3% raise for teachers? What a joke FCPS!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:One thing that could happen to encourage more young people to go into teaching is paying for their degree in full at a state school if they can make it through 2 years of teaching.

To the poster who doesn't believe teachers work 60 hours a week:
7 a.m. -arrive at school, prep items, copy things, respond to emails, work on data
8 a.m. -kids arrive
11:00 a.m. -eat lunch while calling a parent and responding to emails, prep items for after lunch, set up a science demo, meet with a colleague about a student, maybe use the restroom and run to the recess door to pick kids up on time, create a chart for the kid who keeps eating the trash out of the trash can
11:50 a.m.- teach
1:00 p.m. -It's supposed to be prep time, but you have meetings 2/3 days you have prep
1:50 p.m. -pick kids up
2:30 p.m. -dismiss kids, talk with parents at pick up, clean up the room, meet with the social worker about another kid, check emails, attend meetings, planning, grading, create a new center, etc, etc, etc.
4:30 p.m. -drive home, pick up kids, make dinner, go to gym, etc
7:00 p.m. -more emails, analyze student writing samples, plan both whole group and small group writing instruction (or math or reading or whatever). Begin writing a grant, or look for a cool 2 minute video to illustrate a science concept or run to target to buy supplies for a project or look for ways to engage a learner who has adhd, etc, etc.
9:00 p.m. Watch TV, go to bed

All that is M-Th. Fridays, I go out for drinks or am exhausted and go to sleep.

Saturdays, I often go into school for 2 hours because there's no one else there making copies and I get a lot of organizational stuff done. Sunday afternoons I'll put in a few hours on some of my whole group planning.

When my kids were little, I remember bringing them to a roller skating party. While they skated, I sat and cut out laminating. I graded papers at sports practices. I once wanted to bring stuff to cut out to a water park (indoors, winter) and my husband put his foot down and said absolutely not.

I used to LOVE teaching. Truly. I left public education this year and will never go back. Not because of the hours. I'm kind of a workaholic and if I love what I'm doing, it's super satisfying to see students thrive because of it. But I was in a situation where I was truly not safe, and I had to leave. I'll be in a fancy private school this fall and anticipate working just as hard.

You realise even if you work every minute of lunch, every minute of 2:30-4:30, and all of the 7-9pm window… that still isn’t a 12 hour day, right?

You aren’t making the point you think you are. I don’t doubt you have worked an 11 hour day, but there is no way you are averaging anywhere close to 11 hours per day, let alone 12.

When I see a time sheet with 12 hours recorded on it I am going to need to know what the person was crashing on, and if you are averaging 12 per day over a year you need to be going over 12 every time you go under.

You seem to be forgetting the weekend hours I work. That all adds up to 60 hour weeks.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Here’s the reality. It doesn’t matter how many hours people think teachers work or don’t work. We’re all different on that front, once you get beyond mandated contract hours. It doesn’t matter how many hours you think we work in the summer. Some of us have three jobs cobbled together, while some of us take the time to decompress. And it doesn’t matter whether you think 60k, 80k, or whatever is a reasonable salary, or that 3% is a reasonable raise. The fact is that there is a teacher shortage. As a teacher, I can tell you that you can’t attract the best and brightest to this field anymore. Many of those who can leave are leaving, especially the ones who have advanced degrees or transferable skills, which is essentially all of the “good” ones. People who have other sources of income (ie high-earning partners) also are fleeing the field, or at least fleeing public teaching positions. And so the question becomes, do you want to attract the best and brightest to teach our children? And if you do, what do we as a society need to do to make that happen? It’s not whatever it is we’re doing right now, regardless of anyone’s opinion about our salary or the hours we work. I am leaving for a private school. If things aren’t better, I will leave the field. It was a second career for me, and so I have that option.

+1. This is what they don't understand: their opinion on things doesn't matter. Even if teachers are overpaid, undereducated, whining, lazy, entitled brats who are wrong about everything, there is still a historic teacher shortage. Teachers are leaving and there is no one qualified to replace them. I have not heard one detractor address this fact. They keep dismissing it, like a little kid with their hands over their ears, pretending bad things aren't real. When we say we are underpaid, overworked, and disrespected, it isn't a debate, it is an exit interview. There aren't two equal and opposing sides here. These are just statements of fact. Teachers are leaving the field because of these things. Whether you agree or not is utterly irrelevant, because we are still leaving and there isn't anyone qualified to replace us. You won't shame us, insult us, or argue us into staying.

This is a real problem. Filling the vacancies with provisional licenses and teacher residences won't solve it. Telling teachers they are wrong won't solve it and is making things worse.

