Atheist bil won’t allow 3 year old nephew to receive a gift during holidays

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:I'm imagining one of the teens requesting a gift for themselves that the nephew might like (stuffed animal, ball...) and then sharing it with him.

Why would that be less offensive than a kid slipping their Kosher cousin a piece of bacon?

I’ve heard atheist ppl say atheism isn’t a religion; it’s simply no belief in God or gods. But you are comparing the two?

Is belief in God superior to not believe in God? For respect to be received, it must be given, no?

But I’ve been told numerous times here atheism is nothing but a disbelief in God or gods. Santa is not a god.

DP. Parents make all sorts of decisions about their kids that have nothing to do with religion. Or, even within one particular religion, parents will have different “rules” for their family.

Intentionally going against parents’ wishes behind their back is disrespectful. Period.

This was a lame attempt to antagonize atheists. ‘Tis the season?

No, a poster is comparing giving a kosher Jewish child bacon w/o parental knowledge to giving a grandchild a Christmas gift after his atheist parents do not give consent.

Atheism is a religion w/o a god.

It's not.

And PP was comparing two instances of going against parents' wishes. It has nothing to do with religion.

Breaking kosher is breaking religious rules. Specifically.

But they are religious rules that parents choose to follow. Religious rules aren’t superior to any other rules.

Even atheists have their rules, apparently.

There are no “atheist rules”. Just individual families making their own decisions. Just like everyone else.

Then why did pp compare this situation to kosher rules? That’s not parents or families randomly deciding to not eat certain foods; it’s a religious thing.

Ok so would you be cool with slipping a piece of meat to the child of a vegetarian family?

Larlo is extremely limited on cookies and cake, etc. He cried and screamed so much last year my sister allowed him to have a single cookie doled out small piece at a time. It satisfied him and he behaved when she did that. He wouldn’t stop melting down until she allowed him a small cookie. So apparently she was ok with it after he got upset. Everyone wanted him to have a cookie because it’s a treat at Christmas and then when he started screaming for one by the table we wanted him to stop crying. I don’t think it’s bad to limit sweets but when it makes your child have a screaming fit to deprive them, what are you doing to your child?

Limiting sweets isn't the same as a vegetarian or a vegan because for many of those people it is an ethical decision. Even if it wasn't an ethical decision it is up to the parent if they want to stick with it or not. The fundamental disrespect for other's views and opinions when they have no impact on you is astounding here.

I disagree. I feel that my bil married into a family that celebrates Christmas and he should respect that tradition. Imagine if a Christian married a Jewish person and then decided the children couldn’t participate in Jewish family traditions? People can respect the traditions of their extended family and also raise their kids with their family with other values.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm imagining one of the teens requesting a gift for themselves that the nephew might like (stuffed animal, ball...) and then sharing it with him.

Why would that be less offensive than a kid slipping their Kosher cousin a piece of bacon?

I’ve heard atheist ppl say atheism isn’t a religion; it’s simply no belief in God or gods. But you are comparing the two?

Is belief in God superior to not believe in God? For respect to be received, it must be given, no?

But I’ve been told numerous times here atheism is nothing but a disbelief in God or gods. Santa is not a god.

DP. Parents make all sorts of decisions about their kids that have nothing to do with religion. Or, even within one particular religion, parents will have different “rules” for their family.

Intentionally going against parents’ wishes behind their back is disrespectful. Period.

This was a lame attempt to antagonize atheists. ‘Tis the season?

No, a poster is comparing giving a kosher Jewish child bacon w/o parental knowledge to giving a grandchild a Christmas gift after his atheist parents do not give consent.

Atheism is a religion w/o a god.

It's not.

And PP was comparing two instances of going against parents' wishes. It has nothing to do with religion.

Breaking kosher is breaking religious rules. Specifically.

But they are religious rules that parents choose to follow. Religious rules aren’t superior to any other rules.

Even atheists have their rules, apparently.

There are no “atheist rules”. Just individual families making their own decisions. Just like everyone else.

Then why did pp compare this situation to kosher rules? That’s not parents or families randomly deciding to not eat certain foods; it’s a religious thing.

Ok so would you be cool with slipping a piece of meat to the child of a vegetarian family?

Larlo is extremely limited on cookies and cake, etc. He cried and screamed so much last year my sister allowed him to have a single cookie doled out small piece at a time. It satisfied him and he behaved when she did that. He wouldn’t stop melting down until she allowed him a small cookie. So apparently she was ok with it after he got upset. Everyone wanted him to have a cookie because it’s a treat at Christmas and then when he started screaming for one by the table we wanted him to stop crying. I don’t think it’s bad to limit sweets but when it makes your child have a screaming fit to deprive them, what are you doing to your child?

Limiting sweets isn't the same as a vegetarian or a vegan because for many of those people it is an ethical decision. Even if it wasn't an ethical decision it is up to the parent if they want to stick with it or not. The fundamental disrespect for other's views and opinions when they have no impact on you is astounding here.

