How can I request cleaning help wear something more... modest?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Sexism.

You would never ask a man to change his clothes. If a plumber came to unclog your toilet you would not ask him to wear a non-offensive t-shirt.

Actually, the guy who came to fix our kitchen sink was not expecting our family when he put on his All Lives Matter t-shirt that morning. DH is a 6 foot 4 dark-skinned black man. The guy asked to use the bathroom and when he came out, his shirt was on inside out. No words exchanged about it.

Right? And if he was coming every week for hours, it would be fine to ask him to wear a non-offensive shirt.

The sexism is coming from the women on this thread who believe that OP should be quiet and demure and not dare to offend someone by expressing her thoughts. Not to mention those who believe that she should be cleaning her own home.

Then there’s the sexism, possibly classism, and maybe even a few other isms associated with feeling privileged enough to tell someone else what clothes they should wear because they’re working in your home for a couple of hours — because of your personal religious beliefs.
I think it’s unfortunate that someone who feels the need to control what other people wear didn’t realize this about herself. Had she hired someone who shared her standards about modest dress or simply shared her expectations PRIOR to hiring someone, none of this would be an issue.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP is describing clothes that are, in her words, revealing.

You know what else those clothes are, though? They are CHEAP. Those are the clothes sold at stores in low-income neighborhoods. Cheap polyester shirts. Cheap pleather pants.

As a domestic worker, OP's cleaning lady can't afford to have a separate wardrobe just for cleaning the house of one client, and the clothes available in her community are the ones she's wearing.

OP - there are cultural and class issues in play here, and you need to take a step back and look at what you are really asking. It's not pretty.

This. She probably buys her clothing at Rainbow or some similar shop, and that is what they sell.

Please stop with the “she’s poor and only revealing clothes are cheap” BS. Even if she is shopping at rainbow, she could but t shirts and yoga pants that aren’t as tight or cut out. Come on.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You don't. If you want people to respect you and your beliefs, then you need to respect yours, even if they're different. Respect is a two ways street and it's very hypocritical to expect her to respect you when you clearly don't respect her different beliefs about modesty.

Adding to that--she's working HARD and working up a sweat. Let the woman where whatever she needs to in order to avoid overheating. Do you exercise in turtlenecks and jeans?

You would be body shaming her and that is NEVER okay.

Signed--
Someone who grew up in a religiously conservative and modest/shaming household but got tired of other people micromanaging my body and left the religion and gained my independence. It was the most freeing moment of my life.

Wait, if the cleaning lady is coming into a uber religious home and is wearing tight, low cut things that's not respecting the OP. I'm all about body positivity but when I go to dinner at my very religious Muslim neighbor's house, or going to my Hasidic friend's gathering I'm not going to wear a short skirt or show cleavage. That's not body shaming... it's common sense.

It sounds like the cleaning lady is wearing a tank top and leggings. Cheap comfortable clothes to do manual labor.

OP wants her to wear sweatshirt.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Sexism.

You would never ask a man to change his clothes. If a plumber came to unclog your toilet you would not ask him to wear a non-offensive t-shirt.

Actually I have cringed when the electrician had on a shirt with and expletive on it and don’t even get me started on the plumbers with their cracks showing!

Cringing and asking them to wear a uniform are two wildly different things.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Sexism.

You would never ask a man to change his clothes. If a plumber came to unclog your toilet you would not ask him to wear a non-offensive t-shirt.

Actually, the guy who came to fix our kitchen sink was not expecting our family when he put on his All Lives Matter t-shirt that morning. DH is a 6 foot 4 dark-skinned black man. The guy asked to use the bathroom and when he came out, his shirt was on inside out. No words exchanged about it.

Right? And if he was coming every week for hours, it would be fine to ask him to wear a non-offensive shirt.

The sexism is coming from the women on this thread who believe that OP should be quiet and demure and not dare to offend someone by expressing her thoughts. Not to mention those who believe that she should be cleaning her own home.

Then there’s the sexism, possibly classism, and maybe even a few other isms associated with feeling privileged enough to tell someone else what clothes they should wear because they’re working in your home for a couple of hours — because of your personal religious beliefs.
I think it’s unfortunate that someone who feels the need to control what other people wear didn’t realize this about herself. Had she hired someone who shared her standards about modest dress or simply shared her expectations PRIOR to hiring someone, none of this would be an issue.

How is this classist. It’s not The Handmaids Tale where only wives wear a certain color and Op wants the cleaning lady to wear that instead of the sad grey that “poor women” wear. No one is asking her to come in wearing a business suit. I’m sure whatever store she shops at also sells clothes with sleeves and without low cut tops.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:On one hand, you are the employer, so it seems like your employee should abide by your comfort zone (as long as it is legal). BUT, what if you wanted her to wear a veil in your home, that would be going too far in my opinion.

How about your hire a cleaning person through an agency (which usually protects them and you more anyway, in terms of benefits/being bonded, etc). When you first put in the request, explain that due to your cultural/religious beliefs/customs, you would appreciate it if the person they send does not wear X, Y, Z (don't label it as modest, be specific, since "modest" is subjective). That way you are describing a work requirement, not insulting an individual.

Why do people keep saying that OP is the employer? It sounds like this is a cleaning lady, not a full-time housekeeper. So OP is not the employer.

Ok. OP is the client. It’s still a reasonable request.

Would it be reasonable for your employer to ask you to start wearing a headscarf to work, now that they've been bought by a Saudi conglomerate? After all, it's part of their religion.