Teachers ARE being replaced. Maybe not with the best or brightest but patents are kind of used that. There are overseas teachers willing to come here and work for less. An Associates degree seems qualified enough at least for elementary school if it comes to that. Private schools often hire teachers who have lower degrees and they work out fine. Society will move on and the world will not end. That is what parents believe because history repeats itself. Not many are buying into your dooms day hyperbole.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:3% is a perfectly reasonable COLA.

I think plenty of us would be okay paying teachers more if they were full time, year round. Teachers forget how much time they have off when they’re comparing their salaries. 80k would be 100k if they worked year round and got 3 weeks vacation.

FCPS teachers work 195 days. People who work all year with no vacation equals 260 days. Subtract your three weeks of holiday/vacation and you have 245. A difference of 50 days. But here is the thing….

Most teachers put in over 40 hours in a week which adds up to additional work days. So in reality the difference could end up being a lot less. Also many professional jobs get more than 3 weeks vacation. My husband is a fed and has enough vacation time to take off more than 3 weeks a year.

Don’t forget to subtract out two weeks for winter break and one week for spring break for teachers as well, where they don’t have to take vacation days. That’s another 3 weeks right there in FCPS - so a difference on 65 days by your count. I think that’s a lot fwiw.

No. 195 days are Working days. So your math is wrong.

+1. Stay in your lane.

This is my lane but I made a math mistake.

You made a math mistake because you had no idea that 195 contract days meant 195 working days? Or you made a ‘math mistake’ because you wanted to show that teachers don’t work that much as the OP said? And then we’re proven wrong?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Here’s the reality. It doesn’t matter how many hours people think teachers work or don’t work. We’re all different on that front, once you get beyond mandated contract hours. It doesn’t matter how many hours you think we work in the summer. Some of us have three jobs cobbled together, while some of us take the time to decompress. And it doesn’t matter whether you think 60k, 80k, or whatever is a reasonable salary, or that 3% is a reasonable raise. The fact is that there is a teacher shortage. As a teacher, I can tell you that you can’t attract the best and brightest to this field anymore. Many of those who can leave are leaving, especially the ones who have advanced degrees or transferable skills, which is essentially all of the “good” ones. People who have other sources of income (ie high-earning partners) also are fleeing the field, or at least fleeing public teaching positions. And so the question becomes, do you want to attract the best and brightest to teach our children? And if you do, what do we as a society need to do to make that happen? It’s not whatever it is we’re doing right now, regardless of anyone’s opinion about our salary or the hours we work. I am leaving for a private school. If things aren’t better, I will leave the field. It was a second career for me, and so I have that option.

+1. This is what they don't understand: their opinion on things doesn't matter. Even if teachers are overpaid, undereducated, whining, lazy, entitled brats who are wrong about everything, there is still a historic teacher shortage. Teachers are leaving and there is no one qualified to replace them. I have not heard one detractor address this fact. They keep dismissing it, like a little kid with their hands over their ears, pretending bad things aren't real. When we say we are underpaid, overworked, and disrespected, it isn't a debate, it is an exit interview. There aren't two equal and opposing sides here. These are just statements of fact. Teachers are leaving the field because of these things. Whether you agree or not is utterly irrelevant, because we are still leaving and there isn't anyone qualified to replace us. You won't shame us, insult us, or argue us into staying.

This is a real problem. Filling the vacancies with provisional licenses and teacher residences won't solve it. Telling teachers they are wrong won't solve it and is making things worse.

Teachers ARE being replaced. Maybe not with the best or brightest but patents are kind of used that. There are overseas teachers willing to come here and work for less. An Associates degree seems qualified enough at least for elementary school if it comes to that. Private schools often hire teachers who have lower degrees and they work out fine. Society will move on and the world will not end. That is what parents believe because history repeats itself. Not many are buying into your dooms day hyperbole.

Wow.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Here’s the reality. It doesn’t matter how many hours people think teachers work or don’t work. We’re all different on that front, once you get beyond mandated contract hours. It doesn’t matter how many hours you think we work in the summer. Some of us have three jobs cobbled together, while some of us take the time to decompress. And it doesn’t matter whether you think 60k, 80k, or whatever is a reasonable salary, or that 3% is a reasonable raise. The fact is that there is a teacher shortage. As a teacher, I can tell you that you can’t attract the best and brightest to this field anymore. Many of those who can leave are leaving, especially the ones who have advanced degrees or transferable skills, which is essentially all of the “good” ones. People who have other sources of income (ie high-earning partners) also are fleeing the field, or at least fleeing public teaching positions. And so the question becomes, do you want to attract the best and brightest to teach our children? And if you do, what do we as a society need to do to make that happen? It’s not whatever it is we’re doing right now, regardless of anyone’s opinion about our salary or the hours we work. I am leaving for a private school. If things aren’t better, I will leave the field. It was a second career for me, and so I have that option.

