I'm so tired of mom cliques

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP back again - well, at least I know I'm not the only one! I'm sorry for everyone in the same situation (esp baby shower mom, those people sound rude!). I think one way for me to stop feeling bad about this is to stop following some of these people on social media -- but is there a way to block posts on Facebook that my actual friends are tagged in? Like if I unfollow someone, but they tag an actual friend in a "we had a party" post, will I still see it?

You can mute certain people so that you don’t see their posts in your feed even if they tag one of your friends. I don’t know if this still works if your friend then shares that person’s post— maybe someone else has that knowledge.

Facebook definitely sometimes makes it hard to avoid seeing posts from people without outright blocking them, which I think is aggressive and tends to draw attention to something you’d rather not. I went through this after a break up with my ex-fiancé. We unfriended each other but we had so much overlap in our lives that it was very hard to avoid seeing photos of him at people’s events in my feed. I wound up just majorly curtailing my Facebook use to deal with it, only logging in once a week and not scrolling my feed. But that was almost 6 years ago so maybe it’s easier now?

You can mute people and I think there are ways to not see posts they're tagged in. On IG, it's not following them.

I got off FB right around New Years, and it's definitely helped my mental health. I use IG much less frequently, and most of my friends aren't on it, anyway. I miss a few aspects of it but mostly not. It's so human to have a reaction to something you see on social media, even if your rational mind knows that not everyone is included in everything. And it doesn't feel good to be excluded - that's pretty universal.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Sorry but I just don’t see this. They are groups of friends. Not cliques. These are adult women with kids, spouses, jobs, busy lives. They found common ground and connected. No one has the mental energy for “inclusion” of all moms in the entire school, neighborhood, etc. at all cost. Just be friends with who you want And get along with and stop thinking about who you aren’t friends with or what you aren’t invited to. It isn’t personal. No one can be friends with everyone and included in everything

But others may view those groups of friends as cliques.

If mom “cliques” bother you, then you have issues and insecurities. I don’t think at all about what moms are friends with each other or follow anyone on social media or what they post. That is a you problem, not a them problem. Make you own friends and do your own thing- or don’t. But it doesn’t make anyone mean or wrong bc they are friends with each other and post whatever pictures or hashtags you hate on social media. Stay off social media if this makes you feel insecure.

It used to be considered good manners to not talk about parties/events in front of people not invited. That's what happens on social media. It's rude. But manners have gone out the window. Other people notice the bad manners.

Well expecting people to not post anything social on social media; unless their entire friends list that may happen to view such post were invited, is a big reach. It is called social media for a reason. If other people socializing without you bothers you, you really need to change how/if you use social media.

Wow that's a huge leap you just made. Where did I say nothing should be posted? Maybe all the exclusive moms night teehee is too much but there are a lot of other things that are fair game. Posts about kids, trips, dinners, anniversaries, etc etc. There's a long list of things that people can use social media for. Sorry you don't like it when people notice your bad manners with your super special mom clique. We get it, you're in the club.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I think it’s a combo of social media and also the fact that some schools (definitely not all) have some parent hierarchies due to the way the school functions, especially PTA.

I don’t consider our elementary school super cliquish BUT these issues are there. Specifically there are 3, maybe 4 moms who run the PTA and all have multiple kids at the school. I don’t think they mean to, but they absolutely can come off as cliquish or exclusive. Even around stuff like volunteer opportunities, so I’m not just talking about friendships. They will decide to organize something for the teachers or the kids and just forget to communicate it to all parents until the last minute, so it’s always the same group of families who know each other well and socialize outside of school stuff who are the most involved, but there are many other parents who would like to participate but just feel out if the loop.

Again, I don’t think it’s on purpose but the result is really alienating. I think if you do PTA or similar activities, you should make an effort to be inclusive. No one has to include all parents in their personal friendships, but you actually do have an obligation to be inclusive of all families in school activities.

