Feminism, femininity, and marriage

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think people just question why owning a penis makes one the default leader in anything.

I also question why there has to be a family leader in the first place.

Instead of concerning yourself with the private decisions of other women, maybe take the proper feminist view that all women should be supported for choosing what is best for THEM.

Private decision, but can you explain it coherently?

I'm not the "head of household" PP, I just think it's disgusting for a person to claim to be a "feminist" but not support the decisions of ALL women, including those they disagree with.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:"Head of household" PP. Can you give an example of a big decision where your husband's preference trumps your preference?

Sorry if this has been asked in the last 2 pages of sniping, which I did not read because the first 14 pages were pretty exhausting.

I've got work to do. I'm no longer wasting my time on people unable comprehend beyond their own ridged bias and ignorance.

I was actually curious. It wasn't a loaded question and I'm not the PP who is attacking you. I can think of a number of really big family decisions where there would be no way I could accept someone else's decision if I completely disagreed. My list of dealbreakers is pretty tiny, but because this isn't the way it works in my family, it's pretty much hypothetical. I was hoping that someone for whom it's NOT hypothetical could weigh in about their actual experience.

If it's something like "I preferred school X for Larla while DH preferred school Y and because he's the decider, Larla goes to school Y" that's one thing. There is a thread on Expectant Moms right now where a woman is unexpectedly pregnant after infertility and wants to keep the baby, while her husband wants her to get an abortion. I am curious as to how the "head of household" PP(s) would resolve such a dilemma.

I'll give you one that happened a few years ago. We were buying a house. We looked at dozens and could not agree. He made the final decision on the house we purchased. I hated it and he promised to make it liveable for me and I bitched a lot about it. He lived up to that promise and the entire house has been remodeled. Top to bottom. I love the house now. I just couldn't see past the horrible finishes at the time.

However, I'm not sure why all of you are freaking out over the decision thing. How often do couples really disagree? I don't know about you, but it is so incredibly rare that we strongly want to go in two separate directions. In all honesty our biggest disagreement ever in our marriage was over our wedding. I wanted to elope, he did not. I completely threw my hands up and said fine and only referred to it has his wedding. THat is the only time we had an enormous blow out, which of course made me pause and wonder if I was making the right choice.

Being head of the household is really just having the big shoulders to carry us on. Being a stand up guy who is emotionally solid, being the rock for me when I need view of steady ground when I feel like I'm bobbing in the ocean. Being the man that barrels outside with a baseball bat when someone is trying to break in (yes, that happened), advocating for our family when needed, or when my efforts have not gotten us anywhere, being the guy that will beat the contractor up for the best price and then come down on him and make him do it again when it is not done as promised.

I'm sure many of you are made of well worn and tested leather. However, I actually like having a man who can take care of shit when I don't want to expel the energy. I like having someone I can fall back on and trust that he will get it done. I'm comfortable enough with myself to allow myself to sit back sometimes and let someone else sail the ship. I don't always want the ship to have two captains, I'm happy being co. It doesn't' bruise my ego one bit.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think people just question why owning a penis makes one the default leader in anything.

I also question why there has to be a family leader in the first place.

Instead of concerning yourself with the private decisions of other women, maybe take the proper feminist view that all women should be supported for choosing what is best for THEM.

Private decision, but can you explain it coherently?

I'm not the "head of household" PP, I just think it's disgusting for a person to claim to be a "feminist" but not support the decisions of ALL women, including those they disagree with.

I'd be happy to support it if I understood it. No, I do not support a person automatically deferring to another person solely on the basis of gender. For individual households, fine, I support it, but generally I think there should be a reason behind an arbitrary rule. Call me crazy.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:"Head of household" PP. Can you give an example of a big decision where your husband's preference trumps your preference?

Sorry if this has been asked in the last 2 pages of sniping, which I did not read because the first 14 pages were pretty exhausting.

