Ramifications of marrying outside of your social class

[Anonymous]

Should have ended our marriage ended with him in addiction and infidelity. I think there just weren't a lot of controls in his family. A lot of enabling. No strict rules even though they came across like they had them. But when a child had an issue. No big deal. A young adult got fired from a job. No big deal. Husband became an alcoholic. No big deal. Just more acceptance from poor behavior. I feel like in my family people come talk to you when you are going off the rails and try to get you back on. His family just would let it go.

Please explain how the fact that his family had less money than yours led to no "controls" and lots of "enabling."

Again, alcoholism, poor behavior, etc. happen to families regardless of their wealth. It is stupid to imply that families who do not have as much money are more likely to be "poorly behaved."

[Anonymous]

https://www.psychiatrictimes.com/view/addressing-poverty-and-mental-illness

The link between increased rates of physical and mental illness and poverty has been well established.

Individuals who experience poverty, particularly early in life or for an extended period, are at risk of a host of adverse health and developmental outcomes through their life. Poverty in childhood is associated with lower school achievement; worse cognitive, behavioral, and attention-related outcomes; higher rates of delinquency, depressive and anxiety disorders; and higher rates of almost every psychiatric disorder in adulthood. Poverty in adulthood is linked to depressive disorders, anxiety disorders, psychological distress, and suicide.

Poverty affects mental health through an array of social and biological mechanisms acting at multiple levels, including individuals, families, local communities, and nations. Individual-level mediators in the relationship between poverty and mental health include financial stress, chronic and acute stressful life events exposure, hypothalamic-pituitary-adrenal (HPA) axis changes, other brain circuit changes (eg, language processing, executive functioning), poor prenatal health and birth outcomes, inadequate nutrition, and toxin exposure (eg, lead). Family-level mediators include parental relationship stress, parental psychopathology (especially depression), low parental warmth or investment, hostile and inconsistent parenting, low-stimulation home environments, and child abuse and neglect.

The evidence is strong for a causal relationship between poverty and mental health.3 However, findings suggest that poverty leads to mental health and developmental problems that in turn prevent individuals and families from leaving poverty, creating a vicious, intergenerational cycle of poverty and poor health.

[Anonymous]

Well, its a sad reality but poverty is the root cause of a lot of problems.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I grew up LMC and husband’s family is very, very well off. They are outwardly warm and polite, but one time about 5 years ago, my FIL had one too many and accused me of being a gold digger. So… in retrospect I should have been prepared that they would never accept me, no matter what my education and career achievements are.

And before someone says “well, you must have done something…” They have never given us money, we have never asked them for money, and I out-earned my husband until a few years ago. I am in charge of the family budget and the only reason we were able to afford our house is because I sold the DC condo purchased in my 20s which nearly doubled in price (just luck on my part). But I am still a gold digger. We’ve been together nearly 20 years, I guess they think I’m playing the long game?

Oof that's tough. I hope your husband and MIL were ashamed of his mouth.

My MIL just pretended nothing happened, as she always does with unpleasant things. But I could see by her face she was absolutely horrified. My husband was amazing, immediately stood up to FIL, told him he was not to speak to me that way and insisted we leave. FIL called me to apologize the following morning. I accepted the apology because I value family and I know my husband loves his dad, but I can’t ever forget how he looked at me and spoke to me in that moment, completely out of nowhere and unprovoked.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Should have ended our marriage ended with him in addiction and infidelity. I think there just weren't a lot of controls in his family. A lot of enabling. No strict rules even though they came across like they had them. But when a child had an issue. No big deal. A young adult got fired from a job. No big deal. Husband became an alcoholic. No big deal. Just more acceptance from poor behavior. I feel like in my family people come talk to you when you are going off the rails and try to get you back on. His family just would let it go.

Please explain how the fact that his family had less money than yours led to no "controls" and lots of "enabling."

Again, alcoholism, poor behavior, etc. happen to families regardless of their wealth. It is stupid to imply that families who do not have as much money are more likely to be "poorly behaved."

