Busy body friend who gives aggressive advice? How to handle?

[Anonymous]

I agree w/ the neurodivergence possibility.

Sometimes it's easiest, best, and most effective to simple be direct.

Hey Jane, when you give me advice you often use the words "need" and "should". It makes me feel like you're telling me what to do, or like you think I haven't thought of such basic things. I'm sure that isn't your intent. I really think that if you didn't use those words I could handle it better. And actually, I could also just tell you when I want advice versus when I want you to just listen. Would that help?

You might be surprised by her welcoming such directness. I have had that exact experience w/ people. If they don't understand social nuances well enough to adjust their thinking they may actually appreciate direct requests on how to adjust language.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:"Did I ask for your advice?" - the quick way to get this to stop
"I'll take that into consideration" - the passive aggressive route
"Ah, thank you for your infinite wisdom on this subject!" - the sarcastic reply

I mean, you could always start with just talking to your "friend" and letting them know that you'd appreciate it if they'd keep their advice to themselves until/unless you ask, but since you managed to write your little rant on the internet, hopefully you're smart enough to know that already...

Before being snarky I would just ask her to stop providing orders, just talk and be friends.

[Anonymous]

I appreciate that your advice comes from a place of caring, but I'm going to handle this my own way. Anyway, how is your daughter doing [or other appropriate subject pivot)?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:"Did I ask for your advice?" - the quick way to get this to stop
"I'll take that into consideration" - the passive aggressive route
"Ah, thank you for your infinite wisdom on this subject!" - the sarcastic reply

I mean, you could always start with just talking to your "friend" and letting them know that you'd appreciate it if they'd keep their advice to themselves until/unless you ask, but since you managed to write your little rant on the internet, hopefully you're smart enough to know that already...

Before being snarky I would just ask her to stop providing orders, just talk and be friends.

Cool, and be ready for her to reply with "then stop dumping problems on me when you're not looking for solutions" because you have a role in this dynamic.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I agree w/ the neurodivergence possibility.

Sometimes it's easiest, best, and most effective to simple be direct.

Hey Jane, when you give me advice you often use the words "need" and "should". It makes me feel like you're telling me what to do, or like you think I haven't thought of such basic things. I'm sure that isn't your intent. I really think that if you didn't use those words I could handle it better. And actually, I could also just tell you when I want advice versus when I want you to just listen. Would that help?

You might be surprised by her welcoming such directness. I have had that exact experience w/ people. If they don't understand social nuances well enough to adjust their thinking they may actually appreciate direct requests on how to adjust language.

I hate how people have started pretending it's other people's "neurodivergence" and how "they don't understand social nuances well" when it's really the speaker's issues, pet peeves, unspoken preferences causing the speaker's problem(s). This isn't some kind of universal thing where everyone who doesn't work the way you do is off or odd in some way. If you have preferences ("I just need to vent and I don't want any advice"), the burden falls on YOU to create the container for that conversation. Stop blaming/pathologizing your so-called friends for not magically understanding the things you want/need but don't ask for.

[Anonymous]

I guess my post wasn’t clear. I’m not asking for advice on what to say to her. I’m trying to understand why she might be like this so I can view her behavior more favorably or at least not negatively.

Because she thinks she knows what is best for you and wants you to do what she thinks is best. But of course that does not make the behavior appropriate or mean you have to do it.

[Anonymous]

For a time, I had a strong tendency to attract people like this into my life.

I think the reason they are like this is they have control issues that stem from insecurity or anxiety. They seek to control everyone around them because they believe if everyone and everything just functioned according to their directives, there would be no more problems or surprises in life.

I also think there is a usually a touch (or more) of narcissism in these personalities, because of their inability to see that their advice is not welcome or realize that they might not have enough information or context to decide what is best for other people. Someone who has more empathy and a sense of humility would understand when to back off, and would be able to handle the idea that maybe they don't actually know what's best. But people like this will persist even when presented with clear evidence that their advice is not helpful or on point.

I also think people with this personality type tend to seek out people they view to be "coachable" because it helps them satisfy their need for control. They don't do this to people who are very assertive and confident. They seek out people who seem unsure of themselves or who appear willing to be controlled. I think this is why I have a tendency to attract this type. I was abused growing up and my mother is like this, and I think people with similar personalities kind of smell it on me. I also think I tend to be instantly accommodating of people like this when I encounter them, because as a child I learned that resisting or argument could lead to verbal or physical abuse.

I have found the best way to deal with people like this is to keep them at arms length and not let them into my inner circle. Sometimes you can't avoid them completely. I have worked with people like this and you can't always just leave a job. Right now I am dealing with a personality like this in the mother of one of my kid's good school friends. I don't want to make an enemy of her so I have to play along to some degree, but I keep her at a distance -- I encourage the kid's friendship but resist getting too close to the mom. It takes work but it's what I have to do to avoid the meddling and controlling behavior.

