attempt to make both claims seem ridiculous.

This is like debating whether Harvard is better than Univ of Tennessee Chatanooga.

It's pretty hard to game a 40 percentage difference in acceptance rates. High quality students are getting rejected left and right from UR. The only ones who seem to get rejected from Elon are yield management kids (who probably aren't even rejected just wailtlisted pending expressions of interest, ergo not accepted) or maybe terrible students who need aid. Would love to see an example of one full pay kid who is half way decent who was rejected from Elon because he didn't meet their standards.

As far as endowment, have you noticed all the super highly ranked schools have massive endowments per student? This is because endowments kick off a ton of cash that gets used on the student experience and fund the operating budgets of the schools including financial aid budgets. A good school is more than just the size of its endowment, but in general, the more money you have to work with, the better your school should be.

Have you ever been to UR? It's like a Ritz Carlton. They are swimming in money and that is why the school has improved so much over the years. Richmond's endowment is third largest among LACs behind Williams and Amherst. Granted, the school is larger, but UR really has a surprisingly large endowment. Elon by contrast is cash strapped and relies overwhelmingly on tuition revenue to fund operations. Richmond endowment per student is roughly 20x Elon's for goodness sake! They are not peers! One school is hard to get in, the other is easy! They are not peers!

Is your temper tantrum over now?

+1

Perhaps. I find it very frustrating when people insist on drawing false equivalencies. Like oh McDonalds=Union Square Cafe. No it doesn’t!

Yawn

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'll be an outlier here and say Elon. Richmond has a better name but the crime is an issue.

U of Richmond is practically in a gated community. If you've ever been there you know, it's in the suburbs and surrounded by gorgeous mansions. Yes you can go into Richmond proper but trust me, not much crime is happening out near the campus.

I said Richmond 100% and I am not the least bit threatened by Elon, it's a perfectly good school for the good students (like 4.0 W) at our high school. I know several people there. It's small and boring and I know more than one kid who had alot of trouble finding a job after graduating so seemed to me that they didn't go a great job preparing their students for post grad life.

Yeah, and I know a student who went to Elon and just graduated from med school. Anecdotal evidence doesn't mean much.

Anecdotal evidence, data, common sense. Don’t let any of this get in the way of thinking Elon is the best college ever!

Btw acceptance rate is 78 percent. Richmond is 29 pct.

Elon is 2x as big as UR and has 1/10th the endowment.

It is no longer 78 percent, btw.

[Anonymous]

My kid is headed to Elon. I don’t kid myself and think it’s “better” than Richmond. Her counselors also had Richmond on her list but she thought it was too small. Not sure if she would have gotten in or not (maybe but it was not a sure thing). She did not want Elon because it was “everyone”a safety” but needed up loving it upon visiting after acceptance. It’s a nice campus and the kids seem very happy. Everyone she knows who went there or knows someone who went there loved their experience. That worked for her. She is not hung up on rankings and feels she may be better off at the top of the class in a “lower ranked” school, especially if she decides on law school, which she is considering.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:My kid is headed to Elon. I don’t kid myself and think it’s “better” than Richmond. Her counselors also had Richmond on her list but she thought it was too small. Not sure if she would have gotten in or not (maybe but it was not a sure thing). She did not want Elon because it was “everyone”a safety” but needed up loving it upon visiting after acceptance. It’s a nice campus and the kids seem very happy. Everyone she knows who went there or knows someone who went there loved their experience. That worked for her. She is not hung up on rankings and feels she may be better off at the top of the class in a “lower ranked” school, especially if she decides on law school, which she is considering.

So nice of hear that your impressions were in line with ours. My son is will probably choose Elon over his other choices including UVM and Virginia Tech. It’s a nice size that’s difficult to find.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My kid is headed to Elon. I don’t kid myself and think it’s “better” than Richmond. Her counselors also had Richmond on her list but she thought it was too small. Not sure if she would have gotten in or not (maybe but it was not a sure thing). She did not want Elon because it was “everyone”a safety” but needed up loving it upon visiting after acceptance. It’s a nice campus and the kids seem very happy. Everyone she knows who went there or knows someone who went there loved their experience. That worked for her. She is not hung up on rankings and feels she may be better off at the top of the class in a “lower ranked” school, especially if she decides on law school, which she is considering.

