Visiting family - Prayers before meals

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Pick your battles. They’re your in laws. You don’t live with them and probably don’t see them every week. Just think about something else while your head is bowed in “prayer.”

This.

Really?? Just think about something else while your head is bowed in “prayer.”?

Replace the word "prayer" with anything else you might be offended by in your home.

Just think about something else while they Hail Satan.

Just think about something else while they say racist stuff.

Just think about something else while they fart loudly.

Just think about something else while they complain about the food you cooked.

No, you wouldn't sit for any of that other stuff without comment, would you? So why does insisting someone who does not want to pray participate in prayer get a pass? This is not a legal/constitutional issue, as government is not involved.

If you think prayer is racism, you might have an issue with categorical thinking.

Both can be offensive to some people and not to others, correct?

But you keep straw-manning until you have a reasonable response.

DP. Calm down. Equating prayer with racism, in terms of their ability to offend snowflake you, is bonkers.

I did not equate them, I said some people are offended by either.

But no worries. Just pull that example and equate it with farting at the table.

“But it’s my legal right to fart! You can’t tell me not to fart or when or where I can fart!”

It would be just as impolite to fart at the dinner table as not allowing other guests a moment of prayer.

I know the social graces are lost on most of the posters to DCUM who are "In it to win it" and need to start shoveling the food into their mouths when the plates hit the table.

Can we at least agree what we are talking about?

I agree that you generally go with whatever the host wants. And if that is grace before dinner, great.

Do you agree that if the family gathering happens at a home that does not say grace before dinner, guests cannot impose their desire for prayers on the host? Like if thanksgiving was at the son’s house, the son and his wife should decide if they will say a prayer and not the parents?

It would be rude for guests to begin prayer without requesting permission from the host. It would be rude for the host to deny them permission because the request is not unreasonable or even unexpected. You might remember that the majority of Americans have some religious beliefs.

It is here that we disagree. I think it would be rude for the guest to ask permission for a group prayer at someone else’s house. It puts the host in an awkward position and the host would be well within societal bounds to respond with “oh we don’t do that at our house but I love the tradition when we visit you!” I see nothing wrong at all with the guest saying a silent prayer before they start eating.

Are atheists scared of prayer, even when it’s their family members or friends praying? Why is it so important that friends and family don’t say grace in your presence? I am a Christian and often at family meals when someone is praying and we have bowed heads, I look around to watch my family in prayer and am thankful we are all healthy and together. I have seen non-praying family members sitting quietly and we share a smile. It’s totally a moment of gratitude, and expression of love for family and friends. I don’t know why atheists are against it. It doesn’t hurt them. No one makes anyone participate. It seems like an issue that drives a wedge between families unnecessarily. No one has ever yelled at me for looking around during prayer.

DP. I'm not scared of it, but I do think it's extremely rude for a guest to ask others to do it. If a guest asked, I'd probably quieting go along with it - obviously not bowing head or closing eyes - and rethink the guest list for next time.

So no guest has ever asked you if they can lead a prayer in your home? Why are you so outraged over something that has never happened?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Pick your battles. They’re your in laws. You don’t live with them and probably don’t see them every week. Just think about something else while your head is bowed in “prayer.”

This.

Really?? Just think about something else while your head is bowed in “prayer.”?

Replace the word "prayer" with anything else you might be offended by in your home.

Just think about something else while they Hail Satan.

Just think about something else while they say racist stuff.

Just think about something else while they fart loudly.

Just think about something else while they complain about the food you cooked.

No, you wouldn't sit for any of that other stuff without comment, would you? So why does insisting someone who does not want to pray participate in prayer get a pass? This is not a legal/constitutional issue, as government is not involved.

If you think prayer is racism, you might have an issue with categorical thinking.

Both can be offensive to some people and not to others, correct?

But you keep straw-manning until you have a reasonable response.

DP. Calm down. Equating prayer with racism, in terms of their ability to offend snowflake you, is bonkers.

I did not equate them, I said some people are offended by either.

But no worries. Just pull that example and equate it with farting at the table.

“But it’s my legal right to fart! You can’t tell me not to fart or when or where I can fart!”

It would be just as impolite to fart at the dinner table as not allowing other guests a moment of prayer.

I know the social graces are lost on most of the posters to DCUM who are "In it to win it" and need to start shoveling the food into their mouths when the plates hit the table.

Can we at least agree what we are talking about?

I agree that you generally go with whatever the host wants. And if that is grace before dinner, great.

Do you agree that if the family gathering happens at a home that does not say grace before dinner, guests cannot impose their desire for prayers on the host? Like if thanksgiving was at the son’s house, the son and his wife should decide if they will say a prayer and not the parents?

It would be rude for guests to begin prayer without requesting permission from the host. It would be rude for the host to deny them permission because the request is not unreasonable or even unexpected. You might remember that the majority of Americans have some religious beliefs.

