It is so much easier to be a good parent when not working

[Anonymous]

I'm lucky in that have a WFH tech job that pays well and is flexible and based not on face time or hours logged but just "getting the job done." I'm very efficient at my niche area and I'm extremely productive for the hours I work because I've been doing it longer than most--started when the field was emerging.

[Anonymous]

PP here. I can also do my job while not paying full attention at this point.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I'm lucky in that have a WFH tech job that pays well and is flexible and based not on face time or hours logged but just "getting the job done." I'm very efficient at my niche area and I'm extremely productive for the hours I work because I've been doing it longer than most--started when the field was emerging.

I'm not in tech, but everything else about this is precisely true for my full time job too. (And I realize I'm lucky.) Truly no one cares where my butt is when, as long as I deliver high quality work in a timely manner, which, at this point in my career, I can easily accomplish while my ES kids are in school. In the morning I sit with them and eat breakfast and drive them to school. In the afternoon I pick them up, take them to activities, volunteer with some of those activities, help them with homework, make dinner, etc. I also have total flexibility to attend school events, volunteer in their classroom, chaperone field trips, etc.

I do not log back on at night, although, alas, my husband typically does.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:This is 100% true even if stay at home moms love to pretend it’s not. Because their life is just sooooooo hard.

Eh. I agree with OP--it is easier to be a better parent when not trying to balance a paid job. But, being a SAHM is, for many women, soooo hard. I mean, if you have 1 kid and a full time nanny and tons of money, I imagine that is a cushy life. But that isn't the typical SAHM. My friends who have done it have 2-5 kids, varying amounts of money, and someone always needs something. I only have one SAHM friend whose husband truly takes on an equal share of work between 5:30 pm or so and 8 am or so. For the most part, SAHMs seem to do ALL or almost all of the kid and household stuff. I would go out of my mind in that situation. Yes, I get that there are some women who do all of almost all of the household and kid stuff except for outsourcing childcare while they also work a full-time job, and that would also be a nightmare to me. But I know more working moms with spouses that do their share of the work than SAHMs with spouses doing their share (I don't mean 50%--but 50% of what needs to be done when the working spouse is not working).

Once the kids are school aged, it’s silly for the DH of a SAHM to do 50% after work hours. I have down time during the day when the kids are at school/camp, he doesn’t. Of course he should have down time in the evenings! He was completely hands on in the under-5 years and still is very involved, helps cook, drives to activities, even coaches. But now that the kids don’t need supervision for showers or evening play time, he’s fine to sit and read while I clean the kitchen or switch the laundry. I get my rest during his workday! I can’t imagine nickel-and-diming him when we have such a nice life thanks to him.

Idk… there is just something so pathetic about this dynamic to me. I don’t want my kids thinking “Dad goes into the world and makes money and has exciting experiences. Mom mops the kitchen and folds laundry.” It’s better to model a healthy, balanced relationship with spouses on equal footing.

Do you know any real people? Most people who work wouldn’t call it exciting experiences, it is a paycheck. Very few people make or female really love their jobs. Also if you think SAHMS just mop and fold laundry then you must not know any. There are many valuable and rewarding ways in which one can use their time.

Like Pilates and lunch duty?

If not, can you explain what is valuable and rewarding?

Oh come on now. NP but why are you being so dense? I’m a SAHM. I was previously an attorney. I majored in STEM. I love immersing my children in science and math experiments, going to the museums with them and spending time at the library. I find it super rewarding to watch them learn and explore the world around them, and I add value by exposing them to new things and educating them.

When I was working, I never set foot in their school. Now I actually do sometimes volunteer for lunch duty and actually, it’s been really helpful to get to know their classmates, teachers and see the dynamics at school. I also love being able to pick them up after school and hear about their day - I find it’s the time that they are most open and honest about what went on during the school day.

I also loved practicing law - I practiced in Big Law for 15 years. One is not Bette than the other, both can be rewarding and valuable.

So. I work and still do all the things you do.

I still would not describe it as valuable and rewarding.

I like science so we do experiments big deal, they won’t even remember it pre 10 years old it’s just a vague memory.

Lunch duty is in my valuable to the teacher who got a break from it.

It’s not earth shattering, it’s just life.

It doesn’t have to be all or nothing, you could practice law and not be big law and do all those things.

I'm the attorney-turned-SAHM PP. I think there's a disconnect here. I was responding to a poster who implied that all SAHMs do is "Pilates and lunch duty" and that staying at home was not "rewarding or valuable." I wasn't trying to compare working moms to SAHMs.

But since you want to compare, no, you do not work full time and do "all the things" a SAHM does. Unless you don't sleep?

For starters, I volunteer on occasion at school during the workday and I pick up my kid each day, and chat with their teacher. I also go on field trips with the kids and do one off events at the school. Adding in driving time, this probably eats up an average of 8 to 10 hours each week during "working hours." You claim that you do these things, but also work full time. Assuming full time = 40 hours a week, when do you make up the 8-10 hours referenced above? At night? I used to do that too. Many many nights I was logging in after my kids' bedtime, sometimes working until 10, 11 PM. I found it very tiring.

