Estrangement Doesn't Just Happen to "Bad" Moms—It Happened to Me Too

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:If my adult son wanted to propose to someone in a Disneyland theme park (!) I would cut him off right then and there, and never look back.

Lol, +1. God help me, I will try to respect his choices, but I hope I don't raise a kid who thinks this is a romantic engagement.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:I believe the person who doesn’t go out of their way to air their side of a personal relationship publicly. There’s something wrong with a person who does that.

They do that out of the same heartache as a death.
Millennials need to understand how relationships work and how to communicate. Estrangement is epic in this generation and it is usually a daughter or son in law that draws a line in the sand. I've heard a ton of stories as to why someone thinks their MIL is toxic. They don't know what toxic means. Any comment is misconstrued, ever thought, and taken personally...and then the family is cut off.

I’d argue that people are finally starting to demand to be treated better. Being a MIL doesn’t give you a license to say horrible comments. In previous generations women were expected to just take it. Sorry but no one is treating me badly. People make mistakes, but continue to insult me and cause trouble and yes, you will be cut off.

Or maybe someone is the type of person who needs so much validation that they read slights into everything. That is what I see. I know someone who went to a craft store with her DIL. Mil carried the baby, and saw a friend. The friend said to the MIL, who knew there was a new grandchild, " Is that the new baby?" Mil said " Yes! It's our new addition!"
DIL made her apologize later that night , with the husband/son in tow to watch, for the word "our." " It's not YOUR baby!" She was angry, and crying, that Mom used the word "our." SIL, husband's sister suggested that DIL might be overtired. The entire family has been cut off . It's been years. No contact. There are more stories like this. Don't ever assume there is always the "right" one and inlaws or parents are always monsters.

I'd bet a million dollars that the MIL had been acting like its equally/partially her baby up to that point, and it was that behavior and not the particular words that day that caused the estrangement. Like the MIL complaining that she doesn't get to see "our new baby" enough, for example. The fact is that it's not her baby at ALL unless the parents of the baby want that to be the case.

+1. This is just one example of the MIL overstepping boundaries to steal the spotlight. How many others are there? It makes no sense that the entire family was cut off for one not-huge issue. This story that they don't understand why they're cut off but they're blaming the DIL is the hallmark of a dysfunctional family. They just don't want to admit why.

Postpartum is a very emotional time and it's for the parents, especially the mother, to bond with the baby. Everyone else is supposed to support the couple by doing errands, cooking, cleaning, etc. The baby is the mother's turf. The MIL should have been more careful not to overstep. It's also unbelievable that there wasn't more to the story.

+2 And the SIL's comment about being 'overtired'? Yeah, why not just tell her to 'calm down'? That's always good at descalating things. I have to wonder, though, where is the DH in all this? Are his fingers broken and he can't call/text?

This story to me seems to reflect a lack of respect and sanity in both sides. Perhaps MIL and DIL are both drama queens- people always marry someone who reminds them of a parent.

Ok, no. Mom wasn't doing or saying anything that was leading up. The screaming fight came entirely out of the semantics of the answer in the craft store- which had no agenda. But, do you see how quick PP here is talking about the spotlight? There it is.

You seem awful adamant about what happened given that you’re supposedly a bystander who didn’t personally witness it.

LOL No, I am not the person involved. Yet I know the people extremely well. And, no one had to be there to see there was absolutely nothing wrong with what MIL said. The piling on from you and whoever else, who also weren'tvthere yet assumes the worst, underscores my point- issues with communication and relationships.

Ah, narcissists.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:I believe the person who doesn’t go out of their way to air their side of a personal relationship publicly. There’s something wrong with a person who does that.

They do that out of the same heartache as a death.
Millennials need to understand how relationships work and how to communicate. Estrangement is epic in this generation and it is usually a daughter or son in law that draws a line in the sand. I've heard a ton of stories as to why someone thinks their MIL is toxic. They don't know what toxic means. Any comment is misconstrued, ever thought, and taken personally...and then the family is cut off.

