3% raise for teachers? What a joke FCPS!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If the teachers on this thread were to be believed, they wouldn't have time to post constantly on DCUM because they'd be too busy grading papers, preparing lesson plans, and and handling their end-of-the-year responsibilities.

Instead, it's the same steady diet of "woe is me" that we've been hearing from the FEA and FCFT types for years. If only they knew how yawn-inducing it was.

If it makes you happy, I’ve been working since 6:30am this morning. I probably won’t finish prepping for next week until it’s time for me to make dinner.

Yes, I take breaks between papers to clear my brain a bit. Is that okay with you? I mean, it is my day “off”.

Plus, I’m interested in this conversation. I’m fascinated by the blatant falsehoods thrown out by some posters on this thread. I can’t comment from my classroom on a real workday, but I have the freedom now as I work from home.

I’m curious: how do you benefit from ridiculing and insulting teachers online? What’s your end goal?

It would be nice if some teachers here focused more on their students and academics and less on constantly airing their grievances. You often seem more like petulant children than functioning adults.

If your child went to my school, I guarantee that I am the teacher you want for your child. I’m thorough, well-planned, responsive, and my lessons are successful.

My success in the classroom comes at a huge cost: my time with my family and my well-being. This is not an exaggeration.

What you claim as “grievances” is nothing more than multiple teachers trying to clearly and calmly express to you why we are quitting. We can’t keep up this level of work anymore. We are burning out for all the reasons (“complaints,” to some) listed above.

You can help by being supportive. That may look like not throwing rude comments around on DCUM. You don’t know our jobs, so it’s rather ignorant to comment on them. As it stands, you are doing nothing more than adding fuel to the fire. I’m respectful enough not to do that to you. I don’t go to non-teacher threads and bash people.

You should get a job at a private/international school. They have staffs of teachers who do what you say you do and won’t accept less.

You would fit right in and might get a pay bump.

[Anonymous]

3% isn’t so bad across the board

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If the teachers on this thread were to be believed, they wouldn't have time to post constantly on DCUM because they'd be too busy grading papers, preparing lesson plans, and and handling their end-of-the-year responsibilities.

Instead, it's the same steady diet of "woe is me" that we've been hearing from the FEA and FCFT types for years. If only they knew how yawn-inducing it was.

If it makes you happy, I’ve been working since 6:30am this morning. I probably won’t finish prepping for next week until it’s time for me to make dinner.

Yes, I take breaks between papers to clear my brain a bit. Is that okay with you? I mean, it is my day “off”.

Plus, I’m interested in this conversation. I’m fascinated by the blatant falsehoods thrown out by some posters on this thread. I can’t comment from my classroom on a real workday, but I have the freedom now as I work from home.

I’m curious: how do you benefit from ridiculing and insulting teachers online? What’s your end goal?

It would be nice if some teachers here focused more on their students and academics and less on constantly airing their grievances. You often seem more like petulant children than functioning adults.

If your child went to my school, I guarantee that I am the teacher you want for your child. I’m thorough, well-planned, responsive, and my lessons are successful.

My success in the classroom comes at a huge cost: my time with my family and my well-being. This is not an exaggeration.

What you claim as “grievances” is nothing more than multiple teachers trying to clearly and calmly express to you why we are quitting. We can’t keep up this level of work anymore. We are burning out for all the reasons (“complaints,” to some) listed above.

You can help by being supportive. That may look like not throwing rude comments around on DCUM. You don’t know our jobs, so it’s rather ignorant to comment on them. As it stands, you are doing nothing more than adding fuel to the fire. I’m respectful enough not to do that to you. I don’t go to non-teacher threads and bash people.

This wasn’t a thread for teachers, so stop being disingenuous. This is yet another thread started by teachers intended to convince other taxpayers to pay higher taxes and fork over even more money to a bloated, inefficient school system. No thanks.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:IRL, I think there's a lot of respect for teachers, as there is for other public employees, but the hyperbole on threads like these is annoying.

It's like the obnoxious representatives from the teachers' groups who tried to get local schools closed indefinitely, insisted on being the first in line to get Covid-19 vaccinations but then fought not to return to their classrooms, once back in the classrooms moved on to complain incessantly about kids' behavior and lack of socialization and academic progress (gee, wonder how that happened), and then whined about not getting paid enough again without skipping a beat.

If you're tired, we're flat-out exhausted. Do you think the past few years were easy for the rest of us?

