"the victim of the affair is not always the victim of the marriage"
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Anonymous
| a line oft-repeated by esther perel. if you ever cheated or were cheated on, what is your take on this line? |
Anonymous
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If you watch her full Ted talk, she explains what she means by it. She says that sexual infidelity is only one way to deeply hurt a spouse, and that most affairs actually have an emotional component. She doesn't necessarily consider the "victim of the affair" to have a higher moral standing than the cheater, who might have been a victim of their spouse's indifference, emotional unavailability, and so on.
It's quite a departure from the Satan Vs. Saint Cheated Upon dialogue that is pervasive in DCUM discussions of infidelity. I'm glad to see Esther Perel becoming more mainstream. |
Anonymous
| I think when things like this quote circulate, without the full context of her work, that some of her thinking on affairs is unrepresented. For instance, she thinks that the emotional component can often come from within the cheater, without that much bearing on the spouse (e.g. the classic midlife crisis affair). She also talks about how people in happy marriages cheat. She says that, prodoxically, closer marriages can make for worse sex, because some element of desire and novelty needs to be present in order to have a truly hot time. Perhaps that's why many cheated on spouses have success with "the 180" tactic of not being so dutiful and available. |
Anonymous
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Definitely true in our case.
We are both at fault, as is usually the case. It isn't pretty, and recovery has been challenging. |
Anonymous
| The children who are victims of the affair probably agree with that phrase (out of context). Otherswise it sounds like someone trying to justify it. |
Anonymous
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The victim of the affair was the OW. He had an EA with a woman who told him she would leave her DH if he left me. Perhaps he was seeking something emotional that was missing in our marriage, but I was so drained by years of emotional and financial abuse by him that I had nothing left to give. So, like other emotional vampires, he found a new source of energy to feed off. Free of some of his negative attentions, my head cleared enough that I could see his abuse of me for what it was. I accepted the help my parents had offered for years. And in my third trimester, I filed for divorce.
I didn't blame her. She was unhappy in her own marriage and my ex has always been able to oversell himself. I was relieved for her and her DC when she decided to stay with her DH, though I heard from multiple sources that it was a financial decision. I consider her the victim of the affair because she was lured into investing so much of herself into a man who was unavailable due to his personality disorder, but claiming only his marriage was holding him back. |
Anonymous
| This is a very wise quote, but it is no use trying to have an intelligent discussion about it on DCUM. |
Anonymous
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Who is she?
What are her qualifications? Is he an actual therapist or another Dan Savage? How long has she been married? How many times has she been married? Has she ever cheated? Has she ever been cheated on? |
Anonymous
My take is it isn't an original thought. The attitude has long been that if a spouse cheats, the other spouse is on some level the cause of it. Just an attempt to garner clicks. |
Anonymous
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That is very 2015 thinking. Psychologist have done much research since.
Marriages are an agreement between 2 adult parties unless it is an arranged marriage or if one is being held hostage. Affairs are not and agreement between 2 people. It is not reasonable to blame somebody for their spouses actions and is a kin to saying: "I wouldn't hit her if she wasn't such a B*tch" or "I drink because he is such a jerk". People need to take responsibility for their own actions. If the marriage sucks end it. But... but... but... I don't want to, plain and simple. For the kids, for the money, for selfishness. It's a choice to stay married. It's a breach of an agreement to have an affair. |
Anonymous
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It's usually true, of course there are exceptions.
Also, different people place different priorities on monogamy. For me, it would be a far greater betrayal if my spouse spent our marital assets on fancy dates with an AP than if it was simply a physical ONS |
Anonymous
Citation? |
Anonymous
I agree with this. I'm sure that some affairs are rooted in problems within the marriage, but that's not an excuse. Having an affair crosses a huge line, boundary, and the cheater playing a victim doesn't justify it. If the marriage is sexless, etc., then man up and either say you are going to open up the marriage or want a divorce. Don't be a coward. I also think that some infidelity isn't rooted in problems. Some people don't like monogamy. I've dated two man like that. In both instances, we were very serious (in one case living together) and there was nothing wrong. One of them cheated in previous relationships (I didn't find that out until after we were serious). The other one (I know for a fact) cheated on his next girlfriend. Some people want it all. They want to be able play the field and still have a stable and consistent companion at home. Sometimes cheating isn't rooted in flaws in the marriage; it is rooted in flaws in the cheater. |
Anonymous
Technically, the affair is an agreement between the cheater and the AP. |
Anonymous
Nothing wrong with this, as long as it's acknowledged and agreed upon by the people in the marriage. |