[Anonymous]

It's possible that you won't be able to figure out why she is the way she is. You can't diagnose her. You could invent a reason that helps you stay calm in the face of her unsolicited advice (ASD, anxiety, personality disorder), but you might be wrong about the reason. It is equally important to keep a check on your own boundaries here.

You have kindly decided to try to be her friend the way she is, when it appears many others have not been able to do so. So I think as others have said, whatever the reason for her behavior, you can only find a kind and clear way to keep responding, plus draw new boundaries to minimize the incidents that are distressing you.

Maybe the next time she does it you could ask her (kindly) instead of us? "Larla, remember when I told you yesterday that my doctor said I'm not having the side effect you are concerned about? I agree with my doctor, and I'm fine with that, yet we keep having the same conversation about it. It distresses me. Is there a reason I should know about that you keep bringing it up? I'm trying to understand." She may enlighten you to the source of anxiety in her life that causes repetitive meddling. Or she may not realize she is doing it and get defensive. You'll have to decide how to handle that.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:For a time, I had a strong tendency to attract people like this into my life.

I think the reason they are like this is they have control issues that stem from insecurity or anxiety. They seek to control everyone around them because they believe if everyone and everything just functioned according to their directives, there would be no more problems or surprises in life.

I also think there is a usually a touch (or more) of narcissism in these personalities, because of their inability to see that their advice is not welcome or realize that they might not have enough information or context to decide what is best for other people. Someone who has more empathy and a sense of humility would understand when to back off, and would be able to handle the idea that maybe they don't actually know what's best. But people like this will persist even when presented with clear evidence that their advice is not helpful or on point.

I also think people with this personality type tend to seek out people they view to be "coachable" because it helps them satisfy their need for control. They don't do this to people who are very assertive and confident. They seek out people who seem unsure of themselves or who appear willing to be controlled. I think this is why I have a tendency to attract this type. I was abused growing up and my mother is like this, and I think people with similar personalities kind of smell it on me. I also think I tend to be instantly accommodating of people like this when I encounter them, because as a child I learned that resisting or argument could lead to verbal or physical abuse.

I have found the best way to deal with people like this is to keep them at arms length and not let them into my inner circle. Sometimes you can't avoid them completely. I have worked with people like this and you can't always just leave a job. Right now I am dealing with a personality like this in the mother of one of my kid's good school friends. I don't want to make an enemy of her so I have to play along to some degree, but I keep her at a distance -- I encourage the kid's friendship but resist getting too close to the mom. It takes work but it's what I have to do to avoid the meddling and controlling behavior.

Whole lotta words/judgments about others to avoid just saying "Hey, please don't give me advice unless I ask"

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:It's possible that you won't be able to figure out why she is the way she is. You can't diagnose her. You could invent a reason that helps you stay calm in the face of her unsolicited advice (ASD, anxiety, personality disorder), but you might be wrong about the reason. It is equally important to keep a check on your own boundaries here.

You have kindly decided to try to be her friend the way she is, when it appears many others have not been able to do so. So I think as others have said, whatever the reason for her behavior, you can only find a kind and clear way to keep responding, plus draw new boundaries to minimize the incidents that are distressing you.

Maybe the next time she does it you could ask her (kindly) instead of us? "Larla, remember when I told you yesterday that my doctor said I'm not having the side effect you are concerned about? I agree with my doctor, and I'm fine with that, yet we keep having the same conversation about it. It distresses me. Is there a reason I should know about that you keep bringing it up? I'm trying to understand." She may enlighten you to the source of anxiety in her life that causes repetitive meddling. Or she may not realize she is doing it and get defensive. You'll have to decide how to handle that.

Imagine being this sanctimonious, and feeling like some sort of generous person, deigning to befriend this unbefriendable person, instead of just asking for what you want and setting your own boundaries.

It's getting clear where the mental issues are, and it's not where you seem to think

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:This sounds like someone you just need to stop telling things to, to be honest.

This and she sounds awful. What exactly do you like about her?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:For a time, I had a strong tendency to attract people like this into my life.

I think the reason they are like this is they have control issues that stem from insecurity or anxiety. They seek to control everyone around them because they believe if everyone and everything just functioned according to their directives, there would be no more problems or surprises in life.

I also think there is a usually a touch (or more) of narcissism in these personalities, because of their inability to see that their advice is not welcome or realize that they might not have enough information or context to decide what is best for other people. Someone who has more empathy and a sense of humility would understand when to back off, and would be able to handle the idea that maybe they don't actually know what's best. But people like this will persist even when presented with clear evidence that their advice is not helpful or on point.

I also think people with this personality type tend to seek out people they view to be "coachable" because it helps them satisfy their need for control. They don't do this to people who are very assertive and confident. They seek out people who seem unsure of themselves or who appear willing to be controlled. I think this is why I have a tendency to attract this type. I was abused growing up and my mother is like this, and I think people with similar personalities kind of smell it on me. I also think I tend to be instantly accommodating of people like this when I encounter them, because as a child I learned that resisting or argument could lead to verbal or physical abuse.

