Women expecting other women to be in charge of all holidays/logistics/family dynamics

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:Did none of these older women have jobs? I was born in 1986 and NONE of the women in my family had jobs but I thought we were an anomaly. How exhausting to be trying to work and also be expected to coordinate a gourmet meal (and there better not be any subpar stuffing.)

OP here. I was born in 1979 and plenty of my mom’s peers had jobs, including my mom, but it’s like they still have this ingrained homemaking servitude chip embedded in them. My dad does no holiday prep or planning, no meal prep or planning, doesn’t even buy cards and gifts for his own sister. I can recall holidays where my brother was allowed to stay at the table while my sister and I were expected to clear the table. I don’t get it, I really don’t.

I think because if it was left to the majority of men nothing would happen. Seriously. My husband doesn't care about Thanksgiving or Easter dinners. If it were up to him, he would just find someplace that has takeout. Same with special holiday traditions for the kids. I do care about it though. So there it is.

This super bothers me. My husband doesn't totally NOT care, but by the time he gets around to trying to care and pull something together, it is too chaotic for me. I would say I "enjoy" planning, and I do, some of it.

I drop the rope on things I don't care about. I honestly feel a bit bad that my inlaws get such stupid xmas gifts from him, but I'm just not going to jump in. His parents/sisters always text us both (at least it isn't ONLY me!), and I always make him be the one to respond, even if I did the work of figuring out the answer. (My parents/siblings NEVER text both me and him about logistics or anything....)

Yes! This speaks to me. DH does this all.the.time. I would plan a wonderful Christmas eve full of activities but DH couldn't be there to decorate cookies with us because he WAS OUT SHOPPING ON CHRISTMAS EVE for a random gift for his mom and dad. Or we'd get into town to spend a Christmas weekend with his parents, but instead of relaxing, he's dragging us to all these stores to buy things (which are no longer on sale). And the lines are long, crowds are crazy. Or for his dad's birthday he'd say he's going to build X for him. I'd say, nope, you should have done that weeks ago, I need help in the kitchen. But he couldn't help me and would stay up late building something in his workshop. I ask for zero gifts on Christmas or my birthdays so that he can spend time with me instead of rushing around. I have no clue why an adult can't plan out a gift a month in advance like normal people. So yeah, I buy all his family's gifts.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:The call is coming from inside the house! Stop the madness. WHY are women doing this to other women?

My family is visiting my parents this week. My aunt stopped by and spent the entire time yapping about her daughter-in-law, and “why she hasn’t firmed up Thanksgiving plans yet” and “isn’t texting me back about food plans.” I asked her point blank she wasn’t picking up the phone and calling her son. And she honestly seemed baffled and was like, “How would he know what time dinner is, or what food I should bring? He has a job, he’s working.” I said you know Dana has a full-time job, too, right? She’s busy, too. And my aunt just scoffed and said it was her responsibility.

Like, what is going on that it is 2022 and women still expect that other women will do everything related to holiday dynamics, meals, gifts, family relationships, etc. Why do you not expect your husbands, sons, brothers, etc., to be active and full participants?

You are my hero!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:My husband is responsible for the gift buying for his family and every year on December 23, he’s running around trying to find something for his mom. I usually have no idea what he got until I see her opening it, and every year, without fail, she makes a point of thanking me first and very directly, and I honestly have no idea if it’s because she assumed I bought it, or if she’s throwing shade because she knows I didn’t and she can’t believe I had the audacity to expect her son to lift a finger.

And do you clearly and directly say back, “Mary, Tom bought this for you. He thought you’d enjoy it. He always buys Christmas presents for you, Fred, and Alice and the kids. I don’t want to take credit!”

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:I’m in my mid 30s and I do this because I’m just too tired to play dumb. Y’all husbands don’t text back or do their fair share of this stuff. I don’t blame you but I’m not gonna waste my time.

