What is the endgame for current attack on elite unis + international students?

[Anonymous]

I refuse to make any comments because it is not safe for me and my family members.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So is the idea that you have to be a United States citizen to go to a United States institution? Because if so, I’m not necessarily opposed to it.

Never in history have we hosted so many foreigners un US institutions. We need to look after our own FIRST. We've neglected our own. There needs to be a cap, like <10% or some number of foreigners to allow for majority Americans.

And ban foreign students from ever attending any top 30 universities.

They have been stealing IP and American students' seats for decades while we subsidize each of these institutions with tax money in the tune of billions each year.

Tax payers are losing seats and money and foreigners are mocking Americans.

Is this the same poster? Until this week I never heard people complain that we educate too many foreigners in the USA. WTF is going on?

I posted yesterday about the oxygen mask.
Didn’t post anything else.

If you have a US citizen kid at a T25 you know what’s going on. You see it on campus.
It’s different from when I went to school there - and it’s not fair to our kids.

Oh Christ. Come on. I have been visiting my kid at his Ivy the past few days. His club team has a two Germans, a Swede, a Brit and an Italian. The vast majority of his courses are filled with American kids, from all around the US. I don’t see a difference other than it’s not all old $ families anymore.

Not true at Cornell.
At all.

[Anonymous]

If the wealthy Chinese and wealthy Indians desperately want to come here, why don’t we have them attend T200+ schools?

It would help those schools too. Win-win!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So is the idea that you have to be a United States citizen to go to a United States institution? Because if so, I’m not necessarily opposed to it.

Never in history have we hosted so many foreigners un US institutions. We need to look after our own FIRST. We've neglected our own. There needs to be a cap, like <10% or some number of foreigners to allow for majority Americans.

And ban foreign students from ever attending any top 30 universities.

They have been stealing IP and American students' seats for decades while we subsidize each of these institutions with tax money in the tune of billions each year.

Tax payers are losing seats and money and foreigners are mocking Americans.

Is this the same poster? Until this week I never heard people complain that we educate too many foreigners in the USA. WTF is going on?

I posted yesterday about the oxygen mask.
Didn’t post anything else.

If you have a US citizen kid at a T25 you know what’s going on. You see it on campus.
It’s different from when I went to school there - and it’s not fair to our kids.

Oh Christ. Come on. I have been visiting my kid at his Ivy the past few days. His club team has a two Germans, a Swede, a Brit and an Italian. The vast majority of his courses are filled with American kids, from all around the US. I don’t see a difference other than it’s not all old $ families anymore.

+1 it was a high population year. People want something to blame for Johnny and Sally not getting into an Ivy. They are used to snowplowing to get them everything they want. My HS in Nova has never had more than 1-2 kids get into an Ivy since the 80s.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So is the idea that you have to be a United States citizen to go to a United States institution? Because if so, I’m not necessarily opposed to it.

Never in history have we hosted so many foreigners un US institutions. We need to look after our own FIRST. We've neglected our own. There needs to be a cap, like <10% or some number of foreigners to allow for majority Americans.

And ban foreign students from ever attending any top 30 universities.

They have been stealing IP and American students' seats for decades while we subsidize each of these institutions with tax money in the tune of billions each year.

Tax payers are losing seats and money and foreigners are mocking Americans.

Is this the same poster? Until this week I never heard people complain that we educate too many foreigners in the USA. WTF is going on?

I feel like this is a MAGA talking point conservative influencer type thread. Get the Americans riled up against the foreign students trying to get an education. Be careful or there will be no one left to speak for you when this admistration turns on you.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So is the idea that you have to be a United States citizen to go to a United States institution? Because if so, I’m not necessarily opposed to it.

Never in history have we hosted so many foreigners un US institutions. We need to look after our own FIRST. We've neglected our own. There needs to be a cap, like <10% or some number of foreigners to allow for majority Americans.

And ban foreign students from ever attending any top 30 universities.

They have been stealing IP and American students' seats for decades while we subsidize each of these institutions with tax money in the tune of billions each year.

Tax payers are losing seats and money and foreigners are mocking Americans.

Is this the same poster? Until this week I never heard people complain that we educate too many foreigners in the USA. WTF is going on?

I feel like this is a MAGA talking point conservative influencer type thread. Get the Americans riled up against the foreign students trying to get an education. Be careful or there will be no one left to speak for you when this admistration turns on you.

Its gained traction in the mainstream because it affects all of us with HS aged kids so deeply. Our kids DONT have the same opps we did. But kids from other countries are taking up to 25% of the spots at the colleges on our kids lists.
For a while we all shrugged. Until someone started asking why are we ok with this.
Now its a talking point at cocktail parties (with democrats) and PTA meetings.
Every HS parent is talking about this issue.
If you aren't, you are (1) not very social (2) have few friends or (3) so far left the only people you socialize with are wearing keffiyeh.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I am an American with two Ivy League degrees and the smartest classmates I had were largely the international students. The USA has been a beneficiary of the brain drain from countries where there has been less opportunity for talented students, but this won’t continue now that the USA has become a banana republic, chasing down students for breaking unwritten rules that MAGA morons have enacted according to their whims.

