My SIL makes family functions unbearable - I really need to vent.

[Anonymous]

OP again:

I do feel bad too. I needed to vent and get out all the terrible.

SIL does have wonderful qualities. She is smart and funny and she has a very advanced degree w/an interesting job.

She is struggling. She isn't handling that struggle well. I know every one of us in the family has said the wrong thing or not handled a situation well.

Its just getting to the point where everyone is at their breaking point.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP here.

I feel much hmmm I guess saner now that I was able to vent. As I said I needed to get it all out so I didn't explode on my SIL.

I usually just "grin and bear it" because I understand that she must be going through hell and also there isn't a damn thing I can do about it. But this past year and a half things have just been escalating and though some may say it is not my right I really do feel that enough is enough. I am probably the last person to get there too. My DH has 4 brothers and a sister and I'm pretty much the only inlaw that isn't outright hostile towards her. She has burned many a bridge.

I probably should not have mentioned the infertility and just stated that she is controlling, manipulative, physically and mentally abusive and emotionally draining. I think I would have gotten very different advice and commiseration. Because doesn't everyone have at least one emotional vampire in their family circle? I mentioned it though because I was hoping that someone would say this was either normal or there was specific help she could seek to help her better navigate family gatherings that are full of children and mothers.

As I said, I haven't spoken to her since the hospital but I am going to have to see her this Saturday. I am dreading it but at least now I feel I can keep my mouth shut.

But you did. And a lot of people do that. They don't even realize that they do, and they actually further alienate the person they think is horrible. I'm tired of all of the "horrible infertile person" posts.

Sure, it does push people to be passive aggressive because they are bombarded day in and day out ALL.THE.TIME with the constant message that they are incomplete because they are a mother (because, you know, that's the greatist thing you can be and you aren't really a woman until you are a mother and it's the best thing that anyone could ever do). ALL.THE.TIME.

I'm sorry, but you have no clue what that can do to a person over time.

I love how "mental illness" is our new catch-all scapegoat for everything. Instead of looking at, hey, wait a minute, maybe there are things that society does and that a lot of people do to alienate certain groups of people and how that makes them lash out, we instead say they must be mentally ill because they can't handle it.

Infertility is a big deal. It's a very difficult thing. And even women who had trouble getting pregnant but eventually did have a successful pregnant do not fully understand how it feels when the reality is that not only are you struggling with infertility but it is highly unlikely that you will win that battle.

As other PPs have said, we expect people to not talk about it and "be grateful you're an aunt!"

If you are having such a difficult time with your SIL, maybe she just doesn't like you or maybe she's just not nice and the infertility is irrelevant. But maybe the fact that you went out of your way to start off your post with identifying her infertility is a sign that you have made and continue to say things (perhaps without realizing it) that have contributed to how she behaves toward you.

If you didn't get along with her before you had kids and before she realized she was infertile, then what's the mystery? You just don't like each other. But even you framed the issue as having some connection to her infertility. That's disturbing.

So physical attacks, bullying elderly parents into giving money and emotionally abusing a postpartum mom is passive aggressive these days?

SIL and I had a very friendly relationship until the hospital incident. I even took her beating on me and let it go and excused it because of her grief over infertility. As I said this has been building to this point. As I also said I was the last of the ILs that she finally burned a bridge with. I have always been incredibly kind to her regarding her infertility.

You seem to be filling in a lot of blanks that aren't there and projecting your own situation onto mine. You want to paint my SIL with rose colored glasses and paint the rest of us as assholes. Which just isnt true. She is suffering and she wants everyone else to be miserable with her. She also wants to excuse all of her behavior with "well I'm infertile"

There is no way I could have talked out the situation I was having without mentioning that this has been building for years due to increasing anger and grief over infertility.

I'm not projecting because none of my inlaws or extended relatives even know about my infertility story. And I have never done any of the things you say your SIL has done.

I also didn't paint your SIL with rose colored glasses.

But your story is mixed up. First, she's mean because she's infertile and you've endured it out of compassion for her situation, but she's pushing the limits. Then she is mean but using "infertility" as an excuse to behave badly.

I'm not sure she's "bullying" elderly parents into given money. She can say what she wants, and they can say no. We're talking about adults. And that doesn't involve you; it's between her and the parents.

If you don't like her and think she is a "bully" and mean and behaves badly, then distance yourself from her. Your an adult. You qualify everything with "I've always been incredibly kind to her regarding infertility." I don't know what that means. Do you want a cookie?

