What is the parenting secret of Orthodox Jewish families?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Well, they’ve probably never seen a screen/ipad in their life. Unless their mom is “influencer”

Are you kidding? I live near a large orthodox community and the kids are on iPads constantly in their strollers. They aren’t Amish.

They might have some electronics but their media tends to be extremely locked down. They aren’t watching the things regular kids are, and certainly not dirty music, video games etc.

There is simply not a tolerance for acting out, cursing etc that many other parents tolerate. It’s just not done. But when a kid/teen acts out or defies their parents, it is a BIG deal and parents often overreact, and these kids seriously spiral. The cohesiveness of the community works… until it doesn’t.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I sometimes see large Orthodox Jewish families out and about and the kids are so calm and presentable! Yesterday I saw a dad on his own with 6 kids that all appeared to be under 12, including two babies in a double stroller. The kids were all calm and happy, played with the babies, and stuck close to dad. Dad appeared a little weary (seems normal) but nothing like the extreme exhaustion I know I would project if I went out with six kids. I did not hear a single whine or argument from the kids or a single harsh word from the dad. Amazing! How do they do it?

Like most religious fundamentalist, I suspect there's a lot of "Old Testament" parenting.

PP. there really isn’t but there is incredible social influence.

[Anonymous]

My mom was the oldest of 7 in a Catholic family. They weren't happy. Having lots of kids is not for everyone.

My DH and I are agnostic and have one child. We both work full time in flexible jobs and IMO we have the absolute best life for us.

Anyway watch those docs about the Duggars to understand how ultra-religious families keep their kids so well behaved. Spoiler alert - it's fear.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Like Catholics, Mormons, and other religious groups with big families, they expect the older children (especially the older daughters, but sons too) to help. It’s a lot easier to handle a bunch of kids when the big ones change diapers, wipe noses, put on shoes, read books, etc.

It is not the responsibility of older children to take care of their siblings. it is a form of child abuse.

If it is made *their* responsibility * elusively*. Look up parentification. Otherwise it’s no different then telling them to wash the dishes or so their homework.

“Elusively” is the wrong word, so maybe cool it with the excessive asterisks.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Like Catholics, Mormons, and other religious groups with big families, they expect the older children (especially the older daughters, but sons too) to help. It’s a lot easier to handle a bunch of kids when the big ones change diapers, wipe noses, put on shoes, read books, etc.

+1. I saw a group at a playground yesterday and my first thought was "I bet they were really glad the first 2 kids were girls" because the older girls were doing a lovely job helping the little ones, while the two oldest boys ran around with sticks. Not that boys couldn't help, but the gender divisions are pretty strict with the way they are raised, so they wouldn't naturally be asked to.

At risk of being a gender essentialist … sometimes girls really like to interact with and mother their younger sibs. I wasn’t like that to an extreme but I definitely really loved taking care of my baby sister born when I was 12. And my 8 year old sister was extremely close to the baby and was constantly playing school etc.

Same. My parents were very anti gender roles and would have loved to dress me in unisex/boy clothing. I showed them! I only wore pink and dresses (still do). I was beyond thrilled to take care of my younger siblings (8 years younger). I was a nanny throughout high school and college. Sometimes it’s not how you’re raised, sometimes people just gravitate towards certain things. I see this with my own kids. I have one girl who is a tomboy and the other wants to be a princess. It’s nothing I did. Not all kids resent taking care of others, but I know some do of course. My son has lots and lots of chores and does the same ones as my girls. I’m not raising a boy who watches women work while he sits.

To answer op, I think the people who have large families know how to take care of them and also like kids. The same can’t be said for most moms. Also, none of those families practice gentle/permissive parenting. Even if they don’t spank, bad behavior is NOT accepted.

My permissive parenting friends let their kids do anything. The other day at a playdate my friends two kids started jumping on her couch and she let them. I told my kids no, don’t get up there too. The friend was shocked and said they weren’t hurting anything. Ffs. Kids need to learn how to respect everything.

As a non abusive Catholic mom of a big family, I agree with this. No gentle or permissive parenting of a large family. Privileges like screens and sweets and fun are EARNED not the baseline. Kids are brought up to respect the parents who are their natural authority (underneath God) and to contribute to the good of the family (God’s design and plan). My oldest who is 13 is a boy and he does not gravitate towards childcare or younger kids, but he is able to perform his role in the family to look after his younger siblings and guide them as God designed for him (due to his birth order).

Does that make sense? It’s a different way of looking at the world than secular culture which does contribute to child behavior imo. Plus, 90 mins a week of mass with no entertainment and only boredom and hymns and liturgy does help forge self control and self restraint.

