For all the parents complaining that the admissions process is rigged against their kids--

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:A “privileged” kid deserves to get into college the same as everyone. They should not be penalized because they are “privileged” if they’ve got the goods. I would say the same for a kid who isn’t “privileged.” And privilege is not exclusive to White people. I know many Black kids more privileged than my White kids.

How many times have your kids been stopped by the police? How many times have they been assumed to be stealing in a designer store? How many times has someone stared at them?

DP.. what does that have to do with college admissions?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:A “privileged” kid deserves to get into college the same as everyone. They should not be penalized because they are “privileged” if they’ve got the goods. I would say the same for a kid who isn’t “privileged.” And privilege is not exclusive to White people. I know many Black kids more privileged than my White kids.

How many times have your kids been stopped by the police? How many times have they been assumed to be stealing in a designer store? How many times has someone stared at them?

DP.. what does that have to do with college admissions?

PP said she “knows many black kids more privileged than her white kids.”

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:A “privileged” kid deserves to get into college the same as everyone. They should not be penalized because they are “privileged” if they’ve got the goods. I would say the same for a kid who isn’t “privileged.” And privilege is not exclusive to White people. I know many Black kids more privileged than my White kids.

How many times have your kids been stopped by the police? How many times have they been assumed to be stealing in a designer store? How many times has someone stared at them?

Not the poster you are responding to but another previous poster. Do you think kids are better prepared for the world, more confident and more resilient because they’ve been improperly stopped by police? Do you think that makes people better and stronger? I honestly think building up resilience can certainly be good, but perhaps is equally likely to make people less willing to engage and less confident later in life. I’m not sure as a result what suffering abuse by law-enforcement has to do with whether or not someone is better qualified to be admitted to college. Or are we trying to say that yes, it should be made easier for underrepresented minorities and for others to get into college to make up for the fact that they suffered discrimination elsewhere in life? If that’s the case, then, yes, my white kids need to do much better in school and then extracurriculars to get into the same school as their underrepresented Minority friends. It’s a public policy choice and fine. But why should we not be open about the different qualifications required?

NP. That is exactly what I am saying.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is a great article on how to teach your child to have no competitive spirit and be happy with what meager rations they are given.

Kids this bright are quite aware of who is getting into the schools they and their friends have been targeting for 2 or 3 years and they can see the reverse discrimination and unfairness at play. They are not 2 year olds looking for moms reaction on this.

Maybe responsible parenting is acknowledging that while top schools are a stretch for everyone, it IS unfair that qualities outside of their control and baseless to achievement are getting prioritized over what should matter and thus impacting your child's results. It's not fair and there is nothing we can do.

But that they will still go to a good school and because they are brilliant they will make the best of it. The world will level out once they get past the insanity/bubble of college admissions because in the real world results matter more than checking a demographic box and brilliance and hard work will pay off, regardless of liberal agendas.

Companies focus on things that matter and so while this phase of life will illustrate to them the unfairness of racism of discrimination, the good news is that they will be past this BS in four years.

That is the article I would write.

Dear “good parents” of brilliant children,

You should be aware that many, many companies not only factor URM status into their hiring practices these days, they also demand quotas from companies and firms with which they contract, and those companies and firms must comply or be passed over (whether they have a liberal agenda or not). Telling kids “Companies focus on things that matter and so while this phase of life will illustrate to them the unfairness of racism of discrimination, the good news is that they will be past this BS in four years” will win you zero parenting awards.

Sincerely,

Fellow parent living in the real world, not la la land

First, private company behavior is of a different nature than public-funded organization behavior. Private entities have freedom of association and I believe they should be able to discriminate however they want. Second, there are far more opportunities in the world than working at one of the woke/racist companies in terms of working with cutting-edge technology, impact on the world, and potential financial rewards. Those who want to work at a woke/racist company can do so to their heart's content. Those who don't can find other rewarding employment/entreprenurial opportunities.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We are visiting colleges now with our DCs. According to DCUM, we should be seeing plenty of URM « black boys » on these campuses. We simply are not. But do carry on lamenting how these Black boys are stealing your white and Asian kids’ spots at Ivy schools and How life will swing the pendulum back and will be fair again. 😏

True.

We've been on tours of the T20 schools. Across 5-10 schools, we've seen very very few URMs and almost no black males.

Most of the people on DCUM college threads are astute. They look at Common Data Sets and know the demographic stats.

I love how no one on here is acknowledging this. Again, the URM kids are "stealing" all the spots at these elite schools from more deserving white and asian kids, but the vast majority of the demographic on these campuses (white and Asian), are the the ones who actually deserve to be there, correct? How do parents know that it wasn't one of these kids who stole their child's spot? How do they know that legacy wasn't a factor, or money, or influence, or cheating, or lying? Nope, its those CLEARLY unqualified blacks and Hispanics.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:A “privileged” kid deserves to get into college the same as everyone. They should not be penalized because they are “privileged” if they’ve got the goods. I would say the same for a kid who isn’t “privileged.” And privilege is not exclusive to White people. I know many Black kids more privileged than my White kids.