But it's the truth. It's a very true fact that the US doesn't seem to want to hear these days in their push for integration. I turned a blind eye to it and should have been more cautious. And there are countless studies to prove it. Not to mention centuries of historical writings documenting poor behavior and impulsive behavior among the poor.

All those people who are addicted to drugs and alcohol so forth? Poor behavioral controls. Prohibition wasn't to protect the rich people from their poor behavior.

And the loving without consequence comes because there isn't a lot other to offer them and they don't have the money to poor into programs to get help. And the people often are dealing with stresses themselves and have poor self esteem and so will accept the love of an alcoholic rather than getting him help despite him being angry at you for doing it. This is also well established in studies. The enabling behavior.

[Anonymous]

Read the UK study in-depth.

The authors are using the study to advocate for increased funding (yes, in a county with universal health care) for the poor because the poor lack access to health care options that are present for the rich.

In every country, the rich are healthier because they have access to better health care, better food, fewer environmental toxins, etc. See: https://www.nytimes.com/2020/01/16/science/rich-people-longer-life-study.html

The rich often go to jail less, even for the same crimes.

This fact does not explain how the posters can blame many of their complaints on the fact their husbands did not grow up with money. Let us speak plainly.

The posters believe they are superior to their spouses because they came from a higher economic background. As another poster said, this is Downton Abbey played out in NoVA.

So we get "Lord Whatnot had a little too much brandy" while the footman "drank himself silly with gin."

[Anonymous]

But it's the truth. It's a very true fact that the US doesn't seem to want to hear these days in their push for integration. I turned a blind eye to it and should have been more cautious. And there are countless studies to prove it. Not to mention centuries of historical writings documenting poor behavior and impulsive behavior among the poor.

All those people who are addicted to drugs and alcohol so forth? Poor behavioral controls. Prohibition wasn't to protect the rich people from their poor behavior.

Addiction is the result of physiological disorders, not "behavioral controls." There truly are countless medical studies to prove this fact.

What are behavioral controls? One more time, tell us how "poor behavior" is the domain of the poor. The rich can behave just as poorly as anyone else. It is easier for addicted rich people to function in our society because it is easier for them to obtain what they are craving. The rich man can afford to buy coke, while the poor must steal for it.

[Anonymous]

Not too many people on this thread need to worry about marrying "down".

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Downsides of marrying someone whose family is from wealth and privilege is realizing that America is not at all the meritocracy I thought it was growing up MC, at public schools, etc. The smugness and extreme bubble of the wealthy in DC was eye opening: the social slipstream they exist in because of layers of intergenerational wealth and connections is astounding. How they often break rules or feel the rules don’t apply to them. The self assuredness that comes from knowing there is always a safety net for financial security, or a “back channel” for weaving around barriers most unconnected people would find in their way. The way they justify their lavish lifestyles to themselves, or are often not at all shocked at the corruption, cheating and unfair practices they participate in but don’t really acknowledge. Plus, classist and racist viewpoints and seeing lower class people as just tools toward their ends. Sorry that sounds harsh but it’s been my experience!

Mine, too. The ones who grew up wealthy can do whatever they want and it is somehow fine, but someone whose background doesn’t past muster is pilloried for minor things. And everything they do is attributed (in a negative way) to their background, while a rich person can do something iffy and it’s excused and just their personality.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:His family was always jealous of our money and believed it much more than we really had. As if just being upper middle class made you extremely wealthy when in reality it isn't that different from middle class. I think this played a large part in our marriage's downfall although on the most prevalent issue.

He ended up abusing my money with no repercussions from his family. Took out credit cards without telling me and ran us into debt. Once the sister was saying she was really busy with his mom and I offered to help and she showed me all the projects she wanted me to fund. She lived in the home at no expense to take care of the parents. Also asked me to fund a trip overseas. I had meant maybe I can get my husband to call more and send care packages.

