Feminism, femininity, and marriage

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:"Men are by and large the violent ones. Men are the problem. And they know it."
Correct - if "the problem" means violence.

"Men know women are just as capable and smart, perhaps more so."
Just as capable and smart, yes. "More so" - I don't see any evidence of that. If I had to guess, I'd say the bulk is pretty much even with the outliers -- both the dumbest and the smartest being men. I think, biologically, men are expendable (sperm is plentiful, eggs and incubation more resource-intensive), so nature gambles with men, hitting the jackpot some and going bust some.

"We are less prone to be destructive and anti-social."
Less destructive - yes. Less anti-social - doubtful. I see more toxic relationships between women than between men. Basically, women tend to be more indirect with their aggression.

"We can make more humans if we want with very little contribution from men. We don't need you. Oh the irony that for centuries religion insisted that women needed religion to resist their baser natures. When we have proof every day that it is men who are unable to govern themselves, and women can do just fine without them."
You just went off the rails. Yes, you can make more humans. But supporting them and protecting them requires a little more support. I think the religious oppression of women has more to do with the association of religion with the state, and the state's mission to protect the property interests of the elite. In particular, control of female reproduction has been a means of attempting to assure that a man's resources pass to his biological children and not to the biological children of the man who cuckolded him.

"This is why you are seeing angry tirades and backlash. This is why everyone talks about Obama "coming for my guns!" when in reality, no one has touched your guns. They are actually coming for our birth control. Everyone knows a woman who is unable to control when and how she becomes pregnant/a mother is at a serious disadvantage. And many men instinctively want women at a disadvantage. Just like the good old days."
Agree with most of that, though the Obama/guns thing seems like a bit of a tangent. I don't see most men regarding themselves as particularly advantaged. Instead, there is a smallish segment of (mostly white) men who hold most of the advantages. Sure, you can't get into that club without being a man. But most men won't ever be part of that club.

With "antisocial" being sociopathy, males are 3X more likely to be sociopaths than women:

http://www.quora.com/What-percentage-of-people-are-psychopaths-sociopaths

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm a feminist, but my DH is head of the household. What it means is this: sometimes you just can not come to an agreement. Some times both of you feel the other is wrong. When we get to that point, we go with his decision because he is the head.

Every family must have a way to cope when this happens. If this has never happened to you, consider yourself very lucky. It happens to most couples at least at 1 point in their marriage.

In some families, even families with very feminine Stay at home women, the woman really is the head and her decision carries. In my family, it is DH.

Why can't you sometimes go with your decision even if your DH disagrees with it? I'm asking out of real curiosity.

I personally would feel resentful if my DH always got the final say when we couldn't come to an agreement. Instead sometimes I give in to him even if I disagree and sometimes he gives in to me even if he disagrees. It feels like a real partnership, as messy as that can be.

'

What if it is something where you both feel very strongly? For example, what if you had a great job offer in another city while your DH had a great job here? In the end, one of you must sacrifice for the other.

I think I sacrifice because, frankly, I am stronger than my DH and I know somehow I will make it work, even if I don't like it.

Conceding makes you the "strong" one? Huh? You and I do not agree on the definition of strength. You're just giving in to keep household peace.

Relationships are not a contest or a battle. that is where you and I differ.

Of course it isn't for you. You've already lost. How would you feel about this "head of household" garbage if your daring husband came home one day and told you he was leaving you for another woman?

Id feel the same way you would. Odd question. I don't see your point.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:scientists say equality was the archetype:

http://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world/early-men-and-women-were-equal-say-scientists/ar-BBjNsq2?ocid=UP74DHP

Agriculture changed everything - for men and women. Inequality wasn't all that feasible among nomadic hunter gatherers - survival of the tribe depended on pooling resources, and it wasn't practical to accumulate much. But civilization, such as it is, became possible with agriculture. However, it required that an elite be able to squeeze a surplus out of the masses. The majority of men got squeezed into slavery or near slavery too.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

With "antisocial" being sociopathy, males are 3X more likely to be sociopaths than women:

http://www.quora.com/What-percentage-of-people-are-psychopaths-sociopaths

My guess is that that's part of nature gambling with males. In terms of reproduction, males are expendable, so nature can afford to waste a lot of them on unproductive efforts in hopes of hitting the jackpot.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If femininity means I'm the one solely responsible for scrubbing the toilets & tubs, vacuuming, laundry & cooking, picking up socks and other things strewn about the house, then I have to say no thanks. I'll share these tasks everyone else in the household, but don't tell me these are my natural duties based on my female brain. I have no desire to be a maid.

