I hate “guy trips”

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:A woman would be excoriated if she came home from a girls’ trip too hungover and exhausted to deal with the kids. Tell him to suck it up. The trip is fine. But when it is over, it is over.

Yes, this is the issue, I think. It’s not the 3 days. It’s that he makes it 10 days of nonparticipation without acknowledging it or getting spouse on board.

+1

Correct. A lot of PPs above (men who want their own guys' trips, I suspect) are ignoring the fact that the real problem isn't the trip itself, it's that he comes home and is a hungover mopey baby for days afterward, recovering because he can't drink like an adult when he's away.

OP, I'd schedule utterly un-cancel-able things for which he has to be responsible so he has to suck it up and take a kid to, say, the dentist at 8 a.m. on that first morning back because YOU are busy. I'd have stuff of my own scheduled so he has to be the one getting the kids up and off to school. And I wouldn't be passive-aggressive about it -- I'd tell him point blank that family life goes on whether he's hung over and grumpy or not, and if he can't drink like a grown-up, that's his issue to figure out, not his issue to bring home with him.

I often wonder if people like you are actually married or, if so, happily. Who schedules an 8 am dentist appointment for the kid the day after their spouse returns from a weekend away just to stick it to them?

DP - I agree. On top of that, the lack of self awareness of the previous PP is pretty stunning. She proclaims that she "wouldn't be passive-aggressive" about it, but also says that she would "schedule utterly un-cancel-able things for which he has to be responsible so he has to suck it up and take a kid to, say, the dentist at 8 a.m. on that first morning back because YOU are busy. I'd have stuff of my own scheduled so he has to be the one getting the kids up and off to school."

That is the definition of passive-aggressive.

So true

Also, in what universe is a dentist appointment for an elementary schooler "un-cancel-able?"

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:Op - what frustrates me is that I am 100% the default parent. I typically do all the drop offs, pick ups, make food, do laundry etc.

But I expect him to help around the house with the kids. Instead he is sleeping until 7:30 (on a week day!) and now will rush to get ready to work and be all stressed because he has so much work to do.

I have been up since 6:30 getting myself ready, lunches, dealing with the dog, getting breakfast and all the kid stuff so they are on time for school.

If you're 100% the default parent, then are you doing anything extra on these mornings? If you are I think you should talk to him about that, but if your day looks no different I don't think it's reasonable to be upset about what he's doing/how stressed he is, because it's not actually affecting you materially.

My wife sleeping to 7:30 while I feed the cat, make lunches, and do school drop off is every morning of my life and it has never occurred to me to be angry at her for sleeping rather than getting up and going to work; I do the same amount of work regardless. I'm fine with the arrangement of responsibilities, which is what matters, not what she's doing with time that I'm doing kid stuff.

Do you know what “default parent” means?

DP it’s a phrase invented by disgruntled women who overestimate their role in their children’s life and are dismissive of the role their partners play, usually a circumstance that is self-inflicted by excessive hectoring, criticism, and micromanagement.

Tell me you’re a lazy parent without telling me you’re a lazy parent.

More original thinking from the “default parent” cliche user. Prattling on about laziness, ironically enough.

from the OP it seems the DH works 60-80 hours per week including nights and weekends. I would also assume his busy schedule does not allow for him to cover sick days or school closures but OP can correct me if wrong. There are 168 hours in a week. 80 means he is working 50% of the available hours of the week. 6 hours of sleep means 42 hours. An hour to get ready and commute in the morning plus min 30 commute home= 7.5 hours minimum, if he is not commuting into work on weekends. So just with working, sleeping minimum suggested amount, and commuting he takes 130 hours per week leaving 38 hours spread over 7 days is 5.5 hours to eat, workout, spend time with your family/spouse, run errands, cook dinners, etc.

On working hours alone, OP has 40 more hours per week to dedicate to her family and home. So yes she is the default parent, default cleaner, default sports driver, default grocery shopper, default sick day coverer.

as far as salary goes, OP DH better be making 2x the amount of money minimum.

Op - yes you pretty much have it spot on.

And yes he makes about 3.5-4 times what I make.

So the guy works 50-10% more than you and makes 350-400% more than you, and two weeks of inconvenience per year is causing you to build up resentment and might result in a serious talk about his behavior? How selfish. That sounds really spoiled.