I think this is often where the resentment comes in. When people feel they are being excluded by a broader community, not just because they don’t feel included in a specific clique of moms. I already have friends, I’m not upset if someone doesn’t want to be my friend.

+1 to this. People can be friends with whoever, but official/PTA-led things should strive for some level of inclusiveness. I don't think that is what OP is talking about (but may be a small part of it).

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Sorry but I just don’t see this. They are groups of friends. Not cliques. These are adult women with kids, spouses, jobs, busy lives. They found common ground and connected. No one has the mental energy for “inclusion” of all moms in the entire school, neighborhood, etc. at all cost. Just be friends with who you want And get along with and stop thinking about who you aren’t friends with or what you aren’t invited to. It isn’t personal. No one can be friends with everyone and included in everything

But others may view those groups of friends as cliques.

If mom “cliques” bother you, then you have issues and insecurities. I don’t think at all about what moms are friends with each other or follow anyone on social media or what they post. That is a you problem, not a them problem. Make you own friends and do your own thing- or don’t. But it doesn’t make anyone mean or wrong bc they are friends with each other and post whatever pictures or hashtags you hate on social media. Stay off social media if this makes you feel insecure.

It used to be considered good manners to not talk about parties/events in front of people not invited. That's what happens on social media. It's rude. But manners have gone out the window. Other people notice the bad manners.

Well expecting people to not post anything social on social media; unless their entire friends list that may happen to view such post were invited, is a big reach. It is called social media for a reason. If other people socializing without you bothers you, you really need to change how/if you use social media.

DP here and look, you can't have it both ways.

If you want to be somewhat exclusive in your socializing with a neighborhood or school community, that's fine. If you want to be somewhat exclusive about socializing but post pictures and comments about that socializing to social media where people who are part of that community but not included in these events will see it, you have to assume that they will sometimes feel left out and consider this behavior hurtful.

It doesn't matter how you think people SHOULD feel about this stuff. This is how they feel. If you behave this way, you will absolutely sow resentment among community members. That's how it goes. You always have the options of either being less exclusive (yep, just inviting everyone to everything -- I get why this is not desirable and it's not what I do, but it is what some people do) OR you can just be more discreet about your social life and either not share stuff to social media or share it just to private groups where only those included can see it (this is very easy now). Or you can do what you are doing and accept that people think you're a jerk.

You can't tell other people how to feel or act like someone is immature or unevolved because they have a totally normal and predictable emotional response. Feeling left out has been around since the cavemen and is probably biologically conditioned because our ancestors would have risk death if they'd been excluded from the group.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Yes they are everywhere. Just do your best to focus on other areas as best you can, and be friendly to all.

(And yes, it sucks. I'm frequently the one on the outside, despite being involved in lots of activities with all of them.)

OP here - this is me. I know them, our kids are friends, I just don't live in the cool neighborhood, so I am not one of them, nor will I ever be.

15:29 here - I actually live in the "cool" neighborhood and am still excluded. I saw on FB that the neighborhood moms hosted a baby shower for another neighborhood mom. Yep, not invited and didn't know about it - despite knowing most everyone. Yes, it sucks.

Honest question -- why do you care? Why does this suck? If anything, it tells you who your friends are -- and it's none of these women. Go enjoy life with your real friends, and stop worrying about these neighborhood moms.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Sorry but I just don’t see this. They are groups of friends. Not cliques. These are adult women with kids, spouses, jobs, busy lives. They found common ground and connected. No one has the mental energy for “inclusion” of all moms in the entire school, neighborhood, etc. at all cost. Just be friends with who you want And get along with and stop thinking about who you aren’t friends with or what you aren’t invited to. It isn’t personal. No one can be friends with everyone and included in everything

But others may view those groups of friends as cliques.

If mom “cliques” bother you, then you have issues and insecurities. I don’t think at all about what moms are friends with each other or follow anyone on social media or what they post. That is a you problem, not a them problem. Make you own friends and do your own thing- or don’t. But it doesn’t make anyone mean or wrong bc they are friends with each other and post whatever pictures or hashtags you hate on social media. Stay off social media if this makes you feel insecure.

