How do you know if your marriage is dead beyond repair—and do you stay for kids?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP what is your plan if you leave? Are you hoping to find someone more compatible and remarry? Are you the type who says you really just want to live alone and will never remarry again, but maybe you'll date?
If the former....honestly based on what you've said it sounds like you have some serious issues that you need to deal with with a therapist. If what you've said is true, you jumped into an unhappy and codependent relationship and stayed there for years, continuing to get yourself more and more invested in life with him while knowing even since 4 months in that it's not what you wanted. That's...not healthy. What makes you think you'd do any better the next time?
And if the second...you yourself have said he's a great partner/roommate/co-parent. If you're not leaving to hope you meet someone better to build a life with, why not do what many people do and stay in an unfulfilling but ultimately fine marriage? Do you thing, live your life, don't destroy your kids' lives.

OP here: I would never be interested in remarrying or trying to fall in love again. Maybe a FWB arrangement but no interest in a long-term relationship again. I am fine on my own.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I answered this question before, OP. I actually went and found what I wrote because it still makes sense to me.

As someone on the other side of marriage and children and family, I will give you a bit of insight. Yes, there were YEARS when I seriously considered getting divorced. Yes, these were the same years when we had small children or financial struggles or health issues. I didn't and I didn't because I don't view marriage as solely a romantic relationship. It is much, much deeper to me. It's family. It's taking someone and making them your person. And while we never veered into true toxic territory (abuse, adultery, etc.), we had the kind of rough patches that sent many, many of my friends into divorces. The difference? We worked through them and after each one, we were stronger, closer, more intimate. We had a mutual respect and fundamental kindness that was the ethos of our marriage. We went through fire together (or alone, pulling the other on their backs). And I say looking at three grown kids, an empty, sold house and a retirement, our next phase strangely feels like the first one. We travel, we have fun, we have time, we nap, sleep together, have long talks about the meaning of it all, and if it was a recording or a text of our days, we would sound strangely similar to those two 24 year olds who lost their jobs and decided to wonder around Europe together for a year (where I spend equal parts crying and feeling more alive than I ever had). But we're 65 and it's a lifetime between those points. Three kids. A grandchild. Five different careers (yes, I mean careers, not jobs). A flight attendant turned speech therapist. A journalist, turned attorney, turned high school history teacher. A house that some other young family is now raising their children in. My gray hair. His long departed hair. We are so much more than those difficult years when I was a stressed out working mom and he was a stressed out working father. A blip. But I didn't know this at the time. I felt it, I felt that there was a long game to be had when it comes to marriage. But I didn't realize how long and how great the payoff could be.

I don't know how other people define love and marriage. But I think my deal was worth making.

OP here. I do appreciate your post...but I am not in this situation. If I felt the love was there from the beginning, I would stay. There wasn't. It was just a mistake but now there are kids involved. I wanted to leave within a year of marriage and had doubts literally walking down the aisle. We also married later (early 30s). Also, we do not have this: "We had a mutual respect and fundamental kindness that was the ethos of our marriage." We don't even like each other. It is all pretend.

PP here. Then the choice is clear. If you don't want to be married, end your marriage. Pull the plug and deal with the fallout. Everything is a choice and choosing to stay is a fine one, but OWN IT. Own your decision to stay. Own your decision to go. Stop making it about what he's doing or not doing and take a long look at yourself and move forward. You don't want to stay married. Well, leave. You want a better marriage? Well, it's a ton of work, but you need to at least do your part. Either way.

One thing I am seeing in your posts is a wish that your marriage can end without any culpability or wrong on your part. That's not happening. It takes two to marry, you both decided on children, and you walked down the isle. You said yes. Stop blaming someone else for your choices and start living your life on honest terms. That's not happening now.

OP here--you are wrong about this statement: "One thing I am seeing in your posts is a wish that your marriage can end without any culpability or wrong on your part. " I have fully said I should have never gotten married. That is my fault. He pressured me to get off the pill and have the first kid...that was my mistake for giving in...I regretted right after and was talking about getting a divorce with my dad on the phone...turned out I was pregnant. So, I stayed. I did not leave immediately because I was living in another state and would have had custody issues. I had to get back to this area to even think of divorce. It took 8 years to get back here.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I answered this question before, OP. I actually went and found what I wrote because it still makes sense to me.