So you’re going to try to waste my time? I don’t think so. If your brother can’t be bothered to reply to you, take the hint and don’t expect a close family relationship. I’m not your family’s therapist, personal shopper or cruise director.

My SILs aunts etc are still picking up the rope *shrug* like I say I’m not playing games about who “should” do it. I’m operating in accordance with experience.

…and modeling to your sons and daughters that family relationships, holidays, logistics, meals, and the like are “women’s work.” You are showing your sons and daughters that men can do nothing but relax and enjoy the holidays and family gatherings that are organized by women. Great job!

Okay, well, so be it. I don’t need to add more steps to holiday coordination in case my 4 yo son reads my texts and makes inferences. Just keeping the ball moving.

Welp, you’re raising a son, so chances are, you will reap what you sow: very few calls, total disinterest in vacations and holidays, and mayyyyyybe he will remember your birthday.

That doesn’t describe his father so I doubt it. But no, his dad doesn’t call my BIL or his wife or his parents to arrange holiday menus. And I would rather have a good menu nailed down through communication that yields results than play along with whatever dramatic little game of telephone you’re cooking up.

Time will tell! It’s doubtful that you’ll get a passive ninny for a DIL, though. Likely she’ll have a backbone and won’t feel the need to be the point of contact for YOUR family. Best of luck.

Great! IDGAF about who texts who what as long as it works. You’re the one with rigid thinking about how to get from A to B.

The point is, it won’t “work,” because the next generation of women isn’t weak and passive like you, and will not be taking on their husband’s emotional labor. You raised your son to think that this is women’s work, so he won’t do it. And your DIL won’t be a sucker. So it won’t “work” as no one will call you back or make plans with you.

Lady you are one piece of work. You think you’re such a progressive warrior but here you are assuming my boys will marry women. It’s not that serious. We will have holidays or we won’t. Maybe my daughter and I will escape to Paris every year. This is not a hill I am willing to die on today and it won’t be in 20 years either.

At this point I’m surprised any of your in-laws are willing to reach out to you at all.

You’re assuming I identify as a “lady,” if you want to play the faux-outrage social warrior game. Enjoy your disengaged son in the future. You’re raising him not to call, not to care, not to plan, not to celebrate. You will reap what you sow.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My husband is responsible for the gift buying for his family and every year on December 23, he’s running around trying to find something for his mom. I usually have no idea what he got until I see her opening it, and every year, without fail, she makes a point of thanking me first and very directly, and I honestly have no idea if it’s because she assumed I bought it, or if she’s throwing shade because she knows I didn’t and she can’t believe I had the audacity to expect her son to lift a finger.

And do you clearly and directly say back, “Mary, Tom bought this for you. He thought you’d enjoy it. He always buys Christmas presents for you, Fred, and Alice and the kids. I don’t want to take credit!”

No, I smile and say “you’re welcome!” because the gift is from all of us, only he has to do the shopping.

[Anonymous]

I agree but sometimes that’s just the family dynamic within the marriage and it’s too hard to change.
I have one brother where I communicate with him ne he’s more likely to know what’s going on but the other brother I need to communicate with SIL because she is obsessive about holidays and if I ask him I’ll just get non-answers or incorrect answers. I have this with a lot of my kids friends parents too — in some houses the kids planning is evenly distributed and I text both mom and dad but in other households it’s basically just the moms that plan and then delegate pickup to the dads.

[Anonymous]

DH goes off to hunting camp for about 5 days. All of the women would get on this big email chain and would plan out what food to send with the guys. After I got married and put on the email chain- I was like wtf and I refused. One year they said something to me about it and asked what casserole I was sending. I told them that DH should be the one making me meals because he's leaving me with a baby and a toddler for 5 days. DH never once asked me to make something, it's the older women doing all of this.

