How do I deal with this awful dynamic with my mom?

[Anonymous]

My brother and I are estranged. It’s been several years since he cut me off. Without going into too much detail, my brother repeatedly did / said unkind things, I kept my mouth shut each time over the years, and then after one especially egregious episode, got upset with him and told him how hurt I felt.no raised my voice. He responded by telling me he never wanted to speak with me again, even if I was “dying of cancer”, and that I was “seriously f*cked up and an embarrassment” to him. He subsequently blocked my number and has cut me off.

This was several years ago. I told my mom about the incident at the time and my mom immediately took my brother’s side, stating he was in his rights to cut me off because I yelled at him (see above). Aside from the fact that it hurts that she refuses to acknowledge how toxic my brother’s behavior was over the course of years - years where I shut my mouth and dealt with it - she implicitly and explicitly believes he’s the victim.

At the same time, she repeatedly brings him up, repeatedly makes references to him, talks about his “adorable” children (who I’ve never met), and in the latest episode, apparently asked my brother to select and send me a Christmas gift on her behalf, causing a gift with his name to show up at my door. For lack of a better description, that was triggering.

When I bring up how painful I find her behavior (not just the gift situation but the fact that she’s taken his side, doesn’t respect boundaries), she tells me I’m overreacting, irrational, denies that she doing or saying any of these things or that’s her intent. It’s become unbearable and if it weren’t for the fact that I’m trying to honor my children’s relationship with her, I’d stop all contact. I have fantasies of moving far, far away from her and my brother.

Not sure what I’m looking for here - maybe perspective and/or advice. Please be kind. My mom was very abusive physically and emotionally to me in my childhood and unfortunately, while it’s manifesting in different ways, it feels like this is an extension of those same behaviors.

[Anonymous]

^paragraph 1: *and raised my voice

[Anonymous]

You pull way back from her and expose your children to her very minimally and always with supervision. Tell her you will end all conversations that involve talking about your brother. Why honor or foster a relationship with your abuser?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

My brother and I are estranged. It’s been several years since he cut me off. Without going into too much detail, my brother repeatedly did / said unkind things, I kept my mouth shut each time over the years, and then after one especially egregious episode, got upset with him and told him how hurt I felt.no raised my voice. He responded by telling me he never wanted to speak with me again, even if I was “dying of cancer”, and that I was “seriously f*cked up and an embarrassment” to him. He subsequently blocked my number and has cut me off.

This was several years ago. I told my mom about the incident at the time and my mom immediately took my brother’s side, stating he was in his rights to cut me off because I yelled at him (see above). Aside from the fact that it hurts that she refuses to acknowledge how toxic my brother’s behavior was over the course of years - years where I shut my mouth and dealt with it - she implicitly and explicitly believes he’s the victim.

At the same time, she repeatedly brings him up, repeatedly makes references to him, talks about his “adorable” children (who I’ve never met), and in the latest episode, apparently asked my brother to select and send me a Christmas gift on her behalf, causing a gift with his name to show up at my door. For lack of a better description, that was triggering.

When I bring up how painful I find her behavior (not just the gift situation but the fact that she’s taken his side, doesn’t respect boundaries), she tells me I’m overreacting, irrational, denies that she doing or saying any of these things or that’s her intent. It’s become unbearable and if it weren’t for the fact that I’m trying to honor my children’s relationship with her, I’d stop all contact. I have fantasies of moving far, far away from her and my brother.

Not sure what I’m looking for here - maybe perspective and/or advice. Please be kind. My mom was very abusive physically and emotionally to me in my childhood and unfortunately, while it’s manifesting in different ways, it feels like this is an extension of those same behaviors.

Her behavior doesn't just feel abusive, it is abusive.

When she brings up brother, you leave, or hang up, or otherwise exit the scene.

[Anonymous]

Stop making the excuse that keeping contact with her is about your kids having access to their grandmother. I’d never let my kids near someone who was abusive to me. Full stop.

I think you’re using your kids as an excuse to stay connected with her because you still keep holding out hope that your mother will change.

She won’t. Accept that.

I also wonder what you’re getting out of staying engaged with her. Perhaps it’s the drama that is feeding something in you. The more dramatic all of this is, the more you can feel a purpose and wallow in being a victim. It’s a dynamic that needs to end. The only person who can change is you. So pick up yourself up and disengage. Stop calling her. Stop visiting. Let all calls go to voicemail. Cut off contact. Your kids will really be fine.

It’s time to step up and take control of your life. If not today, then when?

[Anonymous]

Thanks, PPs. Need this perspective. And no, I don’t want to be the victim as much as I know my kids value their relationship with my mom. My mom also has moments of being very warm and kind to me so it’s an abusive cycle, I suppose. One where she’s kind, I get sucked in, then something happens that’s hurtful. She’s 84 so I am hesitant to cut her off …. Therapy for me in 2022! In the meantime, thank you.

[Anonymous]

I cut off my abusive mom and siblings two years ago. Best decision I ever made, my life is so much more peaceful now.

Block their numbers and move on with your life.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I cut off my abusive mom and siblings two years ago. Best decision I ever made, my life is so much more peaceful now.

Block their numbers and move on with your life.

Op here. I want to do this, but A) feel sad for my kids who love my mom. I’m always supervising and she is very sweet to them (which sometimes I strangely resent because she was so unkind to me as a kid - but again, therapy for me in 2022!) and B) I do feel a sense of shame that my brother cut me off. I feel embarrassed and also hurt by the injustice of it. That someone who was so toxic and unkind cut me off telling me I was the problem. It’s hard to articulate ….

But yes, peace is what I don’t have with my mom in my life.