Next, during the 3-5 PM spot, I help my kids with homework, reading, go shopping for anything they need, do their extracurriculars, hit up playgrounds, museums and even do those darn science experiments you mention. We also just talk about their day and enjoy the afternoon. If you work full time, you don't get 3-5 PM with your kid. Yet you claim to do everything I do. So are you telling me that between, say 5 and 8 PM, you do everything above, plus make and eat dinner, do laundry, clean the house and get kids ready for bed? I've love to see how you squeeze all that in between 5 and 8!

At 8 PM, my kids are down and my husband and I have some nice time to reconnect and hang out. Let me guess, you work full time and also have that time built in with your spouse, and you also have the best spouse in the world, and your marriage is perfect?

Look, there's absolutely nothing wrong with being a SAHM, nor is there anything wrong with being a working mom. But you are doing yourself a disservice by believing that a working mom can - and should - do all the things a SAHM does. You're going to burn out. I look forward to understanding how you squeeze in 40 hours of work, plus all the child related things listed above, plus reconnecting with your husband each night, plus getting 8 hours of sleep, plus getting your physical exercise in, etc etc etc.

Pick up at my kids' school is a carpool line; how are you chatting with your kids' teachers?

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:This is 100% true even if stay at home moms love to pretend it’s not. Because their life is just sooooooo hard.

Eh. I agree with OP--it is easier to be a better parent when not trying to balance a paid job. But, being a SAHM is, for many women, soooo hard. I mean, if you have 1 kid and a full time nanny and tons of money, I imagine that is a cushy life. But that isn't the typical SAHM. My friends who have done it have 2-5 kids, varying amounts of money, and someone always needs something. I only have one SAHM friend whose husband truly takes on an equal share of work between 5:30 pm or so and 8 am or so. For the most part, SAHMs seem to do ALL or almost all of the kid and household stuff. I would go out of my mind in that situation. Yes, I get that there are some women who do all of almost all of the household and kid stuff except for outsourcing childcare while they also work a full-time job, and that would also be a nightmare to me. But I know more working moms with spouses that do their share of the work than SAHMs with spouses doing their share (I don't mean 50%--but 50% of what needs to be done when the working spouse is not working).

Once the kids are school aged, it’s silly for the DH of a SAHM to do 50% after work hours. I have down time during the day when the kids are at school/camp, he doesn’t. Of course he should have down time in the evenings! He was completely hands on in the under-5 years and still is very involved, helps cook, drives to activities, even coaches. But now that the kids don’t need supervision for showers or evening play time, he’s fine to sit and read while I clean the kitchen or switch the laundry. I get my rest during his workday! I can’t imagine nickel-and-diming him when we have such a nice life thanks to him.

Idk… there is just something so pathetic about this dynamic to me. I don’t want my kids thinking “Dad goes into the world and makes money and has exciting experiences. Mom mops the kitchen and folds laundry.” It’s better to model a healthy, balanced relationship with spouses on equal footing.

Do you know any real people? Most people who work wouldn’t call it exciting experiences, it is a paycheck. Very few people make or female really love their jobs. Also if you think SAHMS just mop and fold laundry then you must not know any. There are many valuable and rewarding ways in which one can use their time.

Like Pilates and lunch duty?

If not, can you explain what is valuable and rewarding?

Oh come on now. NP but why are you being so dense? I’m a SAHM. I was previously an attorney. I majored in STEM. I love immersing my children in science and math experiments, going to the museums with them and spending time at the library. I find it super rewarding to watch them learn and explore the world around them, and I add value by exposing them to new things and educating them.

When I was working, I never set foot in their school. Now I actually do sometimes volunteer for lunch duty and actually, it’s been really helpful to get to know their classmates, teachers and see the dynamics at school. I also love being able to pick them up after school and hear about their day - I find it’s the time that they are most open and honest about what went on during the school day.

I also loved practicing law - I practiced in Big Law for 15 years. One is not Bette than the other, both can be rewarding and valuable.

So. I work and still do all the things you do.

I still would not describe it as valuable and rewarding.

I like science so we do experiments big deal, they won’t even remember it pre 10 years old it’s just a vague memory.

Lunch duty is in my valuable to the teacher who got a break from it.

It’s not earth shattering, it’s just life.

It doesn’t have to be all or nothing, you could practice law and not be big law and do all those things.

Really??

I work as well and I do find many of the specific things that PP listed as valuable and rewarding. I've enjoyed doing these things. Not just for my kids but really for me.

I said I enjoy them, it’s fun. But “valuable “ or “rewarding”…. Idk. Not so much.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Well yeah of course. Being a stay at home mom is a full-time job. But being a work out of the home means you have two full time jobs which is exhausting.

A SAHM is not full time for kids in school.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:This is 100% true even if stay at home moms love to pretend it’s not. Because their life is just sooooooo hard.

Eh. I agree with OP--it is easier to be a better parent when not trying to balance a paid job. But, being a SAHM is, for many women, soooo hard. I mean, if you have 1 kid and a full time nanny and tons of money, I imagine that is a cushy life. But that isn't the typical SAHM. My friends who have done it have 2-5 kids, varying amounts of money, and someone always needs something. I only have one SAHM friend whose husband truly takes on an equal share of work between 5:30 pm or so and 8 am or so. For the most part, SAHMs seem to do ALL or almost all of the kid and household stuff. I would go out of my mind in that situation. Yes, I get that there are some women who do all of almost all of the household and kid stuff except for outsourcing childcare while they also work a full-time job, and that would also be a nightmare to me. But I know more working moms with spouses that do their share of the work than SAHMs with spouses doing their share (I don't mean 50%--but 50% of what needs to be done when the working spouse is not working).