+1. This is what they don't understand: their opinion on things doesn't matter. Even if teachers are overpaid, undereducated, whining, lazy, entitled brats who are wrong about everything, there is still a historic teacher shortage. Teachers are leaving and there is no one qualified to replace them. I have not heard one detractor address this fact. They keep dismissing it, like a little kid with their hands over their ears, pretending bad things aren't real. When we say we are underpaid, overworked, and disrespected, it isn't a debate, it is an exit interview. There aren't two equal and opposing sides here. These are just statements of fact. Teachers are leaving the field because of these things. Whether you agree or not is utterly irrelevant, because we are still leaving and there isn't anyone qualified to replace us. You won't shame us, insult us, or argue us into staying.

This is a real problem. Filling the vacancies with provisional licenses and teacher residences won't solve it. Telling teachers they are wrong won't solve it and is making things worse.

Teachers ARE being replaced. Maybe not with the best or brightest but patents are kind of used that. There are overseas teachers willing to come here and work for less. An Associates degree seems qualified enough at least for elementary school if it comes to that. Private schools often hire teachers who have lower degrees and they work out fine. Society will move on and the world will not end. That is what parents believe because history repeats itself. Not many are buying into your dooms day hyperbole.

Your lack of respect toward the profession is a large part of the problem.

Perhaps you don’t see the value of public education. Perhaps you don’t have children, and therefore this doesn’t apply to you.

I’m a teacher and I have a child. I do want what’s best for my child and for the many I teach. I want their teachers to have the resources available to do a good job, and that means supporting them so they aren’t physically, emotionally, and mentally exhausted. I want to see success, and I know teachers currently aren’t set up to achieve it without tremendous personal drain.

You are comfortable letting public education die. You say this is hyperbole, but what do you know? When was the last time you’ve been in a school? I’m guessing you are using your own education from many years ago to drive your misconceptions.

(And teachers from other countries? I’ve worked with many. Unfortunately, most don’t last. They aren’t used to the extreme disrespect American teachers deal with daily, from children and from grown adults.)

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Here’s the reality. It doesn’t matter how many hours people think teachers work or don’t work. We’re all different on that front, once you get beyond mandated contract hours. It doesn’t matter how many hours you think we work in the summer. Some of us have three jobs cobbled together, while some of us take the time to decompress. And it doesn’t matter whether you think 60k, 80k, or whatever is a reasonable salary, or that 3% is a reasonable raise. The fact is that there is a teacher shortage. As a teacher, I can tell you that you can’t attract the best and brightest to this field anymore. Many of those who can leave are leaving, especially the ones who have advanced degrees or transferable skills, which is essentially all of the “good” ones. People who have other sources of income (ie high-earning partners) also are fleeing the field, or at least fleeing public teaching positions. And so the question becomes, do you want to attract the best and brightest to teach our children? And if you do, what do we as a society need to do to make that happen? It’s not whatever it is we’re doing right now, regardless of anyone’s opinion about our salary or the hours we work. I am leaving for a private school. If things aren’t better, I will leave the field. It was a second career for me, and so I have that option.

+1. This is what they don't understand: their opinion on things doesn't matter. Even if teachers are overpaid, undereducated, whining, lazy, entitled brats who are wrong about everything, there is still a historic teacher shortage. Teachers are leaving and there is no one qualified to replace them. I have not heard one detractor address this fact. They keep dismissing it, like a little kid with their hands over their ears, pretending bad things aren't real. When we say we are underpaid, overworked, and disrespected, it isn't a debate, it is an exit interview. There aren't two equal and opposing sides here. These are just statements of fact. Teachers are leaving the field because of these things. Whether you agree or not is utterly irrelevant, because we are still leaving and there isn't anyone qualified to replace us. You won't shame us, insult us, or argue us into staying.

This is a real problem. Filling the vacancies with provisional licenses and teacher residences won't solve it. Telling teachers they are wrong won't solve it and is making things worse.

Teachers ARE being replaced. Maybe not with the best or brightest but patents are kind of used that. There are overseas teachers willing to come here and work for less. An Associates degree seems qualified enough at least for elementary school if it comes to that. Private schools often hire teachers who have lower degrees and they work out fine. Society will move on and the world will not end. That is what parents believe because history repeats itself. Not many are buying into your dooms day hyperbole.

Your lack of respect toward the profession is a large part of the problem.