As someone with a spouse who works a lot, I really hate this attitude. Just because my husband makes a ton of money doesn't mean he gets to have more rest than I do.

But OP's husband works a lot more than she does, and most likely at a more stressful job (stress tends to come with higher hours and pay, though not always).

If she's default parent for three young kids, he doesn't work more than she does. He works *for pay* more than she does. They should both have equivalent downtime, which she's not getting in the week after his guys' trip because he's working even more at his job, and even less around the house, after doing nothing for either while gone. So yes, she does get to complain. How much she should complain I think comes down to what kind of partner/father he is the other 50 weeks out of the year, but this persistent DCUM trope that if a guy earns enough money he is entitled to treat his family like servants is gross.

Sorry, if you think that working at a 40 hour/wk job and being default parent for three school aged kids is the same amount of work and stress as working 60-80 hours a week at a high-paying (and likely high stress) job, then you have no idea what it's like to actually work a job like that.

And again, it is two weeks out of a year.

I worked in BigLaw for 12 years. I know what 80 hours at the low end feels like, and I still recognize that a full-time job and essentially single-parenting 3 (!!) kids is work. Something tells me you have no idea what either side of the coin is actually like, you just like to devalue women's work.

I've been a very busy commercial litigator for 20 years, and I took 3 years in a govt job (that was still pretty busy) when my three kids were little. I notice that you don't even say that they are equal amounts of work--just that having a 40 hour a week job and parenting is work. No kidding it's work. I get that both are busy. But there is no comparison in stress and busy-ness. Being a busy lawyer who makes a lot of money (as I do) is way more stressful and time consuming. And people who haven't worked like that just don't understand it.

This mindset is ridiculous.

I am also a lawyer and there is nothing about the field in general for a "commercial litigator" even at a large firm that makes it inherently any more busy or stressful than anybody else's experience with career and parenthood.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:I think a lot of you guys are missing that he’s also getting behind at work from these trips. My husband works a ton and works most weekends. Even 4 days visiting family he has to work or he’s stressed out and annoying for a week or more after. If he was gone drinking for 4 days and came back complaining about all the work he was behind on I would find that very annoying. I 100 percent believe that he’s unhelpful and difficult to be around for quite a few days after.

I think he’s entitled to see his friends but he’s not entitled to minimize how it affects you. I don’t have concrete suggestions about what to do (although I personally would just rather have my house in a hotel for an extra day rather than listening to any complaining - I actually encourage my husband to do similar things when he’s traveling for work) but I understand, OP. I feel these situations really emphasize to me how tightly stretched we are all the time and I wish my husband would agree and be open to making changes. But when you handle all the fall out (which I would rather do than make my kids handle it because when my husband is stressed he yells more than I’m ok with) and they refuse to change it’s very hard.

I'm sorry, but if your husband is working a ton and working most weekends, then he better be making a ton of money. In that case, stay home, hire help, and then don't complain that he doesn't help out around the house. If you don't want him making so much money, then suggest he scale back so you can also work. Personally, I wouldn't be married to someone who worked a ton and worked most weekends, but you do you.

I’m the PP you are responding to. I can’t speak for OP but I don’t want to be married to someone who works these hours and especially someone who is this stressed all the time. I love my husband and hate seeing him stressed because I know it’s unpleasant for him too separate from the impact on our family. But the reality is this is the person I’m married to and have children with and while I have asked him over and over to look into other jobs even with considerably lower salaries I can’t make him take one. He took a step back for a brief time and hated the loss of prestige- for him that is the driver not the money.

I could quit my job and be 100 percent on the clock at home and absolve my husband of any responsibility at all. My husband would not support it and has been incredibly vocal about not being the only person supporting the family. But I don’t think he’d divorce me if I did it. Maybe we will reach a breaking point and I’ll do it one of these days. In the meantime my work is incredibly supportive and wonderful and I have zero friends who are SAHMs. My kids are old enough now that the couple I knew are going back to work.

But none of that would give me what I actually want- a spouse who is happy and has a relationship with the kids that’s not at the mercy of what happened with their work that day. So I do the best I can.

Your husband sounds like a jerk. He thinks he can work all the time but he won't let you quit your job even though you're doing everything at home?

Also, it would be interesting to get the demographics of people who post. How old were you when you met your husband? How old were you when you married? When your kid(s) were born?