It used to be considered good manners to not talk about parties/events in front of people not invited. That's what happens on social media. It's rude. But manners have gone out the window. Other people notice the bad manners.

Well expecting people to not post anything social on social media; unless their entire friends list that may happen to view such post were invited, is a big reach. It is called social media for a reason. If other people socializing without you bothers you, you really need to change how/if you use social media.

DP here and look, you can't have it both ways.

If you want to be somewhat exclusive in your socializing with a neighborhood or school community, that's fine. If you want to be somewhat exclusive about socializing but post pictures and comments about that socializing to social media where people who are part of that community but not included in these events will see it, you have to assume that they will sometimes feel left out and consider this behavior hurtful.

It doesn't matter how you think people SHOULD feel about this stuff. This is how they feel. If you behave this way, you will absolutely sow resentment among community members. That's how it goes. You always have the options of either being less exclusive (yep, just inviting everyone to everything -- I get why this is not desirable and it's not what I do, but it is what some people do) OR you can just be more discreet about your social life and either not share stuff to social media or share it just to private groups where only those included can see it (this is very easy now). Or you can do what you are doing and accept that people think you're a jerk.

You can't tell other people how to feel or act like someone is immature or unevolved because they have a totally normal and predictable emotional response. Feeling left out has been around since the cavemen and is probably biologically conditioned because our ancestors would have risk death if they'd been excluded from the group.

Except none of us are cavepeople now. If people think you are a jerk, so what? That doesn't mean you actually are one. You know if you are being a jerk or not, and that's all you can control. You can be the nicest person ever and some people will still think you are a jerk. Stop worrying about what others think and just live your life.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Sorry but I just don’t see this. They are groups of friends. Not cliques. These are adult women with kids, spouses, jobs, busy lives. They found common ground and connected. No one has the mental energy for “inclusion” of all moms in the entire school, neighborhood, etc. at all cost. Just be friends with who you want And get along with and stop thinking about who you aren’t friends with or what you aren’t invited to. It isn’t personal. No one can be friends with everyone and included in everything

But others may view those groups of friends as cliques.

If mom “cliques” bother you, then you have issues and insecurities. I don’t think at all about what moms are friends with each other or follow anyone on social media or what they post. That is a you problem, not a them problem. Make you own friends and do your own thing- or don’t. But it doesn’t make anyone mean or wrong bc they are friends with each other and post whatever pictures or hashtags you hate on social media. Stay off social media if this makes you feel insecure.

It used to be considered good manners to not talk about parties/events in front of people not invited. That's what happens on social media. It's rude. But manners have gone out the window. Other people notice the bad manners.

Well expecting people to not post anything social on social media; unless their entire friends list that may happen to view such post were invited, is a big reach. It is called social media for a reason. If other people socializing without you bothers you, you really need to change how/if you use social media.

DP here and look, you can't have it both ways.

If you want to be somewhat exclusive in your socializing with a neighborhood or school community, that's fine. If you want to be somewhat exclusive about socializing but post pictures and comments about that socializing to social media where people who are part of that community but not included in these events will see it, you have to assume that they will sometimes feel left out and consider this behavior hurtful.

It doesn't matter how you think people SHOULD feel about this stuff. This is how they feel. If you behave this way, you will absolutely sow resentment among community members. That's how it goes. You always have the options of either being less exclusive (yep, just inviting everyone to everything -- I get why this is not desirable and it's not what I do, but it is what some people do) OR you can just be more discreet about your social life and either not share stuff to social media or share it just to private groups where only those included can see it (this is very easy now). Or you can do what you are doing and accept that people think you're a jerk.

You can't tell other people how to feel or act like someone is immature or unevolved because they have a totally normal and predictable emotional response. Feeling left out has been around since the cavemen and is probably biologically conditioned because our ancestors would have risk death if they'd been excluded from the group.