It is here that we disagree. I think it would be rude for the guest to ask permission for a group prayer at someone else’s house. It puts the host in an awkward position and the host would be well within societal bounds to respond with “oh we don’t do that at our house but I love the tradition when we visit you!” I see nothing wrong at all with the guest saying a silent prayer before they start eating.

+1 million

Why would a guest even ask that? So rude.

So you are another poster who has never had the experience of a guest asking to lead a prayer in your home- but just the mere suggestion that it could possibly happen is upsetting to you.

Do you think an atheist attending a dinner with family in the family’s home should refrain from eating until grace has been said, on the basis of good manners? Is it rude to eat while others pray?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Pick your battles. They’re your in laws. You don’t live with them and probably don’t see them every week. Just think about something else while your head is bowed in “prayer.”

This.

Really?? Just think about something else while your head is bowed in “prayer.”?

Replace the word "prayer" with anything else you might be offended by in your home.

Just think about something else while they Hail Satan.

Just think about something else while they say racist stuff.

Just think about something else while they fart loudly.

Just think about something else while they complain about the food you cooked.

No, you wouldn't sit for any of that other stuff without comment, would you? So why does insisting someone who does not want to pray participate in prayer get a pass? This is not a legal/constitutional issue, as government is not involved.

If you think prayer is racism, you might have an issue with categorical thinking.

Both can be offensive to some people and not to others, correct?

But you keep straw-manning until you have a reasonable response.

DP. Calm down. Equating prayer with racism, in terms of their ability to offend snowflake you, is bonkers.

I did not equate them, I said some people are offended by either.

But no worries. Just pull that example and equate it with farting at the table.

“But it’s my legal right to fart! You can’t tell me not to fart or when or where I can fart!”

It would be just as impolite to fart at the dinner table as not allowing other guests a moment of prayer.

I know the social graces are lost on most of the posters to DCUM who are "In it to win it" and need to start shoveling the food into their mouths when the plates hit the table.

Can we at least agree what we are talking about?

I agree that you generally go with whatever the host wants. And if that is grace before dinner, great.

Do you agree that if the family gathering happens at a home that does not say grace before dinner, guests cannot impose their desire for prayers on the host? Like if thanksgiving was at the son’s house, the son and his wife should decide if they will say a prayer and not the parents?

It would be rude for guests to begin prayer without requesting permission from the host. It would be rude for the host to deny them permission because the request is not unreasonable or even unexpected. You might remember that the majority of Americans have some religious beliefs.

It is here that we disagree. I think it would be rude for the guest to ask permission for a group prayer at someone else’s house. It puts the host in an awkward position and the host would be well within societal bounds to respond with “oh we don’t do that at our house but I love the tradition when we visit you!” I see nothing wrong at all with the guest saying a silent prayer before they start eating.

+1 million

Why would a guest even ask that? So rude.

So you are another poster who has never had the experience of a guest asking to lead a prayer in your home- but just the mere suggestion that it could possibly happen is upsetting to you.

Do you think an atheist attending a dinner with family in the family’s home should refrain from eating until grace has been said, on the basis of good manners? Is it rude to eat while others pray?

I am not atheist but rather belong to a religion that does not do prayers before dinner. My DH’s family does say grace before dinner. None of them have ever asked me or DH if they could say grace at our table in our home. I would think it rude if they did. But they are lovely people and it would never occur to them too ask.

I visit my ILs home often. They pray before dinner. I just sit there quietly and expect my children (their grandchildren) to do the same.

This stuff is not hard if you don’t make it hard.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Pick your battles. They’re your in laws. You don’t live with them and probably don’t see them every week. Just think about something else while your head is bowed in “prayer.”

This.

Really?? Just think about something else while your head is bowed in “prayer.”?

Replace the word "prayer" with anything else you might be offended by in your home.

Just think about something else while they Hail Satan.

Just think about something else while they say racist stuff.

Just think about something else while they fart loudly.

Just think about something else while they complain about the food you cooked.

No, you wouldn't sit for any of that other stuff without comment, would you? So why does insisting someone who does not want to pray participate in prayer get a pass? This is not a legal/constitutional issue, as government is not involved.

If you think prayer is racism, you might have an issue with categorical thinking.

Both can be offensive to some people and not to others, correct?

But you keep straw-manning until you have a reasonable response.

DP. Calm down. Equating prayer with racism, in terms of their ability to offend snowflake you, is bonkers.

I did not equate them, I said some people are offended by either.

But no worries. Just pull that example and equate it with farting at the table.

“But it’s my legal right to fart! You can’t tell me not to fart or when or where I can fart!”

It would be just as impolite to fart at the dinner table as not allowing other guests a moment of prayer.

I know the social graces are lost on most of the posters to DCUM who are "In it to win it" and need to start shoveling the food into their mouths when the plates hit the table.

Can we at least agree what we are talking about?

I agree that you generally go with whatever the host wants. And if that is grace before dinner, great.