I get that things change, but the fact that you say your husband is obsessed with the prestige of his position sounds like something that is innate to his personality. When I met, dated, and then married my husband (BEFORE we had kids), I knew that he was a diligent worker and he took his job seriously and cared about the quality of his work but that work wasn't his entire identity. We talked about what we wanted our life to look like, and to this day, I haven't been surprised by how he has handled things with his job and with our kids.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:Sounds wonderful for him, particularly if it is only happening one or two times a year.

I suggest thinking about the type of getaway that may be good for you and doing that one or two times a year as well. Could be a girls trip, could be a solo spa getaway, could be a walking trip in France, could be a service trip to help some people somewhere...

Op here - yes I typically also get one girls trip away a year (or I try). But I go and rejuvenate myself and relax. We get spa appointments and have a wine tasting and sleep as much as possible.

Then when I come back home I jump right back into mom mode and take care of the kids. I don’t mope around the house tired and hungover.

You sound perfect! Why would your husband ever want to be away from you on a weekend?

[Anonymous]

I am sure after a weekend with three children you are exhausted but this really is not worth fighting over.

It’s 2x a year for 4 days ( adding in the recuperation). Let your dh have this. You have your trips.

Life is long, the dc will not be little forever, and you’ll look back on this and realize how short-lived it was.

When we are in the trenches of parenting small children all we think about is the work. It’s hard but try and keep perspective. Wishing your family well.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:DH goes on one, sometimes two, guy trips a year. Usually just a long weekend. I hate them. They all go and act like they are 21 again and drink way to much, stay up too late and come home feeling hungover and exhausted for the next week.

Meanwhile I am stuck 24/7 taking care of the kids and running the house while he is gone. Then when he gets home he can barely help because he is so tired and he is so behind on work from taking the long weekend off.

I completely know he deserves time to decompress and relax and reconnecting with his friends is very important. I am so glad he still has friends and is close with them! I just dislike these trips.

Husband goes away for one weekend year and his wife is all bent out of shape. Attention! Any men dumb enough to consider getting married, this is how backward women's thinking process is!

When I was married my wife would complain endlessly that I went on two on my son's Cub Scout camping trips each year. She seemed to think one night away, sleeping on the ground in a campsite with 30 noisy kids, was somehow a vacation for me.

I used to complain about these camping trips. I am so embarrassed now. If that is you, honey… I’m sorry.

Why.... would you complain about.... a dad taking his son camping?

[Anonymous]

My husband works his tail off and never does poker night or a guys night out but once a year he will do a golf weekend with his friends. Yes, I know he drinks too much and gets little sleep and collapses into bed when he gets back on Sunday night but he heads to work on Monday and recovers there and is fine by Monday night. I’ll do a girls weekend once a year or so so it evens out. I’m happy that he makes it home in one piece and that he had a ton of fun.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:Op - what frustrates me is that I am 100% the default parent. I typically do all the drop offs, pick ups, make food, do laundry etc.

But I expect him to help around the house with the kids. Instead he is sleeping until 7:30 (on a week day!) and now will rush to get ready to work and be all stressed because he has so much work to do.

I have been up since 6:30 getting myself ready, lunches, dealing with the dog, getting breakfast and all the kid stuff so they are on time for school.

OP is this the day after he got back or three days after he got back? Makes a huge difference.

Yeah, this. If he's dragging on Monday morning and stays in bed an extra hour, OP is being completely unreasonable. If he's still not participating in the family at all on the Wednesday after, then he's either milking it (which would be its own issue) or needs to learn to suck it up and deal with *all* his responsibilities.

Hangovers don't last for 3 days.

Tell me you're an amateur without telling me you're an amateur.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:Op - what frustrates me is that I am 100% the default parent. I typically do all the drop offs, pick ups, make food, do laundry etc.

But I expect him to help around the house with the kids. Instead he is sleeping until 7:30 (on a week day!) and now will rush to get ready to work and be all stressed because he has so much work to do.

I have been up since 6:30 getting myself ready, lunches, dealing with the dog, getting breakfast and all the kid stuff so they are on time for school.

OP is this the day after he got back or three days after he got back? Makes a huge difference.

Yeah, this. If he's dragging on Monday morning and stays in bed an extra hour, OP is being completely unreasonable. If he's still not participating in the family at all on the Wednesday after, then he's either milking it (which would be its own issue) or needs to learn to suck it up and deal with *all* his responsibilities.