I disagree. I feel that my bil married into a family that celebrates Christmas and he should respect that tradition. Imagine if a Christian married a Jewish person and then decided the children couldn’t participate in Jewish family traditions? People can respect the traditions of their extended family and also raise their kids with their family with other values.

That’s not the case here. The sister is agnostic and the OP said “they decided”. The Op is blaming the BIL but it appears to be a joint decision. If someone find the traditions offensive, distasteful or unethical that is their prerogative. Again would you encourage a kosher Jew to “just have the ham. After all it’s what Christian’s eat at Easter!”? He didn’t marry the family, he married the wife who is apparently on board. You don’t have to compromise your beliefs because some other family believes it. Do I agree with the stance the sister and BIL are taking, no, but it’s not my life. You don’t have to like something to respect it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm imagining one of the teens requesting a gift for themselves that the nephew might like (stuffed animal, ball...) and then sharing it with him.

Why would that be less offensive than a kid slipping their Kosher cousin a piece of bacon?

I’ve heard atheist ppl say atheism isn’t a religion; it’s simply no belief in God or gods. But you are comparing the two?

Is belief in God superior to not believe in God? For respect to be received, it must be given, no?

But I’ve been told numerous times here atheism is nothing but a disbelief in God or gods. Santa is not a god.

DP. Parents make all sorts of decisions about their kids that have nothing to do with religion. Or, even within one particular religion, parents will have different “rules” for their family.

Intentionally going against parents’ wishes behind their back is disrespectful. Period.

This was a lame attempt to antagonize atheists. ‘Tis the season?

No, a poster is comparing giving a kosher Jewish child bacon w/o parental knowledge to giving a grandchild a Christmas gift after his atheist parents do not give consent.

Atheism is a religion w/o a god.

It's not.

And PP was comparing two instances of going against parents' wishes. It has nothing to do with religion.

Breaking kosher is breaking religious rules. Specifically.

But they are religious rules that parents choose to follow. Religious rules aren’t superior to any other rules.

Even atheists have their rules, apparently.

There are no “atheist rules”. Just individual families making their own decisions. Just like everyone else.

Then why did pp compare this situation to kosher rules? That’s not parents or families randomly deciding to not eat certain foods; it’s a religious thing.

Ok so would you be cool with slipping a piece of meat to the child of a vegetarian family?

Larlo is extremely limited on cookies and cake, etc. He cried and screamed so much last year my sister allowed him to have a single cookie doled out small piece at a time. It satisfied him and he behaved when she did that. He wouldn’t stop melting down until she allowed him a small cookie. So apparently she was ok with it after he got upset. Everyone wanted him to have a cookie because it’s a treat at Christmas and then when he started screaming for one by the table we wanted him to stop crying. I don’t think it’s bad to limit sweets but when it makes your child have a screaming fit to deprive them, what are you doing to your child?

Limiting sweets isn't the same as a vegetarian or a vegan because for many of those people it is an ethical decision. Even if it wasn't an ethical decision it is up to the parent if they want to stick with it or not. The fundamental disrespect for other's views and opinions when they have no impact on you is astounding here.

I disagree. I feel that my bil married into a family that celebrates Christmas and he should respect that tradition. Imagine if a Christian married a Jewish person and then decided the children couldn’t participate in Jewish family traditions? People can respect the traditions of their extended family and also raise their kids with their family with other values.

That’s not the case here. The sister is agnostic and the OP said “they decided”. The Op is blaming the BIL but it appears to be a joint decision. If someone find the traditions offensive, distasteful or unethical that is their prerogative. Again would you encourage a kosher Jew to “just have the ham. After all it’s what Christian’s eat at Easter!”? He didn’t marry the family, he married the wife who is apparently on board. You don’t have to compromise your beliefs because some other family believes it. Do I agree with the stance the sister and BIL are taking, no, but it’s not my life. You don’t have to like something to respect it.

Again with the religious comparison…

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm imagining one of the teens requesting a gift for themselves that the nephew might like (stuffed animal, ball...) and then sharing it with him.

Why would that be less offensive than a kid slipping their Kosher cousin a piece of bacon?

I’ve heard atheist ppl say atheism isn’t a religion; it’s simply no belief in God or gods. But you are comparing the two?

Is belief in God superior to not believe in God? For respect to be received, it must be given, no?

But I’ve been told numerous times here atheism is nothing but a disbelief in God or gods. Santa is not a god.

DP. Parents make all sorts of decisions about their kids that have nothing to do with religion. Or, even within one particular religion, parents will have different “rules” for their family.

Intentionally going against parents’ wishes behind their back is disrespectful. Period.

This was a lame attempt to antagonize atheists. ‘Tis the season?

No, a poster is comparing giving a kosher Jewish child bacon w/o parental knowledge to giving a grandchild a Christmas gift after his atheist parents do not give consent.

Atheism is a religion w/o a god.

It's not.

And PP was comparing two instances of going against parents' wishes. It has nothing to do with religion.

Breaking kosher is breaking religious rules. Specifically.

But they are religious rules that parents choose to follow. Religious rules aren’t superior to any other rules.

