Q re: the wisdom behind FERPA

[Anonymous]

This is such an odd thread. Sounds like the OP may have overreacted from the FERPA presentation, but a parent of a first time college student is working through a lot (as is the kid).

For the professor, yes, there are plenty of helicopter and snow plow parents. That's definitely a hazard of this line of work. (FWIW, the only parent I know to call a university dean about course selection for their kid was a...college professor at another higher ed institution.) There are also parents trying to do their best with kids who may not always be able to do their best. First quarter of my sophomore year of college was watching my friends' suitemate take every day to a new level. He flunked out by the end of the first quarter and was gone at the beginning of the next. We only belatedly learned - and much later really understood - that he was having his first manic episode. As a parent, I guess I would want to know that my college kid was unraveling due to mania, depression, or something similar. Some colleges have not acquitted themselves well here, so yes, I will discuss FERPA with DCs and ask them to sign it in order that we can act as swiftly and responsibly as possible in an emergency. Kudos to one of the PPs who pointed out an emergency is not the time for anyone to have to work out POA for any of the other adults in the family.

For the other parents crapping on the OP, I am bit taken aback at your responses. Kids are not cookie cutters. Any study of twins, triplets, etc will show that those born to the same parents on the same day may still have quite divergent behavior. One twin may be quite mature at the start of college while the other may be struggling with organization, socializing, etc. So there are going to be kids who are fully adults at the start of college, while others may only be on paper. DH and I really hope that we have created conditions for our kids to grow roots and wings, but even then they can still stumble and we will be there if that occurs, ideally with any advanced insights from the school.

OP, good luck!

[Anonymous]

FWIW....our 2 kids both get financial aid, but its no where near enough to cover the entire cost of their college expenses. My husband and I cover the remaining balance and its quite a bit of money. I don't think that being able to confirm that both of them are doing well (or at least passing their classes) is an unreasonable request. We're footing the majority of the bill and we just want to make sure they aren't wasting our money.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:FWIW....our 2 kids both get financial aid, but its no where near enough to cover the entire cost of their college expenses. My husband and I cover the remaining balance and its quite a bit of money. I don't think that being able to confirm that both of them are doing well (or at least passing their classes) is an unreasonable request. We're footing the majority of the bill and we just want to make sure they aren't wasting our money.

What happens when you ask them?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Professor here. No, you should not be choosing your child's courses, checking their grades or telling them what to major in. You don't need to know that your daughter is taking comparative religion or queer studies as she works out her own adult value system if you will feel compelled to block these efforts. And no you shouldn't be "advocating" for your child to have a do over on the final or insisting they didn't plagiarize when they did. The dad who was so insistent that the paper wasn't plagiarized appeared to have written it himself!

I think FERPA is also good for parents like me who tend to be obsessive. I tried not to be a helicopter parent or care overly much about grades, but I developed a terrible addiction to checking the PowerSchool system. I need ready access to my kid’s grades like I need hole in my head.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:FWIW....our 2 kids both get financial aid, but its no where near enough to cover the entire cost of their college expenses. My husband and I cover the remaining balance and its quite a bit of money. I don't think that being able to confirm that both of them are doing well (or at least passing their classes) is an unreasonable request. We're footing the majority of the bill and we just want to make sure they aren't wasting our money.

Then make your kids sharing their grades a condition of their continued enrollment, I don’t get what this has to do with the school.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:FWIW....our 2 kids both get financial aid, but its no where near enough to cover the entire cost of their college expenses. My husband and I cover the remaining balance and its quite a bit of money. I don't think that being able to confirm that both of them are doing well (or at least passing their classes) is an unreasonable request. We're footing the majority of the bill and we just want to make sure they aren't wasting our money.

Then make your kids sharing their grades a condition of their continued enrollment, I don’t get what this has to do with the school.

The colleges get to have it both ways...

FERPA so they don't have to tell us anything and FAFSA/CSS so they can monopoly price using the parents' money.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think you’re more of a helicopter parent than you realize. I’m guessing you’re paying for all or most of college and that’s why you feel entitled?

I graduated from college in the mid-aughts, and I was a true adult. I paid my own tuition and rent with money I made working (attended a very cheap in-state, probably one of the last places in America where this is still possible without major loans or grants). Nothing about college was any of my parents’ business and they certainly had no entitlement to information from the school.

Maybe instead of worrying so much about the fact that FERPA recognizes that your children are adults, you should worry more about the fact that you do not.

And I get it. Since you have the wealth to pay for college, the system puts you in this role of still being “daddy” for check-writing purposes. But if your wealth has, to date, emotionally stunted your children to the point that you really do not believe they are independent and autonomous adults (clearly happens, see the threads about college freshman who don’t even have their own checking accounts) maybe you should ask them to take a gap year and come back when they are truly adults.

I don't think you learned much in college. You don't seem to realize that the chip on your shoulder is blocking your view of most kids' college experiences. Most kids have parental help paying for college expenses. It is not unreasonable for a parent to want information about the outcomes related to those expenses. My parents paid 100% of my tuition, room and board, expenses and spending money while I was in college. Of course I would not begrudge them the ability to know how I was doing with that support. When you mature perhaps you'll understand more about things like this.