Hangovers don't last for 3 days.

Tell me you're an amateur without telling me you're an amateur.

No offense, but if you're hung over for three days after a guy's weekend, you're the amateur.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:Op - what frustrates me is that I am 100% the default parent. I typically do all the drop offs, pick ups, make food, do laundry etc.

But I expect him to help around the house with the kids. Instead he is sleeping until 7:30 (on a week day!) and now will rush to get ready to work and be all stressed because he has so much work to do.

I have been up since 6:30 getting myself ready, lunches, dealing with the dog, getting breakfast and all the kid stuff so they are on time for school.

If you're 100% the default parent, then are you doing anything extra on these mornings? If you are I think you should talk to him about that, but if your day looks no different I don't think it's reasonable to be upset about what he's doing/how stressed he is, because it's not actually affecting you materially.

My wife sleeping to 7:30 while I feed the cat, make lunches, and do school drop off is every morning of my life and it has never occurred to me to be angry at her for sleeping rather than getting up and going to work; I do the same amount of work regardless. I'm fine with the arrangement of responsibilities, which is what matters, not what she's doing with time that I'm doing kid stuff.

Do you know what “default parent” means?

DP it’s a phrase invented by disgruntled women who overestimate their role in their children’s life and are dismissive of the role their partners play, usually a circumstance that is self-inflicted by excessive hectoring, criticism, and micromanagement.

Tell me you’re a lazy parent without telling me you’re a lazy parent.

More original thinking from the “default parent” cliche user. Prattling on about laziness, ironically enough.

from the OP it seems the DH works 60-80 hours per week including nights and weekends. I would also assume his busy schedule does not allow for him to cover sick days or school closures but OP can correct me if wrong. There are 168 hours in a week. 80 means he is working 50% of the available hours of the week. 6 hours of sleep means 42 hours. An hour to get ready and commute in the morning plus min 30 commute home= 7.5 hours minimum, if he is not commuting into work on weekends. So just with working, sleeping minimum suggested amount, and commuting he takes 130 hours per week leaving 38 hours spread over 7 days is 5.5 hours to eat, workout, spend time with your family/spouse, run errands, cook dinners, etc.

On working hours alone, OP has 40 more hours per week to dedicate to her family and home. So yes she is the default parent, default cleaner, default sports driver, default grocery shopper, default sick day coverer.

as far as salary goes, OP DH better be making 2x the amount of money minimum.

Op - yes you pretty much have it spot on.

And yes he makes about 3.5-4 times what I make.

So the guy works 50-10% more than you and makes 350-400% more than you, and two weeks of inconvenience per year is causing you to build up resentment and might result in a serious talk about his behavior? How selfish. That sounds really spoiled.

As someone with a spouse who works a lot, I really hate this attitude. Just because my husband makes a ton of money doesn't mean he gets to have more rest than I do.

But OP's husband works a lot more than she does, and most likely at a more stressful job (stress tends to come with higher hours and pay, though not always).

If she's default parent for three young kids, he doesn't work more than she does. He works *for pay* more than she does. They should both have equivalent downtime, which she's not getting in the week after his guys' trip because he's working even more at his job, and even less around the house, after doing nothing for either while gone. So yes, she does get to complain. How much she should complain I think comes down to what kind of partner/father he is the other 50 weeks out of the year, but this persistent DCUM trope that if a guy earns enough money he is entitled to treat his family like servants is gross.

Sorry, if you think that working at a 40 hour/wk job and being default parent for three school aged kids is the same amount of work and stress as working 60-80 hours a week at a high-paying (and likely high stress) job, then you have no idea what it's like to actually work a job like that.

And again, it is two weeks out of a year.

I worked in BigLaw for 12 years. I know what 80 hours at the low end feels like, and I still recognize that a full-time job and essentially single-parenting 3 (!!) kids is work. Something tells me you have no idea what either side of the coin is actually like, you just like to devalue women's work.

I've been a very busy commercial litigator for 20 years, and I took 3 years in a govt job (that was still pretty busy) when my three kids were little. I notice that you don't even say that they are equal amounts of work--just that having a 40 hour a week job and parenting is work. No kidding it's work. I get that both are busy. But there is no comparison in stress and busy-ness. Being a busy lawyer who makes a lot of money (as I do) is way more stressful and time consuming. And people who haven't worked like that just don't understand it.