I've got work to do. I'm no longer wasting my time on people unable comprehend beyond their own ridged bias and ignorance.

I was actually curious. It wasn't a loaded question and I'm not the PP who is attacking you. I can think of a number of really big family decisions where there would be no way I could accept someone else's decision if I completely disagreed. My list of dealbreakers is pretty tiny, but because this isn't the way it works in my family, it's pretty much hypothetical. I was hoping that someone for whom it's NOT hypothetical could weigh in about their actual experience.

If it's something like "I preferred school X for Larla while DH preferred school Y and because he's the decider, Larla goes to school Y" that's one thing. There is a thread on Expectant Moms right now where a woman is unexpectedly pregnant after infertility and wants to keep the baby, while her husband wants her to get an abortion. I am curious as to how the "head of household" PP(s) would resolve such a dilemma.

I was curious too. But people seem too bitter to answer.

I'm a feminist who is disgusted by possibly one or two rabidly upset posters who claim to be "feminists". I can now see why feminists get a bad name. I actually don't see the bitterness coming from the HoH posters. They actually seem quite comfortable with their lives and don't seem to care much about the "feminists" on here and whatever agenda they are trying to push. With each post, the "feminists" sound more and more unhinged and I'm trying to figure out what is so upsetting to them. The angry hostility is perplexing.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:"Head of household" PP. Can you give an example of a big decision where your husband's preference trumps your preference?

Sorry if this has been asked in the last 2 pages of sniping, which I did not read because the first 14 pages were pretty exhausting.

I've got work to do. I'm no longer wasting my time on people unable comprehend beyond their own ridged bias and ignorance.

I was actually curious. It wasn't a loaded question and I'm not the PP who is attacking you. I can think of a number of really big family decisions where there would be no way I could accept someone else's decision if I completely disagreed. My list of dealbreakers is pretty tiny, but because this isn't the way it works in my family, it's pretty much hypothetical. I was hoping that someone for whom it's NOT hypothetical could weigh in about their actual experience.

If it's something like "I preferred school X for Larla while DH preferred school Y and because he's the decider, Larla goes to school Y" that's one thing. There is a thread on Expectant Moms right now where a woman is unexpectedly pregnant after infertility and wants to keep the baby, while her husband wants her to get an abortion. I am curious as to how the "head of household" PP(s) would resolve such a dilemma.

I'll give you one that happened a few years ago. We were buying a house. We looked at dozens and could not agree. He made the final decision on the house we purchased. I hated it and he promised to make it liveable for me and I bitched a lot about it. He lived up to that promise and the entire house has been remodeled. Top to bottom. I love the house now. I just couldn't see past the horrible finishes at the time.

However, I'm not sure why all of you are freaking out over the decision thing. How often do couples really disagree? I don't know about you, but it is so incredibly rare that we strongly want to go in two separate directions. In all honesty our biggest disagreement ever in our marriage was over our wedding. I wanted to elope, he did not. I completely threw my hands up and said fine and only referred to it has his wedding. THat is the only time we had an enormous blow out, which of course made me pause and wonder if I was making the right choice.

Being head of the household is really just having the big shoulders to carry us on. Being a stand up guy who is emotionally solid, being the rock for me when I need view of steady ground when I feel like I'm bobbing in the ocean. Being the man that barrels outside with a baseball bat when someone is trying to break in (yes, that happened), advocating for our family when needed, or when my efforts have not gotten us anywhere, being the guy that will beat the contractor up for the best price and then come down on him and make him do it again when it is not done as promised.

I'm sure many of you are made of well worn and tested leather. However, I actually like having a man who can take care of shit when I don't want to expel the energy. I like having someone I can fall back on and trust that he will get it done. I'm comfortable enough with myself to allow myself to sit back sometimes and let someone else sail the ship. I don't always want the ship to have two captains, I'm happy being co. It doesn't' bruise my ego one bit.