And I'm sure your child will feel the same. Or maybe you are an overbearing PITA and your kid will feel differently? If so, maybe the problem is you, not FERPA.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Maybe this crap was fine when college cost 500 bucks a semester but very few teens are coughing up 100% of $15,000 to $40,000 cash a semester without parental help.

It's bullsh**.

I just posted this in another thread, our son ended up failing out of university. We'd find out many months later the warns signs were VERY obvious to the university. He was not attending class, he was caught with booze in his room by campus police, he was even fired from his campus job! We knew none of this while they continued to cash our $15,000 checks each semester!

Lesson learned. Make your child sign the disclosure release right after they're admitted as a 12th grader. They'll have no idea what they're signing, so just have them do it and act like it's normal. The university does not care about you, they only care about cashing your checks and freezing you out of your child's life.

+1000 This!

This anecdote happens more often that you'd think. And for the "professors" and college admin "shills" posting here defending "this crap", you're hiding behind an archaic law in a bid to preserve revenue and help your job security, but with no accountability whatsoever. That's isn't the real-world and especially not at current costs, find a different line of work. No one cares about 'pizza parlor basement' politics or student-parent communication when it comes to this. In no other aspect of your life would you allow someone to enthusiastically and swiftly cash your checks for thousands of $s regularly but won't allow any questions whatsoever about the product from the payor, that's a product that shouldn't be purchased and needs to go under.

If you want your kid to prove they are worthy of your investment, then you can insist that they waive FERPA, or make your tuition money contingent on access to their online portal, etc. That is an agreement you have with your child. If your child refuses, then you can refuse to pay. They can find another way to finance college or not go.

This is really not rocket science.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:In no other aspect of your life would you allow someone to enthusiastically and swiftly cash your checks for thousands of $s regularly but won't allow any questions whatsoever about the product from the payor, that's a product that shouldn't be purchased and needs to go under.

Sorry, but this is bullshit.

Any contract signed by an 18 year old is their responsibility, regardless of where they get the money. Kiddo buys a car with your money the dealer won't talk to you about it. Same for kiddos bank account or credit card, even if it is money from you. Certainly anything medical. You might not "allow" it with an auto or real estate purchase, but this time you did, so it is on you. Don't like it, don't pay.

If you can't trust your kid, maybe you shouldn't anyway.

This entire thread has revealed a lot about certain methods of parenting that the posters must have been unaware would reveal. Astounding.

This analogy doesn’t make the point you think it does. Parents pay the college directly. The FAFSA looks at the parents’ assets, not the child’s, unless the child has been emancipated. That’s analogous to a parent co-signing a loan, or actually buying the car themselves and letting the child drive it. The car dealer is absolutely dealing with the parents, not the child.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Maybe this crap was fine when college cost 500 bucks a semester but very few teens are coughing up 100% of $15,000 to $40,000 cash a semester without parental help.

It's bullsh**.

I just posted this in another thread, our son ended up failing out of university. We'd find out many months later the warns signs were VERY obvious to the university. He was not attending class, he was caught with booze in his room by campus police, he was even fired from his campus job! We knew none of this while they continued to cash our $15,000 checks each semester!

Lesson learned. Make your child sign the disclosure release right after they're admitted as a 12th grader. They'll have no idea what they're signing, so just have them do it and act like it's normal. The university does not care about you, they only care about cashing your checks and freezing you out of your child's life.

+1000 This!

This anecdote happens more often that you'd think. And for the "professors" and college admin "shills" posting here defending "this crap", you're hiding behind an archaic law in a bid to preserve revenue and help your job security, but with no accountability whatsoever. That's isn't the real-world and especially not at current costs, find a different line of work. No one cares about 'pizza parlor basement' politics or student-parent communication when it comes to this. In no other aspect of your life would you allow someone to enthusiastically and swiftly cash your checks for thousands of $s regularly but won't allow any questions whatsoever about the product from the payor, that's a product that shouldn't be purchased and needs to go under.

If you want your kid to prove they are worthy of your investment, then you can insist that they waive FERPA, or make your tuition money contingent on access to their online portal, etc. That is an agreement you have with your child. If your child refuses, then you can refuse to pay. They can find another way to finance college or not go.

This is really not rocket science.

But is it really that easy? How many parents understand this before it’s too late? If it’s the kid filling out the forms, will the parent even see it? Do the colleges reach out to the parents themselves to clarify that they have no right to information unless FERPA is waived?

[Anonymous]

I knew about the FERPA problem because my brother was paying full-freight at a SLAC for his son. Due to poor grades, the Don was told he was not allowed to return the next year. Son never told dad. Dad found out by accidentally opening the mail at home and seeing the final letter from the Dean citing what Son had to do (community college and pull up grades) in order to return. This took place months after the Som knew what was coming. So as a condition of our payment of college AND so we could advocate for our children in time if crisis, both signed FERPA waivers. This has become all the more important when children get in trouble on campus. I want to know if my son has been accused of any misdeed so I can get him the counsel he needs. Colleges don’t want parents involved so won’t tell you if there is a disciplinary matter or if your child has been arrested. It is particularly important for parents of SN kids to get FERPA waivers so they can help in times of crisis.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:In no other aspect of your life would you allow someone to enthusiastically and swiftly cash your checks for thousands of $s regularly but won't allow any questions whatsoever about the product from the payor, that's a product that shouldn't be purchased and needs to go under.

