Can someone explain the mindset of a cheater?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I have thought about this, my mindset. Yes, I know cheating is wrong. But after years of rejection, I prioritize happiness as follows 1) my kids, 2) mine, 3) spouse

Divorce is the easy way out. My kids deserve better.

As most cheaters do, you are engaging in a false but self-serving story that your cheating is “for the kids”. It’s no less manipulative than those who say they’re keeping the affair secret from the wife to protect her from pain.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I like sex. I will have sex. My wife has determined she no longer wants sex. Good for her. I don't accept her decision for the both of us. So I'll get sex elsewhere and there are so many people, men and women, in this situation that it's not hard to find.

As for, why don't I just divorce her, then go get the sex? That is such a naive question. There are 100s of reasons why couples stay together yet go outside of marriage for sex. Eventually, we will divorce but that doesn't work for me right now.

And no, I don't have a don't ask, don't tell agreement, or any agreement at all. While she doesn't want sex, she still expects sexual monogamy. Yes, it's an insane situation that I put up with for too long, but now longer. It's really the best situation it can be at the moment. I don't bother her for sex, or act in any way towards her that is angry or resentful. She either chooses to be totally clueless, or she really is if she thinks I just gave up on sex because she did.

If you won't give your spouse sex, don't worry about them going elsewhere for it until the time they stop bothering you about yet seem to be a bit more pleasant for unexplained reasons.

Maybe divorce would "work" for her right now, though, if she knew the truth. Why not tell her?

Trust me, it would NOT work for her right now. She knows there is no future in how things are but it's not enough to make a difference to her. The truth will come out at a more appropriate time.

Different poster here. Some women do not really care that much and will stay married for other reasons. You don't know everyone.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I have thought about this, my mindset. Yes, I know cheating is wrong. But after years of rejection, I prioritize happiness as follows 1) my kids, 2) mine, 3) spouse

Divorce is the easy way out. My kids deserve better.

As most cheaters do, you are engaging in a false but self-serving story that your cheating is “for the kids”. It’s no less manipulative than those who say they’re keeping the affair secret from the wife to protect her from pain.

I assume my wife knows, although she doesn't know who. Wouldn't you assume your DH has gone from initiating all the time (and getting rejected 99% o the time) to getting needs met elsewhere if its been a year? She doesn't ask questions, she doesn't want to know

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I have thought about this, my mindset. Yes, I know cheating is wrong. But after years of rejection, I prioritize happiness as follows 1) my kids, 2) mine, 3) spouse

Divorce is the easy way out. My kids deserve better.

As most cheaters do, you are engaging in a false but self-serving story that your cheating is “for the kids”. It’s no less manipulative than those who say they’re keeping the affair secret from the wife to protect her from pain.

I assume my wife knows, although she doesn't know who. Wouldn't you assume your DH has gone from initiating all the time (and getting rejected 99% o the time) to getting needs met elsewhere if its been a year? She doesn't ask questions, she doesn't want to know

Again, you are assuming. That “assumption” (that she knows) is a story you are telling yourself because it makes you feel better about cheating. It allows you to posit that she knows and consents on some level to your affair. Without the assumption that she “knows” you are cheating and “knows” you will get it elsewhere if she doesn’t provide sex, what you are doing is simply manipulation. With the “assumptions” you are able to turn something pathological into some kind of heroic act you are doing to preserve the marriage for her (because you believe she can’t get better elsewhere and can’t bear the pain of the thought of you with someone else) or for the kids (who can’t bear the idea of not growing up in an intact family). In the history of men and women, men often want to “protect” women and children when really they are “protecting” themselves.

Grownups talk explicitly about problems. I did not have sex with my DH for over a year. I explained to him why and what was necessary in order for us to have sex again. Changes didn’t happen, and after a significant period of time of trying to work our problems out I asked him to leave. He was surprised and continued to try to reconcile for 2 plus years after that. Who knows what he was thinking about our marriage. He was initiating and getting rebuffed regularly. Why he thought I’d be OK with that is a mystery. Perhaps it’s the sexist notion that women don’t really like sex and when they choose not have it it isn’t a reflection of the relationship and the partner but rather that women don’t like sex. Whatever he thought was definitely incompatible with what I was telling him about our marriage.

