Tips for difficult father in law

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
Sorry, I don't invite people to stay overnight who make me feel bad about myself, or God, forbid, my CHILDREN.

Pick up the phone and disinvite him. You can tell him that you have thought a lot about how he expected you to be his maid, and how he bullied your daughter, and that you do not want him visiting for now.

And your husband can shut up and and go with it if he doesn't have the moral courage to defend you and his daughter.

+100 you are setting a horrible example for your daughter by tolerating someone who is cruel to her and treats women as second class citizens in your home

This. It's unacceptable. Don't create an environment where you KNOW it's going to happen.

+1 and also, OP, do you work? If you and DH both work I don't understand why you seem to be responsible for everything surrounding FIL's visit. Tell DH it's his father, and he can spend time with him (taking off from work if necessary), get his meals other than those you may already be preparing for the whole family, wait on him etc.

If you are home all day I can see more how this dynamic developed, but it's time to break it. Find a way NOT to be home all day during FIL's visit. He should not expect that someone is there to wait on him all the time. And if he does, that someone can be his own son, not you.

Have you ever called him out directly on his behavior toward your daughter? Perhaps he is genuinely unaware of how he treats her. I'd start with that. And if he can't or won't change, or denies it, or yells, then you shouldn't have him over -- or should make sure any time he spends with either kid is supervised by you.

Honestly just send your DH to visit him for 2 weeks, it sounds like everyone would be better off.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
Sorry, I don't invite people to stay overnight who make me feel bad about myself, or God, forbid, my CHILDREN.

Pick up the phone and disinvite him. You can tell him that you have thought a lot about how he expected you to be his maid, and how he bullied your daughter, and that you do not want him visiting for now.

And your husband can shut up and and go with it if he doesn't have the moral courage to defend you and his daughter.

+100 you are setting a horrible example for your daughter by tolerating someone who is cruel to her and treats women as second class citizens in your home

This. It's unacceptable. Don't create an environment where you KNOW it's going to happen.

+1 and also, OP, do you work? If you and DH both work I don't understand why you seem to be responsible for everything surrounding FIL's visit. Tell DH it's his father, and he can spend time with him (taking off from work if necessary), get his meals other than those you may already be preparing for the whole family, wait on him etc.

If you are home all day I can see more how this dynamic developed, but it's time to break it. Find a way NOT to be home all day during FIL's visit. He should not expect that someone is there to wait on him all the time. And if he does, that someone can be his own son, not you.

Have you ever called him out directly on his behavior toward your daughter? Perhaps he is genuinely unaware of how he treats her. I'd start with that. And if he can't or won't change, or denies it, or yells, then you shouldn't have him over -- or should make sure any time he spends with either kid is supervised by you.

Honestly just send your DH to visit him for 2 weeks, it sounds like everyone would be better off.

I do work, but have a more flexible schedule than DH who is on zoom calls all day. Crafty FIL takes advantage of this and bothers me routine throughout the day. I usually have to hide from him, which is difficult to when you have kids at home. When I make my kids lunch and add something for myself, it feels pretty and childish to tell father in law I didn’t make anything for him. I don’t mind doing things for him- he is alone and making lunch for himself most of the time. That said, by the end of our visit I could barely keep myself from grumbling when he grabbed a plate for himself and would serve himself before the kids even ate. I would tell this to my husband who, to his credit, would remind father in law I wasn’t his chef. This didnt help so much. I guess I could have told him to make lunch for us, but he is such a horrible cook I didn’t want to eat anything he made or have my kids eat it either.

So I probably wasn’t clear but father in law isn’t visiting us at our home now- his trip has been cut down and we will go on a trip together. We will see how it goes. I am steeling myself for some sort of argument, but as someone said earlier, maybe this isn’t a bad thing? I think my husband needs to lead any sort of discussion since my father in law is al crafty and will focus on how I am a bad person if I say anything. I understand that he is depressed after he retired and lost his wife, but he is young for a retired widower (and healthy too) and will likely continue to leach off of us for years to come. I will not have him come to my house and hurt my children.

