women's invisible labor - anyone had luck getting spouse to take on more of the mental work?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:None of that stuff is really mental work. I’m the dad and I routinely do all that stuff and also plan vacations and work a job. Big deal. It’s called life.

Very few men plan vacations. You’re unusual.

[Anonymous]

Is it a high executive function to bean count? I understand what it being discussed here, and acknowledge that her is often a gap, but I also think that marriage is not about making sure you have everything exactly divided do the middle in terms of what gets done by whom.

After 20+ years of marriage, my DH would be amused if I cam to him with one of the lists PPs have described and I and sure that he would make sure to add on a lot of things that I haven’t thought about.

The lists do not sound like teamwork to me.

[Anonymous]

My husband handles all the camp stuff. We have boys, and he's interested in their sports skills. He also handles all their sports registrations and coordinates their practice and game schedules. I literally do nothing except drop offs at practice or watch games.

He handles all the finances.

I handle all things medical (including his medical appointments), most school related, and religious education (although he does the drop off/pick up).

He handles house maintenance, and I am largely responsible for cleaning.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Didn't we already have this conversation...multiple times? He ain't doing jack. Get used to it.

And for poster #2 - many of OP's example require mental labor. Would you rather be sipping margaritas on a lounger by the pool or pouring over a digital calendar trying to see when Kid A is free from soccer camp and you aren't going on a grocery run to see when you can schedule the orthodontist trip you forgot?

One example is called relaxing.

The other is called labor. Which adds up into fatigue and exhaustion.

This is life, a very basic and easy first world life at that.. You have to think. Life is not sitting on a chair drinking yourself or pickled. There is nothing challenging about making a shopping list, finding one of hundreds of pediatricians in the area, or scheduling camp. Hard mental work is performing hand surgery, rewiring your homes electric, searching for fresh water daily for your family, hard is having a tooth ache and no access to a dentist, hard is or rebuilding an engine. Deciding between YMCA or art camp is not a struggle. Unless you are mentally challenged.

For me it’s not that it’s hard mental work, it’s that it takes time. Time that i don’t have because I work a demanding full tile job. So I want my husband to help so that it doesn’t fall all on my shoulders and make me busier than I already am.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:i tried unsuccessfully to get DH to do some of these tasks, i tried to be hands off and not micromanage him, but what ended up happening was that he did not take care of any of the camp forms for the summer and we lost our spot in one of the camps. Some bills went unpaid, doctors appointments missed, homework and projects not completed. I ended up realizing that he is not going to be an equal partner in this regard, so I shifted more kid related tasks to him, like putting them to bed, driving them to school. I also started doing more things that relax me to de-stress. Yoga daily, massage weekly, etc

I think this is a good plan and it's what I do with my husband - don't expect him to do anything that requires planning or research because he will forget. Instead, write down all of the tasks that are done (including school forms, summer camp planning, etc.), and show him the list with his name beside half of the tasks. These tasks will be the ones that he CAN'T forget because they're physical and must be done. For instance, I buy all family birthday gifts, my husband unloads the dishwasher. I interface with our nanny and remember to pay her, my husband gets the toddler out of the crib and changes her diaper each morning.

My experience with my husband has been that he doesn't think a lot of the social/emotional work that I do is valuable - he views it more like a hobby. As if I like to research camps or buy birthday gifts for his parents. So it's been an uphill battle to get him to remember to do any of these tasks. It's as if he waxed the car every weekend, and thought that was really important, and then was upset when I didn't do it. You can't make someone want to perform tasks that they see little value in.

Counseling has also helped us have a safe space to discuss these issues. It's a lot less heated to save up my grievances and discuss them twice a month with our marriage counselor, rather than unload on him in the moment.

Remember that we're just one-two generations into this whole working mom thing, and it's a learning curve for everyone. Good luck to you.

Spot on. I will add that having my DH willingly handles many physical tasks like driving most of sport carpools, coaching one of the sports, pickup every afternoon, making dinner for the kids ..this balances out a lot of the planning tasks I take on that he has no interest in doing. There are certain time I’ve been overwhelmed like we just had a basement remodel due that was promoted by water damage so I needed a break for home planning and then out AC died. I asked DH if he could handle it because I had new responsibilities at work plus lots of stuff with the kids. BTW since my schedule is more flexible like I can leave early and work from home, I am usually the one that is home for the contractor windows.

Wanted to add like a PP mentioned for me a lot of this planning is a burden because it doesn’t come easy to me. To stay employed and do a great job at work, I use a lot of energy to keep myself on track and focused so when I get home I really don’t want to think of the 3-4 actions and deadlines I have for the kids class, school, or activities. My mid year resolution is to reduce this. Have less activities to coordinate, have my teenage kids take responsibility for replying to the things that they can, not taking on any formal volunteer roles with their school etc.,

[Anonymous]

Men take on the mental burden to provide and protect their families. They feel the pressure and responsibility for their family's economic well being, housing, and for keeping the family safe.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Men take on the mental burden to provide and protect their families. They feel the pressure and responsibility for their family's economic well being, housing, and for keeping the family safe.