During that time I never cheated. Did I think about it? Was I tempted? Of course, but I am a rational human in control of my behaviour, so I didn’t. I also had enough respect for myself and him and my kids not to secretly manipulate him into staying in the relationship while getting my needs met elsewhere.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I have thought about this, my mindset. Yes, I know cheating is wrong. But after years of rejection, I prioritize happiness as follows 1) my kids, 2) mine, 3) spouse

Divorce is the easy way out. My kids deserve better.

As most cheaters do, you are engaging in a false but self-serving story that your cheating is “for the kids”. It’s no less manipulative than those who say they’re keeping the affair secret from the wife to protect her from pain.

I assume my wife knows, although she doesn't know who. Wouldn't you assume your DH has gone from initiating all the time (and getting rejected 99% o the time) to getting needs met elsewhere if its been a year? She doesn't ask questions, she doesn't want to know

Again, you are assuming. That “assumption” (that she knows) is a story you are telling yourself because it makes you feel better about cheating. It allows you to posit that she knows and consents on some level to your affair. Without the assumption that she “knows” you are cheating and “knows” you will get it elsewhere if she doesn’t provide sex, what you are doing is simply manipulation. With the “assumptions” you are able to turn something pathological into some kind of heroic act you are doing to preserve the marriage for her (because you believe she can’t get better elsewhere and can’t bear the pain of the thought of you with someone else) or for the kids (who can’t bear the idea of not growing up in an intact family). In the history of men and women, men often want to “protect” women and children when really they are “protecting” themselves.

Grownups talk explicitly about problems. I did not have sex with my DH for over a year. I explained to him why and what was necessary in order for us to have sex again. Changes didn’t happen, and after a significant period of time of trying to work our problems out I asked him to leave. He was surprised and continued to try to reconcile for 2 plus years after that. Who knows what he was thinking about our marriage. He was initiating and getting rebuffed regularly. Why he thought I’d be OK with that is a mystery. Perhaps it’s the sexist notion that women don’t really like sex and when they choose not have it it isn’t a reflection of the relationship and the partner but rather that women don’t like sex. Whatever he thought was definitely incompatible with what I was telling him about our marriage.

During that time I never cheated. Did I think about it? Was I tempted? Of course, but I am a rational human in control of my behaviour, so I didn’t. I also had enough respect for myself and him and my kids not to secretly manipulate him into staying in the relationship while getting my needs met elsewhere.

You did what worked for your marriage and it worked out. I am doing the same. We are much more civil and happy in our sexless marriage than you were. Not everyone puts sex at the center of their relationship

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I have thought about this, my mindset. Yes, I know cheating is wrong. But after years of rejection, I prioritize happiness as follows 1) my kids, 2) mine, 3) spouse

Divorce is the easy way out. My kids deserve better.

As most cheaters do, you are engaging in a false but self-serving story that your cheating is “for the kids”. It’s no less manipulative than those who say they’re keeping the affair secret from the wife to protect her from pain.

I assume my wife knows, although she doesn't know who. Wouldn't you assume your DH has gone from initiating all the time (and getting rejected 99% o the time) to getting needs met elsewhere if its been a year? She doesn't ask questions, she doesn't want to know

Again, you are assuming. That “assumption” (that she knows) is a story you are telling yourself because it makes you feel better about cheating. It allows you to posit that she knows and consents on some level to your affair. Without the assumption that she “knows” you are cheating and “knows” you will get it elsewhere if she doesn’t provide sex, what you are doing is simply manipulation. With the “assumptions” you are able to turn something pathological into some kind of heroic act you are doing to preserve the marriage for her (because you believe she can’t get better elsewhere and can’t bear the pain of the thought of you with someone else) or for the kids (who can’t bear the idea of not growing up in an intact family). In the history of men and women, men often want to “protect” women and children when really they are “protecting” themselves.

Grownups talk explicitly about problems. I did not have sex with my DH for over a year. I explained to him why and what was necessary in order for us to have sex again. Changes didn’t happen, and after a significant period of time of trying to work our problems out I asked him to leave. He was surprised and continued to try to reconcile for 2 plus years after that. Who knows what he was thinking about our marriage. He was initiating and getting rebuffed regularly. Why he thought I’d be OK with that is a mystery. Perhaps it’s the sexist notion that women don’t really like sex and when they choose not have it it isn’t a reflection of the relationship and the partner but rather that women don’t like sex. Whatever he thought was definitely incompatible with what I was telling him about our marriage.

