If I had know this was the case, I probably wouldn't have married you.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
Ah, and now we're back to "wanting sex is immature."

No, that's not what I said. I do think that bringing up the issue of whether this baby was 100% wanted is immature.

Well, I think the question of who wanted the baby became relevant when someone above seemed to be suggesting that his desire for sex was somehow less legitimate because his wife "sacrificed" for the baby. It wasn't a sacrifice *for* him. So it's not exactly an even trade. If she was the driving force in baby #2, the exchange was more like "I want a baby, and it's going to mean I don't want sex as much, so I also want you to have less sex."
So it is acceptable among mature adults to determine who in a couple "wanted" their child more and to use that information in a conversation like this?
Really?
The question of who wanted the baby is NEVER relevant. This is their CHILD. He exists and OP is his father. Any look-back to who wanted this child and how much is unproductive, hurtful, and IMMATURE.

Agreed. OP, how do you think your child would feel one day knowing how you have spoken about this situation?

OP here. What situation? What exactly would my child get to know in the distant future?

I am asking how you think your child would feel if they were capable of hearing you talk this way about them and their mother? Either hypothetically now or in the future? You have said that you "gave your wife" a child so she wouldn't resent you. Not exactly a wonderful expression of fatherly love. I hope you don't irrevocably fuck up this child - you sound like my own ass of a father, who I hated for a long time and to whom I am now indifferent. Do you want your child to grow up and feel that way about you? Would all the sex in the world be worth that?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No, he sounds like he has needs that aren't being met. That doesn't make him an ass, it makes him human. OP, sit down and talk to your wife. Have open, non-hostile conversations about how both of you can come together to better meet family and maritial needs.

The subtext of his post is that he only got married for sex. That is pretty ass-y, IMO.

That's just not true. I married for love and companionship and to have kids with my husband. I didn't realize that our different sex drives, openness to variety, differing inhibitions, etc. would really wear on the marriage in the long run. It's more complicated than you LD spouses make it out to be.

Then just go have an affair or get a divorce already. If sex is more important than honoring your vows, taking care of your children together, engaging in shared interests and building a solid home, perhaps your spouse would be better off finding someone better matched to them.

No worries, I did go have an affair. Life's too short to be limited by an LD spouse.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I don't know why everyone is attacking the OP, unless this just touched a nerve in their own marriages. I wish I had the energy to do it more with my DH, hell - the OP could be my DH. We are at 1x monthly status.

Have you sought a solution so you'll have more energy for sex?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
Oh yes, the old "give me a BJ" line. As if I am under some obligation when I am taking care of an infant, breasts leaking, using Tucks pads and not sleeping for more than 3-4 hours at a stretch. Go masturbate - I'm not adding your BJ to my list of to do's.

Is this excuse still valid once the child is 1yo? or 2yo? or 3yo?

No, but go read 12:02 and that will give you a sense of why many of us continue to not feel inclined. When you approach me all accusatory that I am not meeting your needs and that you need a physical release what do you expect my reaction to be? It's the selfish asshole approach. If you made one iota of effort to say the things that 12:02 suggests that would get you a lot farther.

You men are really stupid - bottom line. You just have a glaring lack of understanding how women work if you don't get this. I am not a sex machine. If you want me to want it, learn how to turn me on with more than just your tongue. I need some feeling behind it, otherwise I'm just going through the motions. Is that what you really want? That's called a prostitute.

It sounds as if you're implying that men are solely responsible for bring sex to the table in a marriage. Why is it that men have to turn women on? In a marriage, is the women excused for having to turn the men on?

Like it's that hard. My DH could go at it while I am changing my clothes.

I know this will shock you, but this is not true when the man is the LD spouse.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Come on now. I wouldn't have sex if she was in PAIN!!!! Sheesh. We've had sex twice since #2 arrived. Both times were painless!

