Apple river tubing killing

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You leave. You leave and you call the police. He had time to leave and call the police. At the end of the day, it was a cell phone. Leave it. You can get a new cell phone; you can’t get back a dead teen, or your ruined life.

You leave and you call the police.

It’s like we tell our kids: you don’t fight, you don’t hit, you don’t get violent, you walk away and ask for help.

He was under no obligation to leave. He wanted to keep looking for the phone. They didn’t have to surround him, continue to harrass him, and start a physical altercation first.

Never said they were justified in doing what they did. What I did say was—in any escalating, dangerous situation—YOU LEAVE. And he had the opportunity to do so. Now a teen is dead, and he will go to jail for life or will have some other significant sentence. He will be separated from his family. He will pay exorbitant legal fees. He will think about this every day for the rest of his life. And a teen is dead. If that was your teenage son or daughter, would you have wanted this guy to “stand his ground”? You walk away. Period.

NP

I hate living in a world like this. Where people get to be aggressive a$$holes and my only option (according to you) is to walk away. It ain’t right. Eff that sh!t.

OK, keep “living in a world” where teenagers get stabbed to death and the guy who inflicted the wounds has his life completely ruined forever, even if he gets a lenient sentence. Because even if he gets minimal time, this will haunt his life forever. You keep living in THAT world. Shrug.

A person surrounded by a taunting group has every right to protect himself.

A taunting drunk group that was getting physical.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Here is the most detailed chain of events that day I’ve seen yet.

https://www.thedailybeast.com/nicolae-miu-gun-loving-maga-fan-held-in-connection-with-tubing-murder-cops-say

And cites the Daily Beast

[Anonymous]

From the Beast:

“ Miu then began “punching or slapping” a young woman later identified as 24-year-old Ryhley Mattison.”

The video they have is so clear that they can’t distinguish whether or not the 24 year old was being punched or slapped? Really??????????

[Anonymous]

According to the details of the video contained in the Daily Beast article:

The first stabbing by the defendant was provoked by a young man in a yellow bathing suit who kept pushing the defendant back into the water. The young man in the yellow bathing suit seems to be the instigator of at least two attacks. Repeatedly attacking someone displaying an open small pocketknife may support a self-defense defense with respect to the individual in the yellow bathing suit.

No mention of any audio recording.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You leave. You leave and you call the police. He had time to leave and call the police. At the end of the day, it was a cell phone. Leave it. You can get a new cell phone; you can’t get back a dead teen, or your ruined life.

You leave and you call the police.

It’s like we tell our kids: you don’t fight, you don’t hit, you don’t get violent, you walk away and ask for help.

He was under no obligation to leave. He wanted to keep looking for the phone. They didn’t have to surround him, continue to harrass him, and start a physical altercation first.

Never said they were justified in doing what they did. What I did say was—in any escalating, dangerous situation—YOU LEAVE. And he had the opportunity to do so. Now a teen is dead, and he will go to jail for life or will have some other significant sentence. He will be separated from his family. He will pay exorbitant legal fees. He will think about this every day for the rest of his life. And a teen is dead. If that was your teenage son or daughter, would you have wanted this guy to “stand his ground”? You walk away. Period.

NP

I hate living in a world like this. Where people get to be aggressive a$$holes and my only option (according to you) is to walk away. It ain’t right. Eff that sh!t.

OK, keep “living in a world” where teenagers get stabbed to death and the guy who inflicted the wounds has his life completely ruined forever, even if he gets a lenient sentence. Because even if he gets minimal time, this will haunt his life forever. You keep living in THAT world. Shrug.

A person surrounded by a taunting group has every right to protect himself.

A taunting drunk group that was getting physical.

+1

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I’m a 51 year old woman and no bleeping way am I turning my back exposing myself to serious injury while under active attack by a group of drunken hostile teenagers.

Anyone suggesting this is a wise or recommended course of action is an idiot. Full stop.

As a former rural red state America prosecutor, I’m sickened at the charges leveled against this man. They aren’t supported by the known evidence. The state is trying to coerce him into a guilty plea to lesser charges rather than grapple with the complexity and gray in the case and enduring the ire of some of the public - as any truly good prosecutor following the mandate to ‘seek justice, not merely convictions’ should expect to every day of his or her career.

The force of nature that is a parent with a dead kid drives far too many prosecutors to doggedly pursue wrongful convictions in order to quiet the outraged victim family. Sadly in some cases, victims are victims of their own idiocy first and foremost.

These kids had ZERO reason to interact with this guy. If they didn’t like the looks of him they could have floated out of his reach, easily. Surrounding him, yelling insults and accusations, touching him - they absolutely provoked a confrontation and it is entirely within the reasonable standard for a man outnumbered 4 or 5 to 1 to muster all means available for self defense.

He’ll be acquitted.

This posting is concerning. Are you in fact a "former rural red state America prosecutor?"