During that time I never cheated. Did I think about it? Was I tempted? Of course, but I am a rational human in control of my behaviour, so I didn’t. I also had enough respect for myself and him and my kids not to secretly manipulate him into staying in the relationship while getting my needs met elsewhere.

You did what worked for your marriage and it worked out. I am doing the same. We are much more civil and happy in our sexless marriage than you were. Not everyone puts sex at the center of their relationship

I did not put sex at the center of my marriage. I put honesty, transparency and negotiation at the center of my marriage. Without those, I was living a charade.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I have thought about this, my mindset. Yes, I know cheating is wrong. But after years of rejection, I prioritize happiness as follows 1) my kids, 2) mine, 3) spouse

Divorce is the easy way out. My kids deserve better.

As most cheaters do, you are engaging in a false but self-serving story that your cheating is “for the kids”. It’s no less manipulative than those who say they’re keeping the affair secret from the wife to protect her from pain.

I assume my wife knows, although she doesn't know who. Wouldn't you assume your DH has gone from initiating all the time (and getting rejected 99% o the time) to getting needs met elsewhere if its been a year? She doesn't ask questions, she doesn't want to know

Again, you are assuming. That “assumption” (that she knows) is a story you are telling yourself because it makes you feel better about cheating. It allows you to posit that she knows and consents on some level to your affair. Without the assumption that she “knows” you are cheating and “knows” you will get it elsewhere if she doesn’t provide sex, what you are doing is simply manipulation. With the “assumptions” you are able to turn something pathological into some kind of heroic act you are doing to preserve the marriage for her (because you believe she can’t get better elsewhere and can’t bear the pain of the thought of you with someone else) or for the kids (who can’t bear the idea of not growing up in an intact family). In the history of men and women, men often want to “protect” women and children when really they are “protecting” themselves.

Grownups talk explicitly about problems. I did not have sex with my DH for over a year. I explained to him why and what was necessary in order for us to have sex again. Changes didn’t happen, and after a significant period of time of trying to work our problems out I asked him to leave. He was surprised and continued to try to reconcile for 2 plus years after that. Who knows what he was thinking about our marriage. He was initiating and getting rebuffed regularly. Why he thought I’d be OK with that is a mystery. Perhaps it’s the sexist notion that women don’t really like sex and when they choose not have it it isn’t a reflection of the relationship and the partner but rather that women don’t like sex. Whatever he thought was definitely incompatible with what I was telling him about our marriage.

During that time I never cheated. Did I think about it? Was I tempted? Of course, but I am a rational human in control of my behaviour, so I didn’t. I also had enough respect for myself and him and my kids not to secretly manipulate him into staying in the relationship while getting my needs met elsewhere.

You did what worked for your marriage and it worked out. I am doing the same. We are much more civil and happy in our sexless marriage than you were. Not everyone puts sex at the center of their relationship

I did not put sex at the center of my marriage. I put honesty, transparency and negotiation at the center of my marriage. Without those, I was living a charade.

Fair enough. Some people see sex as optional in a marriage. You do, my wife does, I don't.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I have thought about this, my mindset. Yes, I know cheating is wrong. But after years of rejection, I prioritize happiness as follows 1) my kids, 2) mine, 3) spouse

Divorce is the easy way out. My kids deserve better.

As most cheaters do, you are engaging in a false but self-serving story that your cheating is “for the kids”. It’s no less manipulative than those who say they’re keeping the affair secret from the wife to protect her from pain.

I assume my wife knows, although she doesn't know who. Wouldn't you assume your DH has gone from initiating all the time (and getting rejected 99% o the time) to getting needs met elsewhere if its been a year? She doesn't ask questions, she doesn't want to know

She knows that she’s rejected sex with her normal libido husband. Since she’s not divorced you, that means she wants to stay married and the only way that’s possible is you getting sex elsewhere. There are no secrets here. No self serving. He’s doing her a solid by having an affair to keep their sexless marriage together.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I have thought about this, my mindset. Yes, I know cheating is wrong. But after years of rejection, I prioritize happiness as follows 1) my kids, 2) mine, 3) spouse

Divorce is the easy way out. My kids deserve better.