So nice of hear that your impressions were in line with ours. My son is will probably choose Elon over his other choices including UVM and Virginia Tech. It’s a nice size that’s difficult to find.

Yes. She initially thought she wanted a larger school and ruled that out, then fell in love with a smaller school that just felt too small for her (she thought it felt like a boarding school). Elon felt like the perfect size. There are not that many schools in that range and most are Catholic (which was not a deal breaker).

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My kid is headed to Elon. I don’t kid myself and think it’s “better” than Richmond. Her counselors also had Richmond on her list but she thought it was too small. Not sure if she would have gotten in or not (maybe but it was not a sure thing). She did not want Elon because it was “everyone”a safety” but needed up loving it upon visiting after acceptance. It’s a nice campus and the kids seem very happy. Everyone she knows who went there or knows someone who went there loved their experience. That worked for her. She is not hung up on rankings and feels she may be better off at the top of the class in a “lower ranked” school, especially if she decides on law school, which she is considering.

So nice of hear that your impressions were in line with ours. My son is will probably choose Elon over his other choices including UVM and Virginia Tech. It’s a nice size that’s difficult to find.

Yes. She initially thought she wanted a larger school and ruled that out, then fell in love with a smaller school that just felt too small for her (she thought it felt like a boarding school). Elon felt like the perfect size. There are not that many schools in that range and most are Catholic (which was not a deal breaker).

My DD has the same issue — wanting a mid size school that isn’t Catholic. Any good ideas? (Not that there is anything wrong with wanting catholic school.)

[Anonymous]

Completely anecdotal.

Best childhood friend is an Elon alum, spouse is UR. Both gone for more than a decade but I don't think the schools' vibes have changed much. Richmond is Philly/NJ-South. Still. Students are UMC+ and they let you know it. For kids who don't run in those circles (like my DH during his undergrad time there), it can be a tough road. Academically sound. Don't let the "Richmond" address fool you -- PP nailed it with its virtually gated-community feel surrounded by, literally, some of the priciest real estate in the entire RVA metro area (Windsor Farms, River Rd, Country Club of Virginia).

Elon is in a small city (Burlington) between two much more bustling tri-city areas (the Triad: G'boro, W-S, High Pt and the Triangle: Raleigh, Derm (ha!), Ch Hill) and is considered a non-entity by both. The college itself is more homey (in a good way) and most of the kids seem to like it. It's still as boring as regular TV. My friend was a high stats/achieving student who loved her time there and has parlayed her education and contacts into a very successful consulting career.

Visit both. I have a feeling your child will get a feeling of which one is really right for them. They're just not the same. At all.

[Anonymous]

Just want to say both schools will have a range of smarts depending on where the applicants are from. A friends daughter from New York was rejected from Richmond while she knew several kids from other states with much lower stats in every way that were accepted. Every university needs a range and if you’re coming from a competitive area then the acceptance rates are lower. Doesn’t mean every student at Richmond will be smarter than every student at Elon.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Just want to say both schools will have a range of smarts depending on where the applicants are from. A friends daughter from New York was rejected from Richmond while she knew several kids from other states with much lower stats in every way that were accepted. Every university needs a range and if you’re coming from a competitive area then the acceptance rates are lower. Doesn’t mean every student at Richmond will be smarter than every student at Elon.

But 9/10 will be smarter

[Anonymous]

What does your child want to study, where do they geographically want to end up, and do they have a preference for Richmond (small city) vs Elon (small town) and did they get any merit/special honors at either?

My kid visited both schools and liked the location of UR better, both being near small city and closer to home. UR also had the stronger program for their major. I always think it’s such a personal decision because 5-10 years from now most people are working at jobs with colleagues that attended a range of schools so it really comes down to what environment your kid thrive at that is within your financial budget.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Just want to say both schools will have a range of smarts depending on where the applicants are from. A friends daughter from New York was rejected from Richmond while she knew several kids from other states with much lower stats in every way that were accepted. Every university needs a range and if you’re coming from a competitive area then the acceptance rates are lower. Doesn’t mean every student at Richmond will be smarter than every student at Elon.