If my kid acts unsocialized, I do not blame the pandemic or teacher, I blame myself. If my kid misbehaves, I do not blame the pandemic or school, I blame myself. My kids struggled a little bit when we first started virtual learning, but that lasted about two weeks before we squelched that behavior. Parenting and accountability works.

Of course the past few years have been hard on all of us, but that doesn't mean I don't feel bad for what teachers are having to deal with in their classrooms. Parents blaming the pandemic for their kids' misbehavior is ridiculous. We are three years past shutdown, so if your kids are still having behavioral issues, that's a reflection on you, not the school or the global pandemic.

+1, for those families who chose in-person, we have been back in schools for OVER 2 years. Move on. If your child is I’ll-behaved that is the parents’ fault.

100%

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:3% is a perfectly reasonable COLA.

I think plenty of us would be okay paying teachers more if they were full time, year round. Teachers forget how much time they have off when they’re comparing their salaries. 80k would be 100k if they worked year round and got 3 weeks vacation.

FCPS teachers work 195 days. People who work all year with no vacation equals 260 days. Subtract your three weeks of holiday/vacation and you have 245. A difference of 50 days. But here is the thing….

Most teachers put in over 40 hours in a week which adds up to additional work days. So in reality the difference could end up being a lot less. Also many professional jobs get more than 3 weeks vacation. My husband is a fed and has enough vacation time to take off more than 3 weeks a year.

Don’t forget to subtract out two weeks for winter break and one week for spring break for teachers as well, where they don’t have to take vacation days. That’s another 3 weeks right there in FCPS - so a difference on 65 days by your count. I think that’s a lot fwiw.

No. 195 days are Working days. So your math is wrong.

+1. Stay in your lane.

This is my lane but I made a math mistake.

You made a math mistake because you had no idea that 195 contract days meant 195 working days? Or you made a ‘math mistake’ because you wanted to show that teachers don’t work that much as the OP said? And then we’re proven wrong?

I’m a former teacher and my spouse is a current teacher. I was just being sloppy instead of double checking. I don’t even remember what my days were when I worked. I wasn’t a martyr - I quit and got a different job. My spouse is not a martyr now. If he had it so bad I would suggest he quit too.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:One thing that could happen to encourage more young people to go into teaching is paying for their degree in full at a state school if they can make it through 2 years of teaching.

To the poster who doesn't believe teachers work 60 hours a week:
7 a.m. -arrive at school, prep items, copy things, respond to emails, work on data
8 a.m. -kids arrive
11:00 a.m. -eat lunch while calling a parent and responding to emails, prep items for after lunch, set up a science demo, meet with a colleague about a student, maybe use the restroom and run to the recess door to pick kids up on time, create a chart for the kid who keeps eating the trash out of the trash can
11:50 a.m.- teach
1:00 p.m. -It's supposed to be prep time, but you have meetings 2/3 days you have prep
1:50 p.m. -pick kids up
2:30 p.m. -dismiss kids, talk with parents at pick up, clean up the room, meet with the social worker about another kid, check emails, attend meetings, planning, grading, create a new center, etc, etc, etc.
4:30 p.m. -drive home, pick up kids, make dinner, go to gym, etc
7:00 p.m. -more emails, analyze student writing samples, plan both whole group and small group writing instruction (or math or reading or whatever). Begin writing a grant, or look for a cool 2 minute video to illustrate a science concept or run to target to buy supplies for a project or look for ways to engage a learner who has adhd, etc, etc.
9:00 p.m. Watch TV, go to bed

All that is M-Th. Fridays, I go out for drinks or am exhausted and go to sleep.

Saturdays, I often go into school for 2 hours because there's no one else there making copies and I get a lot of organizational stuff done. Sunday afternoons I'll put in a few hours on some of my whole group planning.

When my kids were little, I remember bringing them to a roller skating party. While they skated, I sat and cut out laminating. I graded papers at sports practices. I once wanted to bring stuff to cut out to a water park (indoors, winter) and my husband put his foot down and said absolutely not.

I used to LOVE teaching. Truly. I left public education this year and will never go back. Not because of the hours. I'm kind of a workaholic and if I love what I'm doing, it's super satisfying to see students thrive because of it. But I was in a situation where I was truly not safe, and I had to leave. I'll be in a fancy private school this fall and anticipate working just as hard.

You realise even if you work every minute of lunch, every minute of 2:30-4:30, and all of the 7-9pm window… that still isn’t a 12 hour day, right?