As most cheaters do, you are engaging in a false but self-serving story that your cheating is “for the kids”. It’s no less manipulative than those who say they’re keeping the affair secret from the wife to protect her from pain.

I assume my wife knows, although she doesn't know who. Wouldn't you assume your DH has gone from initiating all the time (and getting rejected 99% o the time) to getting needs met elsewhere if its been a year? She doesn't ask questions, she doesn't want to know

Again, you are assuming. That “assumption” (that she knows) is a story you are telling yourself because it makes you feel better about cheating. It allows you to posit that she knows and consents on some level to your affair. Without the assumption that she “knows” you are cheating and “knows” you will get it elsewhere if she doesn’t provide sex, what you are doing is simply manipulation. With the “assumptions” you are able to turn something pathological into some kind of heroic act you are doing to preserve the marriage for her (because you believe she can’t get better elsewhere and can’t bear the pain of the thought of you with someone else) or for the kids (who can’t bear the idea of not growing up in an intact family). In the history of men and women, men often want to “protect” women and children when really they are “protecting” themselves.

Grownups talk explicitly about problems. I did not have sex with my DH for over a year. I explained to him why and what was necessary in order for us to have sex again. Changes didn’t happen, and after a significant period of time of trying to work our problems out I asked him to leave. He was surprised and continued to try to reconcile for 2 plus years after that. Who knows what he was thinking about our marriage. He was initiating and getting rebuffed regularly. Why he thought I’d be OK with that is a mystery. Perhaps it’s the sexist notion that women don’t really like sex and when they choose not have it it isn’t a reflection of the relationship and the partner but rather that women don’t like sex. Whatever he thought was definitely incompatible with what I was telling him about our marriage.

During that time I never cheated. Did I think about it? Was I tempted? Of course, but I am a rational human in control of my behaviour, so I didn’t. I also had enough respect for myself and him and my kids not to secretly manipulate him into staying in the relationship while getting my needs met elsewhere.

Why did you stay married to an unattractive asshole for several years who you didn’t even want sex with? Sounds like you were not so great at explicit communication and problem solving as you claim. Otherwise you would have quickly resolved the issue or left that jerk face idiot.

Normal men cannot go years without sex as you did. So while it may be possible for women, that’s just not a legit option for men.

[Anonymous]

I may have posted here or in another thread but mine is simple. We have a special needs kid who has sucked the life out of our marriage. My wife has no desire, ever. 4 years without. I am a better spouse and parent now that I have found a glimpse of being a normal man again. Wish it was my wife but she doesn't want to work on that aspect.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I have thought about this, my mindset. Yes, I know cheating is wrong. But after years of rejection, I prioritize happiness as follows 1) my kids, 2) mine, 3) spouse

Divorce is the easy way out. My kids deserve better.

As most cheaters do, you are engaging in a false but self-serving story that your cheating is “for the kids”. It’s no less manipulative than those who say they’re keeping the affair secret from the wife to protect her from pain.

I assume my wife knows, although she doesn't know who. Wouldn't you assume your DH has gone from initiating all the time (and getting rejected 99% o the time) to getting needs met elsewhere if its been a year? She doesn't ask questions, she doesn't want to know

She knows that she’s rejected sex with her normal libido husband. Since she’s not divorced you, that means she wants to stay married and the only way that’s possible is you getting sex elsewhere. There are no secrets here. No self serving. He’s doing her a solid by having an affair to keep their sexless marriage together.

Thanks for this, PPs. Interesting perspective.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:PP, you have the conversation so you can live an honest life and so your spouse knows the truth of their own life. This could go bad in so many ways. What if the DH of his AP finds out and goes crazy? What if AP is a co-worker and it risks the cheater's job if discovered? If his own kids find out, it is very likely to impact his relationship with them . . . kids normally would be protective of their mom in this situation. This would affect how his own family of origin, inlaws, friends, coworkers, neighbors will see him - but he knows this, and is selfish, so it's better for him to sneak around and hope no one finds out.

Exactly all of those consequences happened to my cheating ex and I told his AP’s husband as well. BAM! A name will have to come out. It will come out or you will go directly to divorce kind of how closure works in marriage counseling. They make you say who and give spouse opportunity to talk to AP. You wouldn’t do that to your AP (tell her spouse) your wife might not feel the same and want that whore to face the sane things she is going through, not get off easy, unharmed.