I’d argue that people are finally starting to demand to be treated better. Being a MIL doesn’t give you a license to say horrible comments. In previous generations women were expected to just take it. Sorry but no one is treating me badly. People make mistakes, but continue to insult me and cause trouble and yes, you will be cut off.

Or maybe someone is the type of person who needs so much validation that they read slights into everything. That is what I see. I know someone who went to a craft store with her DIL. Mil carried the baby, and saw a friend. The friend said to the MIL, who knew there was a new grandchild, " Is that the new baby?" Mil said " Yes! It's our new addition!"
DIL made her apologize later that night , with the husband/son in tow to watch, for the word "our." " It's not YOUR baby!" She was angry, and crying, that Mom used the word "our." SIL, husband's sister suggested that DIL might be overtired. The entire family has been cut off . It's been years. No contact. There are more stories like this. Don't ever assume there is always the "right" one and inlaws or parents are always monsters.

I'd bet a million dollars that the MIL had been acting like its equally/partially her baby up to that point, and it was that behavior and not the particular words that day that caused the estrangement. Like the MIL complaining that she doesn't get to see "our new baby" enough, for example. The fact is that it's not her baby at ALL unless the parents of the baby want that to be the case.

+1. This is just one example of the MIL overstepping boundaries to steal the spotlight. How many others are there? It makes no sense that the entire family was cut off for one not-huge issue. This story that they don't understand why they're cut off but they're blaming the DIL is the hallmark of a dysfunctional family. They just don't want to admit why.

Postpartum is a very emotional time and it's for the parents, especially the mother, to bond with the baby. Everyone else is supposed to support the couple by doing errands, cooking, cleaning, etc. The baby is the mother's turf. The MIL should have been more careful not to overstep. It's also unbelievable that there wasn't more to the story.

+2 And the SIL's comment about being 'overtired'? Yeah, why not just tell her to 'calm down'? That's always good at descalating things. I have to wonder, though, where is the DH in all this? Are his fingers broken and he can't call/text?

This story to me seems to reflect a lack of respect and sanity in both sides. Perhaps MIL and DIL are both drama queens- people always marry someone who reminds them of a parent.

Ok, no. Mom wasn't doing or saying anything that was leading up. The screaming fight came entirely out of the semantics of the answer in the craft store- which had no agenda. But, do you see how quick PP here is talking about the spotlight? There it is.

You seem awful adamant about what happened given that you’re supposedly a bystander who didn’t personally witness it.

LOL No, I am not the person involved. Yet I know the people extremely well. And, no one had to be there to see there was absolutely nothing wrong with what MIL said. The piling on from you and whoever else, who also weren'tvthere yet assumes the worst, underscores my point- issues with communication and relationships.

Ah, narcissists.

Yep.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If my adult son wanted to propose to someone in a Disneyland theme park (!) I would cut him off right then and there, and never look back.

Lol, +1. God help me, I will try to respect his choices, but I hope I don't raise a kid who thinks this is a romantic engagement.

This stood out to be too! It screams "I'm a giant man-baby!". But then again, I'm not into Disney but clearly other people are.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I believe the person who doesn’t go out of their way to air their side of a personal relationship publicly. There’s something wrong with a person who does that.

They do that out of the same heartache as a death.
Millennials need to understand how relationships work and how to communicate. Estrangement is epic in this generation and it is usually a daughter or son in law that draws a line in the sand. I've heard a ton of stories as to why someone thinks their MIL is toxic. They don't know what toxic means. Any comment is misconstrued, ever thought, and taken personally...and then the family is cut off.

This, only it's worse than death as the child is alive and choosing to put parents through this pain. A lot of them are going to have regrets. They are also setting examples for their own children that will come back to bite them. Forgive. Move on. We are all deeply flawed.

Worse than death? So you’d rather your child die than cut you off? And you wonder why people think these parents who are being cut off are narcissistic and hyperbolic. Get some perspective. Have you ever lost a child?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I believe the person who doesn’t go out of their way to air their side of a personal relationship publicly. There’s something wrong with a person who does that.

