Parents in 70s plan trips without consulting adult children

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:They have no boundaries and no respect for your time and space.

In some cultures it's the norm. I came from such a culture and find it toxic. My parents also had no respect for personal boundaries, but even they would not do something like this. They recognized that as adults, we had our own lives and if they wanted to visit, they'd check with us about schedules and logistics.

You will get push back when you enforce your boundaries. But right now they keep doing it because you and your sister allow it.

This. This is totally our culture and it's very toxic. I've had years of therapy and you probably don't believe it, but I have tried to set boundaries like ask my dad "why don't you call sister before you make plans?". My sister was at a work trip all week and they came anyway! That is why we went to my sister's this weekend.

I can see why that feels like setting a boundary to you, but you didn’t set a boundary there. At all. A boundary is, “that week don’t suit, Dad. We won’t be able to see you then.” And then you don’t see them! A boundary is what you will or won’t do. It’s not gently suggesting that the other person do something different from what they are doing.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I’d enjoy every minute of time you get to spend with them.

You think you would, but would realize it’s really intrusive and disrespectful, as if you’re their property and they can do whatever you want.

OP, you need to set some boundaries. Find some language that isn’t hurtful but clearly sets the boundaries you would like them to respect.

I've tried to set boundaries. Do you have suggested language like someone else suggested like "that doesn't work for our schedule"? I've said "we aren't available" or "we are not going to be home". They have come anyway, descended upon the house or kids' games, etc. or rescheduled their flights for a weekend that "works". If we say we have other plans, like we are going skiing or we are attending a friend's wedding, they will make comments about how family is more important and how do we have time for X friend but not our own mother or father?

“It seems like you’re upset, Mom. I will call back later when you’re calmer.”

That last line is just then throwing a tantrum - don’t give in!

You say, over and over, "That doesn't work for us". You say it again when they resist. You say it over and over and over. Boredom is your secret weapon here.

If they show up uninvited, put them on an information diet. They don't need to know your kids' game schedule or whatever.

When they start getting nasty, say "I'm going to hang up now". Don't reward their behavior with attention-- and negative attention is attention. If they accuse you of not having time for them, say "I'm sorry you feel that way" and don't argue back or defend yourself. Accept that they're going to have a tantrum and that it'll take about a year of this for them to get the message. If you EVEN ONE TIME give in, you're just training them that wearing you down will eventually succeed.

Leave the house when you can, and before you do, disable the water to the whole house.

[Anonymous]

OP, your parents are super rude and boundaries are totally appropriate. However, there is nothing you can say to people who are behaving this selfishly that will make them accept your boundaries without complaint. So you need to get comfortable with the idea that they will act angry and hurt by your boundary setting.

Personally, I would look at my schedule and find the next dates that are convenient for a visit. I would send them to my parents and say "As I've mentioned several times it's really difficult when you show up without consulting us first. The next dates that are good for you to visit are X. I respectfully request you do not come another time before then. If you do, I will be busy with other activities and not able to drive you around and cook every meal for you."

If you are lucky, you might get a temper tantrum ibn return that results in them not visiting for a while. I personally would enjoy the break.

If this is too much for you, you just have to accept the situation you are in. They won't be able to travel independently forever.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:They have no boundaries and no respect for your time and space.

In some cultures it's the norm. I came from such a culture and find it toxic. My parents also had no respect for personal boundaries, but even they would not do something like this. They recognized that as adults, we had our own lives and if they wanted to visit, they'd check with us about schedules and logistics.

You will get push back when you enforce your boundaries. But right now they keep doing it because you and your sister allow it.

This. This is totally our culture and it's very toxic. I've had years of therapy and you probably don't believe it, but I have tried to set boundaries like ask my dad "why don't you call sister before you make plans?". My sister was at a work trip all week and they came anyway! That is why we went to my sister's this weekend.