The bigger issues were that he couldn't relate to any of my friends. He loved the lifestyle and thought our friends were nice but couldn't converse well and make any really strong friends. He also just had a lot of bad habits that I didn't pick up on during the courtship and his mind started to deteriorate as he grew older. Maybe this could happen to anyone but eventually found out he had a lot of mental health issues. So the biggest issue I've found is that a lot of poorer people have mental health issues which makes marriage difficult. This also happened to another friend of mine and I've now seen how many adopted children from poorer families have mental health issues so these seems to be a recurring trend during my lifetime.

This actually isn’t the case. Mental health problems are distributed fairly evenly among the classes.

There is no way they are evenly distributed. I'll have to do some sleuthing to prove but just common sense and general reading and history has proved this wrong. Maybe some people don't have the means to get help but there is no way that upper middle class people have the same amount and intensity of mental health problems as the lower classes.

This isn’t true at all. Studies also show that upper middle class kids are far more likely to do drugs than poor and working class kids. You’re experiencing cognitive dissonance which is why it’s Hard for you to believe.

I also believe you’re a troll.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

But it's the truth. It's a very true fact that the US doesn't seem to want to hear these days in their push for integration. I turned a blind eye to it and should have been more cautious. And there are countless studies to prove it. Not to mention centuries of historical writings documenting poor behavior and impulsive behavior among the poor.

All those people who are addicted to drugs and alcohol so forth? Poor behavioral controls. Prohibition wasn't to protect the rich people from their poor behavior.

Addiction is the result of physiological disorders, not "behavioral controls." There truly are countless medical studies to prove this fact.

What are behavioral controls? One more time, tell us how "poor behavior" is the domain of the poor. The rich can behave just as poorly as anyone else. It is easier for addicted rich people to function in our society because it is easier for them to obtain what they are craving. The rich man can afford to buy coke, while the poor must steal for it.

Maybe this is true of the ultra wealthy, but it’s pretty difficult to stay UMC if you have a serious mental illness or untreated addiction.
Being poor might not make you mentally ill, but being mentally ill can certainly make you poor.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:His family was always jealous of our money and believed it much more than we really had. As if just being upper middle class made you extremely wealthy when in reality it isn't that different from middle class. I think this played a large part in our marriage's downfall although on the most prevalent issue.

He ended up abusing my money with no repercussions from his family. Took out credit cards without telling me and ran us into debt. Once the sister was saying she was really busy with his mom and I offered to help and she showed me all the projects she wanted me to fund. She lived in the home at no expense to take care of the parents. Also asked me to fund a trip overseas. I had meant maybe I can get my husband to call more and send care packages.

The bigger issues were that he couldn't relate to any of my friends. He loved the lifestyle and thought our friends were nice but couldn't converse well and make any really strong friends. He also just had a lot of bad habits that I didn't pick up on during the courtship and his mind started to deteriorate as he grew older. Maybe this could happen to anyone but eventually found out he had a lot of mental health issues. So the biggest issue I've found is that a lot of poorer people have mental health issues which makes marriage difficult. This also happened to another friend of mine and I've now seen how many adopted children from poorer families have mental health issues so these seems to be a recurring trend during my lifetime.

This actually isn’t the case. Mental health problems are distributed fairly evenly among the classes.

There is no way they are evenly distributed. I'll have to do some sleuthing to prove but just common sense and general reading and history has proved this wrong. Maybe some people don't have the means to get help but there is no way that upper middle class people have the same amount and intensity of mental health problems as the lower classes.

This isn’t true at all. Studies also show that upper middle class kids are far more likely to do drugs than poor and working class kids. You’re experiencing cognitive dissonance which is why it’s Hard for you to believe.

I also believe you’re a troll.

Not a troll. And basic real estate proves that poor neighborhoods have more crime and are more unsafe. Not desirable.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Downsides of marrying someone whose family is from wealth and privilege is realizing that America is not at all the meritocracy I thought it was growing up MC, at public schools, etc. The smugness and extreme bubble of the wealthy in DC was eye opening: the social slipstream they exist in because of layers of intergenerational wealth and connections is astounding. How they often break rules or feel the rules don’t apply to them. The self assuredness that comes from knowing there is always a safety net for financial security, or a “back channel” for weaving around barriers most unconnected people would find in their way. The way they justify their lavish lifestyles to themselves, or are often not at all shocked at the corruption, cheating and unfair practices they participate in but don’t really acknowledge. Plus, classist and racist viewpoints and seeing lower class people as just tools toward their ends. Sorry that sounds harsh but it’s been my experience!