They do that out of the same heartache as a death.
Millennials need to understand how relationships work and how to communicate. Estrangement is epic in this generation and it is usually a daughter or son in law that draws a line in the sand. I've heard a ton of stories as to why someone thinks their MIL is toxic. They don't know what toxic means. Any comment is misconstrued, ever thought, and taken personally...and then the family is cut off.

But in this case, I'd bet money that the mom got upset and said she wouldn't come to the wedding, expecting her son to apologize and beg her to come. Instead of playing her game, the son asked her if she's still planning to not come. The son was the one communicating properly, while the mom was playing a game and being histrionic.

It's telling that she left out large chunks of the story. Something serious had to happen for the DILs family to decline to come to the rehearsal dinner. The writer is being disingenuos to say she doesn't know what she did wrong.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Who asks their son two weeks before the wedding if he is sure?!! Or purchases Disneyland Park tickets for her son and his gf after he tells her he is planning to propose? Yuck.

Parents who know it might not be right.

My father asked me two months before the wedding. He also asked me again right before walking me down the aisle--the wedding photographer caught me giving him a WTF look. He was right, we were divorced 3 yrs later when he left me with a 3 month old who he later gave up for adoption, because he's a complete douchebag. My father was right, and he *knew*.

Same here. My dad asked me the morning of the wedding. My spouse left me with an infant. Dad was right. I would never, ever consider cutting off my parents. Estrangement is not a acceptable except in cases of criminal and major physical abuse.

Yes, I judge you if you are estranged from your parents over accusations that they are narcissistic or toxic. It's more likely that you are the problem.

I have no dog in this fight, but...
Are you kidding me? Why on earth would anyone care about YOUR insignificant opinion or what you think of them, anyway? lol

Your someone who makes sweeping, blanket, generalizations about a subject matter in which you've had zero education, zero training, zero personal experience & zero insight into (and this is what you use as the basis of your petty, intolerable "judgments"?? That's classic). Add lacking self-awareness to that list too.

You are quite literally the definition of ignorance.

Its clear why your father was concerned about you getting married, as it seems like you don't have the capability of using maturity, logic, acumen & good, sound judgment in your decision making process (posting that baseless, uninformed rant up there is a perfect example).

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Who asks their son two weeks before the wedding if he is sure?!! Or purchases Disneyland Park tickets for her son and his gf after he tells her he is planning to propose? Yuck.

Parents who know it might not be right.

My father asked me two months before the wedding. He also asked me again right before walking me down the aisle--the wedding photographer caught me giving him a WTF look. He was right, we were divorced 3 yrs later when he left me with a 3 month old who he later gave up for adoption, because he's a complete douchebag. My father was right, and he *knew*.

Same here. My dad asked me the morning of the wedding. My spouse left me with an infant. Dad was right. I would never, ever consider cutting off my parents. Estrangement is not a acceptable except in cases of criminal and major physical abuse.

Yes, I judge you if you are estranged from your parents over accusations that they are narcissistic or toxic. It's more likely that you are the problem.

I have no dog in this fight, but...
Are you kidding me? Why on earth would anyone care about YOUR insignificant opinion or what you think of them, anyway? lol

Your someone who makes sweeping, blanket, generalizations about a subject matter in which you've had zero education, zero training, zero personal experience & zero insight into (and this is what you use as the basis of your petty, intolerable "judgments"?? That's classic). Add lacking self-awareness to that list too.

You are quite literally the definition of ignorance.

Its clear why your father was concerned about you getting married, as it seems like you don't have the capability of using maturity, logic, acumen & good, sound judgment in your decision making process (posting that baseless, uninformed rant up there is a perfect example).

"Your someone who makes ...."
Um, it is "you're" - not "your" since you want to discuss education and ignorance. You are also conflating two posters, here.

But seriously, sweetheart, get that counseling.

[Anonymous]

I'm also a mom who has an estranged ds. I have several other children, also. Ds is married.