Oh now she is a whore? Nice. And what exactly do you think my W is "going through?" She isn't in any kind of pain all through this. She is blissfully unaware and happy I no longer broach the subject of sex.

Yes, any or all of those terrible things could happen to me, if I was dumb enough to get caught. Thanks for opening my eyes. I'll be sure to be ever vigilant and careful.

I am not one of the women that have argued with you until now. I only have one question for you. I ask it without judgment or castigation, I only want your sincere prognosis.

What do you think would happen if your wife found out, either from you or in some other way? What do you think she would say or do?

What would you do or say? It's unpredictable and I see no reason to take that chance. But I'll speculate from best to worst:

She would say, oh that's great. I'm happy for you and relieved. Just don't fall in love with her and don't let this affect our marriage in all the other ways that we have it so good. Let me know the next time you are going to see her so I can bake her some cookies to send along with a thank you note. This is the least likely outcome.

She would say, who is this bitch? Tell me right now while you are packing your things because I won't have you living here anymore (as she picks up a frying pan to hit me). I'm going to let everyone know what an asshole you are, blah blah blah. She probably wouldn't go that crazy but some form of this more more likely than the previous example.

So, something in the middle I guess. It must be a woman thing but, I don't understand why so many are encouraging me to tell her. No Fing way am I going to tell her. Again, there is no possible good that can come from that, only bad and it would end my good thing. I'm not doing anything to rock that boat.

You sound like a dumb sociopath.

You sound like a stupid biyatch. Feel better now? Go make your husband more miserable than he is already. Insulting me is meaningless.

You're living a double dysfunctional life making excuses as to why it's all valid...

You really should think about what pp said..

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I may have posted here or in another thread but mine is simple. We have a special needs kid who has sucked the life out of our marriage. My wife has no desire, ever. 4 years without. I am a better spouse and parent now that I have found a glimpse of being a normal man again. Wish it was my wife but she doesn't want to work on that aspect.

No you're not. Backstabbing your wife and child does NOT make you better in any way.

Reality check - seriously. Get some marital counseling and talk to your spouse like an adult. Don't bring a stranger into your lives that could potentially destroy it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I have thought about this, my mindset. Yes, I know cheating is wrong. But after years of rejection, I prioritize happiness as follows 1) my kids, 2) mine, 3) spouse

Divorce is the easy way out. My kids deserve better.

As most cheaters do, you are engaging in a false but self-serving story that your cheating is “for the kids”. It’s no less manipulative than those who say they’re keeping the affair secret from the wife to protect her from pain.

I assume my wife knows, although she doesn't know who. Wouldn't you assume your DH has gone from initiating all the time (and getting rejected 99% o the time) to getting needs met elsewhere if its been a year? She doesn't ask questions, she doesn't want to know

Again, you are assuming. That “assumption” (that she knows) is a story you are telling yourself because it makes you feel better about cheating. It allows you to posit that she knows and consents on some level to your affair. Without the assumption that she “knows” you are cheating and “knows” you will get it elsewhere if she doesn’t provide sex, what you are doing is simply manipulation. With the “assumptions” you are able to turn something pathological into some kind of heroic act you are doing to preserve the marriage for her (because you believe she can’t get better elsewhere and can’t bear the pain of the thought of you with someone else) or for the kids (who can’t bear the idea of not growing up in an intact family). In the history of men and women, men often want to “protect” women and children when really they are “protecting” themselves.

Grownups talk explicitly about problems. I did not have sex with my DH for over a year. I explained to him why and what was necessary in order for us to have sex again. Changes didn’t happen, and after a significant period of time of trying to work our problems out I asked him to leave. He was surprised and continued to try to reconcile for 2 plus years after that. Who knows what he was thinking about our marriage. He was initiating and getting rebuffed regularly. Why he thought I’d be OK with that is a mystery. Perhaps it’s the sexist notion that women don’t really like sex and when they choose not have it it isn’t a reflection of the relationship and the partner but rather that women don’t like sex. Whatever he thought was definitely incompatible with what I was telling him about our marriage.