Once the kids are school aged, it’s silly for the DH of a SAHM to do 50% after work hours. I have down time during the day when the kids are at school/camp, he doesn’t. Of course he should have down time in the evenings! He was completely hands on in the under-5 years and still is very involved, helps cook, drives to activities, even coaches. But now that the kids don’t need supervision for showers or evening play time, he’s fine to sit and read while I clean the kitchen or switch the laundry. I get my rest during his workday! I can’t imagine nickel-and-diming him when we have such a nice life thanks to him.

Idk… there is just something so pathetic about this dynamic to me. I don’t want my kids thinking “Dad goes into the world and makes money and has exciting experiences. Mom mops the kitchen and folds laundry.” It’s better to model a healthy, balanced relationship with spouses on equal footing.

Do you know any real people? Most people who work wouldn’t call it exciting experiences, it is a paycheck. Very few people make or female really love their jobs. Also if you think SAHMS just mop and fold laundry then you must not know any. There are many valuable and rewarding ways in which one can use their time.

Like Pilates and lunch duty?

If not, can you explain what is valuable and rewarding?

Oh come on now. NP but why are you being so dense? I’m a SAHM. I was previously an attorney. I majored in STEM. I love immersing my children in science and math experiments, going to the museums with them and spending time at the library. I find it super rewarding to watch them learn and explore the world around them, and I add value by exposing them to new things and educating them.

When I was working, I never set foot in their school. Now I actually do sometimes volunteer for lunch duty and actually, it’s been really helpful to get to know their classmates, teachers and see the dynamics at school. I also love being able to pick them up after school and hear about their day - I find it’s the time that they are most open and honest about what went on during the school day.

I also loved practicing law - I practiced in Big Law for 15 years. One is not Bette than the other, both can be rewarding and valuable.

So. I work and still do all the things you do.

I still would not describe it as valuable and rewarding.

I like science so we do experiments big deal, they won’t even remember it pre 10 years old it’s just a vague memory.

Lunch duty is in my valuable to the teacher who got a break from it.

It’s not earth shattering, it’s just life.

It doesn’t have to be all or nothing, you could practice law and not be big law and do all those things.

DP but your tone reads as though you don’t actually genuinely enjoy any if the things you do. Maybe you’re actually burnt out and that’s why you fail to see value in the non earth shattering, “just life” moments? Just a thought.

I enjoy it I just don’t think it some valuable rewarding event.

Maybe doing very little burns you out so seeing my schedule makes you read “burned out”. Some people need a nap after their 8am coffee, not me.

Maybe your life sucks so when I say it just life you have a negative connotation. I have a great life. I seriously am the one that doesn’t get “I need a vacation”.

If you need a vacation from your life you are doing life wrong.

I go in vacations for new experiences I don’t do it to escape.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is 100% true even if stay at home moms love to pretend it’s not. Because their life is just sooooooo hard.

Eh. I agree with OP--it is easier to be a better parent when not trying to balance a paid job. But, being a SAHM is, for many women, soooo hard. I mean, if you have 1 kid and a full time nanny and tons of money, I imagine that is a cushy life. But that isn't the typical SAHM. My friends who have done it have 2-5 kids, varying amounts of money, and someone always needs something. I only have one SAHM friend whose husband truly takes on an equal share of work between 5:30 pm or so and 8 am or so. For the most part, SAHMs seem to do ALL or almost all of the kid and household stuff. I would go out of my mind in that situation. Yes, I get that there are some women who do all of almost all of the household and kid stuff except for outsourcing childcare while they also work a full-time job, and that would also be a nightmare to me. But I know more working moms with spouses that do their share of the work than SAHMs with spouses doing their share (I don't mean 50%--but 50% of what needs to be done when the working spouse is not working).

Once the kids are school aged, it’s silly for the DH of a SAHM to do 50% after work hours. I have down time during the day when the kids are at school/camp, he doesn’t. Of course he should have down time in the evenings! He was completely hands on in the under-5 years and still is very involved, helps cook, drives to activities, even coaches. But now that the kids don’t need supervision for showers or evening play time, he’s fine to sit and read while I clean the kitchen or switch the laundry. I get my rest during his workday! I can’t imagine nickel-and-diming him when we have such a nice life thanks to him.

Idk… there is just something so pathetic about this dynamic to me. I don’t want my kids thinking “Dad goes into the world and makes money and has exciting experiences. Mom mops the kitchen and folds laundry.” It’s better to model a healthy, balanced relationship with spouses on equal footing.

Do you know any real people? Most people who work wouldn’t call it exciting experiences, it is a paycheck. Very few people make or female really love their jobs. Also if you think SAHMS just mop and fold laundry then you must not know any. There are many valuable and rewarding ways in which one can use their time.

Like Pilates and lunch duty?

If not, can you explain what is valuable and rewarding?