Like the author of the article, the trouble began when the ds married. Unfortunately, dil has some signifigent mental health issues. Ds likely does as well, his biological father did so sometimes that happens.

One example of this is-their first Christmas, they were in temporary housing for college, and I got her a nice present for her beloved pet. In fact, I drove a long distance to purchase this-with my own then-newborn baby along-knowing that they had limited space and finances. Plus, they had mentioned this item for the pet and I was excited to buy it for her.

I then got a phone call from ds, questioning why I had gotten a present for pet and not dil? I could hear her in the backround of this call. I really did not know what to say.

They distanced themselves after this, and I am fine with that. Unlike the lady in the article, I'm not too upset, and I realize the problem is not with me-it's their mental illnesses. I can't take ownership of that.

I told the other kids (all young adults except for the little one) they of course can have any relationship they want with ds. One talks occasionally, the others choose none. I do not allow any contact with the little one-I won't expose the child to the mental illness.

I'm ok with the estrangement and don't mind how it is now. I ensured that ds had a good childhood and education and did my job well. Life goes on!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote: I'm also a mom who has an estranged ds. I have several other children, also. Ds is married.

Like the author of the article, the trouble began when the ds married. Unfortunately, dil has some signifigent mental health issues. Ds likely does as well, his biological father did so sometimes that happens.

One example of this is-their first Christmas, they were in temporary housing for college, and I got her a nice present for her beloved pet. In fact, I drove a long distance to purchase this-with my own then-newborn baby along-knowing that they had limited space and finances. Plus, they had mentioned this item for the pet and I was excited to buy it for her.

I then got a phone call from ds, questioning why I had gotten a present for pet and not dil? I could hear her in the backround of this call. I really did not know what to say.

They distanced themselves after this, and I am fine with that. Unlike the lady in the article, I'm not too upset, and I realize the problem is not with me-it's their mental illnesses. I can't take ownership of that.

I told the other kids (all young adults except for the little one) they of course can have any relationship they want with ds. One talks occasionally, the others choose none. I do not allow any contact with the little one-I won't expose the child to the mental illness.

I'm ok with the estrangement and don't mind how it is now. I ensured that ds had a good childhood and education and did my job well. Life goes on!

I hope this is a joke. You did not get DIL a gift and wonder why she is upset? She should have gotten a gift instead of the pet UNLESS it had been discussed and cleared beforehand that it was ok to substitute a normal gift for her for one for her pet. Also, I'm assuming it was something like a dog bed/chew toy and not a saddle that acknowledges a hobby and that she could use. You sent a huge sign of rejection and I'm not sure they are distancing you because of "mental health issues" so much as ridding themselves of contact with someone they consider thoughtless, rude, and unsupportive of their marriage.

[Anonymous]

She had specifically mentioned wanting the item.

[Anonymous]

And, PP, normal people don't react the way dil did over a gift. Normal people would have accepted it in the spirit given (fulfilling an expressed desire) or just rolled their eyes and moved on.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote: I'm also a mom who has an estranged ds. I have several other children, also. Ds is married.

Like the author of the article, the trouble began when the ds married. Unfortunately, dil has some signifigent mental health issues. Ds likely does as well, his biological father did so sometimes that happens.

One example of this is-their first Christmas, they were in temporary housing for college, and I got her a nice present for her beloved pet. In fact, I drove a long distance to purchase this-with my own then-newborn baby along-knowing that they had limited space and finances. Plus, they had mentioned this item for the pet and I was excited to buy it for her.

I then got a phone call from ds, questioning why I had gotten a present for pet and not dil? I could hear her in the backround of this call. I really did not know what to say.

They distanced themselves after this, and I am fine with that. Unlike the lady in the article, I'm not too upset, and I realize the problem is not with me-it's their mental illnesses. I can't take ownership of that.

I told the other kids (all young adults except for the little one) they of course can have any relationship they want with ds. One talks occasionally, the others choose none. I do not allow any contact with the little one-I won't expose the child to the mental illness.

I'm ok with the estrangement and don't mind how it is now. I ensured that ds had a good childhood and education and did my job well. Life goes on!