Except none of us are cavepeople now. If people think you are a jerk, so what? That doesn't mean you actually are one. You know if you are being a jerk or not, and that's all you can control. You can be the nicest person ever and some people will still think you are a jerk. Stop worrying about what others think and just live your life.

DP. I’m not sure if you do, though.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Yes they are everywhere. Just do your best to focus on other areas as best you can, and be friendly to all.

(And yes, it sucks. I'm frequently the one on the outside, despite being involved in lots of activities with all of them.)

OP here - this is me. I know them, our kids are friends, I just don't live in the cool neighborhood, so I am not one of them, nor will I ever be.

15:29 here - I actually live in the "cool" neighborhood and am still excluded. I saw on FB that the neighborhood moms hosted a baby shower for another neighborhood mom. Yep, not invited and didn't know about it - despite knowing most everyone. Yes, it sucks.

Honest question -- why do you care? Why does this suck? If anything, it tells you who your friends are -- and it's none of these women. Go enjoy life with your real friends, and stop worrying about these neighborhood moms.

PP can still feel hurt by the exclusion.

[Anonymous]

I am not friends with my kids’ friends parents on social media.

My kids have friends and go on play dates and parties. I hear about parties occasionally where my kid was not invited and other kids hanging out. My kids have enough going on and they play and get invited to all their close friends.

My youngest is in preschool and I know some classmates are close. We also do a few play dates but not especially close to anyone. I don’t care that much. She enjoys going to all class parties and her party was very well attended.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Sorry but I just don’t see this. They are groups of friends. Not cliques. These are adult women with kids, spouses, jobs, busy lives. They found common ground and connected. No one has the mental energy for “inclusion” of all moms in the entire school, neighborhood, etc. at all cost. Just be friends with who you want And get along with and stop thinking about who you aren’t friends with or what you aren’t invited to. It isn’t personal. No one can be friends with everyone and included in everything

But others may view those groups of friends as cliques.

If mom “cliques” bother you, then you have issues and insecurities. I don’t think at all about what moms are friends with each other or follow anyone on social media or what they post. That is a you problem, not a them problem. Make you own friends and do your own thing- or don’t. But it doesn’t make anyone mean or wrong bc they are friends with each other and post whatever pictures or hashtags you hate on social media. Stay off social media if this makes you feel insecure.

It used to be considered good manners to not talk about parties/events in front of people not invited. That's what happens on social media. It's rude. But manners have gone out the window. Other people notice the bad manners.

Well expecting people to not post anything social on social media; unless their entire friends list that may happen to view such post were invited, is a big reach. It is called social media for a reason. If other people socializing without you bothers you, you really need to change how/if you use social media.

DP here and look, you can't have it both ways.

If you want to be somewhat exclusive in your socializing with a neighborhood or school community, that's fine. If you want to be somewhat exclusive about socializing but post pictures and comments about that socializing to social media where people who are part of that community but not included in these events will see it, you have to assume that they will sometimes feel left out and consider this behavior hurtful.

It doesn't matter how you think people SHOULD feel about this stuff. This is how they feel. If you behave this way, you will absolutely sow resentment among community members. That's how it goes. You always have the options of either being less exclusive (yep, just inviting everyone to everything -- I get why this is not desirable and it's not what I do, but it is what some people do) OR you can just be more discreet about your social life and either not share stuff to social media or share it just to private groups where only those included can see it (this is very easy now). Or you can do what you are doing and accept that people think you're a jerk.

You can't tell other people how to feel or act like someone is immature or unevolved because they have a totally normal and predictable emotional response. Feeling left out has been around since the cavemen and is probably biologically conditioned because our ancestors would have risk death if they'd been excluded from the group.

Except none of us are cavepeople now. If people think you are a jerk, so what? That doesn't mean you actually are one. You know if you are being a jerk or not, and that's all you can control. You can be the nicest person ever and some people will still think you are a jerk. Stop worrying about what others think and just live your life.