And I'm glad to have feminism there to support me in my lack of desire to embrace traditionally defined femininity while still defining myself as being all woman.

Who likes that arrangement? I wouldn't call myself a feminist and that's not how my household runs. My DH is in charge of the laundry. Even though he is the head of the household, it does not make him king.

What's the difference in your house between head of the household and king? How do you interact differently that you would if you said your household had equal partners instead of a head?

How is a quarterback and a running back different? Do kings change diapers, do laundry, repair the dishwasher, take out the trash and walk the dog?

have you had such male trauma in your life that you cannot understand how a man can be a participating leader in his home?

Are you brainwashed into thinking your marriage couldn't survive if YOU were an equal leader with your DH?

LOL!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm a feminist, but my DH is head of the household. What it means is this: sometimes you just can not come to an agreement. Some times both of you feel the other is wrong. When we get to that point, we go with his decision because he is the head.

Every family must have a way to cope when this happens. If this has never happened to you, consider yourself very lucky. It happens to most couples at least at 1 point in their marriage.

In some families, even families with very feminine Stay at home women, the woman really is the head and her decision carries. In my family, it is DH.

Why can't you sometimes go with your decision even if your DH disagrees with it? I'm asking out of real curiosity.

I personally would feel resentful if my DH always got the final say when we couldn't come to an agreement. Instead sometimes I give in to him even if I disagree and sometimes he gives in to me even if he disagrees. It feels like a real partnership, as messy as that can be.

'

What if it is something where you both feel very strongly? For example, what if you had a great job offer in another city while your DH had a great job here? In the end, one of you must sacrifice for the other.

I think I sacrifice because, frankly, I am stronger than my DH and I know somehow I will make it work, even if I don't like it.

Conceding makes you the "strong" one? Huh? You and I do not agree on the definition of strength. You're just giving in to keep household peace.

Relationships are not a contest or a battle. that is where you and I differ.

Of course it isn't for you. You've already lost. How would you feel about this "head of household" garbage if your daring husband came home one day and told you he was leaving you for another woman?

Id feel the same way you would. Odd question. I don't see your point.

You don't think it leaves you at more of a disadvantage if your head of the household ups and leaves, than if you're used to being an equal participant in your own life decisions?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If femininity means I'm the one solely responsible for scrubbing the toilets & tubs, vacuuming, laundry & cooking, picking up socks and other things strewn about the house, then I have to say no thanks. I'll share these tasks everyone else in the household, but don't tell me these are my natural duties based on my female brain. I have no desire to be a maid.

And I'm glad to have feminism there to support me in my lack of desire to embrace traditionally defined femininity while still defining myself as being all woman.

Who likes that arrangement? I wouldn't call myself a feminist and that's not how my household runs. My DH is in charge of the laundry. Even though he is the head of the household, it does not make him king.

What's the difference in your house between head of the household and king? How do you interact differently that you would if you said your household had equal partners instead of a head?

How is a quarterback and a running back different? Do kings change diapers, do laundry, repair the dishwasher, take out the trash and walk the dog?

have you had such male trauma in your life that you cannot understand how a man can be a participating leader in his home?

Are you brainwashed into thinking your marriage couldn't survive if YOU were an equal leader with your DH?

LOL!

Why is that funny? And isn't a "participating leader" an oxymoron?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm a feminist, but my DH is head of the household. What it means is this: sometimes you just can not come to an agreement. Some times both of you feel the other is wrong. When we get to that point, we go with his decision because he is the head.

Every family must have a way to cope when this happens. If this has never happened to you, consider yourself very lucky. It happens to most couples at least at 1 point in their marriage.

In some families, even families with very feminine Stay at home women, the woman really is the head and her decision carries. In my family, it is DH.

Why can't you sometimes go with your decision even if your DH disagrees with it? I'm asking out of real curiosity.

I personally would feel resentful if my DH always got the final say when we couldn't come to an agreement. Instead sometimes I give in to him even if I disagree and sometimes he gives in to me even if he disagrees. It feels like a real partnership, as messy as that can be.

'

What if it is something where you both feel very strongly? For example, what if you had a great job offer in another city while your DH had a great job here? In the end, one of you must sacrifice for the other.

I think I sacrifice because, frankly, I am stronger than my DH and I know somehow I will make it work, even if I don't like it.

