stubborn senior declaring she would rather die falling at home than go into a nursing home

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If I were 70 and in good health and my kids were already pressing me about nursing homes I’d be pissed too.

Jesus Christ, OP give it a rest. Circle back to her in a few years.

Okay. If you had a stroke, or a fall and broke your hip, or some other catastrophic health event, you would be expecting to handle the time after discharge care and possibly needing assistance all on your own, is that right?

Because if the plan is to have your kids drop the rope on their lives and come figure things out for you, then they kind of have a right to ask a few questions about that in advance.

You sound like a real peach.

[Anonymous]

I'm with her on that one.

[Anonymous]

She is 70. That’s not very old, OP.

My advice is to leave her alone and tend to the relationship.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm 70 and I agree with your mom.

I run the dogs, muck out the stables, and ride my horse 6 days a week and I will do a swan dive off a cliff into the ocean before I'll go to a nursing home.

So what's your plan to not F over your kids when you get older and can't live independently anymore? Or do you not care about them?

I don't have any kids. I live in a state with assisted suicide.

Yeah, good luck with that assisted suicide. You need a diagnosis from a doctor that you have a terminal illness with death expected within 6 months to qualify for medical assistance in dying -- you can't just waltz in and say "time for me to shuffle off the mortal coil." And if you do choose a DIY method, FFS do it responsibly. Clean out your shit, put your affairs in order, and commit suicide in a way that won't traumatize the people who have to deal with your body. Like tie a very heavy rock around your legs and make sure you jump really far off that cliff into deep water so that you won't splatter on the rocks for the EMTs and law enforcement to clean up or so that your bloated corpse doesn't float to the surface for the EMTs and Coast Guard to deal with.

I'm serious here. My husband used to work as an EMT, including a wilderness EMT, and it's hard to underestimate the trauma that dealing with the body of someone who committed suicide or died in a grisly outdoor accident can inflict on those whose job it is to clean up the mess.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm 70 and I agree with your mom.

I run the dogs, muck out the stables, and ride my horse 6 days a week and I will do a swan dive off a cliff into the ocean before I'll go to a nursing home.

Okay, have you actually figured out how this will work when the time comes? Because when you are old and approaching infirmary, you’ve not going to have a lot of options. Is there a cliff near you? Or have you hoarded enough heroin to OD on? You better time it so you can still administer it. Your kids aren’t going to want to help you kill yourself, and if they did, they’d be opening themselves up to murder charges. If you wait until you have a stroke or something and can’t do it yourself, you’re SOL.

Bottom line: This all sounds good in theory, and I hear healthy people say it all the time but “when the time comes I’ll jump off a cliff” is not a plan. If you’re serious, make a real plan, and if you’re not or it makes you too uncomfortable, you’re leaving your kids in the same boat as everyone else: trying to manage end of life care for someone who stubbornly says “no nursing home for me!” but has no alternative. And it’s a sh*tty place to be.

I'm younger, but my plan is to go to a doctor and complain about panic attacks to get a good anti-anxiety med, and combine that with a bottle of tequila and a bath. I guess if I can't get the anti-anxiety meds, then a bottle of Zz-quil would work. This just doesn't seem that complicated...famous people seem to do it all the time.

My sister is a psychiatrist and she has told me most people actually don't manage to die when the try to kill themselves using pills.

ANd many people who jump just wind up disbaling themselves.

It's actually pretty challenging to deliberately die.

[Anonymous]

OP here, I guess my question is would you try to respect the wishes of someone who clearly would rather live at home against medical advice than go to a nursing home when the time comes? No one lives close enough to her to help out (including me), and there's no money for aides, assisted living or long term care insurance. She's unlikely to change her mind, and she definitely has all her faculties at the moment.

She brought up the subject after we visited a relative in a nursing home.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If I were 70 and in good health and my kids were already pressing me about nursing homes I’d be pissed too.

Jesus Christ, OP give it a rest. Circle back to her in a few years.