+1000 except for me this realization came when I went to HYS for law school and realized that that was how the world worked for very wealthy and privileged people. Until that point I had the delusional belief that the world was mostly meritocratic. It was also one of the reasons I didn’t settle down in NYC - that was just not the world I wanted to be a part of.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Downsides of marrying someone whose family is from wealth and privilege is realizing that America is not at all the meritocracy I thought it was growing up MC, at public schools, etc. The smugness and extreme bubble of the wealthy in DC was eye opening: the social slipstream they exist in because of layers of intergenerational wealth and connections is astounding. How they often break rules or feel the rules don’t apply to them. The self assuredness that comes from knowing there is always a safety net for financial security, or a “back channel” for weaving around barriers most unconnected people would find in their way. The way they justify their lavish lifestyles to themselves, or are often not at all shocked at the corruption, cheating and unfair practices they participate in but don’t really acknowledge. Plus, classist and racist viewpoints and seeing lower class people as just tools toward their ends. Sorry that sounds harsh but it’s been my experience!

+1000 except for me this realization came when I went to HYS for law school and realized that that was how the world worked for very wealthy and privileged people. Until that point I had the delusional belief that the world was mostly meritocratic. It was also one of the reasons I didn’t settle down in NYC - that was just not the world I wanted to be a part of.

Realizing the way the US upper class works doesn’t have much to do with marrying outside your class. Many of us have learned this without marrying into it. I was friends with a girl whose dad was COE and large share owner of a big private company. Multi generational family company. Her brother is now CEO. She believes it was meant to be like destiny, he was serious and a leader since childhood and he is the most qualified for the job. When in reality the most important qualifications for the job are last name and having a penis. Also she was nervous that she wouldn’t get into a certain elite school for grad school even though the school has a building with her last name in it. No need to worry of course she got in.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:His family was always jealous of our money and believed it much more than we really had. As if just being upper middle class made you extremely wealthy when in reality it isn't that different from middle class. I think this played a large part in our marriage's downfall although on the most prevalent issue.

He ended up abusing my money with no repercussions from his family. Took out credit cards without telling me and ran us into debt. Once the sister was saying she was really busy with his mom and I offered to help and she showed me all the projects she wanted me to fund. She lived in the home at no expense to take care of the parents. Also asked me to fund a trip overseas. I had meant maybe I can get my husband to call more and send care packages.

The bigger issues were that he couldn't relate to any of my friends. He loved the lifestyle and thought our friends were nice but couldn't converse well and make any really strong friends. He also just had a lot of bad habits that I didn't pick up on during the courtship and his mind started to deteriorate as he grew older. Maybe this could happen to anyone but eventually found out he had a lot of mental health issues. So the biggest issue I've found is that a lot of poorer people have mental health issues which makes marriage difficult. This also happened to another friend of mine and I've now seen how many adopted children from poorer families have mental health issues so these seems to be a recurring trend during my lifetime.

This actually isn’t the case. Mental health problems are distributed fairly evenly among the classes.

There is no way they are evenly distributed. I'll have to do some sleuthing to prove but just common sense and general reading and history has proved this wrong. Maybe some people don't have the means to get help but there is no way that upper middle class people have the same amount and intensity of mental health problems as the lower classes.

This isn’t true at all. Studies also show that upper middle class kids are far more likely to do drugs than poor and working class kids. You’re experiencing cognitive dissonance which is why it’s Hard for you to believe.

I also believe you’re a troll.

Not a troll. And basic real estate proves that poor neighborhoods have more crime and are more unsafe. Not desirable.

I was responding to the part on poor people more likely to have mental illness. Thats a lie. And it's clear you have a deep hatred for poor people.