Sorry, OP. I just don't believe this. About 90% of women I know had significant discomfort - even if not PAIN with capital letters - the first times they had sex after childbirth, and certainly if the sex is within the first 2-3 mos. (And I'm betting I've talked to about 2 dozen more ladies about this than you.) Either your DW doesn't feel like she can communicate this to you or you aren't willing to listen . "Painless"??? Whatever. You guys have serious issues.

DW here. I couldn't wait more than 4 weeks after childbirth to resume sexual relationships. Wasn't painful, just a little uncomfortable at first.

Congratulations. So you are one person, and you don't speak for other women.

There is a thread on here somewhere. Lots of women chimed in when they had sex after birth. Lots of examples of women having sex after 6 weeks. Painless well lubed sex.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No, he sounds like he has needs that aren't being met. That doesn't make him an ass, it makes him human. OP, sit down and talk to your wife. Have open, non-hostile conversations about how both of you can come together to better meet family and maritial needs.

The subtext of his post is that he only got married for sex. That is pretty ass-y, IMO.

That's just not true. I married for love and companionship and to have kids with my husband. I didn't realize that our different sex drives, openness to variety, differing inhibitions, etc. would really wear on the marriage in the long run. It's more complicated than you LD spouses make it out to be.

Then just go have an affair or get a divorce already. If sex is more important than honoring your vows, taking care of your children together, engaging in shared interests and building a solid home, perhaps your spouse would be better off finding someone better matched to them.

No worries, I did go have an affair. Life's too short to be limited by an LD spouse.

Now maybe you should do the honorable thing and ask for a divorce since you can't honor your vows.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Come on now. I wouldn't have sex if she was in PAIN!!!! Sheesh. We've had sex twice since #2 arrived. Both times were painless!

Sorry, OP. I just don't believe this. About 90% of women I know had significant discomfort - even if not PAIN with capital letters - the first times they had sex after childbirth, and certainly if the sex is within the first 2-3 mos. (And I'm betting I've talked to about 2 dozen more ladies about this than you.) Either your DW doesn't feel like she can communicate this to you or you aren't willing to listen . "Painless"??? Whatever. You guys have serious issues.

DW here. I couldn't wait more than 4 weeks after childbirth to resume sexual relationships. Wasn't painful, just a little uncomfortable at first.

Congratulations. So you are one person, and you don't speak for other women.

There is a thread on here somewhere. Lots of women chimed in when they had sex after birth. Lots of examples of women having sex after 6 weeks. Painless well lubed sex.

Well, bully. It doesn't work that way for all of us.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:[
+1 DING DING DING! My DH would get a lot more from me if he didn't A) try to initiate when I am already falling asleep, B) make a fucking effort to hire a babysitter or schedule dates and B) not stay up after me or sleep in on the weekend when I am up at 7am with my son. If you want sex, get the fuck up before I have a preschooler running around. Otherwise, quit bitching. There's only so many hours in the day and I am not doing it at 11pm on a weeknight when I have been up since 5:30 and have to work in the morning. I need sleep. Get over it.

THIS.

OP here. It's not fair that that DH would sleep in, i agree. But having to hire a sitter to go on a date as a pre-requisite to sex is freaking ridiculous. sex is as important as sleep, except maybe to a LD spouse.

My LD spouse has made it clear, over and over, that sex (and TV and booze) are all more important than sex. It's because he says, "Sex is work." You people wonder why I finally had an affair after 15 years of this nonsense.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:[
+1 DING DING DING! My DH would get a lot more from me if he didn't A) try to initiate when I am already falling asleep, B) make a fucking effort to hire a babysitter or schedule dates and B) not stay up after me or sleep in on the weekend when I am up at 7am with my son. If you want sex, get the fuck up before I have a preschooler running around. Otherwise, quit bitching. There's only so many hours in the day and I am not doing it at 11pm on a weeknight when I have been up since 5:30 and have to work in the morning. I need sleep. Get over it.

THIS.