Do you agree that if the family gathering happens at a home that does not say grace before dinner, guests cannot impose their desire for prayers on the host? Like if thanksgiving was at the son’s house, the son and his wife should decide if they will say a prayer and not the parents?

It would be rude for guests to begin prayer without requesting permission from the host. It would be rude for the host to deny them permission because the request is not unreasonable or even unexpected. You might remember that the majority of Americans have some religious beliefs.

It is here that we disagree. I think it would be rude for the guest to ask permission for a group prayer at someone else’s house. It puts the host in an awkward position and the host would be well within societal bounds to respond with “oh we don’t do that at our house but I love the tradition when we visit you!” I see nothing wrong at all with the guest saying a silent prayer before they start eating.

Are atheists scared of prayer, even when it’s their family members or friends praying? Why is it so important that friends and family don’t say grace in your presence? I am a Christian and often at family meals when someone is praying and we have bowed heads, I look around to watch my family in prayer and am thankful we are all healthy and together. I have seen non-praying family members sitting quietly and we share a smile. It’s totally a moment of gratitude, and expression of love for family and friends. I don’t know why atheists are against it. It doesn’t hurt them. No one makes anyone participate. It seems like an issue that drives a wedge between families unnecessarily. No one has ever yelled at me for looking around during prayer.

DP. I'm not scared of it, but I do think it's extremely rude for a guest to ask others to do it. If a guest asked, I'd probably quieting go along with it - obviously not bowing head or closing eyes - and rethink the guest list for next time.

So no guest has ever asked you if they can lead a prayer in your home? Why are you so outraged over something that has never happened?

Because the OP said that her DH’s family comes over and insists on prayers before meals. So I am trying to think about how I would feel about that - and the answer is annoyed because it’s rude to ask.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Pick your battles. They’re your in laws. You don’t live with them and probably don’t see them every week. Just think about something else while your head is bowed in “prayer.”

This.

Really?? Just think about something else while your head is bowed in “prayer.”?

Replace the word "prayer" with anything else you might be offended by in your home.

Just think about something else while they Hail Satan.

Just think about something else while they say racist stuff.

Just think about something else while they fart loudly.

Just think about something else while they complain about the food you cooked.

No, you wouldn't sit for any of that other stuff without comment, would you? So why does insisting someone who does not want to pray participate in prayer get a pass? This is not a legal/constitutional issue, as government is not involved.

If you think prayer is racism, you might have an issue with categorical thinking.

Both can be offensive to some people and not to others, correct?

But you keep straw-manning until you have a reasonable response.

DP. Calm down. Equating prayer with racism, in terms of their ability to offend snowflake you, is bonkers.

I did not equate them, I said some people are offended by either.

But no worries. Just pull that example and equate it with farting at the table.

“But it’s my legal right to fart! You can’t tell me not to fart or when or where I can fart!”

It would be just as impolite to fart at the dinner table as not allowing other guests a moment of prayer.

I know the social graces are lost on most of the posters to DCUM who are "In it to win it" and need to start shoveling the food into their mouths when the plates hit the table.

Can we at least agree what we are talking about?

I agree that you generally go with whatever the host wants. And if that is grace before dinner, great.

Do you agree that if the family gathering happens at a home that does not say grace before dinner, guests cannot impose their desire for prayers on the host? Like if thanksgiving was at the son’s house, the son and his wife should decide if they will say a prayer and not the parents?

It would be rude for guests to begin prayer without requesting permission from the host. It would be rude for the host to deny them permission because the request is not unreasonable or even unexpected. You might remember that the majority of Americans have some religious beliefs.

It is here that we disagree. I think it would be rude for the guest to ask permission for a group prayer at someone else’s house. It puts the host in an awkward position and the host would be well within societal bounds to respond with “oh we don’t do that at our house but I love the tradition when we visit you!” I see nothing wrong at all with the guest saying a silent prayer before they start eating.

Are atheists scared of prayer, even when it’s their family members or friends praying? Why is it so important that friends and family don’t say grace in your presence? I am a Christian and often at family meals when someone is praying and we have bowed heads, I look around to watch my family in prayer and am thankful we are all healthy and together. I have seen non-praying family members sitting quietly and we share a smile. It’s totally a moment of gratitude, and expression of love for family and friends. I don’t know why atheists are against it. It doesn’t hurt them. No one makes anyone participate. It seems like an issue that drives a wedge between families unnecessarily. No one has ever yelled at me for looking around during prayer.

DP. I'm not scared of it, but I do think it's extremely rude for a guest to ask others to do it. If a guest asked, I'd probably quieting go along with it - obviously not bowing head or closing eyes - and rethink the guest list for next time.

So no guest has ever asked you if they can lead a prayer in your home? Why are you so outraged over something that has never happened?

Because the OP said that her DH’s family comes over and insists on prayers before meals. So I am trying to think about how I would feel about that - and the answer is annoyed because it’s rude to ask.