I very much appreciate your time in typing that out and explaining it. I'm glad it works for you all. It wouldn't work for me and my marriage, but it doesn't have to, and I respect your decision and preferences.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:"Head of household" PP. Can you give an example of a big decision where your husband's preference trumps your preference?

Sorry if this has been asked in the last 2 pages of sniping, which I did not read because the first 14 pages were pretty exhausting.

I've got work to do. I'm no longer wasting my time on people unable comprehend beyond their own ridged bias and ignorance.

I was actually curious. It wasn't a loaded question and I'm not the PP who is attacking you. I can think of a number of really big family decisions where there would be no way I could accept someone else's decision if I completely disagreed. My list of dealbreakers is pretty tiny, but because this isn't the way it works in my family, it's pretty much hypothetical. I was hoping that someone for whom it's NOT hypothetical could weigh in about their actual experience.

If it's something like "I preferred school X for Larla while DH preferred school Y and because he's the decider, Larla goes to school Y" that's one thing. There is a thread on Expectant Moms right now where a woman is unexpectedly pregnant after infertility and wants to keep the baby, while her husband wants her to get an abortion. I am curious as to how the "head of household" PP(s) would resolve such a dilemma.

I was curious too. But people seem too bitter to answer.

I'm a feminist who is disgusted by possibly one or two rabidly upset posters who claim to be "feminists". I can now see why feminists get a bad name. I actually don't see the bitterness coming from the HoH posters. They actually seem quite comfortable with their lives and don't seem to care much about the "feminists" on here and whatever agenda they are trying to push. With each post, the "feminists" sound more and more unhinged and I'm trying to figure out what is so upsetting to them. The angry hostility is perplexing.

I don't like any general rule that men are the heads of households. My husband is definitely the follower in our marriage, in every way. I don't want to be made to feel unfeminine because I have strong leadership qualities and don't want a man telling me where to live or making any other major decisions for me.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:"Head of household" PP. Can you give an example of a big decision where your husband's preference trumps your preference?

Sorry if this has been asked in the last 2 pages of sniping, which I did not read because the first 14 pages were pretty exhausting.

I've got work to do. I'm no longer wasting my time on people unable comprehend beyond their own ridged bias and ignorance.

I was actually curious. It wasn't a loaded question and I'm not the PP who is attacking you. I can think of a number of really big family decisions where there would be no way I could accept someone else's decision if I completely disagreed. My list of dealbreakers is pretty tiny, but because this isn't the way it works in my family, it's pretty much hypothetical. I was hoping that someone for whom it's NOT hypothetical could weigh in about their actual experience.

If it's something like "I preferred school X for Larla while DH preferred school Y and because he's the decider, Larla goes to school Y" that's one thing. There is a thread on Expectant Moms right now where a woman is unexpectedly pregnant after infertility and wants to keep the baby, while her husband wants her to get an abortion. I am curious as to how the "head of household" PP(s) would resolve such a dilemma.

I'll give you one that happened a few years ago. We were buying a house. We looked at dozens and could not agree. He made the final decision on the house we purchased. I hated it and he promised to make it liveable for me and I bitched a lot about it. He lived up to that promise and the entire house has been remodeled. Top to bottom. I love the house now. I just couldn't see past the horrible finishes at the time.

However, I'm not sure why all of you are freaking out over the decision thing. How often do couples really disagree? I don't know about you, but it is so incredibly rare that we strongly want to go in two separate directions. In all honesty our biggest disagreement ever in our marriage was over our wedding. I wanted to elope, he did not. I completely threw my hands up and said fine and only referred to it has his wedding. THat is the only time we had an enormous blow out, which of course made me pause and wonder if I was making the right choice.

Being head of the household is really just having the big shoulders to carry us on. Being a stand up guy who is emotionally solid, being the rock for me when I need view of steady ground when I feel like I'm bobbing in the ocean. Being the man that barrels outside with a baseball bat when someone is trying to break in (yes, that happened), advocating for our family when needed, or when my efforts have not gotten us anywhere, being the guy that will beat the contractor up for the best price and then come down on him and make him do it again when it is not done as promised.