Likewise. What a privilege it was to have smart kids from all over the world as my classmates! (Not at an Ivy; the phenomenon is more general across US higher ed.) This is near the top of my list of the amazing benefits of American exceptionalism, and I hate to think we will soon lose it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Colleges want out of state kids hoping to lure in talent that will stay post graduation and improve their state. This is especially true of graduate school. I don’t see that happening with international students who take that education back home. If they want to pay on their dime that’s fine but taxpayer dollars flowing to private universities in particular should prioritize citizen students.

The vast majority of international students are full-pay.

Why not take more American full pay instead??

I think people like you need to understand two important things:

1) Most int'l students are full pay--and subsidize American students, especially at public institutions where they pay out-of-state rates. According to the Institute of International Education, nearly 67% of international students pay for tuition out of pocket from personal or family sources. At public universities, international students often pay higher tuition rates than in-state students, effectively subsidizing the cost of education for domestic students. My own DC's two closest friends at a state flagship university are full-pay foreign students paying around $70,000 for tuition and living expenses per year.

2) Most foreign students are not going to highly competitive colleges like Harvard (where, as many of you have implied, they are taking precious spots from American students--newsflash, your kid is STILL not going to get in to Harvard, even if no more foreign students are accepted). While Ivy League institutions do enroll international students, they constitute a relatively small percentage of the student body. A larger proportion of international students attend public universities and less selective private institutions. Many have come just for ESL programs, which is a moneymaker for colleges.

And what you need to understand is those students are not Americans. They can be full pay in their own country. We've hosted enough. They come here a protest the government - similar to me being invited to dinner at my neighbors and complaining about they way they run their home. The students are smart, they can be smart in their own country.

Much of the benefit of attending an institution like Harvard comes from the students who surround you, who come from all over the country, all over the world, and many different walks of life. Homogeneity doesn't make for a great university.

Many foreign grad students who get jobs at US universities invent things that make the US economy more competitive. That's one of the reasons we have a dynamic economy.

Nah, the rate of foreigner has dramatically increased in the last 50 years or so. Harvard was still just as good with fewer foreigners and more Americans. The world would be better of those people stayed in their own country got a great education and invented those things abroad boosting their economies. America would be better for it their countries would be better for it. Win-win.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I am an American with two Ivy League degrees and the smartest classmates I had were largely the international students. The USA has been a beneficiary of the brain drain from countries where there has been less opportunity for talented students, but this won’t continue now that the USA has become a banana republic, chasing down students for breaking unwritten rules that MAGA morons have enacted according to their whims.

Likewise. What a privilege it was to have smart kids from all over the world as my classmates! (Not at an Ivy; the phenomenon is more general across US higher ed.) This is near the top of my list of the amazing benefits of American exceptionalism, and I hate to think we will soon lose it.

+100

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Colleges want out of state kids hoping to lure in talent that will stay post graduation and improve their state. This is especially true of graduate school. I don’t see that happening with international students who take that education back home. If they want to pay on their dime that’s fine but taxpayer dollars flowing to private universities in particular should prioritize citizen students.

The vast majority of international students are full-pay.

Why not take more American full pay instead??

I think people like you need to understand two important things:

1) Most int'l students are full pay--and subsidize American students, especially at public institutions where they pay out-of-state rates. According to the Institute of International Education, nearly 67% of international students pay for tuition out of pocket from personal or family sources. At public universities, international students often pay higher tuition rates than in-state students, effectively subsidizing the cost of education for domestic students. My own DC's two closest friends at a state flagship university are full-pay foreign students paying around $70,000 for tuition and living expenses per year.

2) Most foreign students are not going to highly competitive colleges like Harvard (where, as many of you have implied, they are taking precious spots from American students--newsflash, your kid is STILL not going to get in to Harvard, even if no more foreign students are accepted). While Ivy League institutions do enroll international students, they constitute a relatively small percentage of the student body. A larger proportion of international students attend public universities and less selective private institutions. Many have come just for ESL programs, which is a moneymaker for colleges.

And what you need to understand is those students are not Americans. They can be full pay in their own country. We've hosted enough. They come here a protest the government - similar to me being invited to dinner at my neighbors and complaining about they way they run their home. The students are smart, they can be smart in their own country.

Much of the benefit of attending an institution like Harvard comes from the students who surround you, who come from all over the country, all over the world, and many different walks of life. Homogeneity doesn't make for a great university.

