"the victim of the affair is not always the victim of the marriage"

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don’t love Esther perel, but in fairness, her work centers around having a good marriage after infidelity if it’s possible. She isn’t trying to justify cheating at all, or blaming the party who didn’t cheat.

It is fair to point out that if, say, one spouse stops showing interest in the other spouse, that might be a factor in why the other would cheat. I think that Perel’s take is that in order for the marriage to get to a good place, the partner who didn’t cheat needs, eventually, to start showing interest in their spouse again.

I find the whole idea repulsive though. Perel says that people who are still willing to work on their marriage after their partner cheats are heroes. Good for them, I could never be that hero.

One persons hero is another persons sucker.

Really change cheating to addiction or hitting.

So women that are abused are suckers. Wow- you are beyond an a-hole.

No. People who buy Esther Perel’s BS are suckers.

Take her philosophy change the word to hit or addiction and you will see his bat sh!t crazy she is.

As a betrayed spouse, I am no fan of Esther. She’s an affair apologist.

What was your contribution to your marriage’s failure? We all like to believe we are victims. I was in an abusivo marriage for years. My spouse hit me, verbally abused me, emotionally abused me. I finally realized that I was not a victim but a willing participant. I enabled. I then refuses to participate any longer. I walked out.

[Anonymous]

For some time, I think I received some validation from the abuse. I was the good spouse and parent. My spouse was evil. In the end, I just realized she was sick and needed help but that I could not give it. The marriage ended when I realized that. I’m now happy and at peace.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don’t love Esther perel, but in fairness, her work centers around having a good marriage after infidelity if it’s possible. She isn’t trying to justify cheating at all, or blaming the party who didn’t cheat.

It is fair to point out that if, say, one spouse stops showing interest in the other spouse, that might be a factor in why the other would cheat. I think that Perel’s take is that in order for the marriage to get to a good place, the partner who didn’t cheat needs, eventually, to start showing interest in their spouse again.

I find the whole idea repulsive though. Perel says that people who are still willing to work on their marriage after their partner cheats are heroes. Good for them, I could never be that hero.

One persons hero is another persons sucker.

Really change cheating to addiction or hitting.

So women that are abused are suckers. Wow- you are beyond an a-hole.

No. People who buy Esther Perel’s BS are suckers.

Take her philosophy change the word to hit or addiction and you will see his bat sh!t crazy she is.

As a betrayed spouse, I am no fan of Esther. She’s an affair apologist.

What was your contribution to your marriage’s failure? We all like to believe we are victims. I was in an abusivo marriage for years. My spouse hit me, verbally abused me, emotionally abused me. I finally realized that I was not a victim but a willing participant. I enabled. I then refuses to participate any longer. I walked out.

Please get help

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don’t love Esther perel, but in fairness, her work centers around having a good marriage after infidelity if it’s possible. She isn’t trying to justify cheating at all, or blaming the party who didn’t cheat.

It is fair to point out that if, say, one spouse stops showing interest in the other spouse, that might be a factor in why the other would cheat. I think that Perel’s take is that in order for the marriage to get to a good place, the partner who didn’t cheat needs, eventually, to start showing interest in their spouse again.

I find the whole idea repulsive though. Perel says that people who are still willing to work on their marriage after their partner cheats are heroes. Good for them, I could never be that hero.

One persons hero is another persons sucker.

Really change cheating to addiction or hitting.

So women that are abused are suckers. Wow- you are beyond an a-hole.

No. People who buy Esther Perel’s BS are suckers.

Take her philosophy change the word to hit or addiction and you will see his bat sh!t crazy she is.

As a betrayed spouse, I am no fan of Esther. She’s an affair apologist.

What was your contribution to your marriage’s failure? We all like to believe we are victims. I was in an abusivo marriage for years. My spouse hit me, verbally abused me, emotionally abused me. I finally realized that I was not a victim but a willing participant. I enabled. I then refuses to participate any longer. I walked out.

My marriage is thriving. My family is thriving. My kids are thriving and we are happy. He’s gotten the help he needed. He was never abusive, always a great father and contributor. We always had passion and a great friendship on top of that. He’s gotten the help he’s needed. In a 25 year relationship that did not define it.

We aren’t all victims. I don’t put up with sh@t. No shrinking violet.