I'm sure many of you are made of well worn and tested leather. However, I actually like having a man who can take care of shit when I don't want to expel the energy. I like having someone I can fall back on and trust that he will get it done. I'm comfortable enough with myself to allow myself to sit back sometimes and let someone else sail the ship. I don't always want the ship to have two captains, I'm happy being co. It doesn't' bruise my ego one bit.

Thank you for your answer. It sounds like you have a great marriage.

With the house example, was there a house that you liked better?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:"Head of household" PP. Can you give an example of a big decision where your husband's preference trumps your preference?

Sorry if this has been asked in the last 2 pages of sniping, which I did not read because the first 14 pages were pretty exhausting.

I've got work to do. I'm no longer wasting my time on people unable comprehend beyond their own ridged bias and ignorance.

I was actually curious. It wasn't a loaded question and I'm not the PP who is attacking you. I can think of a number of really big family decisions where there would be no way I could accept someone else's decision if I completely disagreed. My list of dealbreakers is pretty tiny, but because this isn't the way it works in my family, it's pretty much hypothetical. I was hoping that someone for whom it's NOT hypothetical could weigh in about their actual experience.

If it's something like "I preferred school X for Larla while DH preferred school Y and because he's the decider, Larla goes to school Y" that's one thing. There is a thread on Expectant Moms right now where a woman is unexpectedly pregnant after infertility and wants to keep the baby, while her husband wants her to get an abortion. I am curious as to how the "head of household" PP(s) would resolve such a dilemma.

I was curious too. But people seem too bitter to answer.

I'm a feminist who is disgusted by possibly one or two rabidly upset posters who claim to be "feminists". I can now see why feminists get a bad name. I actually don't see the bitterness coming from the HoH posters. They actually seem quite comfortable with their lives and don't seem to care much about the "feminists" on here and whatever agenda they are trying to push. With each post, the "feminists" sound more and more unhinged and I'm trying to figure out what is so upsetting to them. The angry hostility is perplexing.

I don't like any general rule that men are the heads of households. My husband is definitely the follower in our marriage, in every way. I don't want to be made to feel unfeminine because I have strong leadership qualities and don't want a man telling me where to live or making any other major decisions for me.

So that's your personal decision, which I support. Why do you have to agree with other women's decisions to support them? How can you call yourself a feminist if you don't support all women's decisions, even those you disagree with?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:
I don't want to be made to feel unfeminine because I have strong leadership qualities and don't want a man telling me where to live or making any other major decisions for me.

Because he's a penis-haver, naturally he shouldn't make such decisions.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:
I'm a feminist who is disgusted by possibly one or two rabidly upset posters who claim to be "feminists". I can now see why feminists get a bad name. I actually don't see the bitterness coming from the HoH posters. They actually seem quite comfortable with their lives and don't seem to care much about the "feminists" on here and whatever agenda they are trying to push. With each post, the "feminists" sound more and more unhinged and I'm trying to figure out what is so upsetting to them. The angry hostility is perplexing.

Oh, no. You aren't allowed to draw attention to the anger or hostility. Don't you know the rules of feminist debate? That's "tone policing." It probably means you're a racist or a sexist -- see: http://groupthink.jezebel.com/on-tone-policing-why-its-bullshit-and-why-you-need-to-1148310719

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:"Head of household" PP. Can you give an example of a big decision where your husband's preference trumps your preference?

Sorry if this has been asked in the last 2 pages of sniping, which I did not read because the first 14 pages were pretty exhausting.

I've got work to do. I'm no longer wasting my time on people unable comprehend beyond their own ridged bias and ignorance.