Many foreign grad students who get jobs at US universities invent things that make the US economy more competitive. That's one of the reasons we have a dynamic economy.

Nah, the rate of foreigner has dramatically increased in the last 50 years or so. Harvard was still just as good with fewer foreigners and more Americans. The world would be better of those people stayed in their own country got a great education and invented those things abroad boosting their economies. America would be better for it their countries would be better for it. Win-win.

Agree. It’s like with other things it just went too far.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think it’s hard for the ultra left-wing to hear this, but it’s one of the reasons why Democrats lost the last election.

Americans, people born in this country, feel like our institutions, including higher education, favor those born abroad over those born in our own country. It is a problem. Part of it does ring true. I say that as a lifelong Democrat. And it’s true for many institutions.

We don’t prioritize aid to the poorest parts of our country, but instead send it abroad. Look at what happened in the Carolinas after the hurricane? This isn’t rocket science and you can’t discount the anger that so many in the region felt. The USAID money that would go to a foreign hurricane ravaged area - like Haiti -should have been going to the Carolinas as well.

It works the same way with universities. We should be opening our doors to as many people from all parts of this country - in every university - at every level of selectivity. That should be our priority. Educating our people. Everything else should come second.

If we don’t realize that this is a real growing sentiment in the vast majority of American households, then you’ve lost the narrative. It’s not our responsibility to educate the world. They can still come here, and Silicon Valley will still entice them with jobs with legitimate H1-B visas. They’ll want those jobs since they’ll know that the only way their kids can go to college here is if they come and work in those tech jobs (and those kids are born here).

This isn’t xenophobic. It’s America first. And most voters, including liberal voters, actually agree. Feed ourselves first. It’s like the oxygen mask on a plane….

This! Exactly this! The rise of International Undergraduate students at top public universities is absolutely insane. Look at the University of California which was tuition free for the first 100 years. It has gradually become more and more expensive which makes it harder for middle class families to afford particularly after FAFSA no longer offers the sibling discount. Instead of appropriately funding the Univ of CA for California residents, the top UCs have been taking more and more international students because they pay more. CA taxes should go toward UCs so the CA residents don't lose the opportunity to attend to foreign students.

So let's say you have two parents who work as teachers, nurses, police you make about 200,000 a year in household income in CA, Your kid has to attend a public schools because you can't afford private school. Class sizes in many CA public high school have 40 students, kids have been taught poorly and not allowed to accelerate - thanks to programs from University College of Education professors like Lucy Calkins (anti-phonics idiot) and Jo Boaler - who advocates no math tracking, no math timed tests, and delaying algebra until high school. Now it is time to apply to the UC schools and you realize you have to pay $45K for EACH child you have in college - so that's 90K if you have twins or kids close in age because you get ZERO dollars in financial aid.

So you somehow figure out to pay and then your realize so many seniors are getting rejected or waitlisted from even the mid-tier UCs. Then you look at the stats and realize WTF?

1,031 international freshman students enrolled at the University of Davis. These students are primarily rich Chinese. California freshman enrollment was 5326. In the year 2000 there were only 36 international students enrolling as freshman. In 2010 there were only 50.

At UC San Diego in 2000 there were only 15 international undergrads, by 2010 that number was 127. It rose to 1206 by 2015 while CA residents were 3706!

There are another 1,000 freshman students at UC Irvine.

If you include all undergraduate and graduate students the number of international students at each campus: UC Berkeley 12,441, UC San Diego with 10,467 and UCLA with 10,446. That just isn't right.

+1
I'm also against much of what the Trump admin stand for but the failure to see this sentiment is why the left-ish side is losing. I also want my American kids to have a better chance to life the American dream - defined as a better life than their parents. Downward mobility for those born here is real. The American dream is for those coming to take the spots at top universities and get the better jobs.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Less educated population. Less critical thinking. Fewer places for people to pursue intellectual and liberal ideas. All leads to better control of the population and easier for authoritarians. Taking international students away takes their $$ away and makes universities more susceptible to having to comply with things for $

Elite universities have so diminished themselves, they are little more than ridiculous indoctrination centers for the left.

Start here:

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Claudine_Gay

Harvard claimed it elevated Ms. Gay solely on the basis of her achievement, and her race and gender were “merely incidental.”



Ms. Gay has only a paltry 11 published works throughout her career and most of those works were plagiarized. Worse still, most of the topics in “her” published works involved topics such as critical race theory, DEIA, systemic white racism, etc.

She is but one small but obvious example of a massive bias problem in our universities.

Right!!?? The number of Black Women leaders at ivies is insane! GTFOH. Just admit one is too many for you and the accomplishments will always be questioned and never good enough. But when we accuse you in person, it's time to clutch your pearls.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think it’s hard for the ultra left-wing to hear this, but it’s one of the reasons why Democrats lost the last election.