[Anonymous]

I have learned a lot from Dr. Ramani vids, OP. You might want to watch the vids on trauma bonds.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sKvZGEn0cBY

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I cut off my abusive mom and siblings two years ago. Best decision I ever made, my life is so much more peaceful now.

Block their numbers and move on with your life.

Op here. I want to do this, but A) feel sad for my kids who love my mom. I’m always supervising and she is very sweet to them (which sometimes I strangely resent because she was so unkind to me as a kid - but again, therapy for me in 2022!) and B) I do feel a sense of shame that my brother cut me off. I feel embarrassed and also hurt by the injustice of it. That someone who was so toxic and unkind cut me off telling me I was the problem. It’s hard to articulate ….

But yes, peace is what I don’t have with my mom in my life.

Yes, abusers can be very charming. They can also be careful who they target....for a while. As she ages or as life stressors hit, she may not be so careful and your kids could become fair game. Your mental health is more important to your child's well-being than seeing grandma more often than you feel comfortable. Also, what message do you give your children that it's OK for an abusive person to have this much importance in your life just because she behaves...for now...with grandchildren? Set the boundaries that feel comfortable to you. Your kids are getting sucked into something that could be quite disturbing when grandma finally blows her cover. The more attached they get more life shattering it is when they see her dark side.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I cut off my abusive mom and siblings two years ago. Best decision I ever made, my life is so much more peaceful now.

Block their numbers and move on with your life.

Op here. I want to do this, but A) feel sad for my kids who love my mom. I’m always supervising and she is very sweet to them (which sometimes I strangely resent because she was so unkind to me as a kid - but again, therapy for me in 2022!) and B) I do feel a sense of shame that my brother cut me off. I feel embarrassed and also hurt by the injustice of it. That someone who was so toxic and unkind cut me off telling me I was the problem. It’s hard to articulate ….

But yes, peace is what I don’t have with my mom in my life.

Damn, you really are latched on to using your kids as an excuse to stay connected. Just answer this: What would be the worst thing that would happen if your kids didn't see their grandmother (aka, the person who abused you) anymore. Name it. And then name what would be the best thing that would happen if you were to cut off all relations with your mom. Compare the two. Something tells me that cutting her off would result in longer lasting healthier results for everyone. You'd end up being a stronger, healthier, better mom for your kids. Right now they have a toxic grandmother and a mother who expends way too much energy caught up in an abusive cycle. You think you're managing it all, but you're not.

Sorry to sound harsh, but that's what I see.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I cut off my abusive mom and siblings two years ago. Best decision I ever made, my life is so much more peaceful now.

Block their numbers and move on with your life.

Op here. I want to do this, but A) feel sad for my kids who love my mom. I’m always supervising and she is very sweet to them (which sometimes I strangely resent because she was so unkind to me as a kid - but again, therapy for me in 2022!) and B) I do feel a sense of shame that my brother cut me off. I feel embarrassed and also hurt by the injustice of it. That someone who was so toxic and unkind cut me off telling me I was the problem. It’s hard to articulate ….

But yes, peace is what I don’t have with my mom in my life.

Damn, you really are latched on to using your kids as an excuse to stay connected. Just answer this: What would be the worst thing that would happen if your kids didn't see their grandmother (aka, the person who abused you) anymore. Name it. And then name what would be the best thing that would happen if you were to cut off all relations with your mom. Compare the two. Something tells me that cutting her off would result in longer lasting healthier results for everyone. You'd end up being a stronger, healthier, better mom for your kids. Right now they have a toxic grandmother and a mother who expends way too much energy caught up in an abusive cycle. You think you're managing it all, but you're not.

Sorry to sound harsh, but that's what I see.

I hear your point, PP. I’ve actually received mixed feedback on this topic from friends and even my therapist. The alternate line of thinking is that my kids don’t have to have the same relationship with my mom that I do and that I’m depriving them of a bond with family, something I struggle with because my mom cut me off from family members she had beef with. As a result I missed out on some meaningful relationships as a kid, though happily have rekindled a couple of these with cousins and the like as an adult.

Anyway, I’m not latched to keeping my kids in contact with my mom as much as trying to not to damage my kids in other ways. And it’s made more complicated because my mom is very sweet with them - though PP above I appreciate your point that my mom could unleash a different side. But yes, completely see your point. Thanks again for your post.

[Anonymous]

OP, your mom might be nice to your kids but aren’t they around when she treats you poorly sometimes? That can’t be good for them to see or. A good model for how to communicate with loved ones.

[Anonymous]

It's hard to deal with family members who do hurtful things, and hard to work around your own desire to have normal interactions with them that they are not capable of having. I'm sorry your brother was hurtful to you and your mother did not believe you or acknowledge your hurt. The gift thing is bizarre--if he's so committed to cutting you out, why is he acquiescing to her demand to send you a gift? All of your family's interactions are tied up with that childhood abuse and playing it out in different ways. She's controlling things and you're the victim again.

IME other people find it very easy to tell you to just cut people out, but IME I had many mixed feelings in doing that. Personally, I have found it more productive to work on drawing boundaries--if things get to be untenable, I can always cut her out. So for example, tell your mom that if she brings up your brother, conversations and visits will end immediately. And when it happens, just calmly say, Mom, I told you I won't talk about him. I'm leaving now, and I'll see you next week/visit/whatever. See what comes of that and if she is able to be more respectful of your boundaries. I was able to get my mom to basically stop bringing up my brother and it gave me a chance to focus on dealing with things in therapy.

[Anonymous]

So two people basically agree you are the problem? Sounds like the problem is you? Is that possible? What happen and why?