My SIL makes family functions unbearable - I really need to vent.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Your family needs to recognize your SIL has a mental illness. Infertility may have been the trigger but it is not the cause. The cause, actually, doesn't matter because you need to deal with the symptoms of her illness just as you would if she were a substance abuser. You need to start with establishing boundaries. Abusive, disrespectful behavior is not to be tolerated. If her behavior makes interacting with her unpleasant/intolerable/unpredictable, don't interact with her. You can greet her at events, be civil/polite but don't engage. Don't invite her to events at your house. You can't do anything about her behavior but you have a lot of control over your own. You may not like your choices but you do have many. Disengaging is probably one of the most effective and useful. HTH.

This. Grief is ugly and tough to watch. When someone is suffering, he or she is expected to crawl under a rock and die off quietly, because it is unacceptable to inconvenience the more fortunate in any way. It is sad, but it's true.

OP, may you never be in your SIL's shoes. Meaning never have a crisis that will have your family turn away and forget about you, because you are nothing but a nuisance to them.

That's such bullshit. When people are greiving they're often met with compassion, but when they continually lash out and try to cause everyone else to be in pain for 15 years instead of learning to cope with their circumstances, it's too much. She's becoming toxic by actively ruining what should be happy occasions, going out of her way to hurt other people out of jealousy, and it sounds like she's okay with financially ruining herself, her DH, MIL, and FIL, and expecting everyone in the family to help fund more fertility treatments. No one is abandoning her. She's alienating and pushing people away.

Why is this bullshit, if this is exactly what many PPs advise? Like it or hate it, his is what people do. Unhappy people are unhappy, and yes, it interferes with happy people's family dynamics. If you are more comfortable with saying "she is alienating people," so be it. It doesn't change anything. Sad people are an inconvenience to happy people. Why is it so hard for you to admit this? The algorythm is as follows:

Something bad happens to you, you withdraw, so that others go on with their lives without you. (Frankly, I think it is best for all involved.)
Something bad happens to a friend or relative, you cut the ties. (Again, in most cases best for all involved.)

I wouldn't judge OP, if she wanted to remove this nuisance from her life. I would probably do the same thing. Do we really need to window-dress this? You certainly can, but why?

I take issue with the notion that cutting sad people out of your life is normal or standard. You're calling her sad when she's actually mean, abusive and toxic. You're phrasing it as though people are abandoning her and I don't see it that way.

She needs help, but it sounds like she'd refuse help anyway.

I guess you're right, that in the end they do need to disengage, so stepping back is stepping back. But it's not like OP cut her off immediately because something unfortunate happened to SIL. She's upset with SIL because of SIL's actions. She put in 15 years before getting to this point.

It is semantics. Read the message right above yours. "She should stay home," "I wouldn't attend the upcoming event"--it's not bullshit, I assure you. If this happened right away, everybody would be spared 15 years of upsetting drama. So why not stop pretending like we care? Our lives are about our "experiences," right? Why put a damper on them until we absolutely have to? This reminds me of the thread by a DW whose husband is dying of cancer. Talk about inconveniece... Unfortunately, most people get to experience similar pain sooner or later. So my advice to you: Learn to withdraw early. When the shit hits the fan, just go away and spare the rest of the world your petty drama.

I couldn't disagree more. I've been through a lot, including the loss of a child. I got help when I needed it. My family and friends supported me and helped me. Of course I wasn't being mean to them at every turn, but I had some moments that weren't pretty. A few people couldn't deal and a few friendships ended, but a few acquaintances came from out of nowhere and helped in ways I'd never have imagined and new friendships were made. I could've chosen to hide and shut myself off from the world, but it certainly wouldn't have helped me heal and move on.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Your family needs to recognize your SIL has a mental illness. Infertility may have been the trigger but it is not the cause. The cause, actually, doesn't matter because you need to deal with the symptoms of her illness just as you would if she were a substance abuser. You need to start with establishing boundaries. Abusive, disrespectful behavior is not to be tolerated. If her behavior makes interacting with her unpleasant/intolerable/unpredictable, don't interact with her. You can greet her at events, be civil/polite but don't engage. Don't invite her to events at your house. You can't do anything about her behavior but you have a lot of control over your own. You may not like your choices but you do have many. Disengaging is probably one of the most effective and useful. HTH.