You aren’t making the point you think you are. I don’t doubt you have worked an 11 hour day, but there is no way you are averaging anywhere close to 11 hours per day, let alone 12.

When I see a time sheet with 12 hours recorded on it I am going to need to know what the person was crashing on, and if you are averaging 12 per day over a year you need to be going over 12 every time you go under.

I’m the 60-hour PP you don’t believe.

I regularly assign essays and papers. I’m responsible for teaching writing. One stack of essays can take 30 sustained hours to grade. I don’t get time at school to do that, so if happens on my own time. I try to get them back in 2 weeks, with comments.

120 papers x 15 minutes each = 30 hours

I also have smaller assignments I need to grade each week, so maybe another 5 hours there. Planning takes an additional 5-8 a week. Responding to emails, updating reports? 1-2 hours. Teaching in front of a class? 30-33 hours a week.

I work 12-14 hours every weekend in addition to 1-4 hours every M-F night. It’s Memorial Day and I’m waking up before my family to grade so I can see them later today, hopefully for dinner.

It’s so astoundingly arrogant of you to claim I’m lying. You’ve seen teachers out and about? Somehow that’s proof they don’t work?

I have three coworkers who quit this year from my department because they can’t keep the hours. I’m going to quit, too.

Here’s how you can help: don’t assume you know the life of a teacher. Why don’t you shed some of that ignorance (and arrogance) by signing up to sub. It would be a good eye-opener for you, and we could use the help.

It isn’t arrogant to say I don’t believe you, I simply don’t. As I said before I have actually worked those types of hours and know they leave no time or energy for anything else.

If you work 60 hour weeks even occasionally you are a rare exception.

This is ridiculous, even by DCUM standards. You have little knowledge of my profession. When multiple posters try to explain it to you, you STILL refuse to believe somebody’s reality doesn’t match your imagination.

You are correct: these hours leave little time for anything else. That’s why we are quitting in record numbers. These hours can’t be sustained.

And rare exception? I posted above that 3 department members quit this year alone because of these hours.

It is rather foolish to assume you know more than the expert.

You should quit if you are actually putting in anything close to what you claim.

“ During the school year, her calculations show that teachers work 39.8 hours per week while nonteachers work 41.5 hours. During the summer, teachers do work noticeably fewer hours. West reports that teachers work 21.5 hours per week during the summer. (Perhaps think of this as more like a half-time job than like “summer vacation.”)”

https://www.brookings.edu/blog/brown-center-chalkboard/2019/06/12/do-teachers-work-long-hours/

No responses to this? Maybe because it doesn’t reinforce the narrative that teachers are working big-law hours?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:One thing that could happen to encourage more young people to go into teaching is paying for their degree in full at a state school if they can make it through 2 years of teaching.

To the poster who doesn't believe teachers work 60 hours a week:
7 a.m. -arrive at school, prep items, copy things, respond to emails, work on data
8 a.m. -kids arrive
11:00 a.m. -eat lunch while calling a parent and responding to emails, prep items for after lunch, set up a science demo, meet with a colleague about a student, maybe use the restroom and run to the recess door to pick kids up on time, create a chart for the kid who keeps eating the trash out of the trash can
11:50 a.m.- teach
1:00 p.m. -It's supposed to be prep time, but you have meetings 2/3 days you have prep
1:50 p.m. -pick kids up
2:30 p.m. -dismiss kids, talk with parents at pick up, clean up the room, meet with the social worker about another kid, check emails, attend meetings, planning, grading, create a new center, etc, etc, etc.
4:30 p.m. -drive home, pick up kids, make dinner, go to gym, etc
7:00 p.m. -more emails, analyze student writing samples, plan both whole group and small group writing instruction (or math or reading or whatever). Begin writing a grant, or look for a cool 2 minute video to illustrate a science concept or run to target to buy supplies for a project or look for ways to engage a learner who has adhd, etc, etc.
9:00 p.m. Watch TV, go to bed

All that is M-Th. Fridays, I go out for drinks or am exhausted and go to sleep.

Saturdays, I often go into school for 2 hours because there's no one else there making copies and I get a lot of organizational stuff done. Sunday afternoons I'll put in a few hours on some of my whole group planning.

When my kids were little, I remember bringing them to a roller skating party. While they skated, I sat and cut out laminating. I graded papers at sports practices. I once wanted to bring stuff to cut out to a water park (indoors, winter) and my husband put his foot down and said absolutely not.