Oh come on now. NP but why are you being so dense? I’m a SAHM. I was previously an attorney. I majored in STEM. I love immersing my children in science and math experiments, going to the museums with them and spending time at the library. I find it super rewarding to watch them learn and explore the world around them, and I add value by exposing them to new things and educating them.

When I was working, I never set foot in their school. Now I actually do sometimes volunteer for lunch duty and actually, it’s been really helpful to get to know their classmates, teachers and see the dynamics at school. I also love being able to pick them up after school and hear about their day - I find it’s the time that they are most open and honest about what went on during the school day.

I also loved practicing law - I practiced in Big Law for 15 years. One is not Bette than the other, both can be rewarding and valuable.

So. I work and still do all the things you do.

I still would not describe it as valuable and rewarding.

I like science so we do experiments big deal, they won’t even remember it pre 10 years old it’s just a vague memory.

Lunch duty is in my valuable to the teacher who got a break from it.

It’s not earth shattering, it’s just life.

It doesn’t have to be all or nothing, you could practice law and not be big law and do all those things.

DP but your tone reads as though you don’t actually genuinely enjoy any if the things you do. Maybe you’re actually burnt out and that’s why you fail to see value in the non earth shattering, “just life” moments? Just a thought.

I enjoy it I just don’t think it some valuable rewarding event.

Maybe doing very little burns you out so seeing my schedule makes you read “burned out”. Some people need a nap after their 8am coffee, not me.

Maybe your life sucks so when I say it just life you have a negative connotation. I have a great life. I seriously am the one that doesn’t get “I need a vacation”.

If you need a vacation from your life you are doing life wrong.

I go in vacations for new experiences I don’t do it to escape.

Good for you Marie Antoinette

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is 100% true even if stay at home moms love to pretend it’s not. Because their life is just sooooooo hard.

Eh. I agree with OP--it is easier to be a better parent when not trying to balance a paid job. But, being a SAHM is, for many women, soooo hard. I mean, if you have 1 kid and a full time nanny and tons of money, I imagine that is a cushy life. But that isn't the typical SAHM. My friends who have done it have 2-5 kids, varying amounts of money, and someone always needs something. I only have one SAHM friend whose husband truly takes on an equal share of work between 5:30 pm or so and 8 am or so. For the most part, SAHMs seem to do ALL or almost all of the kid and household stuff. I would go out of my mind in that situation. Yes, I get that there are some women who do all of almost all of the household and kid stuff except for outsourcing childcare while they also work a full-time job, and that would also be a nightmare to me. But I know more working moms with spouses that do their share of the work than SAHMs with spouses doing their share (I don't mean 50%--but 50% of what needs to be done when the working spouse is not working).

Once the kids are school aged, it’s silly for the DH of a SAHM to do 50% after work hours. I have down time during the day when the kids are at school/camp, he doesn’t. Of course he should have down time in the evenings! He was completely hands on in the under-5 years and still is very involved, helps cook, drives to activities, even coaches. But now that the kids don’t need supervision for showers or evening play time, he’s fine to sit and read while I clean the kitchen or switch the laundry. I get my rest during his workday! I can’t imagine nickel-and-diming him when we have such a nice life thanks to him.

Idk… there is just something so pathetic about this dynamic to me. I don’t want my kids thinking “Dad goes into the world and makes money and has exciting experiences. Mom mops the kitchen and folds laundry.” It’s better to model a healthy, balanced relationship with spouses on equal footing.

Do you know any real people? Most people who work wouldn’t call it exciting experiences, it is a paycheck. Very few people make or female really love their jobs. Also if you think SAHMS just mop and fold laundry then you must not know any. There are many valuable and rewarding ways in which one can use their time.

Like Pilates and lunch duty?

If not, can you explain what is valuable and rewarding?

Oh come on now. NP but why are you being so dense? I’m a SAHM. I was previously an attorney. I majored in STEM. I love immersing my children in science and math experiments, going to the museums with them and spending time at the library. I find it super rewarding to watch them learn and explore the world around them, and I add value by exposing them to new things and educating them.

When I was working, I never set foot in their school. Now I actually do sometimes volunteer for lunch duty and actually, it’s been really helpful to get to know their classmates, teachers and see the dynamics at school. I also love being able to pick them up after school and hear about their day - I find it’s the time that they are most open and honest about what went on during the school day.

I also loved practicing law - I practiced in Big Law for 15 years. One is not Bette than the other, both can be rewarding and valuable.

So. I work and still do all the things you do.

I still would not describe it as valuable and rewarding.

I like science so we do experiments big deal, they won’t even remember it pre 10 years old it’s just a vague memory.

Lunch duty is in my valuable to the teacher who got a break from it.

It’s not earth shattering, it’s just life.

It doesn’t have to be all or nothing, you could practice law and not be big law and do all those things.

I'm the attorney-turned-SAHM PP. I think there's a disconnect here. I was responding to a poster who implied that all SAHMs do is "Pilates and lunch duty" and that staying at home was not "rewarding or valuable." I wasn't trying to compare working moms to SAHMs.

But since you want to compare, no, you do not work full time and do "all the things" a SAHM does. Unless you don't sleep?