Are you joking?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Didn't we already have this conversation...multiple times? He ain't doing jack. Get used to it.

And for poster #2 - many of OP's example require mental labor. Would you rather be sipping margaritas on a lounger by the pool or pouring over a digital calendar trying to see when Kid A is free from soccer camp and you aren't going on a grocery run to see when you can schedule the orthodontist trip you forgot?

One example is called relaxing.

The other is called labor. Which adds up into fatigue and exhaustion.

This is life, a very basic and easy first world life at that.. You have to think. Life is not sitting on a chair drinking yourself or pickled. There is nothing challenging about making a shopping list, finding one of hundreds of pediatricians in the area, or scheduling camp. Hard mental work is performing hand surgery, rewiring your homes electric, searching for fresh water daily for your family, hard is having a tooth ache and no access to a dentist, hard is or rebuilding an engine. Deciding between YMCA or art camp is not a struggle. Unless you are mentally challenged.

For me it’s not that it’s hard mental work, it’s that it takes time. Time that i don’t have because I work a demanding full tile job. So I want my husband to help so that it doesn’t fall all on my shoulders and make me busier than I already am.

Well, you picked the wrong guy. And you've enabled him to punt to you. Good luck changing him now.

Draft a list of tasks and divvy it up with him. Let him pick first. And show him this thread. My husband honestly does far more than I do since I have a demanding job and a terrible commute. But he's thoughtful, engaged, and not lazy...so I didn't have to train him.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Men take on the mental burden to provide and protect their families. They feel the pressure and responsibility for their family's economic well being, housing, and for keeping the family safe.

Yeah... I don't think my husband is burdened by this...

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Men take on the mental burden to provide and protect their families. They feel the pressure and responsibility for their family's economic well being, housing, and for keeping the family safe.

Not when the wife works outside the home, too. The financial burden is closer to 50-50.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:None of that stuff is really mental work. I’m the dad and I routinely do all that stuff and also plan vacations and work a job. Big deal. It’s called life.

Very few men plan vacations. You’re unusual.

Planning vacations is literally the only mental work my DH does for the family!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:What happens when you ask for help with a specific task with out all the psychobabble?
“Will you please find a pediatrician and schedule the kids next appt?” Or, “the kids have paperwork for school, could you handle that?

He does things like sign the child up for two camps on the same day so we pay double, forgets to put my name and number down on the camp forms (he never checks messages and rarely answers, so I have to be the contact), doesn't know he has to give the name of the babysitter who will pick kid up from camp ... doesn't even know the last name of our sitter/nanny, who has been with us for almost THREE years!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Is it a high executive function to bean count? I understand what it being discussed here, and acknowledge that her is often a gap, but I also think that marriage is not about making sure you have everything exactly divided do the middle in terms of what gets done by whom.

After 20+ years of marriage, my DH would be amused if I cam to him with one of the lists PPs have described and I and sure that he would make sure to add on a lot of things that I haven’t thought about.

The lists do not sound like teamwork to me.

You know what's not teamwork? When you are running around the field playing defense and offense with ten balls in the air, and your "teammate" is in the dugout watching TV.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What happens when you ask for help with a specific task with out all the psychobabble?
“Will you please find a pediatrician and schedule the kids next appt?” Or, “the kids have paperwork for school, could you handle that?

Read up on the psychobabble, and you'd see that asking for help with a specific task is taking on the role of the executive manager, and it's a gigantic burden, much greater than being handed 2 forms to fill and asked to make a ped appt.

I've read. My point is, how about instead of complaining to DH, "I'm taking on 85% of the mental load", just asking for help. OP's DH is getting defensive because she is criticizing him for not doing enough mental load, when surely he doesn't even know what mental load is. And all OP really wants is help.
Unless she wants to complain about mental load, and then of course, she is just complaining and the kids aren't getting to the ped and the forms are still sitting on the counter, meanwhile her DH is angry and she is resentful=failed marriage.
This is a communication problem. Just ask for what you need specifically and stop with the mental load ridiculous mommy blogging BS. The eyes of most men will glaze over.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Men take on the mental burden to provide and protect their families. They feel the pressure and responsibility for their family's economic well being, housing, and for keeping the family safe.

lol. somehow I do all of this, AND all the medical appointments, school coordination, manage camps and aftercare, all household finances, oversee all household maintainance, garden, coordinate social events, holidays, and family events, most of the house cleaning, all groceries, all cooking, all lunches .......