Sorry, but this is bullshit.

Any contract signed by an 18 year old is their responsibility, regardless of where they get the money. Kiddo buys a car with your money the dealer won't talk to you about it. Same for kiddos bank account or credit card, even if it is money from you. Certainly anything medical. You might not "allow" it with an auto or real estate purchase, but this time you did, so it is on you. Don't like it, don't pay.

If you can't trust your kid, maybe you shouldn't anyway.

This entire thread has revealed a lot about certain methods of parenting that the posters must have been unaware would reveal. Astounding.

This analogy doesn’t make the point you think it does. Parents pay the college directly. The FAFSA looks at the parents’ assets, not the child’s, unless the child has been emancipated. That’s analogous to a parent co-signing a loan, or actually buying the car themselves and letting the child drive it. The car dealer is absolutely dealing with the parents, not the child.

>>> unless the child has been emancipated.

Which basically never happens/can't happen.

>>> The car dealer is absolutely dealing with the parents, not the child.

And, the car dealer has the Feds helping make the steal...

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:In no other aspect of your life would you allow someone to enthusiastically and swiftly cash your checks for thousands of $s regularly but won't allow any questions whatsoever about the product from the payor, that's a product that shouldn't be purchased and needs to go under.

Sorry, but this is bullshit.

Any contract signed by an 18 year old is their responsibility, regardless of where they get the money. Kiddo buys a car with your money the dealer won't talk to you about it. Same for kiddos bank account or credit card, even if it is money from you. Certainly anything medical. You might not "allow" it with an auto or real estate purchase, but this time you did, so it is on you. Don't like it, don't pay.

If you can't trust your kid, maybe you shouldn't anyway.

This entire thread has revealed a lot about certain methods of parenting that the posters must have been unaware would reveal. Astounding.

This analogy doesn’t make the point you think it does. Parents pay the college directly. The FAFSA looks at the parents’ assets, not the child’s, unless the child has been emancipated. That’s analogous to a parent co-signing a loan, or actually buying the car themselves and letting the child drive it. The car dealer is absolutely dealing with the parents, not the child.

>>> unless the child has been emancipated.

Which basically never happens/can't happen.

>>> The car dealer is absolutely dealing with the parents, not the child.

And, the car dealer has the Feds helping make the steal...

I dont know what you are talking about. An 18 year old is not a child in any state, and is capable of signing any contract. For a credit card, for instance. Or their job. You could not be more wrong.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Professor here. No, you should not be choosing your child's courses, checking their grades or telling them what to major in. You don't need to know that your daughter is taking comparative religion or queer studies as she works out her own adult value system if you will feel compelled to block these efforts. And no you shouldn't be "advocating" for your child to have a do over on the final or insisting they didn't plagiarize when they did. The dad who was so insistent that the paper wasn't plagiarized appeared to have written it himself!

You are entitled to this opinion when you are ready to pay for my child's education.. Until then, STFU and be happy you have tenure at an overpaid, relaxing job.

The law says they’re entitled to these opinions now, actually.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:In no other aspect of your life would you allow someone to enthusiastically and swiftly cash your checks for thousands of $s regularly but won't allow any questions whatsoever about the product from the payor, that's a product that shouldn't be purchased and needs to go under.

Sorry, but this is bullshit.

Any contract signed by an 18 year old is their responsibility, regardless of where they get the money. Kiddo buys a car with your money the dealer won't talk to you about it. Same for kiddos bank account or credit card, even if it is money from you. Certainly anything medical. You might not "allow" it with an auto or real estate purchase, but this time you did, so it is on you. Don't like it, don't pay.

If you can't trust your kid, maybe you shouldn't anyway.

This entire thread has revealed a lot about certain methods of parenting that the posters must have been unaware would reveal. Astounding.

This analogy doesn’t make the point you think it does. Parents pay the college directly. The FAFSA looks at the parents’ assets, not the child’s, unless the child has been emancipated. That’s analogous to a parent co-signing a loan, or actually buying the car themselves and letting the child drive it. The car dealer is absolutely dealing with the parents, not the child.

>>> unless the child has been emancipated.

Which basically never happens/can't happen.

>>> The car dealer is absolutely dealing with the parents, not the child.

And, the car dealer has the Feds helping make the steal...

I dont know what you are talking about. An 18 year old is not a child in any state, and is capable of signing any contract. For a credit card, for instance. Or their job. You could not be more wrong.

College price is based on parents assets and income. The ever so special FAFSA expected family contribution. So.... sure... the kids are legal adults but the Feds, via the FAFSA, require other - legally independent adults - assets and incomes be reported and considered when coming up with the kid's price.

Nice racket.