For starters, I volunteer on occasion at school during the workday and I pick up my kid each day, and chat with their teacher. I also go on field trips with the kids and do one off events at the school. Adding in driving time, this probably eats up an average of 8 to 10 hours each week during "working hours." You claim that you do these things, but also work full time. Assuming full time = 40 hours a week, when do you make up the 8-10 hours referenced above? At night? I used to do that too. Many many nights I was logging in after my kids' bedtime, sometimes working until 10, 11 PM. I found it very tiring.

Next, during the 3-5 PM spot, I help my kids with homework, reading, go shopping for anything they need, do their extracurriculars, hit up playgrounds, museums and even do those darn science experiments you mention. We also just talk about their day and enjoy the afternoon. If you work full time, you don't get 3-5 PM with your kid. Yet you claim to do everything I do. So are you telling me that between, say 5 and 8 PM, you do everything above, plus make and eat dinner, do laundry, clean the house and get kids ready for bed? I've love to see how you squeeze all that in between 5 and 8!

At 8 PM, my kids are down and my husband and I have some nice time to reconnect and hang out. Let me guess, you work full time and also have that time built in with your spouse, and you also have the best spouse in the world, and your marriage is perfect?

Look, there's absolutely nothing wrong with being a SAHM, nor is there anything wrong with being a working mom. But you are doing yourself a disservice by believing that a working mom can - and should - do all the things a SAHM does. You're going to burn out. I look forward to understanding how you squeeze in 40 hours of work, plus all the child related things listed above, plus reconnecting with your husband each night, plus getting 8 hours of sleep, plus getting your physical exercise in, etc etc etc.

I’m not the poster you quoted, but you seem very defensive and there’s no reason to be.

By the time many of us had our kids, we were able to expect flexibilities at work to allow much do what you describe. I can volunteer for any trip, read to class, etc. I do it when my daughter asks, which has so far been twice.

Since having my baby my team only does meetings between 10-4, and I arrive at work after dropping my daughter off at 8:30. The last hour of work are typically things that can be done while my husband does bathtime. His relationship with our kid also matters. After that, like you, we chill out. I exercise in the morning and take long walks with my kid after school.

The thing you do that I don’t do is laundry and cleaning the house, those are outsourced.

Agreed, as another WOHM. Except I do laundry (maybe I should outsource that too!)

The only way it's feasible is having a job that's flexible. But I do work 40+ hours a week. I don't generally work late, but often work at my child's activity after I get here there. I volunteer at certain activities at school, not all, but neither do most SAHMs I know either (particularly if they have younger kids that are still at home with them). I don't pick DD up from school, but she takes the bus as it's easier/quicker for all. I quit a job when I was pregnant because I knew I would have no flexibility and it would be miserable. Best thing I ever did was starting a new, more flexible job when my DD was an infant.

For sure it's crazy and working PT would be the best of both world's, it's just not really an option in my profession, so I make it work the best I can.

Outsource FOR SURE. Set it to be returned Friday. Leave bags folded until dad takes kids to swim Saturday morning. Put away while drinking coffee and listening to an audiobook. Total weekly laundry investment: 21 minutes.

Maybe a dumb question... what do you do about things that need to be hung up, not folded? Surely they don't send those back hung... or do they? That's where I get stuck... the putting away part.

Items that are pressed are returned on a hanger.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is 100% true even if stay at home moms love to pretend it’s not. Because their life is just sooooooo hard.

Eh. I agree with OP--it is easier to be a better parent when not trying to balance a paid job. But, being a SAHM is, for many women, soooo hard. I mean, if you have 1 kid and a full time nanny and tons of money, I imagine that is a cushy life. But that isn't the typical SAHM. My friends who have done it have 2-5 kids, varying amounts of money, and someone always needs something. I only have one SAHM friend whose husband truly takes on an equal share of work between 5:30 pm or so and 8 am or so. For the most part, SAHMs seem to do ALL or almost all of the kid and household stuff. I would go out of my mind in that situation. Yes, I get that there are some women who do all of almost all of the household and kid stuff except for outsourcing childcare while they also work a full-time job, and that would also be a nightmare to me. But I know more working moms with spouses that do their share of the work than SAHMs with spouses doing their share (I don't mean 50%--but 50% of what needs to be done when the working spouse is not working).

Once the kids are school aged, it’s silly for the DH of a SAHM to do 50% after work hours. I have down time during the day when the kids are at school/camp, he doesn’t. Of course he should have down time in the evenings! He was completely hands on in the under-5 years and still is very involved, helps cook, drives to activities, even coaches. But now that the kids don’t need supervision for showers or evening play time, he’s fine to sit and read while I clean the kitchen or switch the laundry. I get my rest during his workday! I can’t imagine nickel-and-diming him when we have such a nice life thanks to him.

Idk… there is just something so pathetic about this dynamic to me. I don’t want my kids thinking “Dad goes into the world and makes money and has exciting experiences. Mom mops the kitchen and folds laundry.” It’s better to model a healthy, balanced relationship with spouses on equal footing.

Do you know any real people? Most people who work wouldn’t call it exciting experiences, it is a paycheck. Very few people make or female really love their jobs. Also if you think SAHMS just mop and fold laundry then you must not know any. There are many valuable and rewarding ways in which one can use their time.

Like Pilates and lunch duty?

If not, can you explain what is valuable and rewarding?