Even atheists have their rules, apparently.

There are no “atheist rules”. Just individual families making their own decisions. Just like everyone else.

Then why did pp compare this situation to kosher rules? That’s not parents or families randomly deciding to not eat certain foods; it’s a religious thing.

Ok so would you be cool with slipping a piece of meat to the child of a vegetarian family?

Larlo is extremely limited on cookies and cake, etc. He cried and screamed so much last year my sister allowed him to have a single cookie doled out small piece at a time. It satisfied him and he behaved when she did that. He wouldn’t stop melting down until she allowed him a small cookie. So apparently she was ok with it after he got upset. Everyone wanted him to have a cookie because it’s a treat at Christmas and then when he started screaming for one by the table we wanted him to stop crying. I don’t think it’s bad to limit sweets but when it makes your child have a screaming fit to deprive them, what are you doing to your child?

Limiting sweets isn't the same as a vegetarian or a vegan because for many of those people it is an ethical decision. Even if it wasn't an ethical decision it is up to the parent if they want to stick with it or not. The fundamental disrespect for other's views and opinions when they have no impact on you is astounding here.

I disagree. I feel that my bil married into a family that celebrates Christmas and he should respect that tradition. Imagine if a Christian married a Jewish person and then decided the children couldn’t participate in Jewish family traditions? People can respect the traditions of their extended family and also raise their kids with their family with other values.

That’s not the case here. The sister is agnostic and the OP said “they decided”. The Op is blaming the BIL but it appears to be a joint decision. If someone find the traditions offensive, distasteful or unethical that is their prerogative. Again would you encourage a kosher Jew to “just have the ham. After all it’s what Christian’s eat at Easter!”? He didn’t marry the family, he married the wife who is apparently on board. You don’t have to compromise your beliefs because some other family believes it. Do I agree with the stance the sister and BIL are taking, no, but it’s not my life. You don’t have to like something to respect it.

Yet bil is asking us to compromise our beliefs/traditions?

Giving a child a gift at Christmas is offensive, unethical, or distasteful? How?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm imagining one of the teens requesting a gift for themselves that the nephew might like (stuffed animal, ball...) and then sharing it with him.

Why would that be less offensive than a kid slipping their Kosher cousin a piece of bacon?

I’ve heard atheist ppl say atheism isn’t a religion; it’s simply no belief in God or gods. But you are comparing the two?

Is belief in God superior to not believe in God? For respect to be received, it must be given, no?

But I’ve been told numerous times here atheism is nothing but a disbelief in God or gods. Santa is not a god.

DP. Parents make all sorts of decisions about their kids that have nothing to do with religion. Or, even within one particular religion, parents will have different “rules” for their family.

Intentionally going against parents’ wishes behind their back is disrespectful. Period.

This was a lame attempt to antagonize atheists. ‘Tis the season?

No, a poster is comparing giving a kosher Jewish child bacon w/o parental knowledge to giving a grandchild a Christmas gift after his atheist parents do not give consent.

Atheism is a religion w/o a god.

It's not.

And PP was comparing two instances of going against parents' wishes. It has nothing to do with religion.

Breaking kosher is breaking religious rules. Specifically.

But they are religious rules that parents choose to follow. Religious rules aren’t superior to any other rules.

Even atheists have their rules, apparently.

There are no “atheist rules”. Just individual families making their own decisions. Just like everyone else.

Then why did pp compare this situation to kosher rules? That’s not parents or families randomly deciding to not eat certain foods; it’s a religious thing.

Ok so would you be cool with slipping a piece of meat to the child of a vegetarian family?

Larlo is extremely limited on cookies and cake, etc. He cried and screamed so much last year my sister allowed him to have a single cookie doled out small piece at a time. It satisfied him and he behaved when she did that. He wouldn’t stop melting down until she allowed him a small cookie. So apparently she was ok with it after he got upset. Everyone wanted him to have a cookie because it’s a treat at Christmas and then when he started screaming for one by the table we wanted him to stop crying. I don’t think it’s bad to limit sweets but when it makes your child have a screaming fit to deprive them, what are you doing to your child?

Limiting sweets isn't the same as a vegetarian or a vegan because for many of those people it is an ethical decision. Even if it wasn't an ethical decision it is up to the parent if they want to stick with it or not. The fundamental disrespect for other's views and opinions when they have no impact on you is astounding here.

I disagree. I feel that my bil married into a family that celebrates Christmas and he should respect that tradition. Imagine if a Christian married a Jewish person and then decided the children couldn’t participate in Jewish family traditions? People can respect the traditions of their extended family and also raise their kids with their family with other values.

That’s not the case here. The sister is agnostic and the OP said “they decided”. The Op is blaming the BIL but it appears to be a joint decision. If someone find the traditions offensive, distasteful or unethical that is their prerogative. Again would you encourage a kosher Jew to “just have the ham. After all it’s what Christian’s eat at Easter!”? He didn’t marry the family, he married the wife who is apparently on board. You don’t have to compromise your beliefs because some other family believes it. Do I agree with the stance the sister and BIL are taking, no, but it’s not my life. You don’t have to like something to respect it.