OP here. It's not fair that that DH would sleep in, i agree. But having to hire a sitter to go on a date as a pre-requisite to sex is freaking ridiculous. sex is as important as sleep, except maybe to a LD spouse.

My LD spouse has made it clear, over and over, that sex (and TV and booze) are all more important than sex. It's because he says, "Sex is work." You people wonder why I finally had an affair after 15 years of this nonsense.

But see, this is a bigger problem than just sex. There is a difference between an LD spouse who is bewildered by their own changes and trying to work toward an acceptable solution and your spouse, who just sounds like a lazy jerk. But there are a lot of HD posters on here who are painting all LD spouses with a broad brush, suggesting that they have been lied to, that we are all passive-aggressive withholders, etc etc etc. We are not. When you have experienced this dramatic shift in your drive and all the other myriad changes that go along with being a new parent, and your spouse is unsympathetic and not trying to see your POV, well, then you are not a great spouse either IMO and you must accept part of the blame. I don't see a lot of HDer's on here accepting THEIR roles in the situation. I see a lot of blame, anger and excuse making for their own failings.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
Are we just passionate people, two "high drives" lucky enough to find each other? I'm sure our temperaments are part of it. But what is much more important, what is MOST important, is that we know what sex means: its purpose, its message, its profundity.
If you don't know what sex is all about, you're going to miss the mark, sometimes badly. You wouldn't put sand in your gas tank, and similarly disastrous consequences follow from misunderstanding how sex works and why it is designed the way it is.
What does sex mean to you, OP? What is its purpose? Apologies in advance if you've already shared this, but I need to know where you are coming from to try to help you get where you want to go.

Sex is feeling that I still have a place in this marriage besides the 2 kids. Sex is a release and I'm horny. Sex is me pleasing DW and watching her lose herself. Sex is connecting DW and I since there is no us time anymore with 2 kids. Sex (happening) means that I did not just suffer yet another rejection again.

Hi, OP. Me again. Can you explain something to me? Why do men feel personally rejected when we don't want sex? I can't speak for your wife, but in my case there is NO ONE that I would go for when I don't want it. Like, George Clooney could be naked in my bedroom and I'd be all "George, go the fuck home." For me, I had the hardest time convincing DH that it's not that I don't want sex with YOU, it's that I just don't want sex right now, period. It seems like you guys really internalize this as a self esteem thing. Maybe HD women feel the same way, IDK.

HD woman here. I feel rejected because I know DH would turn off the TV for a woman he hadn't been having sex with for the past 20 years. He makes it all about me when he doesn't want to make the effort to have sex. I don't need dates or romance or compliments, even. Just sex.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
Ah, and now we're back to "wanting sex is immature."

No, that's not what I said. I do think that bringing up the issue of whether this baby was 100% wanted is immature.

Well, I think the question of who wanted the baby became relevant when someone above seemed to be suggesting that his desire for sex was somehow less legitimate because his wife "sacrificed" for the baby. It wasn't a sacrifice *for* him. So it's not exactly an even trade. If she was the driving force in baby #2, the exchange was more like "I want a baby, and it's going to mean I don't want sex as much, so I also want you to have less sex."

So it is acceptable among mature adults to determine who in a couple "wanted" their child more and to use that information in a conversation like this?
Really?
The question of who wanted the baby is NEVER relevant. This is their CHILD. He exists and OP is his father. Any look-back to who wanted this child and how much is unproductive, hurtful, and IMMATURE.

Agreed. OP, how do you think your child would feel one day knowing how you have spoken about this situation?

OP here. What situation? What exactly would my child get to know in the distant future?

I am asking how you think your child would feel if they were capable of hearing you talk this way about them and their mother? Either hypothetically now or in the future? You have said that you "gave your wife" a child so she wouldn't resent you. Not exactly a wonderful expression of fatherly love. I hope you don't irrevocably fuck up this child - you sound like my own ass of a father, who I hated for a long time and to whom I am now indifferent. Do you want your child to grow up and feel that way about you? Would all the sex in the world be worth that?