Conceding makes you the "strong" one? Huh? You and I do not agree on the definition of strength. You're just giving in to keep household peace.

Relationships are not a contest or a battle. that is where you and I differ.

Of course it isn't for you. You've already lost. How would you feel about this "head of household" garbage if your daring husband came home one day and told you he was leaving you for another woman?

Id feel the same way you would. Odd question. I don't see your point.

You don't think it leaves you at more of a disadvantage if your head of the household ups and leaves, than if you're used to being an equal participant in your own life decisions?

What kind of decisions do you think I can't make on my own? I hate to break your fantasy of how oppressed my life is and how brainwashed and victimized I am by the evil white man, but I hold a director position at my company, and make plenty of decisions managing a P&L, I think I'd be just fine. I've been doing this marriage thing with him for 25years. So, once again, odd question. I'd feel the same way anyone would feel if their spouse left them for another person. And JUST LIKE anyone else, I'm pick myself up and move on with my life.

You can be a professionally successful woman and still respect your husband as the head of the household. This doesn't mean I don't know how to run a balance sheet, move around money in a 401k, pay a mortgage, or negotiate the purchase of investment property.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If femininity means I'm the one solely responsible for scrubbing the toilets & tubs, vacuuming, laundry & cooking, picking up socks and other things strewn about the house, then I have to say no thanks. I'll share these tasks everyone else in the household, but don't tell me these are my natural duties based on my female brain. I have no desire to be a maid.

And I'm glad to have feminism there to support me in my lack of desire to embrace traditionally defined femininity while still defining myself as being all woman.

Who likes that arrangement? I wouldn't call myself a feminist and that's not how my household runs. My DH is in charge of the laundry. Even though he is the head of the household, it does not make him king.

What's the difference in your house between head of the household and king? How do you interact differently that you would if you said your household had equal partners instead of a head?

How is a quarterback and a running back different? Do kings change diapers, do laundry, repair the dishwasher, take out the trash and walk the dog?

have you had such male trauma in your life that you cannot understand how a man can be a participating leader in his home?

Are you brainwashed into thinking your marriage couldn't survive if YOU were an equal leader with your DH?

LOL!

Why is that funny? And isn't a "participating leader" an oxymoron?

No, it is not an oxymoron and I won't spell that out for you either.

You are obsessed. You are incapable of critical thinking outside your narrow world experience, heavily steeped negative male experiences.

[Anonymous]

"Head of household" PP. Can you give an example of a big decision where your husband's preference trumps your preference?

Sorry if this has been asked in the last 2 pages of sniping, which I did not read because the first 14 pages were pretty exhausting.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm a feminist, but my DH is head of the household. What it means is this: sometimes you just can not come to an agreement. Some times both of you feel the other is wrong. When we get to that point, we go with his decision because he is the head.

Every family must have a way to cope when this happens. If this has never happened to you, consider yourself very lucky. It happens to most couples at least at 1 point in their marriage.

In some families, even families with very feminine Stay at home women, the woman really is the head and her decision carries. In my family, it is DH.

Why can't you sometimes go with your decision even if your DH disagrees with it? I'm asking out of real curiosity.

I personally would feel resentful if my DH always got the final say when we couldn't come to an agreement. Instead sometimes I give in to him even if I disagree and sometimes he gives in to me even if he disagrees. It feels like a real partnership, as messy as that can be.

'

What if it is something where you both feel very strongly? For example, what if you had a great job offer in another city while your DH had a great job here? In the end, one of you must sacrifice for the other.

I think I sacrifice because, frankly, I am stronger than my DH and I know somehow I will make it work, even if I don't like it.

Conceding makes you the "strong" one? Huh? You and I do not agree on the definition of strength. You're just giving in to keep household peace.

Relationships are not a contest or a battle. that is where you and I differ.

Of course it isn't for you. You've already lost. How would you feel about this "head of household" garbage if your daring husband came home one day and told you he was leaving you for another woman?

Id feel the same way you would. Odd question. I don't see your point.

You don't think it leaves you at more of a disadvantage if your head of the household ups and leaves, than if you're used to being an equal participant in your own life decisions?

What kind of decisions do you think I can't make on my own? I hate to break your fantasy of how oppressed my life is and how brainwashed and victimized I am by the evil white man, but I hold a director position at my company, and make plenty of decisions managing a P&L, I think I'd be just fine. I've been doing this marriage thing with him for 25years. So, once again, odd question. I'd feel the same way anyone would feel if their spouse left them for another person. And JUST LIKE anyone else, I'm pick myself up and move on with my life.