As someone on the other side of marriage and children and family, I will give you a bit of insight. Yes, there were YEARS when I seriously considered getting divorced. Yes, these were the same years when we had small children or financial struggles or health issues. I didn't and I didn't because I don't view marriage as solely a romantic relationship. It is much, much deeper to me. It's family. It's taking someone and making them your person. And while we never veered into true toxic territory (abuse, adultery, etc.), we had the kind of rough patches that sent many, many of my friends into divorces. The difference? We worked through them and after each one, we were stronger, closer, more intimate. We had a mutual respect and fundamental kindness that was the ethos of our marriage. We went through fire together (or alone, pulling the other on their backs). And I say looking at three grown kids, an empty, sold house and a retirement, our next phase strangely feels like the first one. We travel, we have fun, we have time, we nap, sleep together, have long talks about the meaning of it all, and if it was a recording or a text of our days, we would sound strangely similar to those two 24 year olds who lost their jobs and decided to wonder around Europe together for a year (where I spend equal parts crying and feeling more alive than I ever had). But we're 65 and it's a lifetime between those points. Three kids. A grandchild. Five different careers (yes, I mean careers, not jobs). A flight attendant turned speech therapist. A journalist, turned attorney, turned high school history teacher. A house that some other young family is now raising their children in. My gray hair. His long departed hair. We are so much more than those difficult years when I was a stressed out working mom and he was a stressed out working father. A blip. But I didn't know this at the time. I felt it, I felt that there was a long game to be had when it comes to marriage. But I didn't realize how long and how great the payoff could be.

I don't know how other people define love and marriage. But I think my deal was worth making.

OP here. I do appreciate your post...but I am not in this situation. If I felt the love was there from the beginning, I would stay. There wasn't. It was just a mistake but now there are kids involved. I wanted to leave within a year of marriage and had doubts literally walking down the aisle. We also married later (early 30s). Also, we do not have this: "We had a mutual respect and fundamental kindness that was the ethos of our marriage." We don't even like each other. It is all pretend.

OP I can't help but feel like you're rewriting history. I believe you that you had doubts even early on in your marriage...and TRUST me, you are nowhere near alone in that. But I think you're stuck in a very negative mindset and you're only letting yourself remember that things have always been awful, when logically that just doesn't make sense. You're telling me you met some guy who you had nothing in common with and couldn't talk to at all, but he continued asking you out and you continued saying yes, all the while feeling nothing but blah and disconnect? I doubt that. And if so...then the problem here is YOU and I seriously suggest you seek a lot of counseling to understand why on earth you would do something like that. More likely, it seems, is that you're stubbornly blocking out the happier things and the good times, because you don't WANT to remember them or to believe you could work to fix it, because you made up your mind long ago and you just want to give up. Which is your prerogative...but like PP said, there is no easy or guilt-free way to do it. If you walk out on a decent marriage, that's on you.

OP here: I am not rewriting history. I am very self-aware. I knew I did not want to be trying on wedding dresses. I knew we should have broken up at the 4-month mark of dating. I knew why I tried to break up before getting engaged. He convinced me not to break up with him. I new exactly what I was doing...I was trying to get over someone else who was a total jerk to me. I was with my DH only because he seemed nice and that seemed to be enough. I knew I was wrong and did it anyway.

Why'd you stay, then? Why'd you have two children? Why are you thinking of staying now? I feel like the story can't be as simple as the story you're telling or you would have left in the first year of marriage.

OP here: I moved after the wedding and was giving it a year. Right after the year is up I stupidly stopped the pill and got pregnant the first time....I thought I was going back on birth control during the act itself. I got pregnant and lived out of state. I could not leave due to possible custody issues. Took 8 years to get back here. Now I can actually consider leaving because I am in the place I want to live permanently. I could not even consider leaving when I was in another state.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I answered this question before, OP. I actually went and found what I wrote because it still makes sense to me.