This sort of brainwashing is startling to me. I'd rather have a child that doesn’t get compliments on behavior than one who is stuck in a narrow "god given" box. I value free thought over obedience in general.

This. No, PP, “God has designed” for you and their father to take full responsibility for the care of all the children you chose to create, not to pawn it off on your barely teen kid.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I sometimes see large Orthodox Jewish families out and about and the kids are so calm and presentable! Yesterday I saw a dad on his own with 6 kids that all appeared to be under 12, including two babies in a double stroller. The kids were all calm and happy, played with the babies, and stuck close to dad. Dad appeared a little weary (seems normal) but nothing like the extreme exhaustion I know I would project if I went out with six kids. I did not hear a single whine or argument from the kids or a single harsh word from the dad. Amazing! How do they do it?

No secret
This is not the norm at all. Iron fists rule many families.
Kids especially boys run away all the time around age 14/15
They are then sent to reeducation places. Yep Miami has quite a few. My cousins sent their sons.
Domestic violence is high you get shunned if you try and leave the cult

This was my mother’s world growing up. I still have cousins in it.

No better that ultra religious Christians
Just like the Duggars.
Pious pretending to be good people while not educating their children, lots gets welfare.

MAGA which is horrifying in the name of Israel dumbest thing ever. As a grandchild of a survivor I will never forgive this side of my family for supporting that crap.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Well, they’ve probably never seen a screen/ipad in their life. Unless their mom is “influencer”

Could be! I also wonder if there are just better developed parenting skills in the community since most families are large, and children are considered a blessing so they are treated with more care? I obviously am also familiar with the criticisms of orthodox communities, but you never really hear of child abuse or neglect being a big part of that.

What are you taking about ?

Ultra religious abuse runs rampant!

From Chabad to Hasidic to Lubbies abuse is common.

Domestic violence is huge.

Women have real trouble getting a divorce from a terrible husband.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Spare the rod, spoil the child.

I’m not familiar with the orthodox being big spankers.

Oh yes they are and they hit their wives

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I think being serious about religion requires a lot of self- discipline. So it could be that religious parents have self-discipline and their children are more likely to be self-disciplined as well.
The other aspect is that these families have a strong culture and exist a little bit outside of mainstream American culture. So while I am sure they are influenced by parenting trends in pop culture, they likely also receive a lot of community support for parenting more or less like their parents did.

No

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think being serious about religion requires a lot of self- discipline. So it could be that religious parents have self-discipline and their children are more likely to be self-disciplined as well.
The other aspect is that these families have a strong culture and exist a little bit outside of mainstream American culture. So while I am sure they are influenced by parenting trends in pop culture, they likely also receive a lot of community support for parenting more or less like their parents did.

If all the women have 8 kids - what kind of support would be available? Oh, I'll watch 16 kids while you get your hair done?

The orthodox Jewish moms probably aren’t getting their hair done, but for the dentist or something, by the time you have eight kids the oldest ones are able to watch the younger ones for a bit or at least be left alone. “Hey Chaya can you keep my baby and toddler while I get a filling” is not a heavy lift.

Yes they are getting their hair done even though they wear wigs .

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Also bear in mind you’re seeing these kids on their best behavior. People always tell me my large family is so well behaved and that is, uh, not my impression…

Aw give yourself more credit! But I am curious - do you take them all out yourself on outings? do you go to religious services?

I also come from a large religious family and I think we appeared pretty organized in public although the only place we went together indoors was church. I wonder if the needed discipline in public to manage a lot of kids at a religious service is part of the way the kids and parents “learn” the skills needed to appear so calm and orderly.

I think this is part of it too. We switched from a non-denominational Christian church to a Catholic Church when my oldest was in first grade. It wasn’t immediate, but there was definitely a change in the kids’ behavior over the next year or so. When your family has to figure out how to be calm and obedient for an hour a week, it kind of spills over into the rest of your lives.

Omg don’t be absurd

Irish Catholic families are not calm with 12 kids

I grew up on a block with those families. Emotional and physical abuse was the norm still is,

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Well, they’ve probably never seen a screen/ipad in their life. Unless their mom is “influencer”

They haven’t seen too many books in their lives either. They are not brought up like other American children. Education consists solely of religion information and the women are expected to marry at a very early age and produce many children.

+1

[Anonymous]

The above poster is correct. When my kids were little, it was supposed to be gentle parenting. Strict rules were out, discussing good and bad choices was in. Now, of course, we know that that leads to lazy parenting and poorly behaved children. Orthodox Jewish families rule by the iron fist and get highly disciplined children. Of course, not all families are like that but those families probably don't bring their children out in public.

[Anonymous]

Families with disabilities get driven out of the community so they stop dressing Orthodox.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Families with disabilities get driven out of the community so they stop dressing Orthodox.

+1