If she doesn't something you're upset about, holding a grudge but not saying anything to her isn't "being kind." It's passive aggressive. If you are bothered by something she does and you aren't willing to let it go, then you should tell her and then if you reach a standstill, then distance yourself from her.

You need to separate the infertility issue with the relationship issue. That's my point. It sounds like you are just as guilty as she is of making all of these disagreements about her infertility, instead of about your relationship, disputes or wrongs that have gone unaddressed, et cetera.

If you are going to keep making assumptions, twisting words and making up facts then I can't keep trying to respond to you.

Thank you for your advice.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

I'm not projecting because none of my inlaws or extended relatives even know about my infertility story. And I have never done any of the things you say your SIL has done.

I also didn't paint your SIL with rose colored glasses.

But your story is mixed up. First, she's mean because she's infertile and you've endured it out of compassion for her situation, but she's pushing the limits. Then she is mean but using "infertility" as an excuse to behave badly.

I'm not sure she's "bullying" elderly parents into given money. She can say what she wants, and they can say no. We're talking about adults. And that doesn't involve you; it's between her and the parents.

If you don't like her and think she is a "bully" and mean and behaves badly, then distance yourself from her. Your an adult. You qualify everything with "I've always been incredibly kind to her regarding infertility." I don't know what that means. Do you want a cookie?

If she doesn't something you're upset about, holding a grudge but not saying anything to her isn't "being kind." It's passive aggressive. If you are bothered by something she does and you aren't willing to let it go, then you should tell her and then if you reach a standstill, then distance yourself from her.

You need to separate the infertility issue with the relationship issue. That's my point. It sounds like you are just as guilty as she is of making all of these disagreements about her infertility, instead of about your relationship, disputes or wrongs that have gone unaddressed, et cetera.

If someone says no and then you escalate a situation to get our way - that is bullying.

No where has OP said she doesn't like her SIL or her SIL doesn't like her. No where has she said she has held a grudge. In fact I am pretty sure she said she has let things go in the past until recent incidents.

If the SIL makes everything about infertility then her family has no choice but to accept that every issue is about infertility.

I feel like you haven't even read what has been said because there is no way you'd be excusing it. Unless you are just being contrary on purpose because you are pissed off the OP dared to mention infertility.

[Anonymous]

Op, here is what I'd do. Talk to her before Saturday. Be gentle but honest. "I was just so upset when you completely dismissed my feelings and my son's condition at the hospital. You need to know that your words really hurt and alienate others, even though you're struggling." Let her know you care about her, will even lend an ear, but that you can't tolerate the insults and hurtful things anymore.

[Anonymous]

I cannot believe that anyone would defend a grown woman who physically hurts others and also has the nerve to focus on themselves when a family member is in the hospital about to have emergency surgery. Unreal. Team OP.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:
I'm not projecting because none of my inlaws or extended relatives even know about my infertility story. And I have never done any of the things you say your SIL has done.

I also didn't paint your SIL with rose colored glasses.

But your story is mixed up. First, she's mean because she's infertile and you've endured it out of compassion for her situation, but she's pushing the limits. Then she is mean but using "infertility" as an excuse to behave badly.

I'm not sure she's "bullying" elderly parents into given money. She can say what she wants, and they can say no. We're talking about adults. And that doesn't involve you; it's between her and the parents.

If you don't like her and think she is a "bully" and mean and behaves badly, then distance yourself from her. Your an adult. You qualify everything with "I've always been incredibly kind to her regarding infertility." I don't know what that means. Do you want a cookie?

If she doesn't something you're upset about, holding a grudge but not saying anything to her isn't "being kind." It's passive aggressive. If you are bothered by something she does and you aren't willing to let it go, then you should tell her and then if you reach a standstill, then distance yourself from her.

You need to separate the infertility issue with the relationship issue. That's my point. It sounds like you are just as guilty as she is of making all of these disagreements about her infertility, instead of about your relationship, disputes or wrongs that have gone unaddressed, et cetera.

Not the OP, and I think you need to step out and leave OP alone. You are way off and definitely projecting your own shit on this situation and, as OP mentioned, twisting things and making shit up. Please go. Talk to someone who cares about you and find another way to deal.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Op, here is what I'd do. Talk to her before Saturday. Be gentle but honest. "I was just so upset when you completely dismissed my feelings and my son's condition at the hospital. You need to know that your words really hurt and alienate others, even though you're struggling." Let her know you care about her, will even lend an ear, but that you can't tolerate the insults and hurtful things anymore.