I can see why that feels like setting a boundary to you, but you didn’t set a boundary there. At all. A boundary is, “that week don’t suit, Dad. We won’t be able to see you then.” And then you don’t see them! A boundary is what you will or won’t do. It’s not gently suggesting that the other person do something different from what they are doing.

This! You have to follow through, op, and ignore their complaints. If someone is going to be unhappy about the situation, why does it have to be you? Let them be upset - it's good for them! It's teaching them to listen to what you say.

Try this book. I think you need it. https://a.co/d/gotsCNa

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP, your parents are super rude and boundaries are totally appropriate. However, there is nothing you can say to people who are behaving this selfishly that will make them accept your boundaries without complaint. So you need to get comfortable with the idea that they will act angry and hurt by your boundary setting.

Personally, I would look at my schedule and find the next dates that are convenient for a visit. I would send them to my parents and say "As I've mentioned several times it's really difficult when you show up without consulting us first. The next dates that are good for you to visit are X. I respectfully request you do not come another time before then. If you do, I will be busy with other activities and not able to drive you around and cook every meal for you."

If you are lucky, you might get a temper tantrum ibn return that results in them not visiting for a while. I personally would enjoy the break.

If this is too much for you, you just have to accept the situation you are in. They won't be able to travel independently forever.

I would say "Not available to spend time with you at all". If you open the door even a crack, like that they can come as long as they cook for themselves, they'll steamroll right through it.

[Anonymous]

You will need to call their bluff, OP. Pack a "go bag" with a change of clothes and swimsuits for everyone, and keep it in the trunk of your car. The next time they spring something on you, say "Oh, we were just about to head off for a little getaway" and take your children to a motel with a pool. Literally walk right past your in-laws in the driveway, don't leave them a key, and be on your way. Stay gone at least one night.

They will be tremendously hurt and offended, but this is the only thing that works. They need to get burned and burned hard, so that the message gets through their narcissism and denial.

[Anonymous]

I take a middle of the road approach. Like others, I value the time with my mother. Having lost my father, my MIL and an older BIL within the space of 13 months (3 years ago), it's very hard to handle those losses and you often have regrets that you didn't see or spend as much time with them while they were alive. So I accommodate their visits whenever they come, including hosting them in my home.

That said, I don't change any other plans we've made. If they are going to come unannounced, then they'll have to fit into our household schedule. If they want to plan a visit ahead of time, then I'll block off time during their visit to spend more time with them. And I'll be honest. "I'm sorry Mom. If you had let me know ahead of time when you were coming, I could have planned more time to spend with you, but these other plans have been made and I am not going to be rude to these other people because you dropped in without any advance notice. We'll be back in a few hours and see you then." If we are going somewhere they can come, we'll invite them. If we can't, they'll have to entertain themselves until we get back.

If they drop in unannounced, they'll have times when they have to sit in an empty house. I will drive them around if I'm available, but if I have other plans, they'll have to handle it themselves.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I’d enjoy every minute of time you get to spend with them.

You think you would, but would realize it’s really intrusive and disrespectful, as if you’re their property and they can do whatever you want.

OP, you need to set some boundaries. Find some language that isn’t hurtful but clearly sets the boundaries you would like them to respect.

I've tried to set boundaries. Do you have suggested language like someone else suggested like "that doesn't work for our schedule"? I've said "we aren't available" or "we are not going to be home". They have come anyway, descended upon the house or kids' games, etc. or rescheduled their flights for a weekend that "works". If we say we have other plans, like we are going skiing or we are attending a friend's wedding, they will make comments about how family is more important and how do we have time for X friend but not our own mother or father?

"We would love for you to visit, and here are some potential dates. Which one(s) work for you?"
If they suggest a date that isn't what you suggested, repeat the above until there is a mutually agreeable date. You don't need to explicitly state No because thus invites argument and criticism.
Just repeat "we would love for you to visit and...."

