School Shooting in Michigan. 3 Teens DEAD. 1 15-yr old suspect in custody.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:There are a lot of shocking aspects of this story. But for me the most painful/unbelievable/horrible is how a child wrote “help me” on a note, and the parents didn’t help or react or anything. As a parent, I just don’t get it.

x1000000

People like this are not parents, or even human, they are selfish animals.

Agree. Their child was in crisis and they didn’t even respond. Maybe they could have saved their son from throwing his life away. I don’t know how they are still living with themselves. Aside from the culpability to the victims’, they failed their own child.

There must be such disconnect between these parents and Ethan. The fact that they would go on the run when he's in prison even further emphasizes it.

They also hired prominent lawyers for themselves but left him with a public defender.

I've wondered about this the entire time. I'd love to hear their lawyer's assessment of this.

Most likely their lawyers are being funded by an organization tied to gun rights.The org. did not offer to represent their son. It’s a boutique law office, no way they could afford this on their own

This. The benefactors don’t care about the son - they know his case isn’t winnable.

We shouldn't be surprised that a gun rights group would take this case. It'll be a blockbuster and could shift the way prosecutors treat gun owners whose guns are used in a crime like this. They are probably especially alarmed because this particular couple is highly unsympathetic for a host of reasons (former DUIs, dad skipping out on child support for previous kid, callous indifference to his cry for help, going on the lam, getting their own lawyer while kid gets a public attorney) and their actions and failures to act are specific and identifiable and really outside the norms of decent parenting. They are the perfect kind of people to make an example of.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:There are a lot of shocking aspects of this story. But for me the most painful/unbelievable/horrible is how a child wrote “help me” on a note, and the parents didn’t help or react or anything. As a parent, I just don’t get it.

x1000000

People like this are not parents, or even human, they are selfish animals.

Agree. Their child was in crisis and they didn’t even respond. Maybe they could have saved their son from throwing his life away. I don’t know how they are still living with themselves. Aside from the culpability to the victims’, they failed their own child.

There must be such disconnect between these parents and Ethan. The fact that they would go on the run when he's in prison even further emphasizes it.

They also hired prominent lawyers for themselves but left him with a public defender.

I've wondered about this the entire time. I'd love to hear their lawyer's assessment of this.

Most likely their lawyers are being funded by an organization tied to gun rights.The org. did not offer to represent their son. It’s a boutique law office, no way they could afford this on their own

This. The benefactors don’t care about the son - they know his case isn’t winnable.

We shouldn't be surprised that a gun rights group would take this case. It'll be a blockbuster and could shift the way prosecutors treat gun owners whose guns are used in a crime like this. They are probably especially alarmed because this particular couple is highly unsympathetic for a host of reasons (former DUIs, dad skipping out on child support for previous kid, callous indifference to his cry for help, going on the lam, getting their own lawyer while kid gets a public attorney) and their actions and failures to act are specific and identifiable and really outside the norms of decent parenting. They are the perfect kind of people to make an example of.

Also the prosecutor seems both sharp and ambitious.

[Anonymous]

This is not about discipline. The child was in mental health crisis.

He should have been sent to a hospital as would have happened if it was a life threatening physical illness.

You don’t leave the welfare of a kid who is talking the way he was in the hands of the questionable adults who raised him to be that way!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:This is not about discipline. The child was in mental health crisis.

He should have been sent to a hospital as would have happened if it was a life threatening physical illness.

You don’t leave the welfare of a kid who is talking the way he was in the hands of the questionable adults who raised him to be that way!

When the child is in a mental health crisis because of the parents and home environment what can anyone do? Usually it is the parents who are advocating for their children for services. With your reasoning, 1/2 of the school kids should be in CPS, because their parents should be in prison. Especially is they are poor and not educated. Can't call the exterminators on these pests can we?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:This is not about discipline. The child was in mental health crisis.

He should have been sent to a hospital as would have happened if it was a life threatening physical illness.

You don’t leave the welfare of a kid who is talking the way he was in the hands of the questionable adults who raised him to be that way!

Schools can’t override parents when it comes to institutionalization and seeking treatment for a student. The school is a government agency, but it doesn’t have the force of policing or forcing health care decisions onto families.

What don’t people get about that? And do you really want school administrators to have that kind of power over your families? Schools really can’t act when there’s uncooperative parents and no signs of physical/sexual abuse.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:The problem is we've normalized deviant behavior in schools.

Kids can wander around in the elementary school classrooms and they are not disciplined. During serious infractions (chair throwing etc) the behaved students are disciplined in that they have to exit the classroom and lose instruction time.

There is huge pressure at the high school level not to suspend students or get police involved due to Restorative Justice. Stats are kept by school and by district of suspensions and police involvement. It is supposed to be a good thing not to suspend students for misbehavior.

m

Absolutely this. God forbid we actually punish a problem child or worse, remove him from school…can’t do that! We’re gonna hurt his feelings!
It’s sick.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:WaPo now reporting the letter sent by the superintendent yesterday to parents outlining the chronology of events with this kid at the school. Apparently, the report by the teacher and meeting with parents that day all stayed at the guidance counselor level. The principal and VP were never looped in. Wow.

