wow, nice behavior at at McDonalds in Baltimore County

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Well. Baltimore didn't just recently become this way. I don't mean to disparage anyone's ethnicity but the director John Waters has been chronicling the truly sinister and low racial dynamic in Baltimore for 4 decades. I mean the whole "Divine" history. That video was like a scene from from "Pink Flamingos". The horror is that this is a distinctly "Balimer" scenario: Unspeakably violent, base behavior. I'm sure there are some charming aspects to Baltimore, but it has been like south Jersey (culturally) for a looooong time.

dumb post. as if this same scene couldn't have been filmed in the DC metro area. asinine.

I'm just going to assume from your post that you're just from that area and you're offended at the association. Actually, I didn't say this could not have happened in DC, just that Baltimore has a unique dynamic --but perhaps you've never seen a John Waters film.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Well. Baltimore didn't just recently become this way. I don't mean to disparage anyone's ethnicity but the director John Waters has been chronicling the truly sinister and low racial dynamic in Baltimore for 4 decades. I mean the whole "Divine" history. That video was like a scene from from "Pink Flamingos". The horror is that this is a distinctly "Balimer" scenario: Unspeakably violent, base behavior. I'm sure there are some charming aspects to Baltimore, but it has been like south Jersey (culturally) for a looooong time.

dumb post. as if this same scene couldn't have been filmed in the DC metro area. asinine.

I'm just going to assume from your post that you're just from that area and you're offended at the association. Actually, I didn't say this could not have happened in DC, just that Baltimore has a unique dynamic --but perhaps you've never seen a John Waters film.

even more stupid. the events at this McDonalds couldn't be further removed from a JW film. and Waters celebrates Baltimore's eccentricities, none of which were on display in the video of the vicious beating. these animals who attacked were out of control, and location or city had nothing to do with it.

[Anonymous]

To the poster who is ripping through this thread calling people "dumb" and "asinine"? You are really part of the problem. There is no reason to attack anyone here--we're all horrofied by what happened. You may not agree with my analysis, but there's nothing dumb or asinine about it.

[Anonymous]

JW potrays the stark baseness of Baltimore and the main charcter of his films was the cross dresser Divine. He is a hero of the transgendered commmunity. If you don't think JW films alternately glorified the violence of Baltimore while also celibrating it's tatty squalor, then you really missed the point of his films. You also are very uncreative in your insults, so that nuance probably is not your strong suit.

[Anonymous]

America is a nation founded upon violence. It was colonized by countries that forced indigenous peoples off their land and/or killed them.
Its economy was built upon the backs of slaver laborers for centuries.
It gained its independence through armed revolution.
It stayed unified through Civil War.
Our history is stained with blood, from witch burnings to lynchings to World Wars to "nation building".

In the two attackers' lifetimes, violent crime has dropped over 60% nationwide. SIXTY FUCKING PERCENT!

This attack was horrific and the girls should be punished severely. But they are still human being, not animals. And their actions in no way demonstrate a "downfall" of society. A little perspective goes a long way.

[Anonymous]

^^Well said, PP.

[Anonymous]

Can I say with any confidence that this assuredly the case? Absolutely not. But before we conclude that society is doomed and two young girls are animals undeserving of human consideration, maybe we should step back and try to understand what REALLY happened.

What REALLY happened is that two young women beat up a another woman. Then, after they stopped and left the premises - THEY CAME BACK AND BEAT HER SOME MORE. So please spare me the nonsense of "poor young girls who were scared and just trying to defend themselves." They can back to finish the job. Perhaps we shouldn't call them animals, but their behavior is beyone excuse.

And it appears that the racial component to this is of secondary, or even no importance - it's a hate crime based on the victim's transgendered status, not race. Do you really think the two attackers would have acted differently had it been a black transgendered woman? So to all the "reap what you sow" pps - that "excuse" doesn't fly.

As for all the apocalyptic predictions - I actually think the fact that multiple employees stood around and did nothing - and filmed the incident - is more of a sign of the end of times than anything else. There have always been violent, out of control assaults - that, unfortunately, isn't going to change. But has the fabric of society coarsened so much that it is now acceptable to watch an assault without intervening, or even worse, make sure you get the video so it can be posted on youtube?

The fact that some people are trying to explain, or even excuse, this behavior is disgusting in and of itself. Their lawyers will do that, because they have to.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:
As for all the apocalyptic predictions - I actually think the fact that multiple employees stood around and did nothing - and filmed the incident - is more of a sign of the end of times than anything else. There have always been violent, out of control assaults - that, unfortunately, isn't going to change. But has the fabric of society coarsened so much that it is now acceptable to watch an assault without intervening, or even worse, make sure you get the video so it can be posted on youtube?

The fact that some people are trying to explain, or even excuse, this behavior is disgusting in and of itself. Their lawyers will do that, because they have to.

This has always been true, too. From witch burnings to lynchings to the holocaust. For evil to thrive, all good men and women have to do is nothing. (Paraphrase Kennedy).

I believe the victim is now biologically a woman - had an operation. So let's agree to refer to her as "She".

I agree that it was a feeding frenzy for the perps. I think that the employees enjoyed the show and didn't intervene because it was a transgender person.

