Would you really leave America if Trump/Musk are scaring you?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Back to the original question, we are considering a move to Portugal or Barcelona if the SHTF.

My worry is that our real estate here won’t be worth as much by then.

I have lived outside of the US for several years already which made me quite aware of how challenging it is to live as an expat but also how unpleasant living in an undemocratic regime can be.

Where in Portugal? Do you have a city in mind as you do Barcelona in Spain? I just can’t take people seriously when they say things like this. It’s like “I went overseas to Canada” or “I’m thinking of moving to Europe or France”.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:As a Canadian I was surprised at how fast he turned on us, ripping up trade agreements, and surprised at all the negative comments I hear from Americans that actively hate us. And people wonder how Hitler got into power.

The only thing that will rile up most privileged Americans will be when they come after your SSRIs.

You do know that most privileged Americans are scared of this administration and horrified by Trump. That’s why we are thinking of fleeing our own country. The tone deafness it would take to come on to this thread and say Americans don’t care…. Just wow.

The PP is right. Most Americans don’t care. And maybe privileged Americans like you should use your privilege to do something instead of running away.

[Anonymous]

I'd leave because I'm an immigrant who knows what collapse looks like. I'm monitoring the situation every day.

I've lived through the collapse of a nation the currency of which was stronger than the dollar. All of the economist and pundits said that rumors of a collapse were greatly exaggerated. We learned the hard way how quickly these things happen. By the time everyone knows it's happening, it's too late to leave. You have to see the wave coming and escape before the tsunami hits.

My parents (a doctor and lawyer with five degrees between the two of them) got out just in the nick of time, with their highly educated, well resourced employers, family members, and friends telling them they were absolutely bonkers. My Dad was the one who saw things coming and convinced my Mom to leave with him and us kids. I was in my tweens and I, too, thought my Dad was crazy. Within months, all of the people who had told us we'd be back soon were begging for help to escape abroad, but it was too late.

The moment everyone starts to run for the borders, other countries will implement policies restricting or banning emigration from you country and close their doors to you.

I am fully convinced that in my lifetime, I am going to see this great nation experience a mass exit. It won't even take much by other country standards because Americans have grown accustomed to a standard of living that has long been unsustainable and our oligarchy is trying to tear that standard of living down for its own nefarious purposes.

I just need 10 more years, but if necessary, I could be at the airport with my children today. My American husband lives in denial and that's on him.

[Anonymous]

We will leave if freedom of the press is restricted or there are limits to free speech for Americans.

Trump is doing more than just calling reporters "Fake News." He's suing them over ridiculous things, including Ann Seltzer for getting a poll wrong. ABC already paid. CBS probably will.
And he's continued his harassing behavior in small but telling ways. He's banning the AP from events because although they changed the name of Denali to McKinley on his whim, they correctly note that he doesn't have the authority to change the Gulf of Mexico's name. He's bringing propagandists into the press room to ask planted questions of the press secretary, whose exaggerations and falsehoods will tarnish her reputation early in her career. We're only one month in.
It's such a shame. There were so many qualified Republicans who would've been good in the job. He will do lasting damage to the country (and the Republican party) through the cybersecurity risks and haphazard firings of Doge, bizarre foreign affairs missteps, abuse of power and lack of competence.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:You're going to feel pretty silly if the next election cycle results in changes in domestic politics and all of a sudden the sky stops falling. Relocating internationally with shifting political winds seems foolish, at best, not to mention expensive and disruptive.

But, if you wear a tinfoil hat and assume there will be no further elections in the U.S. ever, you'll be patting yourself on the back.

Which scenario seems the more likely?

I think we will still have elections, they just won’t be free and fair. No doubt there are parallels to other authoritarians and America is going to be significantly changed by this administration. I think people just don’t know how extreme it will get.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:As a Canadian I was surprised at how fast he turned on us, ripping up trade agreements, and surprised at all the negative comments I hear from Americans that actively hate us. And people wonder how Hitler got into power.

The only thing that will rile up most privileged Americans will be when they come after your SSRIs.