If you don't care what others think, why are you posting about your social life on social media? Like what possible reason is there for sharing photos of your private events with your good friends if you don't care what others think of you?

I used to be friends with a woman who was constantly brag posting about her life on social media -- every vacation, every girls night, every fancy restaurant, every cute outfit, etc. Which is fine -- she obviously wanted that validation and I don't care either way so I was happy to like her posts and give it to her. But there were definitely people who found this behavior obnoxious (I think it pretty objectively is obnoxious, it just kind of depends on your threshold for it) and would speak poorly of her because of it. When she heard, she was so mad about it and kept telling me "they should mind their own business." But, uh, she brought this on herself. I know the whole thing revolved around her low self-esteem and for that reason I felt bad for her and was empathetic. But she seriously thought she could post all these "look at meeeee" thirst traps on social media and that people would only respond positively. That's not how people work.

If you genuinely don't care what people think, I don't know why you are on social media at all.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Sorry but I just don’t see this. They are groups of friends. Not cliques. These are adult women with kids, spouses, jobs, busy lives. They found common ground and connected. No one has the mental energy for “inclusion” of all moms in the entire school, neighborhood, etc. at all cost. Just be friends with who you want And get along with and stop thinking about who you aren’t friends with or what you aren’t invited to. It isn’t personal. No one can be friends with everyone and included in everything

But others may view those groups of friends as cliques.

If mom “cliques” bother you, then you have issues and insecurities. I don’t think at all about what moms are friends with each other or follow anyone on social media or what they post. That is a you problem, not a them problem. Make you own friends and do your own thing- or don’t. But it doesn’t make anyone mean or wrong bc they are friends with each other and post whatever pictures or hashtags you hate on social media. Stay off social media if this makes you feel insecure.

It used to be considered good manners to not talk about parties/events in front of people not invited. That's what happens on social media. It's rude. But manners have gone out the window. Other people notice the bad manners.

Well expecting people to not post anything social on social media; unless their entire friends list that may happen to view such post were invited, is a big reach. It is called social media for a reason. If other people socializing without you bothers you, you really need to change how/if you use social media.

DP here and look, you can't have it both ways.

If you want to be somewhat exclusive in your socializing with a neighborhood or school community, that's fine. If you want to be somewhat exclusive about socializing but post pictures and comments about that socializing to social media where people who are part of that community but not included in these events will see it, you have to assume that they will sometimes feel left out and consider this behavior hurtful.

It doesn't matter how you think people SHOULD feel about this stuff. This is how they feel. If you behave this way, you will absolutely sow resentment among community members. That's how it goes. You always have the options of either being less exclusive (yep, just inviting everyone to everything -- I get why this is not desirable and it's not what I do, but it is what some people do) OR you can just be more discreet about your social life and either not share stuff to social media or share it just to private groups where only those included can see it (this is very easy now). Or you can do what you are doing and accept that people think you're a jerk.

You can't tell other people how to feel or act like someone is immature or unevolved because they have a totally normal and predictable emotional response. Feeling left out has been around since the cavemen and is probably biologically conditioned because our ancestors would have risk death if they'd been excluded from the group.

Except none of us are cavepeople now. If people think you are a jerk, so what? That doesn't mean you actually are one. You know if you are being a jerk or not, and that's all you can control. You can be the nicest person ever and some people will still think you are a jerk. Stop worrying about what others think and just live your life.

"Jerk" and "nice" are highly subjective. You can't decide unilaterally "I am a nice person, not a jerk." It's an assessment others will make of you.

Also, in my experience, "the nicest person ever" does not get accused of being a jerk very often, if ever. I know a lot of really nice people and I can't think of anyone ever saying they were a jerk.

I do know some people who are selectively nice but don't treat everyone well, and people can disagree a lot on whether those people are nice or jerks. And they are both right! These are people who are very nice to some people and jerks to others. It's a fair assessment.