You can be a professionally successful woman and still respect your husband as the head of the household. This doesn't mean I don't know how to run a balance sheet, move around money in a 401k, pay a mortgage, or negotiate the purchase of investment property.

I don't see how you can have self confidence and be professionally successful, yet defer to your husband as the head of the household. What about his male genitalia makes him the one who gets to prevail in the event of a decision deadlock? Use your analytical skills and explain it in a rational way, please.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If femininity means I'm the one solely responsible for scrubbing the toilets & tubs, vacuuming, laundry & cooking, picking up socks and other things strewn about the house, then I have to say no thanks. I'll share these tasks everyone else in the household, but don't tell me these are my natural duties based on my female brain. I have no desire to be a maid.

And I'm glad to have feminism there to support me in my lack of desire to embrace traditionally defined femininity while still defining myself as being all woman.

Who likes that arrangement? I wouldn't call myself a feminist and that's not how my household runs. My DH is in charge of the laundry. Even though he is the head of the household, it does not make him king.

What's the difference in your house between head of the household and king? How do you interact differently that you would if you said your household had equal partners instead of a head?

How is a quarterback and a running back different? Do kings change diapers, do laundry, repair the dishwasher, take out the trash and walk the dog?

have you had such male trauma in your life that you cannot understand how a man can be a participating leader in his home?

Are you brainwashed into thinking your marriage couldn't survive if YOU were an equal leader with your DH?

LOL!

Why is that funny? And isn't a "participating leader" an oxymoron?

No, it is not an oxymoron and I won't spell that out for you either.

You are obsessed. You are incapable of critical thinking outside your narrow world experience, heavily steeped negative male experiences.

You can't explain it. Thanks any way.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:What feminists say: "Feminism is for everyone!"

What feminists mean: "Feminism is for everyone (with a college/advanced degree, who doesn't conform to traditional gender roles, except for people who disagree with what I think feminism and feminists should look like.)"

And I'm a feminist. Gag.

I repeat.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm a feminist, but my DH is head of the household. What it means is this: sometimes you just can not come to an agreement. Some times both of you feel the other is wrong. When we get to that point, we go with his decision because he is the head.

Every family must have a way to cope when this happens. If this has never happened to you, consider yourself very lucky. It happens to most couples at least at 1 point in their marriage.

In some families, even families with very feminine Stay at home women, the woman really is the head and her decision carries. In my family, it is DH.

Why can't you sometimes go with your decision even if your DH disagrees with it? I'm asking out of real curiosity.

I personally would feel resentful if my DH always got the final say when we couldn't come to an agreement. Instead sometimes I give in to him even if I disagree and sometimes he gives in to me even if he disagrees. It feels like a real partnership, as messy as that can be.

'

What if it is something where you both feel very strongly? For example, what if you had a great job offer in another city while your DH had a great job here? In the end, one of you must sacrifice for the other.

I think I sacrifice because, frankly, I am stronger than my DH and I know somehow I will make it work, even if I don't like it.

Conceding makes you the "strong" one? Huh? You and I do not agree on the definition of strength. You're just giving in to keep household peace.

Relationships are not a contest or a battle. that is where you and I differ.

Of course it isn't for you. You've already lost. How would you feel about this "head of household" garbage if your daring husband came home one day and told you he was leaving you for another woman?

Id feel the same way you would. Odd question. I don't see your point.

You don't think it leaves you at more of a disadvantage if your head of the household ups and leaves, than if you're used to being an equal participant in your own life decisions?

What kind of decisions do you think I can't make on my own? I hate to break your fantasy of how oppressed my life is and how brainwashed and victimized I am by the evil white man, but I hold a director position at my company, and make plenty of decisions managing a P&L, I think I'd be just fine. I've been doing this marriage thing with him for 25years. So, once again, odd question. I'd feel the same way anyone would feel if their spouse left them for another person. And JUST LIKE anyone else, I'm pick myself up and move on with my life.

You can be a professionally successful woman and still respect your husband as the head of the household. This doesn't mean I don't know how to run a balance sheet, move around money in a 401k, pay a mortgage, or negotiate the purchase of investment property.

Why is a head of household necessary?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I think people just question why owning a penis makes one the default leader in anything.

I also question why there has to be a family leader in the first place.