Way over analysis. I probably wouldn't even remember this thread in 2 years.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No, he sounds like he has needs that aren't being met. That doesn't make him an ass, it makes him human. OP, sit down and talk to your wife. Have open, non-hostile conversations about how both of you can come together to better meet family and maritial needs.

The subtext of his post is that he only got married for sex. That is pretty ass-y, IMO.

That's just not true. I married for love and companionship and to have kids with my husband. I didn't realize that our different sex drives, openness to variety, differing inhibitions, etc. would really wear on the marriage in the long run. It's more complicated than you LD spouses make it out to be.

Then just go have an affair or get a divorce already. If sex is more important than honoring your vows, taking care of your children together, engaging in shared interests and building a solid home, perhaps your spouse would be better off finding someone better matched to them.

No worries, I did go have an affair. Life's too short to be limited by an LD spouse.

Now maybe you should do the honorable thing and ask for a divorce since you can't honor your vows.

You could also say the LD spouse is not honoring the vows either.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
Are we just passionate people, two "high drives" lucky enough to find each other? I'm sure our temperaments are part of it. But what is much more important, what is MOST important, is that we know what sex means: its purpose, its message, its profundity.
If you don't know what sex is all about, you're going to miss the mark, sometimes badly. You wouldn't put sand in your gas tank, and similarly disastrous consequences follow from misunderstanding how sex works and why it is designed the way it is.
What does sex mean to you, OP? What is its purpose? Apologies in advance if you've already shared this, but I need to know where you are coming from to try to help you get where you want to go.

Sex is feeling that I still have a place in this marriage besides the 2 kids. Sex is a release and I'm horny. Sex is me pleasing DW and watching her lose herself. Sex is connecting DW and I since there is no us time anymore with 2 kids. Sex (happening) means that I did not just suffer yet another rejection again.

Hi, OP. Me again. Can you explain something to me? Why do men feel personally rejected when we don't want sex? I can't speak for your wife, but in my case there is NO ONE that I would go for when I don't want it. Like, George Clooney could be naked in my bedroom and I'd be all "George, go the fuck home." For me, I had the hardest time convincing DH that it's not that I don't want sex with YOU, it's that I just don't want sex right now, period. It seems like you guys really internalize this as a self esteem thing. Maybe HD women feel the same way, IDK.

HD woman here. I feel rejected because I know DH would turn off the TV for a woman he hadn't been having sex with for the past 20 years. He makes it all about me when he doesn't want to make the effort to have sex. I don't need dates or romance or compliments, even. Just sex.

Me too!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Come on now. I wouldn't have sex if she was in PAIN!!!! Sheesh. We've had sex twice since #2 arrived. Both times were painless!

Sorry, OP. I just don't believe this. About 90% of women I know had significant discomfort - even if not PAIN with capital letters - the first times they had sex after childbirth, and certainly if the sex is within the first 2-3 mos. (And I'm betting I've talked to about 2 dozen more ladies about this than you.) Either your DW doesn't feel like she can communicate this to you or you aren't willing to listen . "Painless"??? Whatever. You guys have serious issues.

DW here. I couldn't wait more than 4 weeks after childbirth to resume sexual relationships. Wasn't painful, just a little uncomfortable at first.

Congratulations. So you are one person, and you don't speak for other women.

There is a thread on here somewhere. Lots of women chimed in when they had sex after birth. Lots of examples of women having sex after 6 weeks. Painless well lubed sex.

Well, bully. It doesn't work that way for all of us.

And no one said it did.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I love sex! I guess I would be considered lower D than my dh, but that doesn't mean I don't love sex. I just prefer really good sex, which means my desire has to have time to build up. It's all about meeting in the middle and being mature about things - how else can a marriage work?

This is what my LD husband says sometimes. But, to be honest, it's not long or varied enough to satisfy me if we only have it once a week. If we had sex more frequently, I'd be happy for shorter sessions.