Elderly woman died after carjacking near WHC in NW this afternoon, SUV crashed

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The arrested driver is a 22 year old who was at the hospital and “walked away from her family.” Sounds like she may have been the patient, maybe in crisis (mental, drugs?). The “elderly” woman was only 55 years old!
https://www.popville.com/2024/06/female-arrested-in-a-northwest-carjacking/#more-299868

I love the constant speculation that only and always tried to find a way to absolve this person of responsibility. Why not just wait for and rely on the facts?

Why are you so invested in a narrative that says this woman is an unrepentant monster? What do you gain from closing your mind off to the (pretty reasonable) possibility that she was not in her right mind?

.

NP. I don't care. She killed someone, and Kayla Kenisha Brown needs to be taken out of society forever, be it in a classic prison or -- if "not in her right mind" -- then she needs to be locked up forever in one of the few remaining high security psychiatric facilities. ala John Hinckley.

Can't wait to see the toxicology report

Disagree, condolences to the family. But clearly the young 22 year old woman needs substance help, recovery and we need to know what the drug is. It's also possible she has mental health issues. No one should be caged for life, I prefer the European model.

This. She needs help, not a cage.

She needs a lifelong cage and complete removal from society. I cannot imagine someone dismissing the death of my loved one at the hands of a malicious criminal just because they were a drug addict. Imagine your family member is killed by a callous criminal, and that criminal is then not punished to the maximum extend of the law.
Mental health issues and substance abuse do not absolve you from a life of crime. There are millions of people who are subject to poverty, terrible childhoods, war, and violence who do not grow up to be criminals. I do not feel sorry for the killer in the slightest. I want her gone from society so she cannot take another life.

+1 we shouldn't have different standards for DUIs resulting in death vs. other types of intoxication, frankly. It seems we do.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Brown’s attorney is saying that the older woman was already deceased when Brown entered the car. If that’s accurate, she’s at most guilty of auto theft.

Is Ms. Brown a doctor now?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We need beefed up involuntary commitment in DC it's a travesty they tore down the old DC general site instead of turning it into a state of the art treatment center with ample beds.. There are so many people having mental breaks roaming the streets - and apparently the hospitals too. PIW, the only secure treatment facility, cannot handle them all. But they don't need to - because DC is loathe to commit and treat in the first place. This girl should have been brought to PIW and put in a secure space for evaluation. What a horrible horrible story of two different mothers and daughters. I have no words.

I love when clueless people post drivel like this. Where is the money and staff for these facilities going to come from? Do you realize it is a constant struggle to staff the facilities we already have? Who wants to be paid $40k/yr to sit one on one with a potentially violent criminal? Every day? Then get bit/spit on/assaulted? Not many, I can tell you that. The staff turnover in these facilities is ridiculous. I know. I work at one.

It’s really not about not wanting to commit them. We just don’t have the resources to do it.

You apparently don't know the entire history of hospitalization/commitment in the US PP. Of course you can commit people, if you change the law.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Brown’s attorney is saying that the older woman was already deceased when Brown entered the car. If that’s accurate, she’s at most guilty of auto theft.

Brown's attorney has said all sorts of things that make my head hurt. I realize the attorney is just doing her job, advocating - but our justice system is just miserable. No wonder the DC magistrates, judges, and prosecutors are all checked out. Miserable.

Same. When I read her statements at the hearing yesterday, I wondered if maybe she had just graduated from law school last month. It reminded me of first year of law school and trying to crack one of those crazy hypotheticals professors would throw at us.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We need beefed up involuntary commitment in DC it's a travesty they tore down the old DC general site instead of turning it into a state of the art treatment center with ample beds.. There are so many people having mental breaks roaming the streets - and apparently the hospitals too. PIW, the only secure treatment facility, cannot handle them all. But they don't need to - because DC is loathe to commit and treat in the first place. This girl should have been brought to PIW and put in a secure space for evaluation. What a horrible horrible story of two different mothers and daughters. I have no words.

I love when clueless people post drivel like this. Where is the money and staff for these facilities going to come from? Do you realize it is a constant struggle to staff the facilities we already have? Who wants to be paid $40k/yr to sit one on one with a potentially violent criminal? Every day? Then get bit/spit on/assaulted? Not many, I can tell you that. The staff turnover in these facilities is ridiculous. I know. I work at one.

It’s really not about not wanting to commit them. We just don’t have the resources to do it.

You apparently don't know the entire history of hospitalization/commitment in the US PP. Of course you can commit people, if you change the law.

The law won’t change unless there is enough $$ to build/staff facilities. And there isn’t. That’s the point.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:This will get plead down thankfully. That young woman deserves a second chance.