As someone on the other side of marriage and children and family, I will give you a bit of insight. Yes, there were YEARS when I seriously considered getting divorced. Yes, these were the same years when we had small children or financial struggles or health issues. I didn't and I didn't because I don't view marriage as solely a romantic relationship. It is much, much deeper to me. It's family. It's taking someone and making them your person. And while we never veered into true toxic territory (abuse, adultery, etc.), we had the kind of rough patches that sent many, many of my friends into divorces. The difference? We worked through them and after each one, we were stronger, closer, more intimate. We had a mutual respect and fundamental kindness that was the ethos of our marriage. We went through fire together (or alone, pulling the other on their backs). And I say looking at three grown kids, an empty, sold house and a retirement, our next phase strangely feels like the first one. We travel, we have fun, we have time, we nap, sleep together, have long talks about the meaning of it all, and if it was a recording or a text of our days, we would sound strangely similar to those two 24 year olds who lost their jobs and decided to wonder around Europe together for a year (where I spend equal parts crying and feeling more alive than I ever had). But we're 65 and it's a lifetime between those points. Three kids. A grandchild. Five different careers (yes, I mean careers, not jobs). A flight attendant turned speech therapist. A journalist, turned attorney, turned high school history teacher. A house that some other young family is now raising their children in. My gray hair. His long departed hair. We are so much more than those difficult years when I was a stressed out working mom and he was a stressed out working father. A blip. But I didn't know this at the time. I felt it, I felt that there was a long game to be had when it comes to marriage. But I didn't realize how long and how great the payoff could be.

I don't know how other people define love and marriage. But I think my deal was worth making.

OP here. I do appreciate your post...but I am not in this situation. If I felt the love was there from the beginning, I would stay. There wasn't. It was just a mistake but now there are kids involved. I wanted to leave within a year of marriage and had doubts literally walking down the aisle. We also married later (early 30s). Also, we do not have this: "We had a mutual respect and fundamental kindness that was the ethos of our marriage." We don't even like each other. It is all pretend.

OP I can't help but feel like you're rewriting history. I believe you that you had doubts even early on in your marriage...and TRUST me, you are nowhere near alone in that. But I think you're stuck in a very negative mindset and you're only letting yourself remember that things have always been awful, when logically that just doesn't make sense. You're telling me you met some guy who you had nothing in common with and couldn't talk to at all, but he continued asking you out and you continued saying yes, all the while feeling nothing but blah and disconnect? I doubt that. And if so...then the problem here is YOU and I seriously suggest you seek a lot of counseling to understand why on earth you would do something like that. More likely, it seems, is that you're stubbornly blocking out the happier things and the good times, because you don't WANT to remember them or to believe you could work to fix it, because you made up your mind long ago and you just want to give up. Which is your prerogative...but like PP said, there is no easy or guilt-free way to do it. If you walk out on a decent marriage, that's on you.

OP here: I am not rewriting history. I am very self-aware. I knew I did not want to be trying on wedding dresses. I knew we should have broken up at the 4-month mark of dating. I knew why I tried to break up before getting engaged. He convinced me not to break up with him. I new exactly what I was doing...I was trying to get over someone else who was a total jerk to me. I was with my DH only because he seemed nice and that seemed to be enough. I knew I was wrong and did it anyway.

Why'd you stay, then? Why'd you have two children? Why are you thinking of staying now? I feel like the story can't be as simple as the story you're telling or you would have left in the first year of marriage.

OP here: I moved after the wedding and was giving it a year. Right after the year is up I stupidly stopped the pill and got pregnant the first time....I thought I was going back on birth control during the act itself. I got pregnant and lived out of state. I could not leave due to possible custody issues. Took 8 years to get back here. Now I can actually consider leaving because I am in the place I want to live permanently. I could not even consider leaving when I was in another state.

These were all choices. That's what you aren't getting, OP. You didn't have to have that child. You chose to go off birth control. You moved.

Stop being a victim and own it! If you want to go, then leave. No one is forcing you to do anything. Stop whining.

[Anonymous]

It sounds like you have made up your mind OP. I am curious to know what your plan is, as a PP asked.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP what is your plan if you leave? Are you hoping to find someone more compatible and remarry? Are you the type who says you really just want to live alone and will never remarry again, but maybe you'll date?
If the former....honestly based on what you've said it sounds like you have some serious issues that you need to deal with with a therapist. If what you've said is true, you jumped into an unhappy and codependent relationship and stayed there for years, continuing to get yourself more and more invested in life with him while knowing even since 4 months in that it's not what you wanted. That's...not healthy. What makes you think you'd do any better the next time?
And if the second...you yourself have said he's a great partner/roommate/co-parent. If you're not leaving to hope you meet someone better to build a life with, why not do what many people do and stay in an unfulfilling but ultimately fine marriage? Do you thing, live your life, don't destroy your kids' lives.