Americans, people born in this country, feel like our institutions, including higher education, favor those born abroad over those born in our own country. It is a problem. Part of it does ring true. I say that as a lifelong Democrat. And it’s true for many institutions.

We don’t prioritize aid to the poorest parts of our country, but instead send it abroad. Look at what happened in the Carolinas after the hurricane? This isn’t rocket science and you can’t discount the anger that so many in the region felt. The USAID money that would go to a foreign hurricane ravaged area - like Haiti -should have been going to the Carolinas as well.

It works the same way with universities. We should be opening our doors to as many people from all parts of this country - in every university - at every level of selectivity. That should be our priority. Educating our people. Everything else should come second.

If we don’t realize that this is a real growing sentiment in the vast majority of American households, then you’ve lost the narrative. It’s not our responsibility to educate the world. They can still come here, and Silicon Valley will still entice them with jobs with legitimate H1-B visas. They’ll want those jobs since they’ll know that the only way their kids can go to college here is if they come and work in those tech jobs (and those kids are born here).

This isn’t xenophobic. It’s America first. And most voters, including liberal voters, actually agree. Feed ourselves first. It’s like the oxygen mask on a plane….

This! Exactly this! The rise of International Undergraduate students at top public universities is absolutely insane. Look at the University of California which was tuition free for the first 100 years. It has gradually become more and more expensive which makes it harder for middle class families to afford particularly after FAFSA no longer offers the sibling discount. Instead of appropriately funding the Univ of CA for California residents, the top UCs have been taking more and more international students because they pay more. CA taxes should go toward UCs so the CA residents don't lose the opportunity to attend to foreign students.

So let's say you have two parents who work as teachers, nurses, police you make about 200,000 a year in household income in CA, Your kid has to attend a public schools because you can't afford private school. Class sizes in many CA public high school have 40 students, kids have been taught poorly and not allowed to accelerate - thanks to programs from University College of Education professors like Lucy Calkins (anti-phonics idiot) and Jo Boaler - who advocates no math tracking, no math timed tests, and delaying algebra until high school. Now it is time to apply to the UC schools and you realize you have to pay $45K for EACH child you have in college - so that's 90K if you have twins or kids close in age because you get ZERO dollars in financial aid.

So you somehow figure out to pay and then your realize so many seniors are getting rejected or waitlisted from even the mid-tier UCs. Then you look at the stats and realize WTF?

1,031 international freshman students enrolled at the University of Davis. These students are primarily rich Chinese. California freshman enrollment was 5326. In the year 2000 there were only 36 international students enrolling as freshman. In 2010 there were only 50.

At UC San Diego in 2000 there were only 15 international undergrads, by 2010 that number was 127. It rose to 1206 by 2015 while CA residents were 3706!

There are another 1,000 freshman students at UC Irvine.

If you include all undergraduate and graduate students the number of international students at each campus: UC Berkeley 12,441, UC San Diego with 10,467 and UCLA with 10,446. That just isn't right.

Then fund the colleges properly. Those are public universities.

Or, just do what made those universities so appealing to foreigners in the first place - take top American students at higher rates than foreigners.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So is the idea that you have to be a United States citizen to go to a United States institution? Because if so, I’m not necessarily opposed to it.

Never in history have we hosted so many foreigners un US institutions. We need to look after our own FIRST. We've neglected our own. There needs to be a cap, like <10% or some number of foreigners to allow for majority Americans.

And ban foreign students from ever attending any top 30 universities.

They have been stealing IP and American students' seats for decades while we subsidize each of these institutions with tax money in the tune of billions each year.

Tax payers are losing seats and money and foreigners are mocking Americans.

Is this the same poster? Until this week I never heard people complain that we educate too many foreigners in the USA. WTF is going on?

I feel like this is a MAGA talking point conservative influencer type thread. Get the Americans riled up against the foreign students trying to get an education. Be careful or there will be no one left to speak for you when this admistration turns on you.

Its gained traction in the mainstream because it affects all of us with HS aged kids so deeply. Our kids DONT have the same opps we did. But kids from other countries are taking up to 25% of the spots at the colleges on our kids lists.
For a while we all shrugged. Until someone started asking why are we ok with this.
Now its a talking point at cocktail parties (with democrats) and PTA meetings.
Every HS parent is talking about this issue.
If you aren't, you are (1) not very social (2) have few friends or (3) so far left the only people you socialize with are wearing keffiyeh.

Agree.
And I’m a Harris voter.
Feel like we need to get this sentiment to the DNC…
They need to shift the official talking points.

[Anonymous]

I mean, the point of most public services is to serve the actual public in question. Which in the case of American universities is presumably American students. It does become outrageous and concerning when universities start primarily catering to foreigners over the native populace, and college/university transforms from a genuine effort to educate the population and turns into a for-profit "get your citizenship here" feeder program