Op

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Yep. Whatever he expects of you, tell him that you're busy and he can ask your husband. It seems like you're stuck in some very unhealthy gender roles. If your husband has to do the work or deal with the fallout, there will be a lot fewer visits. If he doesn't like the normal behavior of children, he should not ask to visit a household with children. So let the kids act how they act and if he doesn't like it, bye.

It will be incredibly damaging to your child if your father tolerates her being mistreated in her own home. You have to intervene the very first time. "Joe, do not speak disrespectfully to Larla." Then stand there and look at him and let it be very, very awkward for a while. That's the only way to draw a boundary. If he gets mad and leaves, you win. This is no kind of grandparent relationship that benefits your child, at all. If your FIL is lonely, it is only the consequence of his own bad choices and not your problem to solve by allowing your child to be mistreated.

You could get a nursery camera so that you can hear what he's saying when he thinks you are not listening. Try that and record it on your phone for your husband to hear.

I think this is a great idea. These nanny cans are cheap and ubiquitous.

Amazing idea.

Op

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP, tangentially, I just want to tell you that your English is impeccable.

Thank you thank you!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I forgot to add:

(1) we don’t use him for childcare ever
(2) the kids were in camp the last time we visited him
(3) we took the kids out every day as I absolutely acknowledge that they were stressors for him. We limited their interactions as much as possible.
(4) we have zero plans for another extended visit to his house
(5) my father In law is relatively young and healthy
(6) he has an expectation of being “served” for lack of a better word. He doesn’t help out around our house or his house when he visits and expects me to clean up after him and making him all his meals. When I told him gently lunch would be very simple since i work full time, he didn’t really listen to care.

I am absolutely in agreement that he worked hard his whole life and deserves to enjoy his retirement, but I think there should be a balance between being courteous and helpful to us by cleaning up after himself and not attacking my daughter. I also would never demand my husband not see him.

My 90 year old grandmother died in 2001 and she never made lunch. Like, ever. There were cold cuts, pickles, bread, 100 different mustards and spreads, chips, apples (always apples!), and maybe cookies or ice cream, but it was paper plates and serve yourself. If she could do it in the 20th century, you can do it in the 21st.

The meanness towards your daughter is more problematic and I am not certain how to solve that except that if he says or does something out of line your husband needs to talk to him about it.

Overall, this is your husband's relationship to navigate. If your FIL is young and healthy then he may need some support in getting back into life and adjusting to the reality that a wife waiting on him hand and foot isn't the norm, but that there's a lot of life to be lived even if you don't have that anymore.

In a layer post OP says FIL is old. OP is a troll.

Sorry if there is a confusion but a widowed grandfather is never “young”. For a grandfather who lost his wife he is on the younger side and healthy. I mention this because there is a huge difference with a 90 year old man and a 65 year old man. Father in law is not on a wheelchair he grumbling about the youth of today. If I was a troll I would hope I would have shared a more interesting story!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I forgot to add:

(1) we don’t use him for childcare ever
(2) the kids were in camp the last time we visited him
(3) we took the kids out every day as I absolutely acknowledge that they were stressors for him. We limited their interactions as much as possible.
(4) we have zero plans for another extended visit to his house
(5) my father In law is relatively young and healthy
(6) he has an expectation of being “served” for lack of a better word. He doesn’t help out around our house or his house when he visits and expects me to clean up after him and making him all his meals. When I told him gently lunch would be very simple since i work full time, he didn’t really listen to care.

I am absolutely in agreement that he worked hard his whole life and deserves to enjoy his retirement, but I think there should be a balance between being courteous and helpful to us by cleaning up after himself and not attacking my daughter. I also would never demand my husband not see him.

My 90 year old grandmother died in 2001 and she never made lunch. Like, ever. There were cold cuts, pickles, bread, 100 different mustards and spreads, chips, apples (always apples!), and maybe cookies or ice cream, but it was paper plates and serve yourself. If she could do it in the 20th century, you can do it in the 21st.

The meanness towards your daughter is more problematic and I am not certain how to solve that except that if he says or does something out of line your husband needs to talk to him about it.

Overall, this is your husband's relationship to navigate. If your FIL is young and healthy then he may need some support in getting back into life and adjusting to the reality that a wife waiting on him hand and foot isn't the norm, but that there's a lot of life to be lived even if you don't have that anymore.