Yet bil is asking us to compromise our beliefs/traditions?

Giving a child a gift at Christmas is offensive, unethical, or distasteful? How?

He’s not asking anyone to compromise anything. He’s coming, he’s interacting. He just doesn’t want his child to receive a gift. I don’t know why he feels this way, but he does. I don’t know why some people do a million things that they do but generally if it doesn’t impact me, I try to respect that.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm imagining one of the teens requesting a gift for themselves that the nephew might like (stuffed animal, ball...) and then sharing it with him.

Why would that be less offensive than a kid slipping their Kosher cousin a piece of bacon?

I’ve heard atheist ppl say atheism isn’t a religion; it’s simply no belief in God or gods. But you are comparing the two?

Is belief in God superior to not believe in God? For respect to be received, it must be given, no?

But I’ve been told numerous times here atheism is nothing but a disbelief in God or gods. Santa is not a god.

DP. Parents make all sorts of decisions about their kids that have nothing to do with religion. Or, even within one particular religion, parents will have different “rules” for their family.

Intentionally going against parents’ wishes behind their back is disrespectful. Period.

This was a lame attempt to antagonize atheists. ‘Tis the season?

No, a poster is comparing giving a kosher Jewish child bacon w/o parental knowledge to giving a grandchild a Christmas gift after his atheist parents do not give consent.

Atheism is a religion w/o a god.

It's not.

And PP was comparing two instances of going against parents' wishes. It has nothing to do with religion.

Breaking kosher is breaking religious rules. Specifically.

But they are religious rules that parents choose to follow. Religious rules aren’t superior to any other rules.

Even atheists have their rules, apparently.

There are no “atheist rules”. Just individual families making their own decisions. Just like everyone else.

Then why did pp compare this situation to kosher rules? That’s not parents or families randomly deciding to not eat certain foods; it’s a religious thing.

Ok so would you be cool with slipping a piece of meat to the child of a vegetarian family?

Larlo is extremely limited on cookies and cake, etc. He cried and screamed so much last year my sister allowed him to have a single cookie doled out small piece at a time. It satisfied him and he behaved when she did that. He wouldn’t stop melting down until she allowed him a small cookie. So apparently she was ok with it after he got upset. Everyone wanted him to have a cookie because it’s a treat at Christmas and then when he started screaming for one by the table we wanted him to stop crying. I don’t think it’s bad to limit sweets but when it makes your child have a screaming fit to deprive them, what are you doing to your child?

Limiting sweets isn't the same as a vegetarian or a vegan because for many of those people it is an ethical decision. Even if it wasn't an ethical decision it is up to the parent if they want to stick with it or not. The fundamental disrespect for other's views and opinions when they have no impact on you is astounding here.

I disagree. I feel that my bil married into a family that celebrates Christmas and he should respect that tradition. Imagine if a Christian married a Jewish person and then decided the children couldn’t participate in Jewish family traditions? People can respect the traditions of their extended family and also raise their kids with their family with other values.

That’s not the case here. The sister is agnostic and the OP said “they decided”. The Op is blaming the BIL but it appears to be a joint decision. If someone find the traditions offensive, distasteful or unethical that is their prerogative. Again would you encourage a kosher Jew to “just have the ham. After all it’s what Christian’s eat at Easter!”? He didn’t marry the family, he married the wife who is apparently on board. You don’t have to compromise your beliefs because some other family believes it. Do I agree with the stance the sister and BIL are taking, no, but it’s not my life. You don’t have to like something to respect it.

Again with the religious comparison…

You seem to think that religious beliefs are the only ones worth being respected.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm imagining one of the teens requesting a gift for themselves that the nephew might like (stuffed animal, ball...) and then sharing it with him.

Why would that be less offensive than a kid slipping their Kosher cousin a piece of bacon?

I’ve heard atheist ppl say atheism isn’t a religion; it’s simply no belief in God or gods. But you are comparing the two?

Is belief in God superior to not believe in God? For respect to be received, it must be given, no?

But I’ve been told numerous times here atheism is nothing but a disbelief in God or gods. Santa is not a god.

DP. Parents make all sorts of decisions about their kids that have nothing to do with religion. Or, even within one particular religion, parents will have different “rules” for their family.

Intentionally going against parents’ wishes behind their back is disrespectful. Period.

This was a lame attempt to antagonize atheists. ‘Tis the season?

No, a poster is comparing giving a kosher Jewish child bacon w/o parental knowledge to giving a grandchild a Christmas gift after his atheist parents do not give consent.

Atheism is a religion w/o a god.

It's not.

And PP was comparing two instances of going against parents' wishes. It has nothing to do with religion.

Breaking kosher is breaking religious rules. Specifically.

But they are religious rules that parents choose to follow. Religious rules aren’t superior to any other rules.

Even atheists have their rules, apparently.

There are no “atheist rules”. Just individual families making their own decisions. Just like everyone else.

Then why did pp compare this situation to kosher rules? That’s not parents or families randomly deciding to not eat certain foods; it’s a religious thing.