Oh come on now. NP but why are you being so dense? I’m a SAHM. I was previously an attorney. I majored in STEM. I love immersing my children in science and math experiments, going to the museums with them and spending time at the library. I find it super rewarding to watch them learn and explore the world around them, and I add value by exposing them to new things and educating them.

When I was working, I never set foot in their school. Now I actually do sometimes volunteer for lunch duty and actually, it’s been really helpful to get to know their classmates, teachers and see the dynamics at school. I also love being able to pick them up after school and hear about their day - I find it’s the time that they are most open and honest about what went on during the school day.

I also loved practicing law - I practiced in Big Law for 15 years. One is not Bette than the other, both can be rewarding and valuable.

So. I work and still do all the things you do.

I still would not describe it as valuable and rewarding.

I like science so we do experiments big deal, they won’t even remember it pre 10 years old it’s just a vague memory.

Lunch duty is in my valuable to the teacher who got a break from it.

It’s not earth shattering, it’s just life.

It doesn’t have to be all or nothing, you could practice law and not be big law and do all those things.

DP but your tone reads as though you don’t actually genuinely enjoy any if the things you do. Maybe you’re actually burnt out and that’s why you fail to see value in the non earth shattering, “just life” moments? Just a thought.

I enjoy it I just don’t think it some valuable rewarding event.

Maybe doing very little burns you out so seeing my schedule makes you read “burned out”. Some people need a nap after their 8am coffee, not me.

Maybe your life sucks so when I say it just life you have a negative connotation. I have a great life. I seriously am the one that doesn’t get “I need a vacation”.

If you need a vacation from your life you are doing life wrong.

I go in vacations for new experiences I don’t do it to escape.

Good for you Marie Antoinette

Wow you’re really defensive about me enjoying my life.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Well yeah of course. Being a stay at home mom is a full-time job. But being a work out of the home means you have two full time jobs which is exhausting.

Being a sahm to school aged is NOT a full time job. I think that’s been clearly established.
Which is ok.

It depends. You can be an intense cook, cleaner, gardener, handyperson, room parent, helping neighbor or family, etc.

Right? Often jobs are as intense as you make them. I certainly wasn’t working intensely for 8-9 hours straight at my paid employment with zero downtime/breaks/social interaction. I suspect a lot of other professional jobs are similar. The only full-time thing about it in many seasons was the fact that I had to be physically present full-time to take care of any tasks as they came up (and those tasks were often mundane and easy and quite frankly pointless). There were of course busy times where I worked my butt off, but that was not the norm.

I feel like maybe people don’t realize they hold SAHM as a “job” to a completely different standard than they might hold their own paid employment. Because I don’t think my experience was totally unusual.

You were lucky to have an easy job. But when so. Being away from your home for 8 hours plus commute and having to spend your remaining waking hours caring for a child/children is exhausting

That’s the thing - you can do just as much stuff as a sahm if you work and have school aged kids - esp if you have location flex (which frankly I would not take a job without). You’re just more burned out.
But the ‘sahm to school aged kids is a full time job’ people need to just - stop.

You’re missing the point. You can do just as much as SOME stay at home moms, but not the ones who actually treat it as a full time job. And the stuff you do undoubtedly won’t be to the same standard. And that’s fine, but why are you insisting that other women don’t get to call their job a job?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is 100% true even if stay at home moms love to pretend it’s not. Because their life is just sooooooo hard.

Eh. I agree with OP--it is easier to be a better parent when not trying to balance a paid job. But, being a SAHM is, for many women, soooo hard. I mean, if you have 1 kid and a full time nanny and tons of money, I imagine that is a cushy life. But that isn't the typical SAHM. My friends who have done it have 2-5 kids, varying amounts of money, and someone always needs something. I only have one SAHM friend whose husband truly takes on an equal share of work between 5:30 pm or so and 8 am or so. For the most part, SAHMs seem to do ALL or almost all of the kid and household stuff. I would go out of my mind in that situation. Yes, I get that there are some women who do all of almost all of the household and kid stuff except for outsourcing childcare while they also work a full-time job, and that would also be a nightmare to me. But I know more working moms with spouses that do their share of the work than SAHMs with spouses doing their share (I don't mean 50%--but 50% of what needs to be done when the working spouse is not working).

Once the kids are school aged, it’s silly for the DH of a SAHM to do 50% after work hours. I have down time during the day when the kids are at school/camp, he doesn’t. Of course he should have down time in the evenings! He was completely hands on in the under-5 years and still is very involved, helps cook, drives to activities, even coaches. But now that the kids don’t need supervision for showers or evening play time, he’s fine to sit and read while I clean the kitchen or switch the laundry. I get my rest during his workday! I can’t imagine nickel-and-diming him when we have such a nice life thanks to him.

Idk… there is just something so pathetic about this dynamic to me. I don’t want my kids thinking “Dad goes into the world and makes money and has exciting experiences. Mom mops the kitchen and folds laundry.” It’s better to model a healthy, balanced relationship with spouses on equal footing.

Do you know any real people? Most people who work wouldn’t call it exciting experiences, it is a paycheck. Very few people make or female really love their jobs. Also if you think SAHMS just mop and fold laundry then you must not know any. There are many valuable and rewarding ways in which one can use their time.

Like Pilates and lunch duty?

If not, can you explain what is valuable and rewarding?