Perhaps you don’t see the value of public education. Perhaps you don’t have children, and therefore this doesn’t apply to you.

I’m a teacher and I have a child. I do want what’s best for my child and for the many I teach. I want their teachers to have the resources available to do a good job, and that means supporting them so they aren’t physically, emotionally, and mentally exhausted. I want to see success, and I know teachers currently aren’t set up to achieve it without tremendous personal drain.

You are comfortable letting public education die. You say this is hyperbole, but what do you know? When was the last time you’ve been in a school? I’m guessing you are using your own education from many years ago to drive your misconceptions.

(And teachers from other countries? I’ve worked with many. Unfortunately, most don’t last. They aren’t used to the extreme disrespect American teachers deal with daily, from children and from grown adults.)

All of this. Horrifying that people just want babysitting.

[Anonymous]

IRL, I think there's a lot of respect for teachers, as there is for other public employees, but the hyperbole on threads like these is annoying.

It's like the obnoxious representatives from the teachers' groups who tried to get local schools closed indefinitely, insisted on being the first in line to get Covid-19 vaccinations but then fought not to return to their classrooms, once back in the classrooms moved on to complain incessantly about kids' behavior and lack of socialization and academic progress (gee, wonder how that happened), and then whined about not getting paid enough again without skipping a beat.

If you're tired, we're flat-out exhausted. Do you think the past few years were easy for the rest of us?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:IRL, I think there's a lot of respect for teachers, as there is for other public employees, but the hyperbole on threads like these is annoying.

It's like the obnoxious representatives from the teachers' groups who tried to get local schools closed indefinitely, insisted on being the first in line to get Covid-19 vaccinations but then fought not to return to their classrooms, once back in the classrooms moved on to complain incessantly about kids' behavior and lack of socialization and academic progress (gee, wonder how that happened), and then whined about not getting paid enough again without skipping a beat.

If you're tired, we're flat-out exhausted. Do you think the past few years were easy for the rest of us?

If my kid acts unsocialized, I do not blame the pandemic or teacher, I blame myself. If my kid misbehaves, I do not blame the pandemic or school, I blame myself. My kids struggled a little bit when we first started virtual learning, but that lasted about two weeks before we squelched that behavior. Parenting and accountability works.

Of course the past few years have been hard on all of us, but that doesn't mean I don't feel bad for what teachers are having to deal with in their classrooms. Parents blaming the pandemic for their kids' misbehavior is ridiculous. We are three years past shutdown, so if your kids are still having behavioral issues, that's a reflection on you, not the school or the global pandemic.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:IRL, I think there's a lot of respect for teachers, as there is for other public employees, but the hyperbole on threads like these is annoying.

It's like the obnoxious representatives from the teachers' groups who tried to get local schools closed indefinitely, insisted on being the first in line to get Covid-19 vaccinations but then fought not to return to their classrooms, once back in the classrooms moved on to complain incessantly about kids' behavior and lack of socialization and academic progress (gee, wonder how that happened), and then whined about not getting paid enough again without skipping a beat.

If you're tired, we're flat-out exhausted. Do you think the past few years were easy for the rest of us?

Point out the hyperbole, please. I haven’t seen any yet. Is it the working conditions? All true. The hours? Also true. The fact we are leaving at unprecedented rates? True. To what hyperbole are you referring?

And exhausted? You do realize that teachers are also parents, correct? I have the same problems at home as you. I just don’t blame them on other people.

[Anonymous]

If the teachers on this thread were to be believed, they wouldn't have time to post constantly on DCUM because they'd be too busy grading papers, preparing lesson plans, and and handling their end-of-the-year responsibilities.

Instead, it's the same steady diet of "woe is me" that we've been hearing from the FEA and FCFT types for years. If only they knew how yawn-inducing it was.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:If the teachers on this thread were to be believed, they wouldn't have time to post constantly on DCUM because they'd be too busy grading papers, preparing lesson plans, and and handling their end-of-the-year responsibilities.

Instead, it's the same steady diet of "woe is me" that we've been hearing from the FEA and FCFT types for years. If only they knew how yawn-inducing it was.

If it makes you happy, I’ve been working since 6:30am this morning. I probably won’t finish prepping for next week until it’s time for me to make dinner.

Yes, I take breaks between papers to clear my brain a bit. Is that okay with you? I mean, it is my day “off”.

Plus, I’m interested in this conversation. I’m fascinated by the blatant falsehoods thrown out by some posters on this thread. I can’t comment from my classroom on a real workday, but I have the freedom now as I work from home.

I’m curious: how do you benefit from ridiculing and insulting teachers online? What’s your end goal?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:How can you become a teacher these days? No one wants to pay for college to be a teacher but I think there are people interested. They should incentivize going into the field.