I will say also that it's easier to work with parents who are overly engaged than disengaged, estranged. It is a small blessing!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don’t understand why you “had” to stay at your sisters. Why didn’t you drop them off, stay for dinner, and then leave, and then have your sister drop them off at your place the day before their flight? Or something like that.

Just go about your routines and do what you want. Be polite and friendly and welcoming but don’t wait on them hand and foot.

I didn't either. I said I was driving home and then my mom guilted DH and my kids (8, 6) to stay overnight again. We said okay, but that we wanted to leave by 8. At 8 am, we were all upstairs, eating breakfast with the car loaded. My parents were downstairs, fully dressed since 5 am and were asking to play games, go shopping, etc. My DH is super nice a bit of a pushover. My sister lives 45 miles away and will not drive to get parents like I would (or DH would). My parents can afford it, but balk at the price of an Uber "It's $90!". My sister hates driving in DC and rarely comes to our house on Sundays as she and her DH are really into football and spend the entire day watching games (we can do this at my house, packabut at a bar...we don't have the NFL package or cable).

Ok, you should not have given in. Say to her "That doesn't work for us" and then ignore everything she says, go about your business and pack up your stuff.

My mom used to be like that and I would say thing like "Mom. Accept the no." and "Boundary: Not staying over." I know it feels rude to be so blunt, but really they are the rude ones and people being blunt or ignoring them is natural consequences.

If your kids have questions, you can say to them "Grammy has trouble managing time" or "Grammy has trouble remembering our schedule" or "Grammy wanted us to stay longer, but I have a lot of chores to do at home".

[Anonymous]

That's such bizarre behavior, OP! Your parents are very rude. They might be on the verge of dementia, but to travel as they do, I cannot excuse their lack of boundaries and general selfishness.

You have to agree with your sibling that you will present a united front and say no when they book flights without telling you. And if they force your hand and show up at your door, make their stay as unpleasant as possible, so they get the message. No need to prepare their room, buy groceries they like, cook or clean for them. Go out every night, do not spent time with them.

The posters who say to enjoy every minute you have with them are way, way off. You cannot enjoy time with someone who wipes their dirty feet on you, no matter how much you might miss them after they're gone, when your mind remembers only their good side!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I’d enjoy every minute of time you get to spend with them.

+1. This.

It might be difficult to hear but it doesn't last forever. Sometimes I get frustrated with my parents - my dad in particular. I will vent to my DH - who lost his father at a very young age. His response is usually, "I know that it's frustrating but focus on the fact that you can still call him and hear his voice. I'd give anything to call my father"

So I'm with PP. It's frustrating. Breathe deeply and roll with it.

Just another point of view, you might not feel like this when they're dead and that's okay too. It might feel like a relief because they were in fact awful. Ask me how I know.

Set some boundaries OP.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don’t understand why you “had” to stay at your sisters. Why didn’t you drop them off, stay for dinner, and then leave, and then have your sister drop them off at your place the day before their flight? Or something like that.

Just go about your routines and do what you want. Be polite and friendly and welcoming but don’t wait on them hand and foot.

I didn't either. I said I was driving home and then my mom guilted DH and my kids (8, 6) to stay overnight again. We said okay, but that we wanted to leave by 8. At 8 am, we were all upstairs, eating breakfast with the car loaded. My parents were downstairs, fully dressed since 5 am and were asking to play games, go shopping, etc. My DH is super nice a bit of a pushover. My sister lives 45 miles away and will not drive to get parents like I would (or DH would). My parents can afford it, but balk at the price of an Uber "It's $90!". My sister hates driving in DC and rarely comes to our house on Sundays as she and her DH are really into football and spend the entire day watching games (we can do this at my house, packabut at a bar...we don't have the NFL package or cable).

Ok, you should not have given in. Say to her "That doesn't work for us" and then ignore everything she says, go about your business and pack up your stuff.