We have muslim friends who asked to pray in our house (they bring their carpet and I would walk them to the office or guest room for privacy), not a big deal. If my Christian friend asks to pray at the table, I will gladly accommodate them. If my Jewish friends ask for kosher meal, I will be happy to do so. That what family and friends for.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Pick your battles. They’re your in laws. You don’t live with them and probably don’t see them every week. Just think about something else while your head is bowed in “prayer.”

This.

Really?? Just think about something else while your head is bowed in “prayer.”?

Replace the word "prayer" with anything else you might be offended by in your home.

Just think about something else while they Hail Satan.

Just think about something else while they say racist stuff.

Just think about something else while they fart loudly.

Just think about something else while they complain about the food you cooked.

No, you wouldn't sit for any of that other stuff without comment, would you? So why does insisting someone who does not want to pray participate in prayer get a pass? This is not a legal/constitutional issue, as government is not involved.

If you think prayer is racism, you might have an issue with categorical thinking.

Both can be offensive to some people and not to others, correct?

But you keep straw-manning until you have a reasonable response.

DP. Calm down. Equating prayer with racism, in terms of their ability to offend snowflake you, is bonkers.

I did not equate them, I said some people are offended by either.

But no worries. Just pull that example and equate it with farting at the table.

“But it’s my legal right to fart! You can’t tell me not to fart or when or where I can fart!”

It would be just as impolite to fart at the dinner table as not allowing other guests a moment of prayer.

I know the social graces are lost on most of the posters to DCUM who are "In it to win it" and need to start shoveling the food into their mouths when the plates hit the table.

Your logic fails completely.

Do we indulge what the guests wish to do, or respect the wishes of our host?

Please answer.

Is your confidence in atheism so weak that a short prayer will shake your foundational beliefs?

A host will consider reasonable requests from guests. A short prayer is not an unreasonable request. They aren't asking to spout racist rants; they aren't asking to fart loudly at the table; other whatever other strawmen you posted above.

But what if the host finds prayer more offensive than farting?

You don’t care. You think your beliefs are paramount and screw everyone else’s, even in their home.

You are a bad and selfish person.

No wonder you have no friends.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Pick your battles. They’re your in laws. You don’t live with them and probably don’t see them every week. Just think about something else while your head is bowed in “prayer.”

This.

Really?? Just think about something else while your head is bowed in “prayer.”?

Replace the word "prayer" with anything else you might be offended by in your home.

Just think about something else while they Hail Satan.

Just think about something else while they say racist stuff.

Just think about something else while they fart loudly.

Just think about something else while they complain about the food you cooked.

No, you wouldn't sit for any of that other stuff without comment, would you? So why does insisting someone who does not want to pray participate in prayer get a pass? This is not a legal/constitutional issue, as government is not involved.

If you think prayer is racism, you might have an issue with categorical thinking.

Both can be offensive to some people and not to others, correct?

But you keep straw-manning until you have a reasonable response.

DP. Calm down. Equating prayer with racism, in terms of their ability to offend snowflake you, is bonkers.

I did not equate them, I said some people are offended by either.

But no worries. Just pull that example and equate it with farting at the table.

“But it’s my legal right to fart! You can’t tell me not to fart or when or where I can fart!”

It would be just as impolite to fart at the dinner table as not allowing other guests a moment of prayer.

I know the social graces are lost on most of the posters to DCUM who are "In it to win it" and need to start shoveling the food into their mouths when the plates hit the table.

Can we at least agree what we are talking about?

I agree that you generally go with whatever the host wants. And if that is grace before dinner, great.

Do you agree that if the family gathering happens at a home that does not say grace before dinner, guests cannot impose their desire for prayers on the host? Like if thanksgiving was at the son’s house, the son and his wife should decide if they will say a prayer and not the parents?

It would be rude for guests to begin prayer without requesting permission from the host. It would be rude for the host to deny them permission because the request is not unreasonable or even unexpected. You might remember that the majority of Americans have some religious beliefs.

It is here that we disagree. I think it would be rude for the guest to ask permission for a group prayer at someone else’s house. It puts the host in an awkward position and the host would be well within societal bounds to respond with “oh we don’t do that at our house but I love the tradition when we visit you!” I see nothing wrong at all with the guest saying a silent prayer before they start eating.

+1 million

Why would a guest even ask that? So rude.

So you are another poster who has never had the experience of a guest asking to lead a prayer in your home- but just the mere suggestion that it could possibly happen is upsetting to you.

Do you think an atheist attending a dinner with family in the family’s home should refrain from eating until grace has been said, on the basis of good manners? Is it rude to eat while others pray?

I am not atheist but rather belong to a religion that does not do prayers before dinner. My DH’s family does say grace before dinner. None of them have ever asked me or DH if they could say grace at our table in our home. I would think it rude if they did. But they are lovely people and it would never occur to them too ask.

I visit my ILs home often. They pray before dinner. I just sit there quietly and expect my children (their grandchildren) to do the same.

This stuff is not hard if you don’t make it hard.