Are you suggesting opening up teaching to people without college degrees?

I teach college-level classes at the high school level.

DP but I think k-6 teaching programs can be possible with a 4 year degree. Education degrees aren’t even all education classes.

I meant without a 4 year degree.

Meaning cut out the extra classes and make it a 2 year program.

Right. You don't want your babysitters to know too much.

Haha whatever. My degree is 20 years old and I’m perfectly capable of teaching grades k-6. Half my college classes didn’t even have to do with education. Teachings in programs should spend more time in actual classrooms and learn management, discipline and what it’s really like these days.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:IRL, I think there's a lot of respect for teachers, as there is for other public employees, but the hyperbole on threads like these is annoying.

It's like the obnoxious representatives from the teachers' groups who tried to get local schools closed indefinitely, insisted on being the first in line to get Covid-19 vaccinations but then fought not to return to their classrooms, once back in the classrooms moved on to complain incessantly about kids' behavior and lack of socialization and academic progress (gee, wonder how that happened), and then whined about not getting paid enough again without skipping a beat.

If you're tired, we're flat-out exhausted. Do you think the past few years were easy for the rest of us?

If my kid acts unsocialized, I do not blame the pandemic or teacher, I blame myself. If my kid misbehaves, I do not blame the pandemic or school, I blame myself. My kids struggled a little bit when we first started virtual learning, but that lasted about two weeks before we squelched that behavior. Parenting and accountability works.

Of course the past few years have been hard on all of us, but that doesn't mean I don't feel bad for what teachers are having to deal with in their classrooms. Parents blaming the pandemic for their kids' misbehavior is ridiculous. We are three years past shutdown, so if your kids are still having behavioral issues, that's a reflection on you, not the school or the global pandemic.

+1, for those families who chose in-person, we have been back in schools for OVER 2 years. Move on. If your child is I’ll-behaved that is the parents’ fault.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If the teachers on this thread were to be believed, they wouldn't have time to post constantly on DCUM because they'd be too busy grading papers, preparing lesson plans, and and handling their end-of-the-year responsibilities.

Instead, it's the same steady diet of "woe is me" that we've been hearing from the FEA and FCFT types for years. If only they knew how yawn-inducing it was.

If it makes you happy, I’ve been working since 6:30am this morning. I probably won’t finish prepping for next week until it’s time for me to make dinner.

Yes, I take breaks between papers to clear my brain a bit. Is that okay with you? I mean, it is my day “off”.

Plus, I’m interested in this conversation. I’m fascinated by the blatant falsehoods thrown out by some posters on this thread. I can’t comment from my classroom on a real workday, but I have the freedom now as I work from home.

I’m curious: how do you benefit from ridiculing and insulting teachers online? What’s your end goal?

It would be nice if some teachers here focused more on their students and academics and less on constantly airing their grievances. You often seem more like petulant children than functioning adults.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If the teachers on this thread were to be believed, they wouldn't have time to post constantly on DCUM because they'd be too busy grading papers, preparing lesson plans, and and handling their end-of-the-year responsibilities.

Instead, it's the same steady diet of "woe is me" that we've been hearing from the FEA and FCFT types for years. If only they knew how yawn-inducing it was.

If it makes you happy, I’ve been working since 6:30am this morning. I probably won’t finish prepping for next week until it’s time for me to make dinner.

Yes, I take breaks between papers to clear my brain a bit. Is that okay with you? I mean, it is my day “off”.

Plus, I’m interested in this conversation. I’m fascinated by the blatant falsehoods thrown out by some posters on this thread. I can’t comment from my classroom on a real workday, but I have the freedom now as I work from home.

I’m curious: how do you benefit from ridiculing and insulting teachers online? What’s your end goal?

It would be nice if some teachers here focused more on their students and academics and less on constantly airing their grievances. You often seem more like petulant children than functioning adults.

If your child went to my school, I guarantee that I am the teacher you want for your child. I’m thorough, well-planned, responsive, and my lessons are successful.

My success in the classroom comes at a huge cost: my time with my family and my well-being. This is not an exaggeration.

What you claim as “grievances” is nothing more than multiple teachers trying to clearly and calmly express to you why we are quitting. We can’t keep up this level of work anymore. We are burning out for all the reasons (“complaints,” to some) listed above.

You can help by being supportive. That may look like not throwing rude comments around on DCUM. You don’t know our jobs, so it’s rather ignorant to comment on them. As it stands, you are doing nothing more than adding fuel to the fire. I’m respectful enough not to do that to you. I don’t go to non-teacher threads and bash people.