You do know that most privileged Americans are scared of this administration and horrified by Trump. That’s why we are thinking of fleeing our own country. The tone deafness it would take to come on to this thread and say Americans don’t care…. Just wow.

The PP is right. Most Americans don’t care. And maybe privileged Americans like you should use your privilege to do something instead of running away.

NP. If I was a billionaire I’d use my $$ to run anti-trump and Elon ads. I’m privileged, but can’t afford that and compete with the oligarchs, so I’ll run away.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:You're going to feel pretty silly if the next election cycle results in changes in domestic politics and all of a sudden the sky stops falling. Relocating internationally with shifting political winds seems foolish, at best, not to mention expensive and disruptive.

But, if you wear a tinfoil hat and assume there will be no further elections in the U.S. ever, you'll be patting yourself on the back.

Which scenario seems the more likely?

My grandparents lived through WWII in Europe. My grandfather was an RAF pilot. My father fled a dictatorship in a once prosperous and peaceful nation. "Things fall apart, the system cannot hold". There is nothing magical about the US that will keep us from falling into this. No one is coming to save us.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I'd leave because I'm an immigrant who knows what collapse looks like. I'm monitoring the situation every day.

I've lived through the collapse of a nation the currency of which was stronger than the dollar. All of the economist and pundits said that rumors of a collapse were greatly exaggerated. We learned the hard way how quickly these things happen. By the time everyone knows it's happening, it's too late to leave. You have to see the wave coming and escape before the tsunami hits.

My parents (a doctor and lawyer with five degrees between the two of them) got out just in the nick of time, with their highly educated, well resourced employers, family members, and friends telling them they were absolutely bonkers. My Dad was the one who saw things coming and convinced my Mom to leave with him and us kids. I was in my tweens and I, too, thought my Dad was crazy. Within months, all of the people who had told us we'd be back soon were begging for help to escape abroad, but it was too late.

The moment everyone starts to run for the borders, other countries will implement policies restricting or banning emigration from you country and close their doors to you.

I am fully convinced that in my lifetime, I am going to see this great nation experience a mass exit. It won't even take much by other country standards because Americans have grown accustomed to a standard of living that has long been unsustainable and our oligarchy is trying to tear that standard of living down for its own nefarious purposes.

I just need 10 more years, but if necessary, I could be at the airport with my children today. My American husband lives in denial and that's on him.

Can you just make the country? It’s helpful having examples, and won’t out you. Thanks.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My sister just moved to an EU county for non-political reasons. We plan to visit for an extended time next year. If we like it, and things escalate here, we will move. We have a daughter with disability who requires a lot of care. If her Medicaid is cut we will move.

Your daughter having a disability will make it impossible for her to move to another country. Wake up.

Eff off. Why would you say this, instead of something helpful? What's wrong with you?

Because it’s true. Look at any immigration forum. Migration to any European country, even with socialized healthcare will require the new immigrant not be a burden on the state. If your kid needs substantial Medicaid it will be near impossible to get any migration visa. Get real.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Look at Australia. Very receptive to immigrants - 31% population born overseas. Far from the troubles of the US and Europe (but with its own anxiety over China). Skills shortages. Universities accept lot of international students. More than 100,000 Americans already live in Australia. On the negative side, high COL and tough housing market.

This is absolutely not true. Australians are some of the most racist people I’ve ever encountered. I don’t know how many times I’ve had the displeasure of hearing them rant about how a certain demographic ruined their country.

Any white person who lives in a continent non native to white people needs to STFU and take a seat about minorities ruining anything. And I say this as someone descended from one of the first families of Virginia.

Then why are European govts importing as many POC from the rest of the world as they can possibly manage? And of course European govts are telling their native white Europeans to STFU about it, too.

So I guess you’ll tell us that white people in places where white people are native to, also should STFU, too, right? Just STFU and go extinct.


Yeah, we know your plan.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Look at Australia. Very receptive to immigrants - 31% population born overseas. Far from the troubles of the US and Europe (but with its own anxiety over China). Skills shortages. Universities accept lot of international students. More than 100,000 Americans already live in Australia. On the negative side, high COL and tough housing market.