Here is another angle on what happened:

https://www.thedailybeast.com/nicolae-miu-gun-lovi...on-with-tubing-murder-cops-say

It seems this man was behaving aggressively towards the kids, and not the other way around. The kids repeatedly asked him to leave them alone. A group of 20-something kids came to the rescue, because the teen age kids were yelling for help - before the stabbings began. If I understand the account correctly, a girl from the second group was one of the young folks who were suddenly stabbed without having done or said anything to provoke the man into stabbing her.

I hope if you really are a former prosecutor, you don't intend to go back to being a prosecutor. You're making assumptions without knowing all the facts.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I’m a 51 year old woman and no bleeping way am I turning my back exposing myself to serious injury while under active attack by a group of drunken hostile teenagers.

Anyone suggesting this is a wise or recommended course of action is an idiot. Full stop.

As a former rural red state America prosecutor, I’m sickened at the charges leveled against this man. They aren’t supported by the known evidence. The state is trying to coerce him into a guilty plea to lesser charges rather than grapple with the complexity and gray in the case and enduring the ire of some of the public - as any truly good prosecutor following the mandate to ‘seek justice, not merely convictions’ should expect to every day of his or her career.

The force of nature that is a parent with a dead kid drives far too many prosecutors to doggedly pursue wrongful convictions in order to quiet the outraged victim family. Sadly in some cases, victims are victims of their own idiocy first and foremost.

These kids had ZERO reason to interact with this guy. If they didn’t like the looks of him they could have floated out of his reach, easily. Surrounding him, yelling insults and accusations, touching him - they absolutely provoked a confrontation and it is entirely within the reasonable standard for a man outnumbered 4 or 5 to 1 to muster all means available for self defense.

He’ll be acquitted.

This posting is concerning. Are you in fact a "former rural red state America prosecutor?"

Here is another angle on what happened:

https://www.thedailybeast.com/nicolae-miu-gun-lovi...on-with-tubing-murder-cops-say

It seems this man was behaving aggressively towards the kids, and not the other way around. The kids repeatedly asked him to leave them alone. A group of 20-something kids came to the rescue, because the teen age kids were yelling for help - before the stabbings began. If I understand the account correctly, a girl from the second group was one of the young folks who were suddenly stabbed without having done or said anything to provoke the man into stabbing her.

I hope if you really are a former prosecutor, you don't intend to go back to being a prosecutor. You're making assumptions without knowing all the facts.

When did we start believing the recall accuracy of drunk individuals?

[Anonymous]

I'm saying we need to wait for the facts to get sorted out. For example, can you cite evidence the kids were drunk? The first group were teen agers.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I’m a 51 year old woman and no bleeping way am I turning my back exposing myself to serious injury while under active attack by a group of drunken hostile teenagers.

Anyone suggesting this is a wise or recommended course of action is an idiot. Full stop.

As a former rural red state America prosecutor, I’m sickened at the charges leveled against this man. They aren’t supported by the known evidence. The state is trying to coerce him into a guilty plea to lesser charges rather than grapple with the complexity and gray in the case and enduring the ire of some of the public - as any truly good prosecutor following the mandate to ‘seek justice, not merely convictions’ should expect to every day of his or her career.

The force of nature that is a parent with a dead kid drives far too many prosecutors to doggedly pursue wrongful convictions in order to quiet the outraged victim family. Sadly in some cases, victims are victims of their own idiocy first and foremost.

These kids had ZERO reason to interact with this guy. If they didn’t like the looks of him they could have floated out of his reach, easily. Surrounding him, yelling insults and accusations, touching him - they absolutely provoked a confrontation and it is entirely within the reasonable standard for a man outnumbered 4 or 5 to 1 to muster all means available for self defense.

He’ll be acquitted.

This posting is concerning. Are you in fact a "former rural red state America prosecutor?"

Here is another angle on what happened:

https://www.thedailybeast.com/nicolae-miu-gun-lovi...on-with-tubing-murder-cops-say

It seems this man was behaving aggressively towards the kids, and not the other way around. The kids repeatedly asked him to leave them alone. A group of 20-something kids came to the rescue, because the teen age kids were yelling for help - before the stabbings began. If I understand the account correctly, a girl from the second group was one of the young folks who were suddenly stabbed without having done or said anything to provoke the man into stabbing her.

I hope if you really are a former prosecutor, you don't intend to go back to being a prosecutor. You're making assumptions without knowing all the facts.

When did we start believing the recall accuracy of drunk individuals?

When there's video from other bystanders backing the kids account

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I'm saying we need to wait for the facts to get sorted out. For example, can you cite evidence the kids were drunk? The first group were teen agers.

This man's reputation is being smeared across news outlets, and hes being held on a million dollar bond,based on the word ofvdrunk individuals and teens. He may be guilty as charged, but it doesn't seem as if anyone is waiting for facts.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I’m a 51 year old woman and no bleeping way am I turning my back exposing myself to serious injury while under active attack by a group of drunken hostile teenagers.

Anyone suggesting this is a wise or recommended course of action is an idiot. Full stop.

As a former rural red state America prosecutor, I’m sickened at the charges leveled against this man. They aren’t supported by the known evidence. The state is trying to coerce him into a guilty plea to lesser charges rather than grapple with the complexity and gray in the case and enduring the ire of some of the public - as any truly good prosecutor following the mandate to ‘seek justice, not merely convictions’ should expect to every day of his or her career.