During that time I never cheated. Did I think about it? Was I tempted? Of course, but I am a rational human in control of my behaviour, so I didn’t. I also had enough respect for myself and him and my kids not to secretly manipulate him into staying in the relationship while getting my needs met elsewhere.

You did what worked for your marriage and it worked out. I am doing the same. We are much more civil and happy in our sexless marriage than you were. Not everyone puts sex at the center of their relationship

I did not put sex at the center of my marriage. I put honesty, transparency and negotiation at the center of my marriage. Without those, I was living a charade.

Fair enough. Some people see sex as optional in a marriage. You do, my wife does, I don't.

It's so weird how deep you are in your self-justification that you can't even use your reading comprehension. I never said I saw sex as optional. I just said that I didn't put it in the center of my marriage -- in the center were honesty, transparency and negotiation, but that doesn't mean sex wasn't important to me. I would never consider going without sex my whole life or even a significant portion nor would I expect anyone else to (although some choose that). I went without sex for a year before I ended my marriage because even after discussing issues, my DH wouldn't make changes to the marriage that were necessary for us to resume our sex life.

I also never said we weren't civil and happy -- that is something you made up to self-justify your own actions (the "she likes it this way; we're happy" argument).

Sex is very important in a marriage to most (but not all people). The issues isn't at all how important sex is or isn't. It is whether you are brave enough to have an honest conversation with your wife about non-monogamy if she isn't going to have sex with you, and to manage the fact that she may respond in a way that you don't like.

The basic principle of sex is informed consent. Even in polyamory, the parameters of non-monogamy are carefully and explicitly negotiated.

But, you, apparently, believe that sex is so important it's OK to lie (whether by omission or commission) in order to get it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I have thought about this, my mindset. Yes, I know cheating is wrong. But after years of rejection, I prioritize happiness as follows 1) my kids, 2) mine, 3) spouse

Divorce is the easy way out. My kids deserve better.

As most cheaters do, you are engaging in a false but self-serving story that your cheating is “for the kids”. It’s no less manipulative than those who say they’re keeping the affair secret from the wife to protect her from pain.

I assume my wife knows, although she doesn't know who. Wouldn't you assume your DH has gone from initiating all the time (and getting rejected 99% o the time) to getting needs met elsewhere if its been a year? She doesn't ask questions, she doesn't want to know

Again, you are assuming. That “assumption” (that she knows) is a story you are telling yourself because it makes you feel better about cheating. It allows you to posit that she knows and consents on some level to your affair. Without the assumption that she “knows” you are cheating and “knows” you will get it elsewhere if she doesn’t provide sex, what you are doing is simply manipulation. With the “assumptions” you are able to turn something pathological into some kind of heroic act you are doing to preserve the marriage for her (because you believe she can’t get better elsewhere and can’t bear the pain of the thought of you with someone else) or for the kids (who can’t bear the idea of not growing up in an intact family). In the history of men and women, men often want to “protect” women and children when really they are “protecting” themselves.

Grownups talk explicitly about problems. I did not have sex with my DH for over a year. I explained to him why and what was necessary in order for us to have sex again. Changes didn’t happen, and after a significant period of time of trying to work our problems out I asked him to leave. He was surprised and continued to try to reconcile for 2 plus years after that. Who knows what he was thinking about our marriage. He was initiating and getting rebuffed regularly. Why he thought I’d be OK with that is a mystery. Perhaps it’s the sexist notion that women don’t really like sex and when they choose not have it it isn’t a reflection of the relationship and the partner but rather that women don’t like sex. Whatever he thought was definitely incompatible with what I was telling him about our marriage.

During that time I never cheated. Did I think about it? Was I tempted? Of course, but I am a rational human in control of my behaviour, so I didn’t. I also had enough respect for myself and him and my kids not to secretly manipulate him into staying in the relationship while getting my needs met elsewhere.

You did what worked for your marriage and it worked out. I am doing the same. We are much more civil and happy in our sexless marriage than you were. Not everyone puts sex at the center of their relationship

I did not put sex at the center of my marriage. I put honesty, transparency and negotiation at the center of my marriage. Without those, I was living a charade.

Fair enough. Some people see sex as optional in a marriage. You do, my wife does, I don't.

Actually, you do see it as optional. You are not having sex inside your marriage. You may not see SEX as optional. But you do see it as optional in your marriage.