+1 I think those who are militantly opposed to this stuff are few and far between. They have issues with their family, and aren’t accepting of their friends as many have stated they would not invite a friend back to their home if they asked to pray.

I think they are people without manners. They lack respect and seem to think eating while their friends and loved ones are saying grace is acceptable, and proudly state they would grab for a jalapeño popper while declaring God doesn’t exist, or fill their plates and eat while others are saying grace because they prepared all the food.

Bad manners and lack of basic respect for loved ones and friends, equals toxic and immature. No adult I have ever been acquainted with acted like this. I think these people are either highly un-self-aware or trolling.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Pick your battles. They’re your in laws. You don’t live with them and probably don’t see them every week. Just think about something else while your head is bowed in “prayer.”

This.

Really?? Just think about something else while your head is bowed in “prayer.”?

Replace the word "prayer" with anything else you might be offended by in your home.

Just think about something else while they Hail Satan.

Just think about something else while they say racist stuff.

Just think about something else while they fart loudly.

Just think about something else while they complain about the food you cooked.

No, you wouldn't sit for any of that other stuff without comment, would you? So why does insisting someone who does not want to pray participate in prayer get a pass? This is not a legal/constitutional issue, as government is not involved.

If you think prayer is racism, you might have an issue with categorical thinking.

Both can be offensive to some people and not to others, correct?

But you keep straw-manning until you have a reasonable response.

DP. Calm down. Equating prayer with racism, in terms of their ability to offend snowflake you, is bonkers.

I did not equate them, I said some people are offended by either.

But no worries. Just pull that example and equate it with farting at the table.

“But it’s my legal right to fart! You can’t tell me not to fart or when or where I can fart!”

It would be just as impolite to fart at the dinner table as not allowing other guests a moment of prayer.

I know the social graces are lost on most of the posters to DCUM who are "In it to win it" and need to start shoveling the food into their mouths when the plates hit the table.

Your logic fails completely.

Do we indulge what the guests wish to do, or respect the wishes of our host?

Please answer.

Is your confidence in atheism so weak that a short prayer will shake your foundational beliefs?

A host will consider reasonable requests from guests. A short prayer is not an unreasonable request. They aren't asking to spout racist rants; they aren't asking to fart loudly at the table; other whatever other strawmen you posted above.

But what if the host finds prayer more offensive than farting?

You don’t care. You think your beliefs are paramount and screw everyone else’s, even in their home.

You are a bad and selfish person.

No wonder you have no friends.

+1 this poster is angry and alone.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Pick your battles. They’re your in laws. You don’t live with them and probably don’t see them every week. Just think about something else while your head is bowed in “prayer.”

This.

Really?? Just think about something else while your head is bowed in “prayer.”?

Replace the word "prayer" with anything else you might be offended by in your home.

Just think about something else while they Hail Satan.

Just think about something else while they say racist stuff.

Just think about something else while they fart loudly.

Just think about something else while they complain about the food you cooked.

No, you wouldn't sit for any of that other stuff without comment, would you? So why does insisting someone who does not want to pray participate in prayer get a pass? This is not a legal/constitutional issue, as government is not involved.

If you think prayer is racism, you might have an issue with categorical thinking.

Both can be offensive to some people and not to others, correct?

But you keep straw-manning until you have a reasonable response.

DP. Calm down. Equating prayer with racism, in terms of their ability to offend snowflake you, is bonkers.

I did not equate them, I said some people are offended by either.

But no worries. Just pull that example and equate it with farting at the table.

“But it’s my legal right to fart! You can’t tell me not to fart or when or where I can fart!”

It would be just as impolite to fart at the dinner table as not allowing other guests a moment of prayer.

I know the social graces are lost on most of the posters to DCUM who are "In it to win it" and need to start shoveling the food into their mouths when the plates hit the table.

Your logic fails completely.

Do we indulge what the guests wish to do, or respect the wishes of our host?

Please answer.

Is your confidence in atheism so weak that a short prayer will shake your foundational beliefs?

A host will consider reasonable requests from guests. A short prayer is not an unreasonable request. They aren't asking to spout racist rants; they aren't asking to fart loudly at the table; other whatever other strawmen you posted above.

But what if the host finds prayer more offensive than farting?

You don’t care. You think your beliefs are paramount and screw everyone else’s, even in their home.

You are a bad and selfish person.

You should really reflect on your bigotry, I can’t be great to be so miserable and hateful.

Stop with the BS. If it is bigoted to be against people who don't respect the wishes of the people whose home they are in, then color me so. You are AWFUL.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Pick your battles. They’re your in laws. You don’t live with them and probably don’t see them every week. Just think about something else while your head is bowed in “prayer.”

This.

Really?? Just think about something else while your head is bowed in “prayer.”?

Replace the word "prayer" with anything else you might be offended by in your home.

Just think about something else while they Hail Satan.

Just think about something else while they say racist stuff.

Just think about something else while they fart loudly.

Just think about something else while they complain about the food you cooked.