Okay. If you had a stroke, or a fall and broke your hip, or some other catastrophic health event, you would be expecting to handle the time after discharge care and possibly needing assistance all on your own, is that right?

Because if the plan is to have your kids drop the rope on their lives and come figure things out for you, then they kind of have a right to ask a few questions about that in advance.

You sound like a real peach.

I do notice that you did not answer the question.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm 70 and I agree with your mom.

I run the dogs, muck out the stables, and ride my horse 6 days a week and I will do a swan dive off a cliff into the ocean before I'll go to a nursing home.

So what's your plan to not F over your kids when you get older and can't live independently anymore? Or do you not care about them?

I don't have any kids. I live in a state with assisted suicide.

DP. What about nephews and nieces or other younger relatives that care about you? They may end up being your advocates/caretakers whether you like it or not. That's what my SILs had to do for several unmarried aunts with no kids. Also, consider that, if you are ever hospitalized, depending on your condition, you may not be allowed to go home if the hospital social worker knows you live alone and have no-one to take care of you. What I'm trying to say is, you don't always have 100 percent choice in what happens to you when you're old and ailing, even if you think you do.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm 70 and I agree with your mom.

I run the dogs, muck out the stables, and ride my horse 6 days a week and I will do a swan dive off a cliff into the ocean before I'll go to a nursing home.

Okay, have you actually figured out how this will work when the time comes? Because when you are old and approaching infirmary, you’ve not going to have a lot of options. Is there a cliff near you? Or have you hoarded enough heroin to OD on? You better time it so you can still administer it. Your kids aren’t going to want to help you kill yourself, and if they did, they’d be opening themselves up to murder charges. If you wait until you have a stroke or something and can’t do it yourself, you’re SOL.

Bottom line: This all sounds good in theory, and I hear healthy people say it all the time but “when the time comes I’ll jump off a cliff” is not a plan. If you’re serious, make a real plan, and if you’re not or it makes you too uncomfortable, you’re leaving your kids in the same boat as everyone else: trying to manage end of life care for someone who stubbornly says “no nursing home for me!” but has no alternative. And it’s a sh*tty place to be.

I'm younger, but my plan is to go to a doctor and complain about panic attacks to get a good anti-anxiety med, and combine that with a bottle of tequila and a bath. I guess if I can't get the anti-anxiety meds, then a bottle of Zz-quil would work. This just doesn't seem that complicated...famous people seem to do it all the time.

My sister is a psychiatrist and she has told me most people actually don't manage to die when the try to kill themselves using pills.

ANd many people who jump just wind up disbaling themselves.

It's actually pretty challenging to deliberately die.

This thread is morbidly interesting. What about fentanyl? The warnings that just a speck can kill.

[Anonymous]

Your mom has made clear her choices. You also have the right to make clear your choices, including what, if anything, you are prepared to do to help her stay at home. That should be part of the conversations you have with her, so she understands the implications of her choices and your boundaries.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm 70 and I agree with your mom.

I run the dogs, muck out the stables, and ride my horse 6 days a week and I will do a swan dive off a cliff into the ocean before I'll go to a nursing home.

Okay, have you actually figured out how this will work when the time comes? Because when you are old and approaching infirmary, you’ve not going to have a lot of options. Is there a cliff near you? Or have you hoarded enough heroin to OD on? You better time it so you can still administer it. Your kids aren’t going to want to help you kill yourself, and if they did, they’d be opening themselves up to murder charges. If you wait until you have a stroke or something and can’t do it yourself, you’re SOL.

Bottom line: This all sounds good in theory, and I hear healthy people say it all the time but “when the time comes I’ll jump off a cliff” is not a plan. If you’re serious, make a real plan, and if you’re not or it makes you too uncomfortable, you’re leaving your kids in the same boat as everyone else: trying to manage end of life care for someone who stubbornly says “no nursing home for me!” but has no alternative. And it’s a sh*tty place to be.