My general rule of thumb is that if someone accuses me of being unkind, I need to at least take a minute to evaluate if their might be some truth in that. But I do actually care what other people think, in the sense that I live in a society and believe we all have a duty of care to each other. So I think it's worthwhile to think about how my behavior impacts others. That's me though.

[Anonymous]

This link summarizes research on social exclusion, which some people may find helpful. Briefly, even a simple computer task that “excluded” people activated the same brain region that processes physical pain. Being left out hurts, and is very, very human. People can recognize that it doesn’t “matter” in the grand scheme of things, and still have that hurt feeling. It doesn’t make them less than, it makes them human.

https://sanlab.psych.ucla.edu/wp-content/uploads/sites/31/2015/05/39-Decety-39.pdf

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Yes they are everywhere. Just do your best to focus on other areas as best you can, and be friendly to all.

(And yes, it sucks. I'm frequently the one on the outside, despite being involved in lots of activities with all of them.)

OP here - this is me. I know them, our kids are friends, I just don't live in the cool neighborhood, so I am not one of them, nor will I ever be.

15:29 here - I actually live in the "cool" neighborhood and am still excluded. I saw on FB that the neighborhood moms hosted a baby shower for another neighborhood mom. Yep, not invited and didn't know about it - despite knowing most everyone. Yes, it sucks.

Honest question -- why do you care? Why does this suck? If anything, it tells you who your friends are -- and it's none of these women. Go enjoy life with your real friends, and stop worrying about these neighborhood moms.

Stop being so surprised that people have feelings. You weren't born yesterday you know why feeling left out or excluded doesn't make someone feel good.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:There is a #neighborhoodmoms group in my neighborhood that does #momsnightout and #momsweekend and #momsdrinkingwine. (Hashtags are actual examples they've used on FB / IG.)

There are a few OG "members" who have lived here for 10+ years and have older kids. A couple of them went to high school together, so there was already that built-in exclusivity. Others became friends b/c we all went to the same neighborhood preschool.

I have a kid the age of the youngest siblings of the #momgroup, so by the time we got to preschool and met the families, there was already a built-in clique.

We are friendly, we do playdates, we invite each other to kid birthday parties, chat in the park, share beers at the pool, watch each other's kids, etc., but I'm not part of the #momgroup.

It is what it is. I have other close friends (including mom friends whose kids and mine are friends) and there are plenty of other neighborhood moms who are also not part of the group. Sometimes, I'm like, "damn, that looks fun." Other times, I'm like... yeah, no... I'm an introvert who would probably not enjoy the #momshikinganddrinking weekends.

It's okay for me to be on the outside of an inner circle, as long as nobody is openly exclusionary and as long as my kid has friends and social experiences. I have my own inner circle.

I have a friend who goes out with her mom group (without the kids) and they all post and tag each other looking like they're having the time of their lives. The handful of times I've been invited, i discovered how much of a show they're putting on for social media. The gatherings were kind of boring, but peppered with selfie sessions where they put on a facade of SOOOOO FUN!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Yes they are everywhere. Just do your best to focus on other areas as best you can, and be friendly to all.

(And yes, it sucks. I'm frequently the one on the outside, despite being involved in lots of activities with all of them.)

OP here - this is me. I know them, our kids are friends, I just don't live in the cool neighborhood, so I am not one of them, nor will I ever be.

15:29 here - I actually live in the "cool" neighborhood and am still excluded. I saw on FB that the neighborhood moms hosted a baby shower for another neighborhood mom. Yep, not invited and didn't know about it - despite knowing most everyone. Yes, it sucks.

Honest question -- why do you care? Why does this suck? If anything, it tells you who your friends are -- and it's none of these women. Go enjoy life with your real friends, and stop worrying about these neighborhood moms.

Stop being so surprised that people have feelings. You weren't born yesterday you know why feeling left out or excluded doesn't make someone feel good.

Still doesn’t explain why she cares about these moms.