No, you wouldn't sit for any of that other stuff without comment, would you? So why does insisting someone who does not want to pray participate in prayer get a pass? This is not a legal/constitutional issue, as government is not involved.

If you think prayer is racism, you might have an issue with categorical thinking.

Both can be offensive to some people and not to others, correct?

But you keep straw-manning until you have a reasonable response.

DP. Calm down. Equating prayer with racism, in terms of their ability to offend snowflake you, is bonkers.

I did not equate them, I said some people are offended by either.

But no worries. Just pull that example and equate it with farting at the table.

“But it’s my legal right to fart! You can’t tell me not to fart or when or where I can fart!”

It would be just as impolite to fart at the dinner table as not allowing other guests a moment of prayer.

I know the social graces are lost on most of the posters to DCUM who are "In it to win it" and need to start shoveling the food into their mouths when the plates hit the table.

Your logic fails completely.

Do we indulge what the guests wish to do, or respect the wishes of our host?

Please answer.

Is your confidence in atheism so weak that a short prayer will shake your foundational beliefs?

A host will consider reasonable requests from guests. A short prayer is not an unreasonable request. They aren't asking to spout racist rants; they aren't asking to fart loudly at the table; other whatever other strawmen you posted above.

But what if the host finds prayer more offensive than farting?

You don’t care. You think your beliefs are paramount and screw everyone else’s, even in their home.

You are a bad and selfish person.

No wonder you have no friends.

No wonder you have to resort to ad hominem. Because you are a bad and selfish person, as evidenced by your post that you think you get to do what you want in someone else's home.

What you do is the same as farting at the table. Rude and unnecessary, and the only reasons you do it is because you want to be demonstrative about your beliefs and you think everyone who doesn't share them is wrong.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Pick your battles. They’re your in laws. You don’t live with them and probably don’t see them every week. Just think about something else while your head is bowed in “prayer.”

This.

Really?? Just think about something else while your head is bowed in “prayer.”?

Replace the word "prayer" with anything else you might be offended by in your home.

Just think about something else while they Hail Satan.

Just think about something else while they say racist stuff.

Just think about something else while they fart loudly.

Just think about something else while they complain about the food you cooked.

No, you wouldn't sit for any of that other stuff without comment, would you? So why does insisting someone who does not want to pray participate in prayer get a pass? This is not a legal/constitutional issue, as government is not involved.

If you think prayer is racism, you might have an issue with categorical thinking.

Both can be offensive to some people and not to others, correct?

But you keep straw-manning until you have a reasonable response.

DP. Calm down. Equating prayer with racism, in terms of their ability to offend snowflake you, is bonkers.

I did not equate them, I said some people are offended by either.

But no worries. Just pull that example and equate it with farting at the table.

“But it’s my legal right to fart! You can’t tell me not to fart or when or where I can fart!”

It would be just as impolite to fart at the dinner table as not allowing other guests a moment of prayer.

I know the social graces are lost on most of the posters to DCUM who are "In it to win it" and need to start shoveling the food into their mouths when the plates hit the table.

Your logic fails completely.

Do we indulge what the guests wish to do, or respect the wishes of our host?

Please answer.

Is your confidence in atheism so weak that a short prayer will shake your foundational beliefs?

A host will consider reasonable requests from guests. A short prayer is not an unreasonable request. They aren't asking to spout racist rants; they aren't asking to fart loudly at the table; other whatever other strawmen you posted above.

But what if the host finds prayer more offensive than farting?

You don’t care. You think your beliefs are paramount and screw everyone else’s, even in their home.

You are a bad and selfish person.

You should really reflect on your bigotry, I can’t be great to be so miserable and hateful.

Stop with the BS. If it is bigoted to be against people who don't respect the wishes of the people whose home they are in, then color me so. You are AWFUL.

And you are angry and YELL online; I can’t imagine how often you yell irl. This thread is rage bait.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Pick your battles. They’re your in laws. You don’t live with them and probably don’t see them every week. Just think about something else while your head is bowed in “prayer.”

This.

Really?? Just think about something else while your head is bowed in “prayer.”?

Replace the word "prayer" with anything else you might be offended by in your home.

Just think about something else while they Hail Satan.

Just think about something else while they say racist stuff.

Just think about something else while they fart loudly.

Just think about something else while they complain about the food you cooked.

No, you wouldn't sit for any of that other stuff without comment, would you? So why does insisting someone who does not want to pray participate in prayer get a pass? This is not a legal/constitutional issue, as government is not involved.

If you think prayer is racism, you might have an issue with categorical thinking.

Both can be offensive to some people and not to others, correct?

But you keep straw-manning until you have a reasonable response.

DP. Calm down. Equating prayer with racism, in terms of their ability to offend snowflake you, is bonkers.

I did not equate them, I said some people are offended by either.

But no worries. Just pull that example and equate it with farting at the table.

“But it’s my legal right to fart! You can’t tell me not to fart or when or where I can fart!”

It would be just as impolite to fart at the dinner table as not allowing other guests a moment of prayer.