I'm younger, but my plan is to go to a doctor and complain about panic attacks to get a good anti-anxiety med, and combine that with a bottle of tequila and a bath. I guess if I can't get the anti-anxiety meds, then a bottle of Zz-quil would work. This just doesn't seem that complicated...famous people seem to do it all the time.

My sister is a psychiatrist and she has told me most people actually don't manage to die when the try to kill themselves using pills.

ANd many people who jump just wind up disbaling themselves.

It's actually pretty challenging to deliberately die.

This thread is morbidly interesting. What about fentanyl? The warnings that just a speck can kill.

Do you know how to get fentanyl? I don’t.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP here, I guess my question is would you try to respect the wishes of someone who clearly would rather live at home against medical advice than go to a nursing home when the time comes? No one lives close enough to her to help out (including me), and there's no money for aides, assisted living or long term care insurance. She's unlikely to change her mind, and she definitely has all her faculties at the moment.

She brought up the subject after we visited a relative in a nursing home.

If I were in your situation I would respectfully ask mom how she envisioned this happening given the obstacles you have named. I think the key is to get her thinking about what is realistic without challenging her or making her feel like her preferences don't matter or aren't possible. You are fortunate to be able to have these discussions before the time for an ultimate decision is imminent.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:She is 70. That’s not very old, OP.

My advice is to leave her alone and tend to the relationship.

No, OP is right.

You aren't going to KNOW the moment when you need POA. I started pressing my parents, mostly my mom because of my dad's progressing Parkinsons (meaning he is not able to be her poa for cognitive reasons) when she was in her early 70's. She finally did it around age 74 to make me poa for them both and her poa for him.

Less than two years later, I got the call that she was in the ambulance after a bad fall (dad fell with her and he also had to be hospitalized) and in an instant, I needed that POA and I'm so grateful I had it! As the child, I'm the one they called, I'm the one who the doctor asked about DNR for the hip surgery, I'm the one who had to get them placed in a rehab, I'm the one who had to pay their bills while they were in rehab for 6 weeks after so they would have power and water at home.I needed and used that POA then.

If OP's mom is not married (sounded like she wasn't) and OP is the one who would do those things, then yes, she needs to be made POA now. Mom can make it so that it is in effect if Mom is 'incapacitated' . That's what I have, my mom is mostly recovered now so she is Dad's poa right now and I'm not excercizing any poa at this time.

[Anonymous]

My mother is 90 and still in good condition. She's still working because she wants to, not because she needs to. And she's in good shape. That said, she's still 90 and we know it. But Dad was 6 years older and passed 3 years ago when he was 93. He had some short stints of going into rehabilitation and he hated those stays and never wanted to stay there. He wanted to leave as soon as he could get anyone to sign off on letting him come home. Mom cared for him at home, so she fully understands that those facilities are like.

My mother has a DNR and orders not to perform any actions that would prolong her life. She is living at home by herself and she cares for herself. The kids all live out of state, but we have a family friend who lives 1 mile from her and checks in on her about every other day. She also has friends that she sees a couple of times a week and they would (and have) called me if they could not get a hold of her.

It's not ideal, but in the long run, I know that she is much happier at home than she would be in an assisted living facility and she's lived a long and full life. So we respect her decision and we check in on her regularly and we stagger our visits with her so that she has kids or grandkids visiting as often as possible. I think that cutting her life short by a few months is better than her living what she would consider a living h*ll for a few years. I would rather she be happy with her life than have a longer unhappy life.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP here, I guess my question is would you try to respect the wishes of someone who clearly would rather live at home against medical advice than go to a nursing home when the time comes? No one lives close enough to her to help out (including me), and there's no money for aides, assisted living or long term care insurance. She's unlikely to change her mind, and she definitely has all her faculties at the moment.

She brought up the subject after we visited a relative in a nursing home.

Well, if she was mentally capable but physically needed a nursing home-I guess you can't stop someone from dying at home. If she's not mentally competent when she needed a nursing home, then she wouldn't have a say in it.