The post I responded to (unclear at this point if it was you) said he works 50-100% more than she does and she is "selfish" and "spoiled" for resenting this behavior of his. I said that he does not work twice as much as she does, he just spends more time on *paid* work. Then you either joined the thread or pivoted to an argument that it's not the "same amount of work and stress" and incorrectly assumed I don't know what a stressful job is like. Again, no. You clearly don't get that they "both are busy" because you're arguing (or joining in support of an argument) that OP's DH works 50-100% more than she does. That argument only makes sense if you do not recognize the unpaid work that she's doing and discount literally every hour she puts in as default parent on the second shift after her 40 hours of paid work.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:A woman would be excoriated if she came home from a girls’ trip too hungover and exhausted to deal with the kids. Tell him to suck it up. The trip is fine. But when it is over, it is over.

Yes, this is the issue, I think. It’s not the 3 days. It’s that he makes it 10 days of nonparticipation without acknowledging it or getting spouse on board.

+1

Correct. A lot of PPs above (men who want their own guys' trips, I suspect) are ignoring the fact that the real problem isn't the trip itself, it's that he comes home and is a hungover mopey baby for days afterward, recovering because he can't drink like an adult when he's away.

OP, I'd schedule utterly un-cancel-able things for which he has to be responsible so he has to suck it up and take a kid to, say, the dentist at 8 a.m. on that first morning back because YOU are busy. I'd have stuff of my own scheduled so he has to be the one getting the kids up and off to school. And I wouldn't be passive-aggressive about it -- I'd tell him point blank that family life goes on whether he's hung over and grumpy or not, and if he can't drink like a grown-up, that's his issue to figure out, not his issue to bring home with him.

I often wonder if people like you are actually married or, if so, happily. Who schedules an 8 am dentist appointment for the kid the day after their spouse returns from a weekend away just to stick it to them?

DP - I agree. On top of that, the lack of self awareness of the previous PP is pretty stunning. She proclaims that she "wouldn't be passive-aggressive" about it, but also says that she would "schedule utterly un-cancel-able things for which he has to be responsible so he has to suck it up and take a kid to, say, the dentist at 8 a.m. on that first morning back because YOU are busy. I'd have stuff of my own scheduled so he has to be the one getting the kids up and off to school."

That is the definition of passive-aggressive.

So true

Also, in what universe is a dentist appointment for an elementary schooler "un-cancel-able?"

It's a recent trend in pediatric dentistry. You are charged for canceling or not showing up. Our kid's Alexandria dentist started instituting this and we switched to a different one.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:Op - what frustrates me is that I am 100% the default parent. I typically do all the drop offs, pick ups, make food, do laundry etc.

But I expect him to help around the house with the kids. Instead he is sleeping until 7:30 (on a week day!) and now will rush to get ready to work and be all stressed because he has so much work to do.

I have been up since 6:30 getting myself ready, lunches, dealing with the dog, getting breakfast and all the kid stuff so they are on time for school.

OP is this the day after he got back or three days after he got back? Makes a huge difference.

Yeah, this. If he's dragging on Monday morning and stays in bed an extra hour, OP is being completely unreasonable. If he's still not participating in the family at all on the Wednesday after, then he's either milking it (which would be its own issue) or needs to learn to suck it up and deal with *all* his responsibilities.

Hangovers don't last for 3 days.

Tell me you're an amateur without telling me you're an amateur.

No offense, but if you're hung over for three days after a guy's weekend, you're the amateur.

No offence, but if you bounce back after 50 beers, a 1/2 ounce of weed, three 8 balls of blow and 6 hours of sleep total for three days... you're an addict.

Otherwise your guys weekend sounds more like a Golden Girls marathon.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:Op - what frustrates me is that I am 100% the default parent. I typically do all the drop offs, pick ups, make food, do laundry etc.

But I expect him to help around the house with the kids. Instead he is sleeping until 7:30 (on a week day!) and now will rush to get ready to work and be all stressed because he has so much work to do.

I have been up since 6:30 getting myself ready, lunches, dealing with the dog, getting breakfast and all the kid stuff so they are on time for school.

If you're 100% the default parent, then are you doing anything extra on these mornings? If you are I think you should talk to him about that, but if your day looks no different I don't think it's reasonable to be upset about what he's doing/how stressed he is, because it's not actually affecting you materially.