I shared your post with my husband. I think you have an excellent perspective. He is obviously still hurting from losing his only friend (his wife) and hoping that the world cares for him a little. He would like his children to baby him for a while, but it’s been a few years at this point. Also I am just his daughter in law- not his wife or daughter or son. Dh says he feels overwhelmed when he thinks about how fil will likely get worse not better and wonders how he can seek help trying to continue living when his life changed (he retired and lost his wife). No real way to figure it out but our children will be our joint priority. FIL must recognize this.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You husband needs to sharply correct him if her is out of line with your daughter. Your daughter NEEDS to see her parents standing up for her, especially in her own home.

I could not agree more with you. I have and will stand up to him on her behalf, but this made my father in law crafty. My son told me the minute I leave the room he begins to berate her or call her mean nicknames.

That is frankly kind of scary. Shows awareness and ill intention. Please don’t leave him alone with your daughter.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You husband needs to sharply correct him if her is out of line with your daughter. Your daughter NEEDS to see her parents standing up for her, especially in her own home.

I could not agree more with you. I have and will stand up to him on her behalf, but this made my father in law crafty. My son told me the minute I leave the room he begins to berate her or call her mean nicknames.

That is frankly kind of scary. Shows awareness and ill intention. Please don’t leave him alone with your daughter.

I won’t.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I forgot to add:

(1) we don’t use him for childcare ever
(2) the kids were in camp the last time we visited him
(3) we took the kids out every day as I absolutely acknowledge that they were stressors for him. We limited their interactions as much as possible.
(4) we have zero plans for another extended visit to his house
(5) my father In law is relatively young and healthy
(6) he has an expectation of being “served” for lack of a better word. He doesn’t help out around our house or his house when he visits and expects me to clean up after him and making him all his meals. When I told him gently lunch would be very simple since i work full time, he didn’t really listen to care.

I am absolutely in agreement that he worked hard his whole life and deserves to enjoy his retirement, but I think there should be a balance between being courteous and helpful to us by cleaning up after himself and not attacking my daughter. I also would never demand my husband not see him.

My 90 year old grandmother died in 2001 and she never made lunch. Like, ever. There were cold cuts, pickles, bread, 100 different mustards and spreads, chips, apples (always apples!), and maybe cookies or ice cream, but it was paper plates and serve yourself. If she could do it in the 20th century, you can do it in the 21st.

The meanness towards your daughter is more problematic and I am not certain how to solve that except that if he says or does something out of line your husband needs to talk to him about it.

Overall, this is your husband's relationship to navigate. If your FIL is young and healthy then he may need some support in getting back into life and adjusting to the reality that a wife waiting on him hand and foot isn't the norm, but that there's a lot of life to be lived even if you don't have that anymore.

I shared your post with my husband. I think you have an excellent perspective. He is obviously still hurting from losing his only friend (his wife) and hoping that the world cares for him a little. He would like his children to baby him for a while, but it’s been a few years at this point. Also I am just his daughter in law- not his wife or daughter or son. Dh says he feels overwhelmed when he thinks about how fil will likely get worse not better and wonders how he can seek help trying to continue living when his life changed (he retired and lost his wife). No real way to figure it out but our children will be our joint priority. FIL must recognize this.

Well, he's lonely because he acts like a jerk and is a bad houseguest. No wonder he has no friends. Your H needs to know that setting some boundaries will ultimately help your family be supportive in the long run.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
Sorry, I don't invite people to stay overnight who make me feel bad about myself, or God, forbid, my CHILDREN.

Pick up the phone and disinvite him. You can tell him that you have thought a lot about how he expected you to be his maid, and how he bullied your daughter, and that you do not want him visiting for now.

And your husband can shut up and and go with it if he doesn't have the moral courage to defend you and his daughter.

+100 you are setting a horrible example for your daughter by tolerating someone who is cruel to her and treats women as second class citizens in your home

This. It's unacceptable. Don't create an environment where you KNOW it's going to happen.

+1 and also, OP, do you work? If you and DH both work I don't understand why you seem to be responsible for everything surrounding FIL's visit. Tell DH it's his father, and he can spend time with him (taking off from work if necessary), get his meals other than those you may already be preparing for the whole family, wait on him etc.