+1

Perfect advice for navigating a tough situation.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

I'm not projecting because none of my inlaws or extended relatives even know about my infertility story. And I have never done any of the things you say your SIL has done.

I also didn't paint your SIL with rose colored glasses.

But your story is mixed up. First, she's mean because she's infertile and you've endured it out of compassion for her situation, but she's pushing the limits. Then she is mean but using "infertility" as an excuse to behave badly.

I'm not sure she's "bullying" elderly parents into given money. She can say what she wants, and they can say no. We're talking about adults. And that doesn't involve you; it's between her and the parents.

If you don't like her and think she is a "bully" and mean and behaves badly, then distance yourself from her. Your an adult. You qualify everything with "I've always been incredibly kind to her regarding infertility." I don't know what that means. Do you want a cookie?

If she doesn't something you're upset about, holding a grudge but not saying anything to her isn't "being kind." It's passive aggressive. If you are bothered by something she does and you aren't willing to let it go, then you should tell her and then if you reach a standstill, then distance yourself from her.

You need to separate the infertility issue with the relationship issue. That's my point. It sounds like you are just as guilty as she is of making all of these disagreements about her infertility, instead of about your relationship, disputes or wrongs that have gone unaddressed, et cetera.

If someone says no and then you escalate a situation to get our way - that is bullying.

No where has OP said she doesn't like her SIL or her SIL doesn't like her. No where has she said she has held a grudge. In fact I am pretty sure she said she has let things go in the past until recent incidents.

If the SIL makes everything about infertility then her family has no choice but to accept that every issue is about infertility.

I feel like you haven't even read what has been said because there is no way you'd be excusing it. Unless you are just being contrary on purpose because you are pissed off the OP dared to mention infertility.

Not the pp, but I've read it and not really sure what needs to be acted upon. SIL sounds Annoying, obnoxious, selfish...but abusive? I also don't agree that pushing when you hear no is 'bullying.' It's not like she's a drug addict stealing from the in laws for her habit. Hopefully op's family never has to deal with that kind of real drama. how is any of this op's business/problem? The comment she overheard at the hospital did not wish ill on her son, just the opposite, in fact. it was prefaced with a selfish statement which was inappropriate for the time and place. But all this drama over that? An intervention? If anything, wouldn't she want to stay out of it so as not to feed her SIL's attempts to get attention for this? I think op is acting like a drama queen herself, and frankly, this will only escalate the situation. Hopefully, other cooler heads and more mature members in the family can rise above all this drama and they'll make it through this without resorting to throwing around the Sicilian curses that the people on here are recommending.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

I'm not projecting because none of my inlaws or extended relatives even know about my infertility story. And I have never done any of the things you say your SIL has done.

I also didn't paint your SIL with rose colored glasses.

But your story is mixed up. First, she's mean because she's infertile and you've endured it out of compassion for her situation, but she's pushing the limits. Then she is mean but using "infertility" as an excuse to behave badly.

I'm not sure she's "bullying" elderly parents into given money. She can say what she wants, and they can say no. We're talking about adults. And that doesn't involve you; it's between her and the parents.

If you don't like her and think she is a "bully" and mean and behaves badly, then distance yourself from her. Your an adult. You qualify everything with "I've always been incredibly kind to her regarding infertility." I don't know what that means. Do you want a cookie?

If she doesn't something you're upset about, holding a grudge but not saying anything to her isn't "being kind." It's passive aggressive. If you are bothered by something she does and you aren't willing to let it go, then you should tell her and then if you reach a standstill, then distance yourself from her.

You need to separate the infertility issue with the relationship issue. That's my point. It sounds like you are just as guilty as she is of making all of these disagreements about her infertility, instead of about your relationship, disputes or wrongs that have gone unaddressed, et cetera.

If someone says no and then you escalate a situation to get our way - that is bullying.

No where has OP said she doesn't like her SIL or her SIL doesn't like her. No where has she said she has held a grudge. In fact I am pretty sure she said she has let things go in the past until recent incidents.

If the SIL makes everything about infertility then her family has no choice but to accept that every issue is about infertility.

I feel like you haven't even read what has been said because there is no way you'd be excusing it. Unless you are just being contrary on purpose because you are pissed off the OP dared to mention infertility.