But 9/10 will be smarter

Perhaps you missed this earlier in the thread:


"The last year test scores were required by either was 2019. According to the CDS from that year for each:

Elon's SAT ran from 1170-1330, which is 77th percentile to 93rd percentile. The median is around the 85th percentile.

Richmond's ran from 1300-1450, which is 91st to 99th percentile. The median is around the 95th percentile.

25% of Elon's students are therefore close to, at, or above the median at Richmond."


So not only will 9/10 not be smarter (assuming you're referring to testing ability), but 25% of Elon students are smarter than half of Richmond's students.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Just want to say both schools will have a range of smarts depending on where the applicants are from. A friends daughter from New York was rejected from Richmond while she knew several kids from other states with much lower stats in every way that were accepted. Every university needs a range and if you’re coming from a competitive area then the acceptance rates are lower. Doesn’t mean every student at Richmond will be smarter than every student at Elon.

But 9/10 will be smarter

Perhaps you missed this earlier in the thread:


"The last year test scores were required by either was 2019. According to the CDS from that year for each:

Elon's SAT ran from 1170-1330, which is 77th percentile to 93rd percentile. The median is around the 85th percentile.

Richmond's ran from 1300-1450, which is 91st to 99th percentile. The median is around the 95th percentile.

25% of Elon's students are therefore close to, at, or above the median at Richmond."


So not only will 9/10 not be smarter (assuming you're referring to testing ability), but 25% of Elon students are smarter than half of Richmond's students.

Most people who get into both will not choose Elon. It’s not as if it’s a much less expensive state school. So the kids who can actually get into U of R will likely go there over Elon.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Just want to say both schools will have a range of smarts depending on where the applicants are from. A friends daughter from New York was rejected from Richmond while she knew several kids from other states with much lower stats in every way that were accepted. Every university needs a range and if you’re coming from a competitive area then the acceptance rates are lower. Doesn’t mean every student at Richmond will be smarter than every student at Elon.

But 9/10 will be smarter

Perhaps you missed this earlier in the thread:


"The last year test scores were required by either was 2019. According to the CDS from that year for each:

Elon's SAT ran from 1170-1330, which is 77th percentile to 93rd percentile. The median is around the 85th percentile.

Richmond's ran from 1300-1450, which is 91st to 99th percentile. The median is around the 95th percentile.

25% of Elon's students are therefore close to, at, or above the median at Richmond."


So not only will 9/10 not be smarter (assuming you're referring to testing ability), but 25% of Elon students are smarter than half of Richmond's students.

The 75th percentile Elon student is just slightly above the bottom quartile UR student. This is a material spread.

Put differently, a very large number of students scored above 1400 at Richmond while probably only 5 pct or so did at Elon. Schools are defined by their best students.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Just want to say both schools will have a range of smarts depending on where the applicants are from. A friends daughter from New York was rejected from Richmond while she knew several kids from other states with much lower stats in every way that were accepted. Every university needs a range and if you’re coming from a competitive area then the acceptance rates are lower. Doesn’t mean every student at Richmond will be smarter than every student at Elon.

But 9/10 will be smarter

Wrong

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My kid is headed to Elon. I don’t kid myself and think it’s “better” than Richmond. Her counselors also had Richmond on her list but she thought it was too small. Not sure if she would have gotten in or not (maybe but it was not a sure thing). She did not want Elon because it was “everyone”a safety” but needed up loving it upon visiting after acceptance. It’s a nice campus and the kids seem very happy. Everyone she knows who went there or knows someone who went there loved their experience. That worked for her. She is not hung up on rankings and feels she may be better off at the top of the class in a “lower ranked” school, especially if she decides on law school, which she is considering.

So nice of hear that your impressions were in line with ours. My son is will probably choose Elon over his other choices including UVM and Virginia Tech. It’s a nice size that’s difficult to find.

Yes. She initially thought she wanted a larger school and ruled that out, then fell in love with a smaller school that just felt too small for her (she thought it felt like a boarding school). Elon felt like the perfect size. There are not that many schools in that range and most are Catholic (which was not a deal breaker).

My DD has the same issue — wanting a mid size school that isn’t Catholic. Any good ideas? (Not that there is anything wrong with wanting catholic school.)

Wake Forest is a similar size.