My wife sleeping to 7:30 while I feed the cat, make lunches, and do school drop off is every morning of my life and it has never occurred to me to be angry at her for sleeping rather than getting up and going to work; I do the same amount of work regardless. I'm fine with the arrangement of responsibilities, which is what matters, not what she's doing with time that I'm doing kid stuff.

Do you know what “default parent” means?

DP it’s a phrase invented by disgruntled women who overestimate their role in their children’s life and are dismissive of the role their partners play, usually a circumstance that is self-inflicted by excessive hectoring, criticism, and micromanagement.

Tell me you’re a lazy parent without telling me you’re a lazy parent.

More original thinking from the “default parent” cliche user. Prattling on about laziness, ironically enough.

from the OP it seems the DH works 60-80 hours per week including nights and weekends. I would also assume his busy schedule does not allow for him to cover sick days or school closures but OP can correct me if wrong. There are 168 hours in a week. 80 means he is working 50% of the available hours of the week. 6 hours of sleep means 42 hours. An hour to get ready and commute in the morning plus min 30 commute home= 7.5 hours minimum, if he is not commuting into work on weekends. So just with working, sleeping minimum suggested amount, and commuting he takes 130 hours per week leaving 38 hours spread over 7 days is 5.5 hours to eat, workout, spend time with your family/spouse, run errands, cook dinners, etc.

On working hours alone, OP has 40 more hours per week to dedicate to her family and home. So yes she is the default parent, default cleaner, default sports driver, default grocery shopper, default sick day coverer.

as far as salary goes, OP DH better be making 2x the amount of money minimum.

Op - yes you pretty much have it spot on.

And yes he makes about 3.5-4 times what I make.

So the guy works 50-10% more than you and makes 350-400% more than you, and two weeks of inconvenience per year is causing you to build up resentment and might result in a serious talk about his behavior? How selfish. That sounds really spoiled.

As someone with a spouse who works a lot, I really hate this attitude. Just because my husband makes a ton of money doesn't mean he gets to have more rest than I do.

But OP's husband works a lot more than she does, and most likely at a more stressful job (stress tends to come with higher hours and pay, though not always).

If she's default parent for three young kids, he doesn't work more than she does. He works *for pay* more than she does. They should both have equivalent downtime, which she's not getting in the week after his guys' trip because he's working even more at his job, and even less around the house, after doing nothing for either while gone. So yes, she does get to complain. How much she should complain I think comes down to what kind of partner/father he is the other 50 weeks out of the year, but this persistent DCUM trope that if a guy earns enough money he is entitled to treat his family like servants is gross.

Sorry, if you think that working at a 40 hour/wk job and being default parent for three school aged kids is the same amount of work and stress as working 60-80 hours a week at a high-paying (and likely high stress) job, then you have no idea what it's like to actually work a job like that.

And again, it is two weeks out of a year.

I worked in BigLaw for 12 years. I know what 80 hours at the low end feels like, and I still recognize that a full-time job and essentially single-parenting 3 (!!) kids is work. Something tells me you have no idea what either side of the coin is actually like, you just like to devalue women's work.

I've been a very busy commercial litigator for 20 years, and I took 3 years in a govt job (that was still pretty busy) when my three kids were little. I notice that you don't even say that they are equal amounts of work--just that having a 40 hour a week job and parenting is work. No kidding it's work. I get that both are busy. But there is no comparison in stress and busy-ness. Being a busy lawyer who makes a lot of money (as I do) is way more stressful and time consuming. And people who haven't worked like that just don't understand it.

This mindset is ridiculous.

I am also a lawyer and there is nothing about the field in general for a "commercial litigator" even at a large firm that makes it inherently any more busy or stressful than anybody else's experience with career and parenthood.

This is silly. I'm not saying that there aren't jobs that are as stressful or demanding, but if you're comparing your job as a fed, then you don't know what you're talking about. And the truth is that most jobs that make more than 500k/yr, which sounds like OP's husband, are very stressful and time consuming. I mean, OP said her DH works 60-80 hours a week. That is a very busy job.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:A woman would be excoriated if she came home from a girls’ trip too hungover and exhausted to deal with the kids. Tell him to suck it up. The trip is fine. But when it is over, it is over.