Ok so would you be cool with slipping a piece of meat to the child of a vegetarian family?

Larlo is extremely limited on cookies and cake, etc. He cried and screamed so much last year my sister allowed him to have a single cookie doled out small piece at a time. It satisfied him and he behaved when she did that. He wouldn’t stop melting down until she allowed him a small cookie. So apparently she was ok with it after he got upset. Everyone wanted him to have a cookie because it’s a treat at Christmas and then when he started screaming for one by the table we wanted him to stop crying. I don’t think it’s bad to limit sweets but when it makes your child have a screaming fit to deprive them, what are you doing to your child?

Limiting sweets isn't the same as a vegetarian or a vegan because for many of those people it is an ethical decision. Even if it wasn't an ethical decision it is up to the parent if they want to stick with it or not. The fundamental disrespect for other's views and opinions when they have no impact on you is astounding here.

I disagree. I feel that my bil married into a family that celebrates Christmas and he should respect that tradition. Imagine if a Christian married a Jewish person and then decided the children couldn’t participate in Jewish family traditions? People can respect the traditions of their extended family and also raise their kids with their family with other values.

That’s not the case here. The sister is agnostic and the OP said “they decided”. The Op is blaming the BIL but it appears to be a joint decision. If someone find the traditions offensive, distasteful or unethical that is their prerogative. Again would you encourage a kosher Jew to “just have the ham. After all it’s what Christian’s eat at Easter!”? He didn’t marry the family, he married the wife who is apparently on board. You don’t have to compromise your beliefs because some other family believes it. Do I agree with the stance the sister and BIL are taking, no, but it’s not my life. You don’t have to like something to respect it.

Yet bil is asking us to compromise our beliefs/traditions?

Giving a child a gift at Christmas is offensive, unethical, or distasteful? How?

He’s not asking anyone to compromise anything. He’s coming, he’s interacting. He just doesn’t want his child to receive a gift. I don’t know why he feels this way, but he does. I don’t know why some people do a million things that they do but generally if it doesn’t impact me, I try to respect that.

OK, but his son will be impacted by seeing everybody except him get presents. That's the issue here, not the degree to which BIL is a PITA.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm imagining one of the teens requesting a gift for themselves that the nephew might like (stuffed animal, ball...) and then sharing it with him.

Why would that be less offensive than a kid slipping their Kosher cousin a piece of bacon?

I’ve heard atheist ppl say atheism isn’t a religion; it’s simply no belief in God or gods. But you are comparing the two?

Is belief in God superior to not believe in God? For respect to be received, it must be given, no?

But I’ve been told numerous times here atheism is nothing but a disbelief in God or gods. Santa is not a god.

DP. Parents make all sorts of decisions about their kids that have nothing to do with religion. Or, even within one particular religion, parents will have different “rules” for their family.

Intentionally going against parents’ wishes behind their back is disrespectful. Period.

This was a lame attempt to antagonize atheists. ‘Tis the season?

No, a poster is comparing giving a kosher Jewish child bacon w/o parental knowledge to giving a grandchild a Christmas gift after his atheist parents do not give consent.

Atheism is a religion w/o a god.

It's not.

And PP was comparing two instances of going against parents' wishes. It has nothing to do with religion.

Breaking kosher is breaking religious rules. Specifically.

But they are religious rules that parents choose to follow. Religious rules aren’t superior to any other rules.

Even atheists have their rules, apparently.

There are no “atheist rules”. Just individual families making their own decisions. Just like everyone else.

Then why did pp compare this situation to kosher rules? That’s not parents or families randomly deciding to not eat certain foods; it’s a religious thing.

Ok so would you be cool with slipping a piece of meat to the child of a vegetarian family?

Larlo is extremely limited on cookies and cake, etc. He cried and screamed so much last year my sister allowed him to have a single cookie doled out small piece at a time. It satisfied him and he behaved when she did that. He wouldn’t stop melting down until she allowed him a small cookie. So apparently she was ok with it after he got upset. Everyone wanted him to have a cookie because it’s a treat at Christmas and then when he started screaming for one by the table we wanted him to stop crying. I don’t think it’s bad to limit sweets but when it makes your child have a screaming fit to deprive them, what are you doing to your child?

Limiting sweets isn't the same as a vegetarian or a vegan because for many of those people it is an ethical decision. Even if it wasn't an ethical decision it is up to the parent if they want to stick with it or not. The fundamental disrespect for other's views and opinions when they have no impact on you is astounding here.

I disagree. I feel that my bil married into a family that celebrates Christmas and he should respect that tradition. Imagine if a Christian married a Jewish person and then decided the children couldn’t participate in Jewish family traditions? People can respect the traditions of their extended family and also raise their kids with their family with other values.

That’s not the case here. The sister is agnostic and the OP said “they decided”. The Op is blaming the BIL but it appears to be a joint decision. If someone find the traditions offensive, distasteful or unethical that is their prerogative. Again would you encourage a kosher Jew to “just have the ham. After all it’s what Christian’s eat at Easter!”? He didn’t marry the family, he married the wife who is apparently on board. You don’t have to compromise your beliefs because some other family believes it. Do I agree with the stance the sister and BIL are taking, no, but it’s not my life. You don’t have to like something to respect it.