I was actually curious. It wasn't a loaded question and I'm not the PP who is attacking you. I can think of a number of really big family decisions where there would be no way I could accept someone else's decision if I completely disagreed. My list of dealbreakers is pretty tiny, but because this isn't the way it works in my family, it's pretty much hypothetical. I was hoping that someone for whom it's NOT hypothetical could weigh in about their actual experience.

If it's something like "I preferred school X for Larla while DH preferred school Y and because he's the decider, Larla goes to school Y" that's one thing. There is a thread on Expectant Moms right now where a woman is unexpectedly pregnant after infertility and wants to keep the baby, while her husband wants her to get an abortion. I am curious as to how the "head of household" PP(s) would resolve such a dilemma.

I was curious too. But people seem too bitter to answer.

I'm a feminist who is disgusted by possibly one or two rabidly upset posters who claim to be "feminists". I can now see why feminists get a bad name. I actually don't see the bitterness coming from the HoH posters. They actually seem quite comfortable with their lives and don't seem to care much about the "feminists" on here and whatever agenda they are trying to push. With each post, the "feminists" sound more and more unhinged and I'm trying to figure out what is so upsetting to them. The angry hostility is perplexing.

I don't like any general rule that men are the heads of households. My husband is definitely the follower in our marriage, in every way. I don't want to be made to feel unfeminine because I have strong leadership qualities and don't want a man telling me where to live or making any other major decisions for me.

So that's your personal decision, which I support. Why do you have to agree with other women's decisions to support them? How can you call yourself a feminist if you don't support all women's decisions, even those you disagree with?

I do support the woman who posted the house example. Her marriage, her choices. Just don't call other women who prefer a different marital dynamic "unfeminine."

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
I'm a feminist who is disgusted by possibly one or two rabidly upset posters who claim to be "feminists". I can now see why feminists get a bad name. I actually don't see the bitterness coming from the HoH posters. They actually seem quite comfortable with their lives and don't seem to care much about the "feminists" on here and whatever agenda they are trying to push. With each post, the "feminists" sound more and more unhinged and I'm trying to figure out what is so upsetting to them. The angry hostility is perplexing.

Oh, no. You aren't allowed to draw attention to the anger or hostility. Don't you know the rules of feminist debate? That's "tone policing." It probably means you're a racist or a sexist -- see: http://groupthink.jezebel.com/on-tone-policing-why-its-bullshit-and-why-you-need-to-1148310719

You don't think it's dangerous to extrapolate to the general from the specific? Eg, if one woman feels comfortable with her spouse being head of the house, that all women should feel the same way or risk unflattering labels?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
I don't want to be made to feel unfeminine because I have strong leadership qualities and don't want a man telling me where to live or making any other major decisions for me.

Because he's a penis-haver, naturally he shouldn't make such decisions.

That's right, I'm heterosexual, so my spouse is by definition male, and no spouse of mine is going to have the final word on any major decisions in my life.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:"Head of household" PP. Can you give an example of a big decision where your husband's preference trumps your preference?

Sorry if this has been asked in the last 2 pages of sniping, which I did not read because the first 14 pages were pretty exhausting.

I've got work to do. I'm no longer wasting my time on people unable comprehend beyond their own ridged bias and ignorance.

I was actually curious. It wasn't a loaded question and I'm not the PP who is attacking you. I can think of a number of really big family decisions where there would be no way I could accept someone else's decision if I completely disagreed. My list of dealbreakers is pretty tiny, but because this isn't the way it works in my family, it's pretty much hypothetical. I was hoping that someone for whom it's NOT hypothetical could weigh in about their actual experience.

If it's something like "I preferred school X for Larla while DH preferred school Y and because he's the decider, Larla goes to school Y" that's one thing. There is a thread on Expectant Moms right now where a woman is unexpectedly pregnant after infertility and wants to keep the baby, while her husband wants her to get an abortion. I am curious as to how the "head of household" PP(s) would resolve such a dilemma.