I have a son and am getting him to help as much as possible with holiday decorating, meal planning for big events/holidays, gift shopping and planning ahead (like if you want to see the Nutcracker, you have to buy tickets a month in advance). I noticed early on that my daughter was always included in stuff like this, but my son got left out.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:I’m in my mid 30s and I do this because I’m just too tired to play dumb. Y’all husbands don’t text back or do their fair share of this stuff. I don’t blame you but I’m not gonna waste my time.

So you’re going to try to waste my time? I don’t think so. If your brother can’t be bothered to reply to you, take the hint and don’t expect a close family relationship. I’m not your family’s therapist, personal shopper or cruise director.

My SILs aunts etc are still picking up the rope *shrug* like I say I’m not playing games about who “should” do it. I’m operating in accordance with experience.

…and modeling to your sons and daughters that family relationships, holidays, logistics, meals, and the like are “women’s work.” You are showing your sons and daughters that men can do nothing but relax and enjoy the holidays and family gatherings that are organized by women. Great job!

Okay, well, so be it. I don’t need to add more steps to holiday coordination in case my 4 yo son reads my texts and makes inferences. Just keeping the ball moving.

Welp, you’re raising a son, so chances are, you will reap what you sow: very few calls, total disinterest in vacations and holidays, and mayyyyyybe he will remember your birthday.

That doesn’t describe his father so I doubt it. But no, his dad doesn’t call my BIL or his wife or his parents to arrange holiday menus. And I would rather have a good menu nailed down through communication that yields results than play along with whatever dramatic little game of telephone you’re cooking up.

Time will tell! It’s doubtful that you’ll get a passive ninny for a DIL, though. Likely she’ll have a backbone and won’t feel the need to be the point of contact for YOUR family. Best of luck.

Great! IDGAF about who texts who what as long as it works. You’re the one with rigid thinking about how to get from A to B.

The point is, it won’t “work,” because the next generation of women isn’t weak and passive like you, and will not be taking on their husband’s emotional labor. You raised your son to think that this is women’s work, so he won’t do it. And your DIL won’t be a sucker. So it won’t “work” as no one will call you back or make plans with you.

Lady you are one piece of work. You think you’re such a progressive warrior but here you are assuming my boys will marry women. It’s not that serious. We will have holidays or we won’t. Maybe my daughter and I will escape to Paris every year. This is not a hill I am willing to die on today and it won’t be in 20 years either.

At this point I’m surprised any of your in-laws are willing to reach out to you at all.

You’re assuming I identify as a “lady,” if you want to play the faux-outrage social warrior game. Enjoy your disengaged son in the future. You’re raising him not to call, not to care, not to plan, not to celebrate. You will reap what you sow.

Two sons!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:DH goes off to hunting camp for about 5 days. All of the women would get on this big email chain and would plan out what food to send with the guys. After I got married and put on the email chain- I was like wtf and I refused. One year they said something to me about it and asked what casserole I was sending. I told them that DH should be the one making me meals because he's leaving me with a baby and a toddler for 5 days. DH never once asked me to make something, it's the older women doing all of this.

I have a son and am getting him to help as much as possible with holiday decorating, meal planning for big events/holidays, gift shopping and planning ahead (like if you want to see the Nutcracker, you have to buy tickets a month in advance). I noticed early on that my daughter was always included in stuff like this, but my son got left out.

Good for you, PP! You are doing it right. Raising sons to think holidays and family care are “women’s work” is a disservice to them as much as it is to daughters. You’re teaching him a lot about life—not just holidays. Planning, preparation and responsibility are good lessons for all kids.

[Anonymous]

Not a perfect system, but my inlaws will text both dh and me. They realize that I do everything but are trying to get their son to be more responsive/ not put the burden on me. I nag dh to answer them back. I wish he'd do this on his own, but I'm trying. We're both juggling a lot of balls but somehow he puts his extended family last and I can still manage to do mine.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Not a perfect system, but my inlaws will text both dh and me. They realize that I do everything but are trying to get their son to be more responsive/ not put the burden on me. I nag dh to answer them back. I wish he'd do this on his own, but I'm trying. We're both juggling a lot of balls but somehow he puts his extended family last and I can still manage to do mine.