Again with the religious comparison…

You seem to think that religious beliefs are the only ones worth being respected.

I believe if I was attending a celebration, I’d participate and not impose my beliefs on the celebration. If the only thing atheists believe is that God or gods don’t exist, why can’t Larlo have a gift? How is a gift unethical, distasteful, etc? I truly don’t understand.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm imagining one of the teens requesting a gift for themselves that the nephew might like (stuffed animal, ball...) and then sharing it with him.

Why would that be less offensive than a kid slipping their Kosher cousin a piece of bacon?

I’ve heard atheist ppl say atheism isn’t a religion; it’s simply no belief in God or gods. But you are comparing the two?

Is belief in God superior to not believe in God? For respect to be received, it must be given, no?

But I’ve been told numerous times here atheism is nothing but a disbelief in God or gods. Santa is not a god.

DP. Parents make all sorts of decisions about their kids that have nothing to do with religion. Or, even within one particular religion, parents will have different “rules” for their family.

Intentionally going against parents’ wishes behind their back is disrespectful. Period.

This was a lame attempt to antagonize atheists. ‘Tis the season?

No, a poster is comparing giving a kosher Jewish child bacon w/o parental knowledge to giving a grandchild a Christmas gift after his atheist parents do not give consent.

Atheism is a religion w/o a god.

It's not.

And PP was comparing two instances of going against parents' wishes. It has nothing to do with religion.

Breaking kosher is breaking religious rules. Specifically.

But they are religious rules that parents choose to follow. Religious rules aren’t superior to any other rules.

Even atheists have their rules, apparently.

There are no “atheist rules”. Just individual families making their own decisions. Just like everyone else.

Then why did pp compare this situation to kosher rules? That’s not parents or families randomly deciding to not eat certain foods; it’s a religious thing.

Ok so would you be cool with slipping a piece of meat to the child of a vegetarian family?

Larlo is extremely limited on cookies and cake, etc. He cried and screamed so much last year my sister allowed him to have a single cookie doled out small piece at a time. It satisfied him and he behaved when she did that. He wouldn’t stop melting down until she allowed him a small cookie. So apparently she was ok with it after he got upset. Everyone wanted him to have a cookie because it’s a treat at Christmas and then when he started screaming for one by the table we wanted him to stop crying. I don’t think it’s bad to limit sweets but when it makes your child have a screaming fit to deprive them, what are you doing to your child?

Limiting sweets isn't the same as a vegetarian or a vegan because for many of those people it is an ethical decision. Even if it wasn't an ethical decision it is up to the parent if they want to stick with it or not. The fundamental disrespect for other's views and opinions when they have no impact on you is astounding here.

I disagree. I feel that my bil married into a family that celebrates Christmas and he should respect that tradition. Imagine if a Christian married a Jewish person and then decided the children couldn’t participate in Jewish family traditions? People can respect the traditions of their extended family and also raise their kids with their family with other values.

That’s not the case here. The sister is agnostic and the OP said “they decided”. The Op is blaming the BIL but it appears to be a joint decision. If someone find the traditions offensive, distasteful or unethical that is their prerogative. Again would you encourage a kosher Jew to “just have the ham. After all it’s what Christian’s eat at Easter!”? He didn’t marry the family, he married the wife who is apparently on board. You don’t have to compromise your beliefs because some other family believes it. Do I agree with the stance the sister and BIL are taking, no, but it’s not my life. You don’t have to like something to respect it.

Yet bil is asking us to compromise our beliefs/traditions?

Giving a child a gift at Christmas is offensive, unethical, or distasteful? How?

He’s not asking anyone to compromise anything. He’s coming, he’s interacting. He just doesn’t want his child to receive a gift. I don’t know why he feels this way, but he does. I don’t know why some people do a million things that they do but generally if it doesn’t impact me, I try to respect that.

OK, but his son will be impacted by seeing everybody except him get presents. That's the issue here, not the degree to which BIL is a PITA.

Exactly. Bil won’t be impacted. Larlo will. We aren’t offering bil a gift.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm imagining one of the teens requesting a gift for themselves that the nephew might like (stuffed animal, ball...) and then sharing it with him.

Why would that be less offensive than a kid slipping their Kosher cousin a piece of bacon?

I’ve heard atheist ppl say atheism isn’t a religion; it’s simply no belief in God or gods. But you are comparing the two?

Is belief in God superior to not believe in God? For respect to be received, it must be given, no?

But I’ve been told numerous times here atheism is nothing but a disbelief in God or gods. Santa is not a god.

DP. Parents make all sorts of decisions about their kids that have nothing to do with religion. Or, even within one particular religion, parents will have different “rules” for their family.

Intentionally going against parents’ wishes behind their back is disrespectful. Period.

This was a lame attempt to antagonize atheists. ‘Tis the season?