OP here: I would never be interested in remarrying or trying to fall in love again. Maybe a FWB arrangement but no interest in a long-term relationship again. I am fine on my own.

If that's the case I guess I don't see why you're in any big rush to leave

[Anonymous]

OP here: I moved after the wedding and was giving it a year. Right after the year is up I stupidly stopped the pill and got pregnant the first time....I thought I was going back on birth control during the act itself. I got pregnant and lived out of state. I could not leave due to possible custody issues. Took 8 years to get back here. Now I can actually consider leaving because I am in the place I want to live permanently. I could not even consider leaving when I was in another state.

These were all choices. That's what you aren't getting, OP. You didn't have to have that child. You chose to go off birth control. You moved.

Stop being a victim and own it! If you want to go, then leave. No one is forcing you to do anything. Stop whining.

You really think this? She has clearly "owned" it numerous times. Go yell at the wind. She's simply offering answers to questions and figuring out the pros and cons of leaving versus staying. There is no right answer.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Every marriage is different. Every divorce is different. In my case, our co-parenting is much better than our marriage was.

Look at some of the threads in special parenting concerns on co-parenting to get a peek of what you could be in store for, and compare to what you’re dealing with now.

How old are your children?

One is in preschool; one is in early elementary school

So you have clearly been having sex.

Let me explain it for you: the first was conceived the very first and only time we had unprotected sex, which I immediately regretted afterward but resulted in pregnancy. We did not have sex until three years later when my second was conceived. And then we did not have sex for four more years after that.

DP. You sound like a lot in pain and I’m sorry but why you and your husband aren’t having sex for long period of time ?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP here: I moved after the wedding and was giving it a year. Right after the year is up I stupidly stopped the pill and got pregnant the first time....I thought I was going back on birth control during the act itself. I got pregnant and lived out of state. I could not leave due to possible custody issues. Took 8 years to get back here. Now I can actually consider leaving because I am in the place I want to live permanently. I could not even consider leaving when I was in another state.

These were all choices. That's what you aren't getting, OP. You didn't have to have that child. You chose to go off birth control. You moved.

Stop being a victim and own it! If you want to go, then leave. No one is forcing you to do anything. Stop whining.

You really think this? She has clearly "owned" it numerous times. Go yell at the wind. She's simply offering answers to questions and figuring out the pros and cons of leaving versus staying. There is no right answer.
+1
She's owned it since her initial post. At this point she's just answering questions, I haven't seen her whine yet.

[Anonymous]

OP honestly if you live/operate well together and you definitely aren't interested in trying to meet someone else, what is the big urgency in doing this?

[Anonymous]

No, don't stay.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP here: I moved after the wedding and was giving it a year. Right after the year is up I stupidly stopped the pill and got pregnant the first time....I thought I was going back on birth control during the act itself. I got pregnant and lived out of state. I could not leave due to possible custody issues. Took 8 years to get back here. Now I can actually consider leaving because I am in the place I want to live permanently. I could not even consider leaving when I was in another state.

These were all choices. That's what you aren't getting, OP. You didn't have to have that child. You chose to go off birth control. You moved.

Stop being a victim and own it! If you want to go, then leave. No one is forcing you to do anything. Stop whining.

You really think this? She has clearly "owned" it numerous times. Go yell at the wind. She's simply offering answers to questions and figuring out the pros and cons of leaving versus staying. There is no right answer.
+1
She's owned it since her initial post. At this point she's just answering questions, I haven't seen her whine yet.

OP here: thanks for your support. I thought the same thing. I was not whining; I was answering questions asked and I admitted to messing up from the very beginning. But how to stay for kids and if that makes sense or if better to go is my dilemma.

[Anonymous]

I don’t understand why you think staying for the kids is a good option. You are demonstrating to the kids that married people don’t show affection, act like roommates, and harbor resentment. Do you want that mindset ingrained in them? You are modeling dysfunction. As the kids get older, they will pick up on this more and more.

Better to cut your losses now, get divorced, and show your kids what two happy but divorced parents look like. It sounds like you guys would be fine as co-parents.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP honestly if you live/operate well together and you definitely aren't interested in trying to meet someone else, what is the big urgency in doing this?

OP here: the decision is not urgent, but I think it should be made within a year or two.

[Anonymous]

I'm in a dead marriage. The kids are grown. I try to put a good face on it but honestly? I wish I'd left him when the children were small. They knew our marriage was a disaster and it made life unhappy for them, too.