Such obvious CYA bullshit.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:There are a lot of shocking aspects of this story. But for me the most painful/unbelievable/horrible is how a child wrote “help me” on a note, and the parents didn’t help or react or anything. As a parent, I just don’t get it.

x1000000

People like this are not parents, or even human, they are selfish animals.

Agree. Their child was in crisis and they didn’t even respond. Maybe they could have saved their son from throwing his life away. I don’t know how they are still living with themselves. Aside from the culpability to the victims’, they failed their own child.

There must be such disconnect between these parents and Ethan. The fact that they would go on the run when he's in prison even further emphasizes it.

You’re thinking like a sane, rational, concerned, loving parent. That’s not who these people are. Their motto is “don’t get caught,” so they were foolishly trying to run. They don’t have the brains or other resources for that, but again, they’re not rational people.

I don't think they are irrational or mentally ill or anything else people are throwing out. I think they are like a lot of parents these days, selfish and entitled. Once again take a look at the parenting forum and the number of posts where teenagers are engaging in unhealthy behaviors and the majority of posters always reply, it's no big deal, so hovering over your kid, you are going to ruin your relationship with them if you set any sort of limits.

It’s a safe bet there are substance abuse issues in this home and undiagnosed mental health issues as well.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is not about discipline. The child was in mental health crisis.

He should have been sent to a hospital as would have happened if it was a life threatening physical illness.

You don’t leave the welfare of a kid who is talking the way he was in the hands of the questionable adults who raised him to be that way!

Schools can’t override parents when it comes to institutionalization and seeking treatment for a student. The school is a government agency, but it doesn’t have the force of policing or forcing health care decisions onto families.

What don’t people get about that? And do you really want school administrators to have that kind of power over your families? Schools really can’t act when there’s uncooperative parents and no signs of physical/sexual abuse.

All states have provisions for involuntarily committing someone who is a danger to themselves or others. The police would have known this had they been called. I’ve been very impressed by the Sheriff so far.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is not about discipline. The child was in mental health crisis.

He should have been sent to a hospital as would have happened if it was a life threatening physical illness.

You don’t leave the welfare of a kid who is talking the way he was in the hands of the questionable adults who raised him to be that way!

Schools can’t override parents when it comes to institutionalization and seeking treatment for a student. The school is a government agency, but it doesn’t have the force of policing or forcing health care decisions onto families.

What don’t people get about that? And do you really want school administrators to have that kind of power over your families? Schools really can’t act when there’s uncooperative parents and no signs of physical/sexual abuse.

I don't think of it as control "over my family."

I think of it as responsible adults stepping in to protect a child with very limited power.

Parents do not own their children.

This is from the PA dept of education's Model Suicide Prevention Policy:

<<Procedures for Parental Involvement

Parents or guardians of a student identified as being at risk of suicide must be immediately notified by the school and must be involved in consequent actions and provided with crisis and community resources. If any mandated reporter suspects that a student’s risk status is the result of abuse or neglect, that individual must comply with the reporting requirements of the Child Protective Services Law.

If the parents or guardians refuse to cooperate and there is any doubt regarding the child’s safety, the school personnel who directly witnessed the expressed suicide thought or intention will pursue a 302 involuntary behavioral health assessment by calling County Emergency Services at [provide number] and ask for a delegate. >>

[Anonymous]

Local outlets and even the NY Times are reporting the district is up a creek and the lawsuits will be flying this week.

https://deadlinedetroit.com/articles/29396/oxford_school_district_likely_to_be_sued_over_shootings

[Anonymous]

I live in Loudoun and can totally picture this happening here. Reminds me of the case where the HS was suicidal. He told his friend, who told the counselor, who met with the suicidal boy…and did nothing and told no one else. The boy killed himself a couple days later.

AND if the friend had not EMAILED the counselor (creating a paper trail) the school and district would have denied the whole thing. As it was, they still closed ranks and totally defended their indefensible actions.

[Anonymous]

Letter without paywall:

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.wxyz.com/news/oxford-school-shooting/oxford-community-schools-superintendent-details-schools-version-of-events%3f_amp=true

[Anonymous]

Did the shooter HAND IN the paper that said, "I can't stop the thoughts. Blood everywhere. I want help" or did a teacher find/see it?

I did hear those statements were written on an assignment sheet he was supposed to complete.

If he handed it in before the crime, then I actually think he was hoping an adult would stop him.

Not sympathetic view, I am sure. But there was a moment in time that morning when everyone was still alive.

[Anonymous]

Interesting article about Shannon Smith, one of the lawyers for the parents.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.newsweek.com/who-shannon-smith-larry-nassars-attorney-reps-alleged-oxford-shooters-parents-1655983%3famp=1