No, a poster is comparing giving a kosher Jewish child bacon w/o parental knowledge to giving a grandchild a Christmas gift after his atheist parents do not give consent.

Atheism is a religion w/o a god.

It's not.

And PP was comparing two instances of going against parents' wishes. It has nothing to do with religion.

Breaking kosher is breaking religious rules. Specifically.

But they are religious rules that parents choose to follow. Religious rules aren’t superior to any other rules.

Even atheists have their rules, apparently.

There are no “atheist rules”. Just individual families making their own decisions. Just like everyone else.

Then why did pp compare this situation to kosher rules? That’s not parents or families randomly deciding to not eat certain foods; it’s a religious thing.

Ok so would you be cool with slipping a piece of meat to the child of a vegetarian family?

Larlo is extremely limited on cookies and cake, etc. He cried and screamed so much last year my sister allowed him to have a single cookie doled out small piece at a time. It satisfied him and he behaved when she did that. He wouldn’t stop melting down until she allowed him a small cookie. So apparently she was ok with it after he got upset. Everyone wanted him to have a cookie because it’s a treat at Christmas and then when he started screaming for one by the table we wanted him to stop crying. I don’t think it’s bad to limit sweets but when it makes your child have a screaming fit to deprive them, what are you doing to your child?

Limiting sweets isn't the same as a vegetarian or a vegan because for many of those people it is an ethical decision. Even if it wasn't an ethical decision it is up to the parent if they want to stick with it or not. The fundamental disrespect for other's views and opinions when they have no impact on you is astounding here.

I disagree. I feel that my bil married into a family that celebrates Christmas and he should respect that tradition. Imagine if a Christian married a Jewish person and then decided the children couldn’t participate in Jewish family traditions? People can respect the traditions of their extended family and also raise their kids with their family with other values.

That’s not the case here. The sister is agnostic and the OP said “they decided”. The Op is blaming the BIL but it appears to be a joint decision. If someone find the traditions offensive, distasteful or unethical that is their prerogative. Again would you encourage a kosher Jew to “just have the ham. After all it’s what Christian’s eat at Easter!”? He didn’t marry the family, he married the wife who is apparently on board. You don’t have to compromise your beliefs because some other family believes it. Do I agree with the stance the sister and BIL are taking, no, but it’s not my life. You don’t have to like something to respect it.

Again with the religious comparison…

Why should religious rules have more importance than other, nonreligious family rules?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm imagining one of the teens requesting a gift for themselves that the nephew might like (stuffed animal, ball...) and then sharing it with him.

Why would that be less offensive than a kid slipping their Kosher cousin a piece of bacon?

I’ve heard atheist ppl say atheism isn’t a religion; it’s simply no belief in God or gods. But you are comparing the two?

Is belief in God superior to not believe in God? For respect to be received, it must be given, no?

But I’ve been told numerous times here atheism is nothing but a disbelief in God or gods. Santa is not a god.

DP. Parents make all sorts of decisions about their kids that have nothing to do with religion. Or, even within one particular religion, parents will have different “rules” for their family.

Intentionally going against parents’ wishes behind their back is disrespectful. Period.

This was a lame attempt to antagonize atheists. ‘Tis the season?

No, a poster is comparing giving a kosher Jewish child bacon w/o parental knowledge to giving a grandchild a Christmas gift after his atheist parents do not give consent.

Atheism is a religion w/o a god.

It's not.

And PP was comparing two instances of going against parents' wishes. It has nothing to do with religion.

Breaking kosher is breaking religious rules. Specifically.

But they are religious rules that parents choose to follow. Religious rules aren’t superior to any other rules.

Even atheists have their rules, apparently.

There are no “atheist rules”. Just individual families making their own decisions. Just like everyone else.

Then why did pp compare this situation to kosher rules? That’s not parents or families randomly deciding to not eat certain foods; it’s a religious thing.

Ok so would you be cool with slipping a piece of meat to the child of a vegetarian family?

Larlo is extremely limited on cookies and cake, etc. He cried and screamed so much last year my sister allowed him to have a single cookie doled out small piece at a time. It satisfied him and he behaved when she did that. He wouldn’t stop melting down until she allowed him a small cookie. So apparently she was ok with it after he got upset. Everyone wanted him to have a cookie because it’s a treat at Christmas and then when he started screaming for one by the table we wanted him to stop crying. I don’t think it’s bad to limit sweets but when it makes your child have a screaming fit to deprive them, what are you doing to your child?

Limiting sweets isn't the same as a vegetarian or a vegan because for many of those people it is an ethical decision. Even if it wasn't an ethical decision it is up to the parent if they want to stick with it or not. The fundamental disrespect for other's views and opinions when they have no impact on you is astounding here.

I disagree. I feel that my bil married into a family that celebrates Christmas and he should respect that tradition. Imagine if a Christian married a Jewish person and then decided the children couldn’t participate in Jewish family traditions? People can respect the traditions of their extended family and also raise their kids with their family with other values.