Not the pp, but I've read it and not really sure what needs to be acted upon. SIL sounds Annoying, obnoxious, selfish...but abusive? I also don't agree that pushing when you hear no is 'bullying.' It's not like she's a drug addict stealing from the in laws for her habit. Hopefully op's family never has to deal with that kind of real drama. how is any of this op's business/problem? The comment she overheard at the hospital did not wish ill on her son, just the opposite, in fact. it was prefaced with a selfish statement which was inappropriate for the time and place. But all this drama over that? An intervention? If anything, wouldn't she want to stay out of it so as not to feed her SIL's attempts to get attention for this? I think op is acting like a drama queen herself, and frankly, this will only escalate the situation. Hopefully, other cooler heads and more mature members in the family can rise above all this drama and they'll make it through this without resorting to throwing around the Sicilian curses that the people on here are recommending.

Please stop posting here over and over. Its really obvious.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

I'm not projecting because none of my inlaws or extended relatives even know about my infertility story. And I have never done any of the things you say your SIL has done.

I also didn't paint your SIL with rose colored glasses.

But your story is mixed up. First, she's mean because she's infertile and you've endured it out of compassion for her situation, but she's pushing the limits. Then she is mean but using "infertility" as an excuse to behave badly.

I'm not sure she's "bullying" elderly parents into given money. She can say what she wants, and they can say no. We're talking about adults. And that doesn't involve you; it's between her and the parents.

If you don't like her and think she is a "bully" and mean and behaves badly, then distance yourself from her. Your an adult. You qualify everything with "I've always been incredibly kind to her regarding infertility." I don't know what that means. Do you want a cookie?

If she doesn't something you're upset about, holding a grudge but not saying anything to her isn't "being kind." It's passive aggressive. If you are bothered by something she does and you aren't willing to let it go, then you should tell her and then if you reach a standstill, then distance yourself from her.

You need to separate the infertility issue with the relationship issue. That's my point. It sounds like you are just as guilty as she is of making all of these disagreements about her infertility, instead of about your relationship, disputes or wrongs that have gone unaddressed, et cetera.

If someone says no and then you escalate a situation to get our way - that is bullying.

No where has OP said she doesn't like her SIL or her SIL doesn't like her. No where has she said she has held a grudge. In fact I am pretty sure she said she has let things go in the past until recent incidents.

If the SIL makes everything about infertility then her family has no choice but to accept that every issue is about infertility.

I feel like you haven't even read what has been said because there is no way you'd be excusing it. Unless you are just being contrary on purpose because you are pissed off the OP dared to mention infertility.

Not the pp, but I've read it and not really sure what needs to be acted upon. SIL sounds Annoying, obnoxious, selfish...but abusive? I also don't agree that pushing when you hear no is 'bullying.' It's not like she's a drug addict stealing from the in laws for her habit. Hopefully op's family never has to deal with that kind of real drama. how is any of this op's business/problem? The comment she overheard at the hospital did not wish ill on her son, just the opposite, in fact. it was prefaced with a selfish statement which was inappropriate for the time and place. But all this drama over that? An intervention? If anything, wouldn't she want to stay out of it so as not to feed her SIL's attempts to get attention for this? I think op is acting like a drama queen herself, and frankly, this will only escalate the situation. Hopefully, other cooler heads and more mature members in the family can rise above all this drama and they'll make it through this without resorting to throwing around the Sicilian curses that the people on here are recommending.

Please stop posting here over and over. Its really obvious.

That was my second post here. not sure what's obvious? sounds like you are the one posting over and over? anyway the advice below seems good, except the lending an ear part- SIL might really take that seriously, and I doubt if OP is up for it (frankly only a therapist might be) and it will like just create more family drama. boundaries, people!:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Op, here is what I'd do. Talk to her before Saturday. Be gentle but honest. "I was just so upset when you completely dismissed my feelings and my son's condition at the hospital. You need to know that your words really hurt and alienate others, even though you're struggling." Let her know you care about her, will even lend an ear, but that you can't tolerate the insults and hurtful things anymore.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Op, here is what I'd do. Talk to her before Saturday. Be gentle but honest. "I was just so upset when you completely dismissed my feelings and my son's condition at the hospital. You need to know that your words really hurt and alienate others, even though you're struggling." Let her know you care about her, will even lend an ear, but that you can't tolerate the insults and hurtful things anymore.

+1

Perfect advice for navigating a tough situation.

Yes! This is very good advice. And if/when she does anything mean to you again (like the thing with your son in the hospital), you are totally justified in saying "It is not OK for you treat me like that" and leave the room.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
I think you need a family meeting about this, sans SIL. Centering about when enough is enough, and what the grandparents's obligations are regarding money, and what the family's obligations are regarding including her in social gatherings if she continues to make it all about her. I think you are all miserable separately and feeling guilty, and that you will feel so much better if you can find a safe outlet to express everyone's feelings about the matter.