This is absolutely not true. Australians are some of the most racist people I’ve ever encountered. I don’t know how many times I’ve had the displeasure of hearing them rant about how a certain demographic ruined their country.

Any white person who lives in a continent non native to white people needs to STFU and take a seat about minorities ruining anything. And I say this as someone descended from one of the first families of Virginia.

Then why are European govts importing as many POC from the rest of the world as they can possibly manage? And of course European govts are telling their native white Europeans to STFU about it, too.

So I guess you’ll tell us that white people in places where white people are native to, also should STFU, too, right? Just STFU and go extinct.


Yeah, we know your plan.

Oh man you think you read me huh! What if I told you I also support nationalism in Europe and think that there are too many immigrants destroying native European culture? Not everyone is as capable of cognitive dissonance as you fools.

[Anonymous]

I’m hearing from a friend her passport is delayed being sent

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I’m hearing from a friend her passport is delayed being sent

I think this is because we just fired all the passport processors, not because they're trying to keep us from leaving. That being said we renewed our passports on November 8.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I'd leave because I'm an immigrant who knows what collapse looks like. I'm monitoring the situation every day.

I've lived through the collapse of a nation the currency of which was stronger than the dollar. All of the economist and pundits said that rumors of a collapse were greatly exaggerated. We learned the hard way how quickly these things happen. By the time everyone knows it's happening, it's too late to leave. You have to see the wave coming and escape before the tsunami hits.

My parents (a doctor and lawyer with five degrees between the two of them) got out just in the nick of time, with their highly educated, well resourced employers, family members, and friends telling them they were absolutely bonkers. My Dad was the one who saw things coming and convinced my Mom to leave with him and us kids. I was in my tweens and I, too, thought my Dad was crazy. Within months, all of the people who had told us we'd be back soon were begging for help to escape abroad, but it was too late.

The moment everyone starts to run for the borders, other countries will implement policies restricting or banning emigration from you country and close their doors to you.

I am fully convinced that in my lifetime, I am going to see this great nation experience a mass exit. It won't even take much by other country standards because Americans have grown accustomed to a standard of living that has long been unsustainable and our oligarchy is trying to tear that standard of living down for its own nefarious purposes.

I just need 10 more years, but if necessary, I could be at the airport with my children today. My American husband lives in denial and that's on him.

Which country? I keep reading similar sentiments from people who have experienced collapse. The NYT video linked upthread says the same.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Look at Australia. Very receptive to immigrants - 31% population born overseas. Far from the troubles of the US and Europe (but with its own anxiety over China). Skills shortages. Universities accept lot of international students. More than 100,000 Americans already live in Australia. On the negative side, high COL and tough housing market.

My European family live in the U.S. and Australia. Not sure how you think Australia is open to immigrants. The illegals are shipped off to an island with well-documented abuse and the legal are not treated very well. We are white so fared much better but Australia is well-known for being racist.

Legal immigrants aren’t treated very well??!! How do you figure that?

So, I’ve actually spent a significant amount of time there and can base my opinion on more than just random internet searches that support a random assumption. Like I said, I have family there. Legal immigrants. And yes, they are not treated well. I bet you’ve never even heard the term “wog” before. Our country sucks for sure but to think that other countries aren’t bigoted is a fairy tale. I bet you think that any country will want you just because you are American and that you won’t need to learn a new language and conform to a new culture. White Americans are delusional. I’m white btw but hold dual citizenship, have lived abroad and know the reality. Yes, it is better in some countries but nobody is falling over themselves to be graced with people who facked up their own country.

A lot of people on this thread are missing the point. We are not comparing the rest of the world and America on 2/20/25, we are comparing the rest of the world to what America will be on 2/20/26. Yes, the rest of the world is racist and problematic in a lot of ways. Will they be worse than the America we are careening quickly towards? Likely not.

Fair point and I really hope you are wrong, for all our sakes.