If you are home all day I can see more how this dynamic developed, but it's time to break it. Find a way NOT to be home all day during FIL's visit. He should not expect that someone is there to wait on him all the time. And if he does, that someone can be his own son, not you.

Have you ever called him out directly on his behavior toward your daughter? Perhaps he is genuinely unaware of how he treats her. I'd start with that. And if he can't or won't change, or denies it, or yells, then you shouldn't have him over -- or should make sure any time he spends with either kid is supervised by you.

Honestly just send your DH to visit him for 2 weeks, it sounds like everyone would be better off.

I do work, but have a more flexible schedule than DH who is on zoom calls all day. Crafty FIL takes advantage of this and bothers me routine throughout the day. I usually have to hide from him, which is difficult to when you have kids at home. When I make my kids lunch and add something for myself, it feels pretty and childish to tell father in law I didn’t make anything for him. I don’t mind doing things for him- he is alone and making lunch for himself most of the time. That said, by the end of our visit I could barely keep myself from grumbling when he grabbed a plate for himself and would serve himself before the kids even ate. I would tell this to my husband who, to his credit, would remind father in law I wasn’t his chef. This didnt help so much. I guess I could have told him to make lunch for us, but he is such a horrible cook I didn’t want to eat anything he made or have my kids eat it either.

So I probably wasn’t clear but father in law isn’t visiting us at our home now- his trip has been cut down and we will go on a trip together. We will see how it goes. I am steeling myself for some sort of argument, but as someone said earlier, maybe this isn’t a bad thing? I think my husband needs to lead any sort of discussion since my father in law is al crafty and will focus on how I am a bad person if I say anything. I understand that he is depressed after he retired and lost his wife, but he is young for a retired widower (and healthy too) and will likely continue to leach off of us for years to come. I will not have him come to my house and hurt my children.

Op

Sounds like you need to get a lot less flexible with your schedule. And figure out what foods your FIL dislikes and make those for lunch.

[Anonymous]

It sounds like you may need to say "FIL, if you are truly.unable to care for yourself without my help, then perhaps it's time for assisted living".

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:You husband needs to sharply correct him if her is out of line with your daughter. Your daughter NEEDS to see her parents standing up for her, especially in her own home.

Yes, omg get into couples therapy to set some boundaries with this elderly FIL before he breaks you and your daughters spirit and creates a monster out of your son he puts in a pedestal.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:It sounds like you may need to say "FIL, if you are truly.unable to care for yourself without my help, then perhaps it's time for assisted living".

First get you husband and any siblings on board, then collect some basic quick data points (places, costs, availability, timing), then the adult offspring tell him.
Tours and POA in finances come next.

This could go on for years.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I forgot to add:

(1) we don’t use him for childcare ever
(2) the kids were in camp the last time we visited him
(3) we took the kids out every day as I absolutely acknowledge that they were stressors for him. We limited their interactions as much as possible.
(4) we have zero plans for another extended visit to his house
(5) my father In law is relatively young and healthy
(6) he has an expectation of being “served” for lack of a better word. He doesn’t help out around our house or his house when he visits and expects me to clean up after him and making him all his meals. When I told him gently lunch would be very simple since i work full time, he didn’t really listen to care.

I am absolutely in agreement that he worked hard his whole life and deserves to enjoy his retirement, but I think there should be a balance between being courteous and helpful to us by cleaning up after himself and not attacking my daughter. I also would never demand my husband not see him.

Get him o line dating. Maybe some women pleaser type will like taking care of him.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You husband needs to sharply correct him if her is out of line with your daughter. Your daughter NEEDS to see her parents standing up for her, especially in her own home.

I could not agree more with you. I have and will stand up to him on her behalf, but this made my father in law crafty. My son told me the minute I leave the room he begins to berate her or call her mean nicknames.

WTAF, OP? This man would not be anywhere near my daughter, much less in her house for 2 weeks. What is wrong with you??? Protect your daughter. I cannot believe you allow this. This is a hill to die on.

Put some ring cams in or nest cams. With recording for 10 days if he will be over.