The reality is, some people need to be told directly what the boundaries are. If the whole family can agree on some, it might be a good idea to let SIL know what they are. She'll feel awful in the moment, but perhaps it will be healthier for her in the long-term.

She is not open to adoption?

My DH's sister has wanted to have a family sit down about this for a while now. No one has wanted to exclude SIL though and go behind her back. We are all really trying to be considerate of her situation. I think I might back the idea though. It certainly couldn't make this situation worse.

My BIL has wanted adoption for a very long time. I don't know why she is not open to that idea. Maybe she will be now that their options are limited.

It's very nice that y'all are being considerate "of her situation" but for 15 years?? Are you completely crazy?

Why would you put up with such outrageous behavior for 15 years??

This must be a troll post.

No one is this nuts.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
I think you need a family meeting about this, sans SIL. Centering about when enough is enough, and what the grandparents's obligations are regarding money, and what the family's obligations are regarding including her in social gatherings if she continues to make it all about her. I think you are all miserable separately and feeling guilty, and that you will feel so much better if you can find a safe outlet to express everyone's feelings about the matter.

The reality is, some people need to be told directly what the boundaries are. If the whole family can agree on some, it might be a good idea to let SIL know what they are. She'll feel awful in the moment, but perhaps it will be healthier for her in the long-term.

She is not open to adoption?

My DH's sister has wanted to have a family sit down about this for a while now. No one has wanted to exclude SIL though and go behind her back. We are all really trying to be considerate of her situation. I think I might back the idea though. It certainly couldn't make this situation worse.

My BIL has wanted adoption for a very long time. I don't know why she is not open to that idea. Maybe she will be now that their options are limited.

It's very nice that y'all are being considerate "of her situation" but for 15 years?? Are you completely crazy?

Why would you put up with such outrageous behavior for 15 years??

This must be a troll post.

No one is this nuts.

You must have missed the part where this has been building up and escalating.

Some people take a while to show their true colors.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

I'm sorry for your loss, PP. My close friend lost a child years ago, and I'm still shell-shocked. Anyway, whose to say OP's SIL won't form new friendships and get the support she needs? She won't get it with OP, will she? So there is little point in analyzing this family's dynamic. SIL must die for them. The end.

Yep, because trying to establish some boundaries after letting this abusive woman run roughshod over the entire family for years is the same as wishing her dead. Super duper equivalent.

Oh the drama. Not physically dead, PP. Chill.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Your family needs to recognize your SIL has a mental illness. Infertility may have been the trigger but it is not the cause. The cause, actually, doesn't matter because you need to deal with the symptoms of her illness just as you would if she were a substance abuser. You need to start with establishing boundaries. Abusive, disrespectful behavior is not to be tolerated. If her behavior makes interacting with her unpleasant/intolerable/unpredictable, don't interact with her. You can greet her at events, be civil/polite but don't engage. Don't invite her to events at your house. You can't do anything about her behavior but you have a lot of control over your own. You may not like your choices but you do have many. Disengaging is probably one of the most effective and useful. HTH.

This. Grief is ugly and tough to watch. When someone is suffering, he or she is expected to crawl under a rock and die off quietly, because it is unacceptable to inconvenience the more fortunate in any way. It is sad, but it's true.

OP, may you never be in your SIL's shoes. Meaning never have a crisis that will have your family turn away and forget about you, because you are nothing but a nuisance to them.

SIL isn't "inconveniencing" people. She's not making them "uncomfortable." She's not a "nuisance." She's been a raging bitch to everyone in her family for 15 years. She's been mean and toxic. For 15 years. She made a new mother cry because that mother had the temerity to have a baby when SIL couldn't. Her family walks on eggshells around her. It's not her grief that they object to; it's the fact that she makes a giant spectacle of it in order to make them all feel sorry for her at every possible opportunity. She makes every niece's birthday party and every nephew's broken arm about her. She wields her grief like a club against the very same people that she demands money from. She hits people. For 15 years.

Grief does not give you carte blanc to treat your family like crap for the rest of your life. This SIL needs treatment, because she's clearly suffering from some kind of mental illness or disorder. In the meantime, her family is not obligated to take her shit endlessly.

So? I couldn't care less how you describe the situation. The result will be the same I don't care if it makes you feel uncomfortable enough to justify your position on an anonymous forum. I simply didn't feel like placating OP's ego. There is nothing wrong with her life, and she doesn't need your comfort. You can tell her to drop her SIL like a hot potato and be done with it