Oh come on now. NP but why are you being so dense? I’m a SAHM. I was previously an attorney. I majored in STEM. I love immersing my children in science and math experiments, going to the museums with them and spending time at the library. I find it super rewarding to watch them learn and explore the world around them, and I add value by exposing them to new things and educating them.

When I was working, I never set foot in their school. Now I actually do sometimes volunteer for lunch duty and actually, it’s been really helpful to get to know their classmates, teachers and see the dynamics at school. I also love being able to pick them up after school and hear about their day - I find it’s the time that they are most open and honest about what went on during the school day.

I also loved practicing law - I practiced in Big Law for 15 years. One is not Bette than the other, both can be rewarding and valuable.

So. I work and still do all the things you do.

I still would not describe it as valuable and rewarding.

I like science so we do experiments big deal, they won’t even remember it pre 10 years old it’s just a vague memory.

Lunch duty is in my valuable to the teacher who got a break from it.

It’s not earth shattering, it’s just life.

It doesn’t have to be all or nothing, you could practice law and not be big law and do all those things.

DP but your tone reads as though you don’t actually genuinely enjoy any if the things you do. Maybe you’re actually burnt out and that’s why you fail to see value in the non earth shattering, “just life” moments? Just a thought.

I enjoy it I just don’t think it some valuable rewarding event.

Maybe doing very little burns you out so seeing my schedule makes you read “burned out”. Some people need a nap after their 8am coffee, not me.

Maybe your life sucks so when I say it just life you have a negative connotation. I have a great life. I seriously am the one that doesn’t get “I need a vacation”.

If you need a vacation from your life you are doing life wrong.

I go in vacations for new experiences I don’t do it to escape.

Either English is not your first language (which could explain some of the aforementioned tone in your writing) or you are extremely bitter. Some people enjoy being bitter and negative and hypercritical, though, so I believe you that you enjoy your life in some way.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Well yeah of course. Being a stay at home mom is a full-time job. But being a work out of the home means you have two full time jobs which is exhausting.

Being a sahm to school aged is NOT a full time job. I think that’s been clearly established.
Which is ok.

It depends. You can be an intense cook, cleaner, gardener, handyperson, room parent, helping neighbor or family, etc.

Right? Often jobs are as intense as you make them. I certainly wasn’t working intensely for 8-9 hours straight at my paid employment with zero downtime/breaks/social interaction. I suspect a lot of other professional jobs are similar. The only full-time thing about it in many seasons was the fact that I had to be physically present full-time to take care of any tasks as they came up (and those tasks were often mundane and easy and quite frankly pointless). There were of course busy times where I worked my butt off, but that was not the norm.

I feel like maybe people don’t realize they hold SAHM as a “job” to a completely different standard than they might hold their own paid employment. Because I don’t think my experience was totally unusual.

You were lucky to have an easy job. But when so. Being away from your home for 8 hours plus commute and having to spend your remaining waking hours caring for a child/children is exhausting

That’s the thing - you can do just as much stuff as a sahm if you work and have school aged kids - esp if you have location flex (which frankly I would not take a job without). You’re just more burned out.
But the ‘sahm to school aged kids is a full time job’ people need to just - stop.

You’re missing the point. You can do just as much as SOME stay at home moms, but not the ones who actually treat it as a full time job. And the stuff you do undoubtedly won’t be to the same standard. And that’s fine, but why are you insisting that other women don’t get to call their job a job?

I am SAHM and cannot eyeroll this big enough.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is 100% true even if stay at home moms love to pretend it’s not. Because their life is just sooooooo hard.

Eh. I agree with OP--it is easier to be a better parent when not trying to balance a paid job. But, being a SAHM is, for many women, soooo hard. I mean, if you have 1 kid and a full time nanny and tons of money, I imagine that is a cushy life. But that isn't the typical SAHM. My friends who have done it have 2-5 kids, varying amounts of money, and someone always needs something. I only have one SAHM friend whose husband truly takes on an equal share of work between 5:30 pm or so and 8 am or so. For the most part, SAHMs seem to do ALL or almost all of the kid and household stuff. I would go out of my mind in that situation. Yes, I get that there are some women who do all of almost all of the household and kid stuff except for outsourcing childcare while they also work a full-time job, and that would also be a nightmare to me. But I know more working moms with spouses that do their share of the work than SAHMs with spouses doing their share (I don't mean 50%--but 50% of what needs to be done when the working spouse is not working).

Once the kids are school aged, it’s silly for the DH of a SAHM to do 50% after work hours. I have down time during the day when the kids are at school/camp, he doesn’t. Of course he should have down time in the evenings! He was completely hands on in the under-5 years and still is very involved, helps cook, drives to activities, even coaches. But now that the kids don’t need supervision for showers or evening play time, he’s fine to sit and read while I clean the kitchen or switch the laundry. I get my rest during his workday! I can’t imagine nickel-and-diming him when we have such a nice life thanks to him.

Idk… there is just something so pathetic about this dynamic to me. I don’t want my kids thinking “Dad goes into the world and makes money and has exciting experiences. Mom mops the kitchen and folds laundry.” It’s better to model a healthy, balanced relationship with spouses on equal footing.