How many times have your kids been stopped by the police? How many times have they been assumed to be stealing in a designer store? How many times has someone stared at them?

Not the poster you are responding to but another previous poster. Do you think kids are better prepared for the world, more confident and more resilient because they’ve been improperly stopped by police? Do you think that makes people better and stronger? I honestly think building up resilience can certainly be good, but perhaps is equally likely to make people less willing to engage and less confident later in life. I’m not sure as a result what suffering abuse by law-enforcement has to do with whether or not someone is better qualified to be admitted to college. Or are we trying to say that yes, it should be made easier for underrepresented minorities and for others to get into college to make up for the fact that they suffered discrimination elsewhere in life? If that’s the case, then, yes, my white kids need to do much better in school and then extracurriculars to get into the same school as their underrepresented Minority friends. It’s a public policy choice and fine. But why should we not be open about the different qualifications required?

How is the kid that is sheltered from racist garbage better prepared? That person is living in lalal land.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:This is a great article on how to teach your child to have no competitive spirit and be happy with what meager rations they are given.

Kids this bright are quite aware of who is getting into the schools they and their friends have been targeting for 2 or 3 years and they can see the reverse discrimination and unfairness at play. They are not 2 year olds looking for moms reaction on this.

Maybe responsible parenting is acknowledging that while top schools are a stretch for everyone, it IS unfair that qualities outside of their control and baseless to achievement are getting prioritized over what should matter and thus impacting your child's results. It's not fair and there is nothing we can do.

But that they will still go to a good school and because they are brilliant they will make the best of it. The world will level out once they get past the insanity/bubble of college admissions because in the real world results matter more than checking a demographic box and brilliance and hard work will pay off, regardless of liberal agendas.

Companies focus on things that matter and so while this phase of life will illustrate to them the unfairness of racism of discrimination, the good news is that they will be past this BS in four years.

That is the article I would write.

You are presuming that grades and “hard work” are all that matter. First, someone who may not have as good as grades as your child perhaps worked as hard, but barriers put before them (that are outside of THEIR control) moved their starting point back a little — they worked hard nonetheless and possibly overcame MORE than your child. Second, success in the real world goes beyond grades. Studies have shown (over and over) how different perspectives, different backgrounds, and different experiences lead to greater success in business, research, and other industries. That is what colleges are looking for — diversity — whether you like it or not.

[Anonymous]

We are visiting colleges now with our DCs. According to DCUM, we should be seeing plenty of URM « black boys » on these campuses. We simply are not. But do carry on lamenting how these Black boys are stealing your white and Asian kids’ spots at Ivy schools and How life will swing the pendulum back and will be fair again. 😏

True. We've been on tours of the T20 schools. Across 5-10 schools, we've seen very very few URMs and almost no black males. Most of the people on DCUM college threads are astute. They look at Common Data Sets and know the demographic stats.

This mirrors our experience as well. There just aren't that many black kids either on tours or on campus, especially males. There are a few more Latino kids, but even then, not many. The majority of the students are white and Asian, so much so that my DC now looks at the demographic data on the school's CDS before we visit. Conversely, we were at VT's admitted student/Open House this weekend and the engineering students were overwhelmingly Asian males - like 85%. So, the line that those kids aren't getting accepted or facing discrimination doesn't gel with what we're seeing on the ground or the schools' CDS.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:If your kid is white and has parents who graduated college, they are already unfathomably privileged. Of course, they don't realize that, because they have been privileged by it their entire lives.

Ridiculous. My tiny violin would be out but for your racist assumption made on the basis of skin color. This country has a significant number of poor white folks who are not, privileged. Get out of your bubble and stop using this tired excuse.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Different poster but the fact is that my kids (white) need to score higher by over 100 points (closer to 200) on SAT and have a higher gpa to get into the same schools as their friends who are black. It’s simply the truth.

It's also "simply the truth" that you think that 100 points matters and the colleges do not. And they get to choose.

Anonymous wrote:So they need to work harder, perform better and have a more appealing set of extracurricular activities. Other groups have had to do that at other times for admissions and now it is the turn for my kids. It’s important that they know. Our son’s closest friend at a top private will be a full pay black boy.

I probably should not even bother with a troll who uses the phrase "black boy", but I can't help myself. I recommend you ask your son's bestie what he thinks of that phrase.

Anonymous wrote:So when my kid asks if he can spend the summer in the same way that his friend does, my answer is no. Because you need to have a higher standard for the same result. And, sadly, your black friend will likely face discrimination later in life and he will need to be a higher standard. I don’t think it’s a problem to give kids, really young adults, the information they need to navigate this.

And this is where you show you are the problem - that it is YOU that cares if the kid goes to Dartmouth and not Skidmore, Cornell and not Michigan. Not your kid. YOU.