My mom used to be like that and I would say thing like "Mom. Accept the no." and "Boundary: Not staying over." I know it feels rude to be so blunt, but really they are the rude ones and people being blunt or ignoring them is natural consequences.

If your kids have questions, you can say to them "Grammy has trouble managing time" or "Grammy has trouble remembering our schedule" or "Grammy wanted us to stay longer, but I have a lot of chores to do at home".

Heed this poster. She has the perfect responses. Blunt is good, and indeed the only words they're likely to understand. Diplomatic language doesn't get you far with such people.

[Anonymous]

I would tell them, we love you and we love to visit, but we can’t accommodate you without advance notice. I can’t let you in if you show up unannounced again.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don’t understand why you “had” to stay at your sisters. Why didn’t you drop them off, stay for dinner, and then leave, and then have your sister drop them off at your place the day before their flight? Or something like that.

Just go about your routines and do what you want. Be polite and friendly and welcoming but don’t wait on them hand and foot.

I didn't either. I said I was driving home and then my mom guilted DH and my kids (8, 6) to stay overnight again. We said okay, but that we wanted to leave by 8. At 8 am, we were all upstairs, eating breakfast with the car loaded. My parents were downstairs, fully dressed since 5 am and were asking to play games, go shopping, etc. My DH is super nice a bit of a pushover. My sister lives 45 miles away and will not drive to get parents like I would (or DH would). My parents can afford it, but balk at the price of an Uber "It's $90!". My sister hates driving in DC and rarely comes to our house on Sundays as she and her DH are really into football and spend the entire day watching games (we can do this at my house, packabut at a bar...we don't have the NFL package or cable).

Ok, you should not have given in. Say to her "That doesn't work for us" and then ignore everything she says, go about your business and pack up your stuff.

My mom used to be like that and I would say thing like "Mom. Accept the no." and "Boundary: Not staying over." I know it feels rude to be so blunt, but really they are the rude ones and people being blunt or ignoring them is natural consequences.

If your kids have questions, you can say to them "Grammy has trouble managing time" or "Grammy has trouble remembering our schedule" or "Grammy wanted us to stay longer, but I have a lot of chores to do at home".

You don't give in to the guilt. Give them an hour's notice, at 6:30 say "We need to leave by 7:30." Then ignore the guilting. At 7:30, "Well, it's been fun, but we're leaving. If you want to come with us, we need to leave. If not, we'll see you tomorrow." Then LEAVE. They can also choose to pay for an Uber for the 45 min drive to get back to your place anytime they want.

The problem here is that you give in to the guilting and to the manipulation. You need to draw boundaries and you need to stick to them. Just know that your parents will fight you every step of the way on your drawing boundaries that do not cater to them. And you have to be firm. You are leaving and going home. They can stay or come with you. If you aren't available to give them a ride when they want, they'll have to Uber. Stop caving to them and fulfill your other obligations without guilt.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don’t understand why you “had” to stay at your sisters. Why didn’t you drop them off, stay for dinner, and then leave, and then have your sister drop them off at your place the day before their flight? Or something like that.

Just go about your routines and do what you want. Be polite and friendly and welcoming but don’t wait on them hand and foot.

I didn't either. I said I was driving home and then my mom guilted DH and my kids (8, 6) to stay overnight again. We said okay, but that we wanted to leave by 8. At 8 am, we were all upstairs, eating breakfast with the car loaded. My parents were downstairs, fully dressed since 5 am and were asking to play games, go shopping, etc. My DH is super nice a bit of a pushover. My sister lives 45 miles away and will not drive to get parents like I would (or DH would). My parents can afford it, but balk at the price of an Uber "It's $90!". My sister hates driving in DC and rarely comes to our house on Sundays as she and her DH are really into football and spend the entire day watching games (we can do this at my house, packabut at a bar...we don't have the NFL package or cable).

Why can't you meet half way to exchange parents? Stop offering to drive the full distance.