I have found the best way to deal with people like this is to keep them at arms length and not let them into my inner circle. Sometimes you can't avoid them completely. I have worked with people like this and you can't always just leave a job. Right now I am dealing with a personality like this in the mother of one of my kid's good school friends. I don't want to make an enemy of her so I have to play along to some degree, but I keep her at a distance -- I encourage the kid's friendship but resist getting too close to the mom. It takes work but it's what I have to do to avoid the meddling and controlling behavior.

Whole lotta words/judgments about others to avoid just saying "Hey, please don't give me advice unless I ask"

OP specifically asked for insight into why her friend may behave this way. I have a lot of experience with people like this and have thought a lot about this dynamic, so I shared that insight.

And when I have known people like this, saying "hey, please don't give me advice unless I ask" has resulted in them getting upset, arguing with me about it, or becoming nasty towards me. So I have not found that directly telling someone with this personality to stop is particularly useful.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My husband can get like hyperfocused like this on other people's problems and has trouble understanding when to back off. He has an ASD/ADHD profile and a stubborn personality. Our son also has an ASD/ADHD profile but he's sweet and gentle, and would never insert himself in this way. So I think it's a combo of neurodivergence (not being able to read social cues) and being stubborn.

Me again. The only thing you can do is be direct, because if your friend isn't great at reading body language and diplomatic beating around the bush, she will never understand until you say: "No, I've decided to do it my way instead."

I think the expression is "Clear is kind"

Exactly. Clear is kind:
“Sally, please stop. I can handle this, and I’m not discussing it anymore.”

That's crossing out of kindness. You can be clear without being rude.

+1 The "Sally, please stop" example given is classic DCUM harsh. You can be clear without scolding.

OP, think of this friend's advice as their love language. They are trying to help, and feel useful.

Asking someone to stop isn't harsh. FFS.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:For a time, I had a strong tendency to attract people like this into my life.

I think the reason they are like this is they have control issues that stem from insecurity or anxiety. They seek to control everyone around them because they believe if everyone and everything just functioned according to their directives, there would be no more problems or surprises in life.

I also think there is a usually a touch (or more) of narcissism in these personalities, because of their inability to see that their advice is not welcome or realize that they might not have enough information or context to decide what is best for other people. Someone who has more empathy and a sense of humility would understand when to back off, and would be able to handle the idea that maybe they don't actually know what's best. But people like this will persist even when presented with clear evidence that their advice is not helpful or on point.

I also think people with this personality type tend to seek out people they view to be "coachable" because it helps them satisfy their need for control. They don't do this to people who are very assertive and confident. They seek out people who seem unsure of themselves or who appear willing to be controlled. I think this is why I have a tendency to attract this type. I was abused growing up and my mother is like this, and I think people with similar personalities kind of smell it on me. I also think I tend to be instantly accommodating of people like this when I encounter them, because as a child I learned that resisting or argument could lead to verbal or physical abuse.

I have found the best way to deal with people like this is to keep them at arms length and not let them into my inner circle. Sometimes you can't avoid them completely. I have worked with people like this and you can't always just leave a job. Right now I am dealing with a personality like this in the mother of one of my kid's good school friends. I don't want to make an enemy of her so I have to play along to some degree, but I keep her at a distance -- I encourage the kid's friendship but resist getting too close to the mom. It takes work but it's what I have to do to avoid the meddling and controlling behavior.

I completely agree with this. It matches my experience with these types. I notice this sort of behavior on DCUM too!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I agree w/ the neurodivergence possibility.

Sometimes it's easiest, best, and most effective to simple be direct.

Hey Jane, when you give me advice you often use the words "need" and "should". It makes me feel like you're telling me what to do, or like you think I haven't thought of such basic things. I'm sure that isn't your intent. I really think that if you didn't use those words I could handle it better. And actually, I could also just tell you when I want advice versus when I want you to just listen. Would that help?

You might be surprised by her welcoming such directness. I have had that exact experience w/ people. If they don't understand social nuances well enough to adjust their thinking they may actually appreciate direct requests on how to adjust language.

I hate how people have started pretending it's other people's "neurodivergence" and how "they don't understand social nuances well" when it's really the speaker's issues, pet peeves, unspoken preferences causing the speaker's problem(s). This isn't some kind of universal thing where everyone who doesn't work the way you do is off or odd in some way. If you have preferences ("I just need to vent and I don't want any advice"), the burden falls on YOU to create the container for that conversation. Stop blaming/pathologizing your so-called friends for not magically understanding the things you want/need but don't ask for.

DP. I get where you’re coming from but the responses OP’s friend is giving suggest that the friend has no idea of how to talk within social norms. OP has also said the friend has relationship issues. That seems plausible.

The board isn’t helped by you trying to make stuff up and rip into OP. Maybe you’re posting because you need someone to tell you to take up exercise. No judgement.