I hope everyone understands that these people are messing with you. They are parodying the light-on-crime current culture in DC. And I guess it’s working because you’re falling for it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Kayla Brown’s parents contacted 911 to seek help for their daughter who wasn’t acting normal after consuming drugs. Why did the authorities leave her unattended at the hospital? She should have been under constant supervision by hospital staff or security. I feel that this is the fault of our law enforcement and health care system. We need a better way to address mental illness and drug abuse. The law enforcement and hospital need to take some blame for this event.

Do you realize how much staffing is necessary to stay with every patient like the carjacker? Good luck with that.

I had a family member taken into a an ER on psych watch —- two different hospitals and they both had someone stationed at her door to watch. That’s standard protocol for psych admits. Possible she overpowered that person — they aren’t cops, just staffers. But they do typically assign one on one observation for psych cases. And my family member was just a little depressed—not “acting crazy” like this.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Kayla Brown’s parents contacted 911 to seek help for their daughter who wasn’t acting normal after consuming drugs. Why did the authorities leave her unattended at the hospital? She should have been under constant supervision by hospital staff or security. I feel that this is the fault of our law enforcement and health care system. We need a better way to address mental illness and drug abuse. The law enforcement and hospital need to take some blame for this event.

Do you realize how much staffing is necessary to stay with every patient like the carjacker? Good luck with that.

I had a family member taken into a an ER on psych watch —- two different hospitals and they both had someone stationed at her door to watch. That’s standard protocol for psych admits. Possible she overpowered that person — they aren’t cops, just staffers. But they do typically assign one on one observation for psych cases. And my family member was just a little depressed—not “acting crazy” like this.

Do we know if the carjacker was a psych admit?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Kayla Brown’s parents contacted 911 to seek help for their daughter who wasn’t acting normal after consuming drugs. Why did the authorities leave her unattended at the hospital? She should have been under constant supervision by hospital staff or security. I feel that this is the fault of our law enforcement and health care system. We need a better way to address mental illness and drug abuse. The law enforcement and hospital need to take some blame for this event.

Do you realize how much staffing is necessary to stay with every patient like the carjacker? Good luck with that.

I had a family member taken into a an ER on psych watch —- two different hospitals and they both had someone stationed at her door to watch. That’s standard protocol for psych admits. Possible she overpowered that person — they aren’t cops, just staffers. But they do typically assign one on one observation for psych cases. And my family member was just a little depressed—not “acting crazy” like this.

But per reports, the specific reason this person was brought to the ER was her vital signs, not their mental state. Yes, the parents called because they were concerned that the person was not acting right, but the decision to bring to the ER was specific to her heart rate and blood pressure. Simply "not acting right" wouldn't qualify for an FD-12/involuntary hold.

[Anonymous]

This strikes me as a little different than drunk driving. If she was given a drug and had an adverse reaction….that’s different than choosing to drink and drive. I had a family member have an adverse reaction to an meds for dental surgery — they suddenly were trying to jump out of a moving car and hit someone. The nicest person—it was just a weird drug reaction made them suddenly manically depressive and paranoid.
I hope they gave her an immediate tox screen so we can know if the “given a weird drug” story has any basis. She may have gotten weed that was heavily laced with fetanyl, unknown to her, and it induced psychosis.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:This strikes me as a little different than drunk driving. If she was given a drug and had an adverse reaction….that’s different than choosing to drink and drive. I had a family member have an adverse reaction to an meds for dental surgery — they suddenly were trying to jump out of a moving car and hit someone. The nicest person—it was just a weird drug reaction made them suddenly manically depressive and paranoid.
I hope they gave her an immediate tox screen so we can know if the “given a weird drug” story has any basis. She may have gotten weed that was heavily laced with fetanyl, unknown to her, and it induced psychosis.

The “I” in DUI stands for intoxicated. Doesn’t matter if it’s from drugs (including prescription drugs) or alcohol.

My understanding is that DUI does include an intent standard, but normally it’s about intent to drive a vehicle not intent to get intoxicated. I would presume that if you were unintentionally intoxicated, for example roofied, the law wouldn’t necessarily save you but prosecutorial discretion would, considering that your intoxicated state was the result of you being a victim of a separate crime.

Intentionally ingesting drugs then driving is DUI all day long. Even if you didn’t know what drugs you were ingesting.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Kayla Brown’s parents contacted 911 to seek help for their daughter who wasn’t acting normal after consuming drugs. Why did the authorities leave her unattended at the hospital? She should have been under constant supervision by hospital staff or security. I feel that this is the fault of our law enforcement and health care system. We need a better way to address mental illness and drug abuse. The law enforcement and hospital need to take some blame for this event.

Do you realize how much staffing is necessary to stay with every patient like the carjacker? Good luck with that.

I had a family member taken into a an ER on psych watch —- two different hospitals and they both had someone stationed at her door to watch. That’s standard protocol for psych admits. Possible she overpowered that person — they aren’t cops, just staffers. But they do typically assign one on one observation for psych cases. And my family member was just a little depressed—not “acting crazy” like this.

Do we know if the carjacker was a psych admit?