I know the social graces are lost on most of the posters to DCUM who are "In it to win it" and need to start shoveling the food into their mouths when the plates hit the table.

Your logic fails completely.

Do we indulge what the guests wish to do, or respect the wishes of our host?

Please answer.

Is your confidence in atheism so weak that a short prayer will shake your foundational beliefs?

A host will consider reasonable requests from guests. A short prayer is not an unreasonable request. They aren't asking to spout racist rants; they aren't asking to fart loudly at the table; other whatever other strawmen you posted above.

But what if the host finds prayer more offensive than farting?

You don’t care. You think your beliefs are paramount and screw everyone else’s, even in their home.

You are a bad and selfish person.

No wonder you have no friends.

No wonder you have to resort to ad hominem. Because you are a bad and selfish person, as evidenced by your post that you think you get to do what you want in someone else's home.

What you do is the same as farting at the table. Rude and unnecessary, and the only reasons you do it is because you want to be demonstrative about your beliefs and you think everyone who doesn't share them is wrong.

dp- you seriously have issues. It’s not an insult; you need therapy. I hope you get it soon. You don’t have to go through life this way. Take care and I hope something positive happens for you soon.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Pick your battles. They’re your in laws. You don’t live with them and probably don’t see them every week. Just think about something else while your head is bowed in “prayer.”

This.

Really?? Just think about something else while your head is bowed in “prayer.”?

Replace the word "prayer" with anything else you might be offended by in your home.

Just think about something else while they Hail Satan.

Just think about something else while they say racist stuff.

Just think about something else while they fart loudly.

Just think about something else while they complain about the food you cooked.

No, you wouldn't sit for any of that other stuff without comment, would you? So why does insisting someone who does not want to pray participate in prayer get a pass? This is not a legal/constitutional issue, as government is not involved.

If you think prayer is racism, you might have an issue with categorical thinking.

Both can be offensive to some people and not to others, correct?

But you keep straw-manning until you have a reasonable response.

DP. Calm down. Equating prayer with racism, in terms of their ability to offend snowflake you, is bonkers.

I did not equate them, I said some people are offended by either.

But no worries. Just pull that example and equate it with farting at the table.

“But it’s my legal right to fart! You can’t tell me not to fart or when or where I can fart!”

It would be just as impolite to fart at the dinner table as not allowing other guests a moment of prayer.

I know the social graces are lost on most of the posters to DCUM who are "In it to win it" and need to start shoveling the food into their mouths when the plates hit the table.

Your logic fails completely.

Do we indulge what the guests wish to do, or respect the wishes of our host?

Please answer.

Is your confidence in atheism so weak that a short prayer will shake your foundational beliefs?

A host will consider reasonable requests from guests. A short prayer is not an unreasonable request. They aren't asking to spout racist rants; they aren't asking to fart loudly at the table; other whatever other strawmen you posted above.

But what if the host finds prayer more offensive than farting?

You don’t care. You think your beliefs are paramount and screw everyone else’s, even in their home.

You are a bad and selfish person.

No wonder you have no friends.

No wonder you have to resort to ad hominem. Because you are a bad and selfish person, as evidenced by your post that you think you get to do what you want in someone else's home.

What you do is the same as farting at the table. Rude and unnecessary, and the only reasons you do it is because you want to be demonstrative about your beliefs and you think everyone who doesn't share them is wrong.

dp- you seriously have issues. It’s not an insult; you need therapy. I hope you get it soon. You don’t have to go through life this way. Take care and I hope something positive happens for you soon.

Ahh the poster who uses mental illness as an insult. Is there nothing you will not stoop too? No low too low? Is that the Christian way? Would Jesus approve of that?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Pick your battles. They’re your in laws. You don’t live with them and probably don’t see them every week. Just think about something else while your head is bowed in “prayer.”

This.

Really?? Just think about something else while your head is bowed in “prayer.”?

Replace the word "prayer" with anything else you might be offended by in your home.

Just think about something else while they Hail Satan.

Just think about something else while they say racist stuff.

Just think about something else while they fart loudly.

Just think about something else while they complain about the food you cooked.

No, you wouldn't sit for any of that other stuff without comment, would you? So why does insisting someone who does not want to pray participate in prayer get a pass? This is not a legal/constitutional issue, as government is not involved.

If you think prayer is racism, you might have an issue with categorical thinking.

Both can be offensive to some people and not to others, correct?

But you keep straw-manning until you have a reasonable response.

DP. Calm down. Equating prayer with racism, in terms of their ability to offend snowflake you, is bonkers.

I did not equate them, I said some people are offended by either.

But no worries. Just pull that example and equate it with farting at the table.

“But it’s my legal right to fart! You can’t tell me not to fart or when or where I can fart!”

It would be just as impolite to fart at the dinner table as not allowing other guests a moment of prayer.

I know the social graces are lost on most of the posters to DCUM who are "In it to win it" and need to start shoveling the food into their mouths when the plates hit the table.