Yes, this is the issue, I think. It’s not the 3 days. It’s that he makes it 10 days of nonparticipation without acknowledging it or getting spouse on board.

+1

Correct. A lot of PPs above (men who want their own guys' trips, I suspect) are ignoring the fact that the real problem isn't the trip itself, it's that he comes home and is a hungover mopey baby for days afterward, recovering because he can't drink like an adult when he's away.

OP, I'd schedule utterly un-cancel-able things for which he has to be responsible so he has to suck it up and take a kid to, say, the dentist at 8 a.m. on that first morning back because YOU are busy. I'd have stuff of my own scheduled so he has to be the one getting the kids up and off to school. And I wouldn't be passive-aggressive about it -- I'd tell him point blank that family life goes on whether he's hung over and grumpy or not, and if he can't drink like a grown-up, that's his issue to figure out, not his issue to bring home with him.

I often wonder if people like you are actually married or, if so, happily. Who schedules an 8 am dentist appointment for the kid the day after their spouse returns from a weekend away just to stick it to them?

DP - I agree. On top of that, the lack of self awareness of the previous PP is pretty stunning. She proclaims that she "wouldn't be passive-aggressive" about it, but also says that she would "schedule utterly un-cancel-able things for which he has to be responsible so he has to suck it up and take a kid to, say, the dentist at 8 a.m. on that first morning back because YOU are busy. I'd have stuff of my own scheduled so he has to be the one getting the kids up and off to school."

That is the definition of passive-aggressive.

So true

Also, in what universe is a dentist appointment for an elementary schooler "un-cancel-able?"

Did you not get the point? That DH needs to have things he has to do that OP can't do FOR his hungover ass.

And yeah, it's passive aggressive, but I told OP to f'ing TELL her DH what she's doing there. So, it's passive aggression made clear to the target!

OP's DH is a man-baby and needs a kick up the rear the first morning after a guys' trip when he's acting like a hungover college kid. FFS.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:A woman would be excoriated if she came home from a girls’ trip too hungover and exhausted to deal with the kids. Tell him to suck it up. The trip is fine. But when it is over, it is over.

Yes, this is the issue, I think. It’s not the 3 days. It’s that he makes it 10 days of nonparticipation without acknowledging it or getting spouse on board.

+1

Correct. A lot of PPs above (men who want their own guys' trips, I suspect) are ignoring the fact that the real problem isn't the trip itself, it's that he comes home and is a hungover mopey baby for days afterward, recovering because he can't drink like an adult when he's away.

OP, I'd schedule utterly un-cancel-able things for which he has to be responsible so he has to suck it up and take a kid to, say, the dentist at 8 a.m. on that first morning back because YOU are busy. I'd have stuff of my own scheduled so he has to be the one getting the kids up and off to school. And I wouldn't be passive-aggressive about it -- I'd tell him point blank that family life goes on whether he's hung over and grumpy or not, and if he can't drink like a grown-up, that's his issue to figure out, not his issue to bring home with him.

I often wonder if people like you are actually married or, if so, happily. Who schedules an 8 am dentist appointment for the kid the day after their spouse returns from a weekend away just to stick it to them?

DP - I agree. On top of that, the lack of self awareness of the previous PP is pretty stunning. She proclaims that she "wouldn't be passive-aggressive" about it, but also says that she would "schedule utterly un-cancel-able things for which he has to be responsible so he has to suck it up and take a kid to, say, the dentist at 8 a.m. on that first morning back because YOU are busy. I'd have stuff of my own scheduled so he has to be the one getting the kids up and off to school."

That is the definition of passive-aggressive.

So true

Also, in what universe is a dentist appointment for an elementary schooler "un-cancel-able?"

It's a recent trend in pediatric dentistry. You are charged for canceling or not showing up. Our kid's Alexandria dentist started instituting this and we switched to a different one.

This, above. Plus, dentist was an example, people. Some idiot here is fixating on "But, but, but, it's not un-cancel-ableeee!" Dentist, school dropoff, whatever, the point is that the DH needs to pull his weight rather than playing the poor-me-I'm-worn-out card after he's been playing too hard all weekend.

The same would go for any DW who came back "too tired" after a weekend swilling wine with the girls.

Have your fun but don't wake up the first day back home and instantly check out for the daybecause you can't exercise control like an adult when you're not home.