I don't even think she'd been admitted yet. From the sounds of the court documents that were released, she and the woman who died just had the misfortune of arriving at the ER at the same time. It does not sound like a mental health crisis, it sounds like she took bad drugs.

She should absolutely be in jail for carjacking - drugs are no excuse. Unfortunately I have no faith in the DC courts to bother if it was just carjacking. However, the court documents also make it sound like the woman who died was mid-heart attack or stroke en route to the ER entrance. So it will be very, very difficult to prove that Kayla killed her. I certainly don't think she died in the crash - if she died, why wasn't Kayla seriously injured?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This strikes me as a little different than drunk driving. If she was given a drug and had an adverse reaction….that’s different than choosing to drink and drive. I had a family member have an adverse reaction to an meds for dental surgery — they suddenly were trying to jump out of a moving car and hit someone. The nicest person—it was just a weird drug reaction made them suddenly manically depressive and paranoid.
I hope they gave her an immediate tox screen so we can know if the “given a weird drug” story has any basis. She may have gotten weed that was heavily laced with fetanyl, unknown to her, and it induced psychosis.

The “I” in DUI stands for intoxicated. Doesn’t matter if it’s from drugs (including prescription drugs) or alcohol.

My understanding is that DUI does include an intent standard, but normally it’s about intent to drive a vehicle not intent to get intoxicated. I would presume that if you were unintentionally intoxicated, for example roofied, the law wouldn’t necessarily save you but prosecutorial discretion would, considering that your intoxicated state was the result of you being a victim of a separate crime.

Intentionally ingesting drugs then driving is DUI all day long. Even if you didn’t know what drugs you were ingesting.

I thought DUI meant Driving Under the Influence

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Kayla Brown’s parents contacted 911 to seek help for their daughter who wasn’t acting normal after consuming drugs. Why did the authorities leave her unattended at the hospital? She should have been under constant supervision by hospital staff or security. I feel that this is the fault of our law enforcement and health care system. We need a better way to address mental illness and drug abuse. The law enforcement and hospital need to take some blame for this event.

Do you realize how much staffing is necessary to stay with every patient like the carjacker? Good luck with that.

I had a family member taken into a an ER on psych watch —- two different hospitals and they both had someone stationed at her door to watch. That’s standard protocol for psych admits. Possible she overpowered that person — they aren’t cops, just staffers. But they do typically assign one on one observation for psych cases. And my family member was just a little depressed—not “acting crazy” like this.

Do we know if the carjacker was a psych admit?

I don't even think she'd been admitted yet. From the sounds of the court documents that were released, she and the woman who died just had the misfortune of arriving at the ER at the same time. It does not sound like a mental health crisis, it sounds like she took bad drugs.

She should absolutely be in jail for carjacking - drugs are no excuse. Unfortunately I have no faith in the DC courts to bother if it was just carjacking. However, the court documents also make it sound like the woman who died was mid-heart attack or stroke en route to the ER entrance. So it will be very, very difficult to prove that Kayla killed her. I certainly don't think she died in the crash - if she died, why wasn't Kayla seriously injured?

The airbags deployed in the crash, indicating that it was at some speed. The high 22 year old walked away from the crash while the ill 55 year old died. That doesn't indicate that the crash was minor, it indicates that being young and high gives you better odds of surviving a crash.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Kayla Brown’s parents contacted 911 to seek help for their daughter who wasn’t acting normal after consuming drugs. Why did the authorities leave her unattended at the hospital? She should have been under constant supervision by hospital staff or security. I feel that this is the fault of our law enforcement and health care system. We need a better way to address mental illness and drug abuse. The law enforcement and hospital need to take some blame for this event.

Do you realize how much staffing is necessary to stay with every patient like the carjacker? Good luck with that.

I had a family member taken into a an ER on psych watch —- two different hospitals and they both had someone stationed at her door to watch. That’s standard protocol for psych admits. Possible she overpowered that person — they aren’t cops, just staffers. But they do typically assign one on one observation for psych cases. And my family member was just a little depressed—not “acting crazy” like this.

Do we know if the carjacker was a psych admit?

I don't even think she'd been admitted yet. From the sounds of the court documents that were released, she and the woman who died just had the misfortune of arriving at the ER at the same time. It does not sound like a mental health crisis, it sounds like she took bad drugs.

She should absolutely be in jail for carjacking - drugs are no excuse. Unfortunately I have no faith in the DC courts to bother if it was just carjacking. However, the court documents also make it sound like the woman who died was mid-heart attack or stroke en route to the ER entrance. So it will be very, very difficult to prove that Kayla killed her. I certainly don't think she died in the crash - if she died, why wasn't Kayla seriously injured?

The airbags deployed in the crash, indicating that it was at some speed. The high 22 year old walked away from the crash while the ill 55 year old died. That doesn't indicate that the crash was minor, it indicates that being young and high gives you better odds of surviving a crash.

Got it, thanks for clarifying