Do you know any real people? Most people who work wouldn’t call it exciting experiences, it is a paycheck. Very few people make or female really love their jobs. Also if you think SAHMS just mop and fold laundry then you must not know any. There are many valuable and rewarding ways in which one can use their time.

Like Pilates and lunch duty?

If not, can you explain what is valuable and rewarding?

Oh come on now. NP but why are you being so dense? I’m a SAHM. I was previously an attorney. I majored in STEM. I love immersing my children in science and math experiments, going to the museums with them and spending time at the library. I find it super rewarding to watch them learn and explore the world around them, and I add value by exposing them to new things and educating them.

When I was working, I never set foot in their school. Now I actually do sometimes volunteer for lunch duty and actually, it’s been really helpful to get to know their classmates, teachers and see the dynamics at school. I also love being able to pick them up after school and hear about their day - I find it’s the time that they are most open and honest about what went on during the school day.

I also loved practicing law - I practiced in Big Law for 15 years. One is not Bette than the other, both can be rewarding and valuable.

So. I work and still do all the things you do.

I still would not describe it as valuable and rewarding.

I like science so we do experiments big deal, they won’t even remember it pre 10 years old it’s just a vague memory.

Lunch duty is in my valuable to the teacher who got a break from it.

It’s not earth shattering, it’s just life.

It doesn’t have to be all or nothing, you could practice law and not be big law and do all those things.

I'm the attorney-turned-SAHM PP. I think there's a disconnect here. I was responding to a poster who implied that all SAHMs do is "Pilates and lunch duty" and that staying at home was not "rewarding or valuable." I wasn't trying to compare working moms to SAHMs.

But since you want to compare, no, you do not work full time and do "all the things" a SAHM does. Unless you don't sleep?

For starters, I volunteer on occasion at school during the workday and I pick up my kid each day, and chat with their teacher. I also go on field trips with the kids and do one off events at the school. Adding in driving time, this probably eats up an average of 8 to 10 hours each week during "working hours." You claim that you do these things, but also work full time. Assuming full time = 40 hours a week, when do you make up the 8-10 hours referenced above? At night? I used to do that too. Many many nights I was logging in after my kids' bedtime, sometimes working until 10, 11 PM. I found it very tiring.

Next, during the 3-5 PM spot, I help my kids with homework, reading, go shopping for anything they need, do their extracurriculars, hit up playgrounds, museums and even do those darn science experiments you mention. We also just talk about their day and enjoy the afternoon. If you work full time, you don't get 3-5 PM with your kid. Yet you claim to do everything I do. So are you telling me that between, say 5 and 8 PM, you do everything above, plus make and eat dinner, do laundry, clean the house and get kids ready for bed? I've love to see how you squeeze all that in between 5 and 8!

At 8 PM, my kids are down and my husband and I have some nice time to reconnect and hang out. Let me guess, you work full time and also have that time built in with your spouse, and you also have the best spouse in the world, and your marriage is perfect?

Look, there's absolutely nothing wrong with being a SAHM, nor is there anything wrong with being a working mom. But you are doing yourself a disservice by believing that a working mom can - and should - do all the things a SAHM does. You're going to burn out. I look forward to understanding how you squeeze in 40 hours of work, plus all the child related things listed above, plus reconnecting with your husband each night, plus getting 8 hours of sleep, plus getting your physical exercise in, etc etc etc.

I’m not the poster you quoted, but you seem very defensive and there’s no reason to be.

By the time many of us had our kids, we were able to expect flexibilities at work to allow much do what you describe. I can volunteer for any trip, read to class, etc. I do it when my daughter asks, which has so far been twice.

Since having my baby my team only does meetings between 10-4, and I arrive at work after dropping my daughter off at 8:30. The last hour of work are typically things that can be done while my husband does bathtime. His relationship with our kid also matters. After that, like you, we chill out. I exercise in the morning and take long walks with my kid after school.

The thing you do that I don’t do is laundry and cleaning the house, those are outsourced.

Agreed, as another WOHM. Except I do laundry (maybe I should outsource that too!)

The only way it's feasible is having a job that's flexible. But I do work 40+ hours a week. I don't generally work late, but often work at my child's activity after I get here there. I volunteer at certain activities at school, not all, but neither do most SAHMs I know either (particularly if they have younger kids that are still at home with them). I don't pick DD up from school, but she takes the bus as it's easier/quicker for all. I quit a job when I was pregnant because I knew I would have no flexibility and it would be miserable. Best thing I ever did was starting a new, more flexible job when my DD was an infant.

For sure it's crazy and working PT would be the best of both world's, it's just not really an option in my profession, so I make it work the best I can.

Outsource FOR SURE. Set it to be returned Friday. Leave bags folded until dad takes kids to swim Saturday morning. Put away while drinking coffee and listening to an audiobook. Total weekly laundry investment: 21 minutes.

At the risk of derailing this thread if you have a laundry service that you like please recommend them. We have tried two and they both were not good. I can’t stand fragrances on my clothes and one used scented detergent despite promising not to and the other returned the clothes smelling weirdly burnt. I had a great service where we lived before so I know this is possible!!!!

In MOCO specifically.

[Anonymous]

I took time off to just be a mother. It is great. I know my kid so well. My stressors are different but not having to think about work is a big piece of the relaxation pie.