The force of nature that is a parent with a dead kid drives far too many prosecutors to doggedly pursue wrongful convictions in order to quiet the outraged victim family. Sadly in some cases, victims are victims of their own idiocy first and foremost.

These kids had ZERO reason to interact with this guy. If they didn’t like the looks of him they could have floated out of his reach, easily. Surrounding him, yelling insults and accusations, touching him - they absolutely provoked a confrontation and it is entirely within the reasonable standard for a man outnumbered 4 or 5 to 1 to muster all means available for self defense.

He’ll be acquitted.

This posting is concerning. Are you in fact a "former rural red state America prosecutor?"

Here is another angle on what happened:

https://www.thedailybeast.com/nicolae-miu-gun-lovi...on-with-tubing-murder-cops-say

It seems this man was behaving aggressively towards the kids, and not the other way around. The kids repeatedly asked him to leave them alone. A group of 20-something kids came to the rescue, because the teen age kids were yelling for help - before the stabbings began. If I understand the account correctly, a girl from the second group was one of the young folks who were suddenly stabbed without having done or said anything to provoke the man into stabbing her.

I hope if you really are a former prosecutor, you don't intend to go back to being a prosecutor. You're making assumptions without knowing all the facts.

When did we start believing the recall accuracy of drunk individuals?

When there's video from other bystanders backing the kids account

Clearcut video?

[Anonymous]

I have read the Daily Beast article several times. A female victim's account of what happened conveniently cannot recall what the group & she said to the 52 year old man, yet recalls clearly "facts" that indicate that the 52 year old was the instigator.

Unclear as to when the first stabbing occurred and which person was the first stabbing victim.

Seems as though both sides are being untruthful. The video of part of the encounter should help establish some accuracy of what transpired.

Does not appear to be any indication of premeditation.

[Anonymous]

Y'all don't know the whole story.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I have read the Daily Beast article several times. A female victim's account of what happened conveniently cannot recall what the group & she said to the 52 year old man, yet recalls clearly "facts" that indicate that the 52 year old was the instigator.

Unclear as to when the first stabbing occurred and which person was the first stabbing victim.

Seems as though both sides are being untruthful. The video of part of the encounter should help establish some accuracy of what transpired.

Does not appear to be any indication of premeditation.

I have also read several of the different accounts, including the Daily Beast article. I wouldn't say untruthful but the stories are very different and don't seem to line up at all. I don't think that's unusual.

I don't see any premeditation, from anyone. The episode was totally out of control and there was probably alcohol and maybe other drugs involved. It was horrific and tragic.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So he approached them. If he thought they had it then the snorkel part gets creepier. Was he staring at them underwater trying to spot it? Grabbing onto a tube where he thought a person was hiding it? As an engineer what made him think the phone was there?

it's to reasonable to ask whether someone had found a phone? The teens were drunk. Their minds were altered

I never said it wasn’t reasonable for him to ask. But if they said no and then he got up in their space and was touching their tubes and not leaving them alone after they asked him to be left alone, he was essentially saying, “I don’t believe you, and I’m searching.” At that point, he goes from dude asking about a phone into space-invading creeper guy, 100%. And ring-a-ding-ding, turns out he IS a crazy creeper guy, what with being a murderer who stabbed three other people to the point that two had to be *airlifted* to the hospital, the other two rushed to the hospital. Intestines hanging out of bodies, organs exposed. A teen life over, others severely injured, and then he tries to flee.

He will be convicted. 100% he will be convicted, and while his sentence might be somewhat lenient given all the circumstances, he will absolutely serve jail time. I’ll see you all back here in a few months to tell you I told you so.

I'm not sure if it's reasonable to ask about a missing cell phone lost in a river. Why? Because those things sink like stones when they're dropped in water. Why would a group of kids floating down the river have anything to do with a cell phone lying somewhere on the riverbed ? ?

I think it's reasonable to ask about a misplaced cell phone. Say, it goes missing sometime in the course of a shopping trip. It's reasonable to backtrack and ask companies if it might be in their lost and found. But suspecting a group of kids saw the phone fall into the water and somehow managed to catch it with the intent to steal it? That's not reasonable at all. He was already behaving irrationally.

Apparently it was in a floating bag designed to keep phones/keys/wallets on that type of trip. So i don’t think a quick and polite inquiry was wrong, at all! What I think we will eventually find out in trial is that when they said they hadn’t seen it, he didn’t believe them and then started getting in their space, maybe accusing. He could have just waited for them to exit the area before searching, but he didn’t. He chose to get up in their space, and yes, that is creepy if you’ve already said no we haven’t seen the phone.

DCUM is a picture perfect reason why juries must be vetted. You just made up facts.

I read the FACT that it was in a floating bag in a news story, and I said "I think" about the rest of my THOUGHTS. Of course if I were on a jury I would listen to all facts and evidence presented. But as a yapper on DCUM (same as you, Jack), I get to say what I THINK and come up with theories. That's like what these threads are, dude. Bye.