+1 Spot on.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I can't believe that some posters are not acknowledging the fact of racist discrimination against Asians. This is not an open topic for debate - the schools admit going it, there is no denial, they are simply claiming that the racist discrimination is a good thing. California tried to pass a proposition to legalist racist discrimination but failed. There is no debate that this is going on to the detriment of Asians.

Yes there is a debate. The criteria you claim should be the most important form decing access to an elite college is apparently criteria wherein your student and other asiain students excel. What is it? Standardized test scores? GPAs?

The debate about who should get into a top school and why is not decided and there is disagreement about what attributes are most important.

Not at the colleges and universities. They know who and what they are looking for and sometimes it's not PP's kid(s). Sucks but such is life.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If your kid is white and has parents who graduated college, they are already unfathomably privileged. Of course, they don't realize that, because they have been privileged by it their entire lives.

Ridiculous. My tiny violin would be out but for your racist assumption made on the basis of skin color. This country has a significant number of poor white folks who are not, privileged. Get out of your bubble and stop using this tired excuse.

To be fair, the poster specifically refers to white kids who have 2 college educated parents. And s/he is largely correct IMO. Having parents who understand what is entitled in the process of applying to and succeeding in colleges and universities *is* a huge advantage socioculturally and academically.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If your kid is white and has parents who graduated college, they are already unfathomably privileged. Of course, they don't realize that, because they have been privileged by it their entire lives.

Ridiculous. My tiny violin would be out but for your racist assumption made on the basis of skin color. This country has a significant number of poor white folks who are not, privileged. Get out of your bubble and stop using this tired excuse.

To be fair, the poster specifically refers to white kids who have 2 college educated parents. And s/he is largely correct IMO. Having parents who understand what is entitled in the process of applying to and succeeding in colleges and universities *is* a huge advantage socioculturally and academically.

Sorry, **entailed** in the process.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We are visiting colleges now with our DCs. According to DCUM, we should be seeing plenty of URM « black boys » on these campuses. We simply are not. But do carry on lamenting how these Black boys are stealing your white and Asian kids’ spots at Ivy schools and How life will swing the pendulum back and will be fair again. 😏

True.

We've been on tours of the T20 schools. Across 5-10 schools, we've seen very very few URMs and almost no black males.

Most of the people on DCUM college threads are astute. They look at Common Data Sets and know the demographic stats.

I love how no one on here is acknowledging this. Again, the URM kids are "stealing" all the spots at these elite schools from more deserving white and asian kids, but the vast majority of the demographic on these campuses (white and Asian), are the the ones who actually deserve to be there, correct? How do parents know that it wasn't one of these kids who stole their child's spot? How do they know that legacy wasn't a factor, or money, or influence, or cheating, or lying? Nope, its those CLEARLY unqualified blacks and Hispanics.

No one is acknowledging this because this is not a position that people are taking. You are making up a strawman. Second, your anecdotes are meaningless against real actual data that's been published. It's undisputed fact that schools are discriminating against Asians in favor of other student demographics.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is a great article on how to teach your child to have no competitive spirit and be happy with what meager rations they are given.

Kids this bright are quite aware of who is getting into the schools they and their friends have been targeting for 2 or 3 years and they can see the reverse discrimination and unfairness at play. They are not 2 year olds looking for moms reaction on this.

Maybe responsible parenting is acknowledging that while top schools are a stretch for everyone, it IS unfair that qualities outside of their control and baseless to achievement are getting prioritized over what should matter and thus impacting your child's results. It's not fair and there is nothing we can do.

But that they will still go to a good school and because they are brilliant they will make the best of it. The world will level out once they get past the insanity/bubble of college admissions because in the real world results matter more than checking a demographic box and brilliance and hard work will pay off, regardless of liberal agendas.

Companies focus on things that matter and so while this phase of life will illustrate to them the unfairness of racism of discrimination, the good news is that they will be past this BS in four years.

That is the article I would write.

You are presuming that grades and “hard work” are all that matter. First, someone who may not have as good as grades as your child perhaps worked as hard, but barriers put before them (that are outside of THEIR control) moved their starting point back a little — they worked hard nonetheless and possibly overcame MORE than your child. Second, success in the real world goes beyond grades. Studies have shown (over and over) how different perspectives, different backgrounds, and different experiences lead to greater success in business, research, and other industries. That is what colleges are looking for — diversity — whether you like it or not.

That's an interesting question, and one that simply cannot be answered based on the level of details provided by a college application. No, instead they have gone straight to skin color as a differentiator. Absent actual evidence, it's simply racist to assume that a black person achieving the same level as an Asian person must have worked harder. Skin color is also an improper proxy for so-called different perspectives, backgrounds, or experiences, because a simple demographic study shows that there is *FAR* more of these things within the Asian community than the more homogenous African American community. My kids are born in the US, they share very little with Chinese immigrants, and even less with Indian immigrants. Yet we are all blended in the same spot and shunned for lack of "diversity". Colleges are looking for superficial race balance, rather than true diversity.