I’m a therapist and own my own practice. It would be reasonable for a client to tell me that they would prefer that I wear a headscarf while I am with them. And it would also be completely reasonable for me to say that I am not comfortable with that and to work it out or refer them elsewhere.

If you’re a therapist, you surely recognize the differences between a therapist- client relationship and the type of relationship that the OP is describing. So, interesting observations, but not really relevant. Let’s flip it. Would it be reasonable for you to ask a client to wear a head scarf? Would it be reasonable for your clients to ask you to purchase entire outfits to wear during your sessions with them — when the outfits may cost far more than the fee they’re paying you? Would it be reasonable for them to bring you an outfit that meets their standards for acceptability? If any of these questions has made you cringe, even a little bit, then maybe some empathy and insight have been achieved.

Look. I’m not saying it’s a perfect analogy. It’s just a response to some asking me if it would be okay if my employer asked me to wear a headscarf.

Yes. Someone bringing in an outfit for me to wear or requesting that I purchase something specific to wear during sessions with them would be unusual behavior. And people suggesting that the OP purchase a uniform are out of line.

However, asking someone politely to choose a t-shirt instead of a tank top when they come to your home is reasonable. And, in my experience, most women need more encouragement to be assertive and ask for things that they want.

Has anyone ever asked you this, though? If not, again, I urge you to think about the potential power dynamics involved here. I trust that you would be equally supportive of the other woman. What would you say to a client that told you that although they were appropriately dressed, someone that they worked for a few hours a month, wanted them to change their clothes — to conform with religious beliefs that your client did not share. How would you support THIS client in being assertive and empowered in standing up to an unreasonable request?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP is describing clothes that are, in her words, revealing.

You know what else those clothes are, though? They are CHEAP. Those are the clothes sold at stores in low-income neighborhoods. Cheap polyester shirts. Cheap pleather pants.

As a domestic worker, OP's cleaning lady can't afford to have a separate wardrobe just for cleaning the house of one client, and the clothes available in her community are the ones she's wearing.

OP - there are cultural and class issues in play here, and you need to take a step back and look at what you are really asking. It's not pretty.

This. She probably buys her clothing at Rainbow or some similar shop, and that is what they sell.

Please stop with the “she’s poor and only revealing clothes are cheap” BS. Even if she is shopping at rainbow, she could but t shirts and yoga pants that aren’t as tight or cut out. Come on.

Her clothes, which she pays for, are, as far as we know, perfectly fine in every other area of her life — except for the few hour a month that she works in the OPs house. If the OP has standard for the dress of other people in her house, it’s on her to make this clear as a job requirement BEFORE hiring someone. The issue isn’t really what she wears — it’s whether someone who has hired her to work for a few hours has any standing to say something about it, using her own personal religious standards to support her request.

[Anonymous]

This is so easy. Show her a picture of what you want. Give her money for three of those outfits.

She'll be delighted, particularly if all you say is cover more skin. But even if you're more specific, there is absolutely nothing wrong with a dress code.

I'm very surprised by the negative reactions of others about this, but then I'm European. We don't go to work dressed in something the cat dragged in.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I find wearing tight clothing like leggings and a better fitting t shirt helps me stay dry when doing a deep clean. OP have you ever tried washing down a walk in shower in baggy sweatpants????

Haha! OP has never cleaned up after herself in her life. Clueless.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:
This is so easy. Show her a picture of what you want. Give her money for three of those outfits.

She'll be delighted, particularly if all you say is cover more skin. But even if you're more specific, there is absolutely nothing wrong with a dress code.

I'm very surprised by the negative reactions of others about this, but then I'm European. We don't go to work dressed in something the cat dragged in.

How strange, I've had many European cleaning ladies and they've worn pretty awful outfits. How long have you been cleaning homes?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:
This is so easy. Show her a picture of what you want. Give her money for three of those outfits.

She'll be delighted, particularly if all you say is cover more skin. But even if you're more specific, there is absolutely nothing wrong with a dress code.

I'm very surprised by the negative reactions of others about this, but then I'm European. We don't go to work dressed in something the cat dragged in.

1. You have no reason to believe that anyone other than the OP would object to what the woman is wearing.
2. This is being driven by the OPs personal religious standards - which are very different from current norms.
3. Many of us have been to Europe. Your generalization — is not entirely accurate.
4. You might enjoy the thread on the Trump women and their clothing choices. Lots of Europeans and European influences there. Just sayin’...

[Anonymous]

Maybe it’s possible to drive cleaning lady to Kohl's or some similar discount store to chose some appropriate clothing? OP can pay and explain she would feel guilty if the help’s own clothes got dirty. Problem solved.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
This is so easy. Show her a picture of what you want. Give her money for three of those outfits.

She'll be delighted, particularly if all you say is cover more skin. But even if you're more specific, there is absolutely nothing wrong with a dress code.

I'm very surprised by the negative reactions of others about this, but then I'm European. We don't go to work dressed in something the cat dragged in.

How strange, I've had many European cleaning ladies and they've worn pretty awful outfits. How long have you been cleaning homes?

Yeah the Eastern European cleaning ladies wore the most revealing outfits. Definitely leather leggings territory.

[Anonymous]

Funny, on the fashion forum you all can’t wait to call someone’s low cut, revealing, too tight, bra visible, clothes trashy. Now suddenly it’s empowering to dress like this?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Funny, on the fashion forum you all can’t wait to call someone’s low cut, revealing, too tight, bra visible, clothes trashy. Now suddenly it’s empowering to dress like this?

It's not our business to police other women, no matter the personal feelings.