That’s not the case here. The sister is agnostic and the OP said “they decided”. The Op is blaming the BIL but it appears to be a joint decision. If someone find the traditions offensive, distasteful or unethical that is their prerogative. Again would you encourage a kosher Jew to “just have the ham. After all it’s what Christian’s eat at Easter!”? He didn’t marry the family, he married the wife who is apparently on board. You don’t have to compromise your beliefs because some other family believes it. Do I agree with the stance the sister and BIL are taking, no, but it’s not my life. You don’t have to like something to respect it.

Again with the religious comparison…

Why should religious rules have more importance than other, nonreligious family rules?

A Christmas gift is not a religious rule.

[Anonymous]

It would be easier for BIL to let Larlo accept a gift, while explaining in the car on the way over or going home that they don't believe in Jesus. And that plenty of people have secular Christmases. BIL really has chosen the most confrontational path.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm imagining one of the teens requesting a gift for themselves that the nephew might like (stuffed animal, ball...) and then sharing it with him.

Why would that be less offensive than a kid slipping their Kosher cousin a piece of bacon?

I’ve heard atheist ppl say atheism isn’t a religion; it’s simply no belief in God or gods. But you are comparing the two?

Is belief in God superior to not believe in God? For respect to be received, it must be given, no?

But I’ve been told numerous times here atheism is nothing but a disbelief in God or gods. Santa is not a god.

DP. Parents make all sorts of decisions about their kids that have nothing to do with religion. Or, even within one particular religion, parents will have different “rules” for their family.

Intentionally going against parents’ wishes behind their back is disrespectful. Period.

This was a lame attempt to antagonize atheists. ‘Tis the season?

No, a poster is comparing giving a kosher Jewish child bacon w/o parental knowledge to giving a grandchild a Christmas gift after his atheist parents do not give consent.

Atheism is a religion w/o a god.

It's not.

And PP was comparing two instances of going against parents' wishes. It has nothing to do with religion.

Breaking kosher is breaking religious rules. Specifically.

But they are religious rules that parents choose to follow. Religious rules aren’t superior to any other rules.

Even atheists have their rules, apparently.

There are no “atheist rules”. Just individual families making their own decisions. Just like everyone else.

Then why did pp compare this situation to kosher rules? That’s not parents or families randomly deciding to not eat certain foods; it’s a religious thing.

Ok so would you be cool with slipping a piece of meat to the child of a vegetarian family?

Larlo is extremely limited on cookies and cake, etc. He cried and screamed so much last year my sister allowed him to have a single cookie doled out small piece at a time. It satisfied him and he behaved when she did that. He wouldn’t stop melting down until she allowed him a small cookie. So apparently she was ok with it after he got upset. Everyone wanted him to have a cookie because it’s a treat at Christmas and then when he started screaming for one by the table we wanted him to stop crying. I don’t think it’s bad to limit sweets but when it makes your child have a screaming fit to deprive them, what are you doing to your child?

Limiting sweets isn't the same as a vegetarian or a vegan because for many of those people it is an ethical decision. Even if it wasn't an ethical decision it is up to the parent if they want to stick with it or not. The fundamental disrespect for other's views and opinions when they have no impact on you is astounding here.

I disagree. I feel that my bil married into a family that celebrates Christmas and he should respect that tradition. Imagine if a Christian married a Jewish person and then decided the children couldn’t participate in Jewish family traditions? People can respect the traditions of their extended family and also raise their kids with their family with other values.

That’s not the case here. The sister is agnostic and the OP said “they decided”. The Op is blaming the BIL but it appears to be a joint decision. If someone find the traditions offensive, distasteful or unethical that is their prerogative. Again would you encourage a kosher Jew to “just have the ham. After all it’s what Christian’s eat at Easter!”? He didn’t marry the family, he married the wife who is apparently on board. You don’t have to compromise your beliefs because some other family believes it. Do I agree with the stance the sister and BIL are taking, no, but it’s not my life. You don’t have to like something to respect it.

Again with the religious comparison…

Why should religious rules have more importance than other, nonreligious family rules?

A Christmas gift is not a religious rule.

The religious rule in the comment above was about keeping kosher.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:It would be easier for BIL to let Larlo accept a gift, while explaining in the car on the way over or going home that they don't believe in Jesus. And that plenty of people have secular Christmases. BIL really has chosen the most confrontational path.

The gift is not from Jesus.

How does Larlo know what he believes in? He’s a toddler. He has to grow and learn about religion and the world and see if anything (or nothing) makes sense to him.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It would be easier for BIL to let Larlo accept a gift, while explaining in the car on the way over or going home that they don't believe in Jesus. And that plenty of people have secular Christmases. BIL really has chosen the most confrontational path.

The gift is not from Jesus.

How does Larlo know what he believes in? He’s a toddler. He has to grow and learn about religion and the world and see if anything (or nothing) makes sense to him.

The brother in law isn’t on this thread. If they were Jehovas Witnesses or Seventh Day Adventists or Quakers would you insist or accept their point of view? The whole thing is that possibly the parents are being a jerks but the kindest and most Christian thing to do would be to respect the choices and decisions of the parents.