Can we at least agree what we are talking about?

I agree that you generally go with whatever the host wants. And if that is grace before dinner, great.

Do you agree that if the family gathering happens at a home that does not say grace before dinner, guests cannot impose their desire for prayers on the host? Like if thanksgiving was at the son’s house, the son and his wife should decide if they will say a prayer and not the parents?

It would be rude for guests to begin prayer without requesting permission from the host. It would be rude for the host to deny them permission because the request is not unreasonable or even unexpected. You might remember that the majority of Americans have some religious beliefs.

It is here that we disagree. I think it would be rude for the guest to ask permission for a group prayer at someone else’s house. It puts the host in an awkward position and the host would be well within societal bounds to respond with “oh we don’t do that at our house but I love the tradition when we visit you!” I see nothing wrong at all with the guest saying a silent prayer before they start eating.

Are atheists scared of prayer, even when it’s their family members or friends praying? Why is it so important that friends and family don’t say grace in your presence? I am a Christian and often at family meals when someone is praying and we have bowed heads, I look around to watch my family in prayer and am thankful we are all healthy and together. I have seen non-praying family members sitting quietly and we share a smile. It’s totally a moment of gratitude, and expression of love for family and friends. I don’t know why atheists are against it. It doesn’t hurt them. No one makes anyone participate. It seems like an issue that drives a wedge between families unnecessarily. No one has ever yelled at me for looking around during prayer.

DP. I'm not scared of it, but I do think it's extremely rude for a guest to ask others to do it. If a guest asked, I'd probably quieting go along with it - obviously not bowing head or closing eyes - and rethink the guest list for next time.

So no guest has ever asked you if they can lead a prayer in your home? Why are you so outraged over something that has never happened?

Because the OP said that her DH’s family comes over and insists on prayers before meals. So I am trying to think about how I would feel about that - and the answer is annoyed because it’s rude to ask.

We have muslim friends who asked to pray in our house (they bring their carpet and I would walk them to the office or guest room for privacy), not a big deal. If my Christian friend asks to pray at the table, I will gladly accommodate them. If my Jewish friends ask for kosher meal, I will be happy to do so. That what family and friends for.

Do you have a kosher kitchen that you could cook a kosher meal in? With my friends who are strictly kosher we eat out in kosher restaurants. Because there's no way I, who am not Jewish and don't have a kosher-certified kitchen, can cook a kosher meal.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Pick your battles. They’re your in laws. You don’t live with them and probably don’t see them every week. Just think about something else while your head is bowed in “prayer.”

This.

Really?? Just think about something else while your head is bowed in “prayer.”?

Replace the word "prayer" with anything else you might be offended by in your home.

Just think about something else while they Hail Satan.

Just think about something else while they say racist stuff.

Just think about something else while they fart loudly.

Just think about something else while they complain about the food you cooked.

No, you wouldn't sit for any of that other stuff without comment, would you? So why does insisting someone who does not want to pray participate in prayer get a pass? This is not a legal/constitutional issue, as government is not involved.

If you think prayer is racism, you might have an issue with categorical thinking.

Both can be offensive to some people and not to others, correct?

But you keep straw-manning until you have a reasonable response.

DP. Calm down. Equating prayer with racism, in terms of their ability to offend snowflake you, is bonkers.

I did not equate them, I said some people are offended by either.

But no worries. Just pull that example and equate it with farting at the table.

“But it’s my legal right to fart! You can’t tell me not to fart or when or where I can fart!”

It would be just as impolite to fart at the dinner table as not allowing other guests a moment of prayer.

I know the social graces are lost on most of the posters to DCUM who are "In it to win it" and need to start shoveling the food into their mouths when the plates hit the table.

Your logic fails completely.

Do we indulge what the guests wish to do, or respect the wishes of our host?

Please answer.

Is your confidence in atheism so weak that a short prayer will shake your foundational beliefs?

A host will consider reasonable requests from guests. A short prayer is not an unreasonable request. They aren't asking to spout racist rants; they aren't asking to fart loudly at the table; other whatever other strawmen you posted above.

But what if the host finds prayer more offensive than farting?

You don’t care. You think your beliefs are paramount and screw everyone else’s, even in their home.

You are a bad and selfish person.

No wonder you have no friends.

No wonder you have to resort to ad hominem. Because you are a bad and selfish person, as evidenced by your post that you think you get to do what you want in someone else's home.

What you do is the same as farting at the table. Rude and unnecessary, and the only reasons you do it is because you want to be demonstrative about your beliefs and you think everyone who doesn't share them is wrong.

dp- you seriously have issues. It’s not an insult; you need therapy. I hope you get it soon. You don’t have to go through life this way. Take care and I hope something positive happens for you soon.

Ahh the poster who uses mental illness as an insult. Is there nothing you will not stoop too? No low too low? Is that the Christian way? Would Jesus approve of that?

Talking about issues or problems with a professional therapist doesn’t mean anyone is mentally ill.