Sounds like trying to play puppeteer is more work than just doing it. But it’s VERY VERY important to show your son(s) that their mom nagged daddy to text grandma instead of just getting things settled so be sure to never stop.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Not a perfect system, but my inlaws will text both dh and me. They realize that I do everything but are trying to get their son to be more responsive/ not put the burden on me. I nag dh to answer them back. I wish he'd do this on his own, but I'm trying. We're both juggling a lot of balls but somehow he puts his extended family last and I can still manage to do mine.

Sounds like trying to play puppeteer is more work than just doing it. But it’s VERY VERY important to show your son(s) that their mom nagged daddy to text grandma instead of just getting things settled so be sure to never stop.

Maybe. But sometimes you just have to "hold the line". It's not my job and I'm not taking it over entirely. DH and I often tell each other to hold the line in regards to our kids. Like if they're being super bad, we don't give them candy to make them good.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Not a perfect system, but my inlaws will text both dh and me. They realize that I do everything but are trying to get their son to be more responsive/ not put the burden on me. I nag dh to answer them back. I wish he'd do this on his own, but I'm trying. We're both juggling a lot of balls but somehow he puts his extended family last and I can still manage to do mine.

Sounds like trying to play puppeteer is more work than just doing it. But it’s VERY VERY important to show your son(s) that their mom nagged daddy to text grandma instead of just getting things settled so be sure to never stop.

NP. It is, actually. Because then son realizes dad has a responsibility, and his failure to fulfill it doesn’t make it mom’s responsibility. This will show the son that you can’t just shirk your duties not only with regards to your family, but at your job, as a neighbor, etc. If you fail to shovel the sidewalk in front of your house, you will still be liable for accidents even if your other neighbor occasionally picks up the slack and does it for you for the good of the neighborhood.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Not a perfect system, but my inlaws will text both dh and me. They realize that I do everything but are trying to get their son to be more responsive/ not put the burden on me. I nag dh to answer them back. I wish he'd do this on his own, but I'm trying. We're both juggling a lot of balls but somehow he puts his extended family last and I can still manage to do mine.

Sounds like trying to play puppeteer is more work than just doing it. But it’s VERY VERY important to show your son(s) that their mom nagged daddy to text grandma instead of just getting things settled so be sure to never stop.

There was a nice quote from Harry Potter that talked about as you grow up, you need to start deciding if you’re going to do what’s easy, or what’s right.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Not a perfect system, but my inlaws will text both dh and me. They realize that I do everything but are trying to get their son to be more responsive/ not put the burden on me. I nag dh to answer them back. I wish he'd do this on his own, but I'm trying. We're both juggling a lot of balls but somehow he puts his extended family last and I can still manage to do mine.

Sounds like trying to play puppeteer is more work than just doing it. But it’s VERY VERY important to show your son(s) that their mom nagged daddy to text grandma instead of just getting things settled so be sure to never stop.

NP. It is, actually. Because then son realizes dad has a responsibility, and his failure to fulfill it doesn’t make it mom’s responsibility. This will show the son that you can’t just shirk your duties not only with regards to your family, but at your job, as a neighbor, etc. If you fail to shovel the sidewalk in front of your house, you will still be liable for accidents even if your other neighbor occasionally picks up the slack and does it for you for the good of the neighborhood.

+1. I want my son to not only be a good family member who plans, communicates, helps and participates, but a good lab partner, a good group project member, a good friend, a good roommate, a good co-worker, a good neighbor, a good boss, and maybe one day, a good spouse or partner. That all starts at home. And me rescuing my husband like men are hapless dolts who can’t buy gifts, send cards, or help plan a holiday dinner is not doing anyone any favors.