Spoken like a true narcissist! So, you drove all the way to your son's college (probably unannounced) to drop off a present for his girlfriend's dog. Let me guess. You'd had a fight and were "love bombing" or you wanted to check up on things and used the gift as a reason to come by. Then, you told all his siblings he has mental health issues like his father but that they can still have a relationship with you even if he's "rejected you." We don't know his side--hence the quotation marks. Google "flying monkeys." And...you have a son in college, other children, and a newborn. This all hints at the fact you've had multiple relationships and your son was born into an unstable home life. Me thinks you need to do some soul searching, but never will. Your obvious response is going to be to say I'm looking too much into what you've said...however, anyone who's ever had to deal with narcissists know exactly what you've done. Your son is smart to keep his distance. Kudos to him.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote: I'm also a mom who has an estranged ds. I have several other children, also. Ds is married.

Like the author of the article, the trouble began when the ds married. Unfortunately, dil has some signifigent mental health issues. Ds likely does as well, his biological father did so sometimes that happens.

One example of this is-their first Christmas, they were in temporary housing for college, and I got her a nice present for her beloved pet. In fact, I drove a long distance to purchase this-with my own then-newborn baby along-knowing that they had limited space and finances. Plus, they had mentioned this item for the pet and I was excited to buy it for her.

I then got a phone call from ds, questioning why I had gotten a present for pet and not dil? I could hear her in the backround of this call. I really did not know what to say.

They distanced themselves after this, and I am fine with that. Unlike the lady in the article, I'm not too upset, and I realize the problem is not with me-it's their mental illnesses. I can't take ownership of that.

I told the other kids (all young adults except for the little one) they of course can have any relationship they want with ds. One talks occasionally, the others choose none. I do not allow any contact with the little one-I won't expose the child to the mental illness.

I'm ok with the estrangement and don't mind how it is now. I ensured that ds had a good childhood and education and did my job well. Life goes on!

It is posts like this that make me think that I probably could cut off my BPD parent without them living in a pit of sadness and rejection. They would quickly rationalize it, paint me as the villain and move on with their life. Where I would probably be plagued with guilt.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote: I'm also a mom who has an estranged ds. I have several other children, also. Ds is married.

Like the author of the article, the trouble began when the ds married. Unfortunately, dil has some signifigent mental health issues. Ds likely does as well, his biological father did so sometimes that happens.

One example of this is-their first Christmas, they were in temporary housing for college, and I got her a nice present for her beloved pet. In fact, I drove a long distance to purchase this-with my own then-newborn baby along-knowing that they had limited space and finances. Plus, they had mentioned this item for the pet and I was excited to buy it for her.

I then got a phone call from ds, questioning why I had gotten a present for pet and not dil? I could hear her in the backround of this call. I really did not know what to say.

They distanced themselves after this, and I am fine with that. Unlike the lady in the article, I'm not too upset, and I realize the problem is not with me-it's their mental illnesses. I can't take ownership of that.

I told the other kids (all young adults except for the little one) they of course can have any relationship they want with ds. One talks occasionally, the others choose none. I do not allow any contact with the little one-I won't expose the child to the mental illness.

I'm ok with the estrangement and don't mind how it is now. I ensured that ds had a good childhood and education and did my job well. Life goes on!

It is posts like this that make me think that I probably could cut off my BPD parent without them living in a pit of sadness and rejection. They would quickly rationalize it, paint me as the villain and move on with their life. Where I would probably be plagued with guilt.

+1. amazing how the pp quickly let herself off the hook for not helping her son with mental health issues and blames her ex for it. Another hallmark of the toxic estranged parent is that she claims it was over some extremely minor slight and blames her own child's SO. It's just not logical that pp and her son had a great relationship then one gift mistake and their relationship is over. Now pp has no interest in fixing it because deep down she knows she's to blame and isn't willing to correct her own behavior to enable a relationship with her own son. And she's cool with just not having a relationship with her own offspring, no regrets? No decent parent would take this position.