I used to LOVE teaching. Truly. I left public education this year and will never go back. Not because of the hours. I'm kind of a workaholic and if I love what I'm doing, it's super satisfying to see students thrive because of it. But I was in a situation where I was truly not safe, and I had to leave. I'll be in a fancy private school this fall and anticipate working just as hard.

You realise even if you work every minute of lunch, every minute of 2:30-4:30, and all of the 7-9pm window… that still isn’t a 12 hour day, right?

You aren’t making the point you think you are. I don’t doubt you have worked an 11 hour day, but there is no way you are averaging anywhere close to 11 hours per day, let alone 12.

When I see a time sheet with 12 hours recorded on it I am going to need to know what the person was crashing on, and if you are averaging 12 per day over a year you need to be going over 12 every time you go under.

I’m the 60-hour PP you don’t believe.

I regularly assign essays and papers. I’m responsible for teaching writing. One stack of essays can take 30 sustained hours to grade. I don’t get time at school to do that, so if happens on my own time. I try to get them back in 2 weeks, with comments.

120 papers x 15 minutes each = 30 hours

I also have smaller assignments I need to grade each week, so maybe another 5 hours there. Planning takes an additional 5-8 a week. Responding to emails, updating reports? 1-2 hours. Teaching in front of a class? 30-33 hours a week.

I work 12-14 hours every weekend in addition to 1-4 hours every M-F night. It’s Memorial Day and I’m waking up before my family to grade so I can see them later today, hopefully for dinner.

It’s so astoundingly arrogant of you to claim I’m lying. You’ve seen teachers out and about? Somehow that’s proof they don’t work?

I have three coworkers who quit this year from my department because they can’t keep the hours. I’m going to quit, too.

Here’s how you can help: don’t assume you know the life of a teacher. Why don’t you shed some of that ignorance (and arrogance) by signing up to sub. It would be a good eye-opener for you, and we could use the help.

It isn’t arrogant to say I don’t believe you, I simply don’t. As I said before I have actually worked those types of hours and know they leave no time or energy for anything else.

If you work 60 hour weeks even occasionally you are a rare exception.

This is ridiculous, even by DCUM standards. You have little knowledge of my profession. When multiple posters try to explain it to you, you STILL refuse to believe somebody’s reality doesn’t match your imagination.

You are correct: these hours leave little time for anything else. That’s why we are quitting in record numbers. These hours can’t be sustained.

And rare exception? I posted above that 3 department members quit this year alone because of these hours.

It is rather foolish to assume you know more than the expert.

You should quit if you are actually putting in anything close to what you claim.

“ During the school year, her calculations show that teachers work 39.8 hours per week while nonteachers work 41.5 hours. During the summer, teachers do work noticeably fewer hours. West reports that teachers work 21.5 hours per week during the summer. (Perhaps think of this as more like a half-time job than like “summer vacation.”)”

https://www.brookings.edu/blog/brown-center-chalkboard/2019/06/12/do-teachers-work-long-hours/

No responses to this? Maybe because it doesn’t reinforce the narrative that teachers are working big-law hours?

I responded earlier. The info in the article is rather useless:

“The American Time Use Survey (ATUS) asks thousands of people to keep just such a diary for a 24-hour period.”
- hardly a useful data set for the number of teachers in the US. Also doesn’t take account of the many variables: experience, location, discipline (high school APs, for example)

“During the school year, her calculations show that teachers work 39.8 hours per week.”
- old data / pre-Covid and pre-exodus. Many teachers don’t receive planning time at work now, pushing work into the evenings.

“During the summer, teachers do work noticeably fewer hours. West reports that teachers work 21.5 hours per week during the summer.” (Perhaps think of this as more like a half-time job than like “summer vacation.”)
- I do work this over the summer. I’m unpaid, so that isn’t a half-time job. That’s free labor.