[Anonymous]

I whole-heartedly agree with the title of this thread. There are people in this world who like to box others in, don't allow them any agency, and then are chagrined at the consequences.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:That is very 2015 thinking. Psychologist have done much research since.

Marriages are an agreement between 2 adult parties unless it is an arranged marriage or if one is being held hostage.

Affairs are not and agreement between 2 people.

It is not reasonable to blame somebody for their spouses actions and is a kin to saying: "I wouldn't hit her if she wasn't such a B*tch" or "I drink because he is such a jerk".

People need to take responsibility for their own actions. If the marriage sucks end it. But... but... but... I don't want to, plain and simple. For the kids, for the money, for selfishness. It's a choice to stay married. It's a breach of an agreement to have an affair.

I agree with this. I'm sure that some affairs are rooted in problems within the marriage, but that's not an excuse. Having an affair crosses a huge line, boundary, and the cheater playing a victim doesn't justify it.

If the marriage is sexless, etc., then man up and either say you are going to open up the marriage or want a divorce. Don't be a coward.

I also think that some infidelity isn't rooted in problems. Some people don't like monogamy. I've dated two man like that. In both instances, we were very serious (in one case living together) and there was nothing wrong. One of them cheated in previous relationships (I didn't find that out until after we were serious). The other one (I know for a fact) cheated on his next girlfriend.

Some people want it all. They want to be able play the field and still have a stable and consistent companion at home. Sometimes cheating isn't rooted in flaws in the marriage; it is rooted in flaws in the cheater.

Absolutely this. You articulated exactly how I feel so we'll.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:The victim of the affair was the OW. He had an EA with a woman who told him she would leave her DH if he left me. Perhaps he was seeking something emotional that was missing in our marriage, but I was so drained by years of emotional and financial abuse by him that I had nothing left to give. So, like other emotional vampires, he found a new source of energy to feed off. Free of some of his negative attentions, my head cleared enough that I could see his abuse of me for what it was. I accepted the help my parents had offered for years. And in my third trimester, I filed for divorce.

I didn't blame her. She was unhappy in her own marriage and my ex has always been able to oversell himself. I was relieved for her and her DC when she decided to stay with her DH, though I heard from multiple sources that it was a financial decision. I consider her the victim of the affair because she was lured into investing so much of herself into a man who was unavailable due to his personality disorder, but claiming only his marriage was holding him back.

Amazing…my husband also says I’m holding him back. Also a narcissist who is financially / emotionally abusive. Affair seeking whatever attention / adoration I could not give him because I was (like you), so beaten down

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:If you watch her full Ted talk, she explains what she means by it. She says that sexual infidelity is only one way to deeply hurt a spouse, and that most affairs actually have an emotional component. She doesn't necessarily consider the "victim of the affair" to have a higher moral standing than the cheater, who might have been a victim of their spouse's indifference, emotional unavailability, and so on.

It's quite a departure from the Satan Vs. Saint Cheated Upon dialogue that is pervasive in DCUM discussions of infidelity.

I'm glad to see Esther Perel becoming more mainstream.

Such complete BS. If you’re the “victim of the marriage,” LEAVE and then do whatever you like.

The excuse making for cheating is so pathetically transparent.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Sounds like victim-blaming bullshit to me.

NO amount of "indifference or emotional unavailability" or anything else justifies an affair. You want out, GET A DIVORCE.

It's not that simple with kids involved. I know you'd like to think it is, but it isn't. My niece and her husband are divorced and he's a bitter drunk, but that hasn't stopped a judge from forcing the the kids to be with him for visitation, even though they don't want to go. He was caught driving drunk with one of the boys already. Liberal state, so slap on the wrist. It's a constant battle. That's her reward for divorce - constant worry when the kids are forced to be with him.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Sounds like victim-blaming bullshit to me.

NO amount of "indifference or emotional unavailability" or anything else justifies an affair. You want out, GET A DIVORCE.

It's not that simple with kids involved. I know you'd like to think it is, but it isn't. My niece and her husband are divorced and he's a bitter drunk, but that hasn't stopped a judge from forcing the the kids to be with him for visitation, even though they don't want to go. He was caught driving drunk with one of the boys already. Liberal state, so slap on the wrist. It's a constant battle. That's her reward for divorce - constant worry when the kids are forced to be with him.

Because living with a drunk full time watching him abuse your mom is so much better. FFS