I'll give you one that happened a few years ago. We were buying a house. We looked at dozens and could not agree. He made the final decision on the house we purchased. I hated it and he promised to make it liveable for me and I bitched a lot about it. He lived up to that promise and the entire house has been remodeled. Top to bottom. I love the house now. I just couldn't see past the horrible finishes at the time.

However, I'm not sure why all of you are freaking out over the decision thing. How often do couples really disagree? I don't know about you, but it is so incredibly rare that we strongly want to go in two separate directions. In all honesty our biggest disagreement ever in our marriage was over our wedding. I wanted to elope, he did not. I completely threw my hands up and said fine and only referred to it has his wedding. THat is the only time we had an enormous blow out, which of course made me pause and wonder if I was making the right choice.

Being head of the household is really just having the big shoulders to carry us on. Being a stand up guy who is emotionally solid, being the rock for me when I need view of steady ground when I feel like I'm bobbing in the ocean. Being the man that barrels outside with a baseball bat when someone is trying to break in (yes, that happened), advocating for our family when needed, or when my efforts have not gotten us anywhere, being the guy that will beat the contractor up for the best price and then come down on him and make him do it again when it is not done as promised.

I'm sure many of you are made of well worn and tested leather. However, I actually like having a man who can take care of shit when I don't want to expel the energy. I like having someone I can fall back on and trust that he will get it done. I'm comfortable enough with myself to allow myself to sit back sometimes and let someone else sail the ship. I don't always want the ship to have two captains, I'm happy being co. It doesn't' bruise my ego one bit.

Thank you for your answer. It sounds like you have a great marriage.

With the house example, was there a house that you liked better?

Yes, I wanted to move into a town house and he wanted nothing to do with anything other than a SFH, there was a fundamental divide. We could afford a TH that had the interior loaded with new finishes and move right in. We did not have the budget for a SFH with all the options I wanted. However, in retrospect, this SFH Is better because now the house is customized to what I want. He could have cared less about the interior. He wanted the yard for our boys, as he coaches all of their sports.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:"Head of household" PP. Can you give an example of a big decision where your husband's preference trumps your preference?

Sorry if this has been asked in the last 2 pages of sniping, which I did not read because the first 14 pages were pretty exhausting.

I've got work to do. I'm no longer wasting my time on people unable comprehend beyond their own ridged bias and ignorance.

I was actually curious. It wasn't a loaded question and I'm not the PP who is attacking you. I can think of a number of really big family decisions where there would be no way I could accept someone else's decision if I completely disagreed. My list of dealbreakers is pretty tiny, but because this isn't the way it works in my family, it's pretty much hypothetical. I was hoping that someone for whom it's NOT hypothetical could weigh in about their actual experience.

If it's something like "I preferred school X for Larla while DH preferred school Y and because he's the decider, Larla goes to school Y" that's one thing. There is a thread on Expectant Moms right now where a woman is unexpectedly pregnant after infertility and wants to keep the baby, while her husband wants her to get an abortion. I am curious as to how the "head of household" PP(s) would resolve such a dilemma.

I was curious too. But people seem too bitter to answer.

I'm a feminist who is disgusted by possibly one or two rabidly upset posters who claim to be "feminists". I can now see why feminists get a bad name. I actually don't see the bitterness coming from the HoH posters. They actually seem quite comfortable with their lives and don't seem to care much about the "feminists" on here and whatever agenda they are trying to push. With each post, the "feminists" sound more and more unhinged and I'm trying to figure out what is so upsetting to them. The angry hostility is perplexing.

I don't like any general rule that men are the heads of households. My husband is definitely the follower in our marriage, in every way. I don't want to be made to feel unfeminine because I have strong leadership qualities and don't want a man telling me where to live or making any other major decisions for me.

Sounds like you are very much the head of the household. More so than my DH is of ours! That is OK. As long as it works for both of you. You very much so lead and your DH is probably laid back enough to take your direction.