Also it is my anecdotal understanding that the black community is even less tolerant of LGTB than other communities may be. Perhaps that factored into the failure to intervene.

[Anonymous]

The victim wanted to use the restroom and was told she had to buy something first. The boyfriend of one of the perps worked there and made a pass at the victim. This set the perps off and then they found out she was transgdered.

One of the male employees standing around was the boyfriend.

[Anonymous]

I agree with what I highlighted in PP's post. Society as a whole has deteriorated - mainly b/c we now have access to every horrific incident that occurs b/c of the media. So we're hardened by tragic events. How soon did we lose track of Katrina victims? Certainly, shortly after, when the news covered it 24-7, we were all stunned. But then something came along to replace it. BP oil spill? Japan quake?

Think about the nameless victims killed in DC? another drive by shooting, for example, or a 5 yo with a gun - Our "pain" is fleeting - and replaced by the Love/Huguely case, who are given so much press coverage b/c of their race and socioeconomic status. Again, the news determines how much covereage to give to each topic.

So we can play the blame game all we want, but it won't get us anywhere b/c we've already been trained by the media (whether we realize it or not) to view issues through a specific lens.

Those violent girls themselves are victims. I am NOT supporting them in the least bit - and know of many kids their age who have suffered through horrible abuse who would NEVER stoop that low. However, they've grown up with cell phones, would rather text a friend than to sit and chat face-to-face, look to the internet and TV for instant amusement, can't determine what information is credible and what's not, think that Kanye West's Bush-bashing was more newsworthy than Katrina itself - I could go on and on.

Knowing society is at its lowest point, I am trying my best to help my students UNlearn some terrible habits. So I do what I can to save my small piece of the world. I just wish each of us would do the same - take the time to help some kid move forward. But unfortunately, most of us are too afraid b/c of stereotypes we tend to believe.

Anonymous wrote:

Can I say with any confidence that this assuredly the case? Absolutely not. But before we conclude that society is doomed and two young girls are animals undeserving of human consideration, maybe we should step back and try to understand what REALLY happened.

What REALLY happened is that two young women beat up a another woman. Then, after they stopped and left the premises - THEY CAME BACK AND BEAT HER SOME MORE. So please spare me the nonsense of "poor young girls who were scared and just trying to defend themselves." They can back to finish the job. Perhaps we shouldn't call them animals, but their behavior is beyone excuse.

And it appears that the racial component to this is of secondary, or even no importance - it's a hate crime based on the victim's transgendered status, not race. Do you really think the two attackers would have acted differently had it been a black transgendered woman? So to all the "reap what you sow" pps - that "excuse" doesn't fly.

As for all the apocalyptic predictions - I actually think the fact that multiple employees stood around and did nothing - and filmed the incident - is more of a sign of the end of times than anything else. There have always been violent, out of control assaults - that, unfortunately, isn't going to change. But has the fabric of society coarsened so much that it is now acceptable to watch an assault without intervening, or even worse, make sure you get the video so it can be posted on youtube?
The fact that some people are trying to explain, or even excuse, this behavior is disgusting in and of itself. Their lawyers will do that, because they have to.

[Anonymous]

"Those violent girls themselves are victims."

PP please tell me you meant are NOT VICTIMS. Maybe victims of stupidity and ignorance. They knew exactly what they were doing.

[Anonymous]

This is probably why no one intervened:

http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/top-stories/2011/04/21/dad-who-split-up-fight-in-mcdonald-s-shot-dead-115875-23075797/#ixzz1KT8zaSme

[Anonymous]

"Knowing society is at its lowest point, I am trying my best to help my students UNlearn some terrible habits. So I do what I can to save my small piece of the world. I just wish each of us would do the same - take the time to help some kid move forward. But unfortunately, most of us are too afraid b/c of stereotypes we tend to believe"

ITA

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:This is probably why no one intervened:

http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/top-stories/2011/04/21/dad-who-split-up-fight-in-mcdonald-s-shot-dead-115875-23075797/#ixzz1KT8zaSme

Was this part neccessary? It only adds to the stereotype. I'm not supporting the killers; I'm only saying that the media (which is trash IMO - and that was my FIRST degree, by the way) distorts issues and perpetuates stereotypes.

One of them, who had several gold teeth, shouted at Raymond: “You are gonna die tonight, you are not gonna see the morning.”

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:America is a nation founded upon violence. It was colonized by countries that forced indigenous peoples off their land and/or killed them.
Its economy was built upon the backs of slaver laborers for centuries.
It gained its independence through armed revolution.
It stayed unified through Civil War.
Our history is stained with blood, from witch burnings to lynchings to World Wars to "nation building".

In the two attackers' lifetimes, violent crime has dropped over 60% nationwide. SIXTY FUCKING PERCENT!

This attack was horrific and the girls should be punished severely. But they are still human being, not animals. And their actions in no way demonstrate a "downfall" of society. A little perspective goes a long way.

as opposed to every other country on Earth? despite the shared history (and despite the drop in violent crime from horrible highs during the crack epidemic), we still have a much more violent society than almost any other western nation. our lower socioeconomic classes are much more violent than those of similar countries, for whatever reason.