“The bottom line on deciding on compensation is whether you’re paying enough to get a sufficiently large supply of sufficiently good employees. In other words, if you think we have more great teachers than we need you should be okay with lower compensation rates. Contrariwise, if you think we need more great teachers than we have on board then you should want to raise salaries. That’s how a market system works—you get what you pay for.”
- And there you have it! We are leaving! In droves! Clearly that’s how the market system works. You want teachers who provide feedback and plan engaging lessons? Pay is in TIME. I shouldn’t be up at 4am to work.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Here’s the reality. It doesn’t matter how many hours people think teachers work or don’t work. We’re all different on that front, once you get beyond mandated contract hours. It doesn’t matter how many hours you think we work in the summer. Some of us have three jobs cobbled together, while some of us take the time to decompress. And it doesn’t matter whether you think 60k, 80k, or whatever is a reasonable salary, or that 3% is a reasonable raise. The fact is that there is a teacher shortage. As a teacher, I can tell you that you can’t attract the best and brightest to this field anymore. Many of those who can leave are leaving, especially the ones who have advanced degrees or transferable skills, which is essentially all of the “good” ones. People who have other sources of income (ie high-earning partners) also are fleeing the field, or at least fleeing public teaching positions. And so the question becomes, do you want to attract the best and brightest to teach our children? And if you do, what do we as a society need to do to make that happen? It’s not whatever it is we’re doing right now, regardless of anyone’s opinion about our salary or the hours we work. I am leaving for a private school. If things aren’t better, I will leave the field. It was a second career for me, and so I have that option.

+1. This is what they don't understand: their opinion on things doesn't matter. Even if teachers are overpaid, undereducated, whining, lazy, entitled brats who are wrong about everything, there is still a historic teacher shortage. Teachers are leaving and there is no one qualified to replace them. I have not heard one detractor address this fact. They keep dismissing it, like a little kid with their hands over their ears, pretending bad things aren't real. When we say we are underpaid, overworked, and disrespected, it isn't a debate, it is an exit interview. There aren't two equal and opposing sides here. These are just statements of fact. Teachers are leaving the field because of these things. Whether you agree or not is utterly irrelevant, because we are still leaving and there isn't anyone qualified to replace us. You won't shame us, insult us, or argue us into staying.

This is a real problem. Filling the vacancies with provisional licenses and teacher residences won't solve it. Telling teachers they are wrong won't solve it and is making things worse.

Teachers ARE being replaced. Maybe not with the best or brightest but patents are kind of used that. There are overseas teachers willing to come here and work for less. An Associates degree seems qualified enough at least for elementary school if it comes to that. Private schools often hire teachers who have lower degrees and they work out fine. Society will move on and the world will not end. That is what parents believe because history repeats itself. Not many are buying into your dooms day hyperbole.

Are you the poster who wants to br g in foreign L&D nurses who will hold the baby and give her massages?

Parents on the college forum whine about international Phd students teaching their college kids. It will be fun to see how they react to their 1st grader's new foreign teacher who barely got an AA degree.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:It is 3% + a step.

$80.9 million to provide a market scale adjustment of 3.0% for all employees.
$58.2 million to provide a step increase for all eligible employees.
$4.3 million to provide a step extension for all scales.

I'm not sure what you want from FCPS. The Fairfax Board of Supervisors needs to raise taxes further if you want big teacher raises.

No they actually don't have to raise taxes. They need to be held more accountable for how they spend the money they already have.

[Anonymous]

How much is a step? What is the average step?

How does the pension figure into the salary?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:How much is a step? What is the average step?

How does the pension figure into the salary?

The average step is about $1700-2000 difference, so 2-3%. VRS is a small percentage of your compensation.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:How much is a step? What is the average step?

How does the pension figure into the salary?

Steps:
Since I have been hired, we have gotten steps about 75% of the time. They are around $2-2.5k
https://www.fcps.edu/sites/default/files/media/pdf/FY24-teacher-195-day.pdf

Pension:
Someone hired today gets 1% pension per year of service based on the average of your highest 5 years, and for full benefits you must be 60 with 30 years of service.

Someone hired before 2010 gets 1.7% and could retire with full benefits at 50 with 30 years of service.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:How much is a step? What is the average step?

How does the pension figure into the salary?

Steps:
Since I have been hired, we have gotten steps about 75% of the time. They are around $2-2.5k
https://www.fcps.edu/sites/default/files/media/pdf/FY24-teacher-195-day.pdf

Pension:
Someone hired today gets 1% pension per year of service based on the average of your highest 5 years, and for full benefits you must be 60 with 30 years of service.

Someone hired before 2010 gets 1.7% and could retire with full benefits at 50 with 30 years of service.

Pension info: https://www.varetire.org/pdf/publications/vrs-plans-comparison.pdf

[Anonymous]

Full benefits is amazing. If you live another 30 years that is like earning double your income.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Full benefits is amazing. If you live another 30 years that is like earning double your income.

You don’t get your full income annually. It’s a percentage of your highest five years’ aversge.