This. Grief is ugly and tough to watch. When someone is suffering, he or she is expected to crawl under a rock and die off quietly, because it is unacceptable to inconvenience the more fortunate in any way. It is sad, but it's true.

OP, may you never be in your SIL's shoes. Meaning never have a crisis that will have your family turn away and forget about you, because you are nothing but a nuisance to them.

That's such bullshit. When people are greiving they're often met with compassion, but when they continually lash out and try to cause everyone else to be in pain for 15 years instead of learning to cope with their circumstances, it's too much. She's becoming toxic by actively ruining what should be happy occasions, going out of her way to hurt other people out of jealousy, and it sounds like she's okay with financially ruining herself, her DH, MIL, and FIL, and expecting everyone in the family to help fund more fertility treatments. No one is abandoning her. She's alienating and pushing people away.

Why is this bullshit, if this is exactly what many PPs advise? Like it or hate it, his is what people do. Unhappy people are unhappy, and yes, it interferes with happy people's family dynamics. If you are more comfortable with saying "she is alienating people," so be it. It doesn't change anything. Sad people are an inconvenience to happy people. Why is it so hard for you to admit this? The algorythm is as follows:

Something bad happens to you, you withdraw, so that others go on with their lives without you. (Frankly, I think it is best for all involved.)
Something bad happens to a friend or relative, you cut the ties. (Again, in most cases best for all involved.)

I wouldn't judge OP, if she wanted to remove this nuisance from her life. I would probably do the same thing. Do we really need to window-dress this? You certainly can, but why?

I take issue with the notion that cutting sad people out of your life is normal or standard. You're calling her sad when she's actually mean, abusive and toxic. You're phrasing it as though people are abandoning her and I don't see it that way.

She needs help, but it sounds like she'd refuse help anyway.

I guess you're right, that in the end they do need to disengage, so stepping back is stepping back. But it's not like OP cut her off immediately because something unfortunate happened to SIL. She's upset with SIL because of SIL's actions. She put in 15 years before getting to this point.

It is semantics. Read the message right above yours. "She should stay home," "I wouldn't attend the upcoming event"--it's not bullshit, I assure you. If this happened right away, everybody would be spared 15 years of upsetting drama. So why not stop pretending like we care? Our lives are about our "experiences," right? Why put a damper on them until we absolutely have to? This reminds me of the thread by a DW whose husband is dying of cancer. Talk about inconveniece... Unfortunately, most people get to experience similar pain sooner or later. So my advice to you: Learn to withdraw early. When the shit hits the fan, just go away and spare the rest of the world your petty drama.

I couldn't disagree more. I've been through a lot, including the loss of a child. I got help when I needed it. My family and friends supported me and helped me. Of course I wasn't being mean to them at every turn, but I had some moments that weren't pretty. A few people couldn't deal and a few friendships ended, but a few acquaintances came from out of nowhere and helped in ways I'd never have imagined and new friendships were made. I could've chosen to hide and shut myself off from the world, but it certainly wouldn't have helped me heal and move on.

I'm sorry for your loss, PP. My close friend lost a child years ago, and I'm still shell-shocked. Anyway, whose to say OP's SIL won't form new friendships and get the support she needs? She won't get it with OP, will she? So there is little point in analyzing this family's dynamic. SIL must die for them. The end.

[Anonymous]

OP, not sure I read this right, but was SIL at hospital when 10 YO was admitted? Who is asking her to be present at such a time?

On the mass emails for bday parties, use the BCC field instead of TO field.

I would have my DH let her know that if she hits you again the police will be called.

I would consider moving away. She's losing her mind, clearly, because of her grief. Don't let it consume you too.

[Anonymous]

It sounds like your SIL essentially wished ill for your son to make things more "fair". That's way over the line. You should decline to see her again for a long time (unless she, without prodding from you, can get her act together to apologize). Stop inviting her to things. Stop attending things where she will be. See other family members in small gatherings where it won't be viewed as a purposeful "exclusion" of SIL.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

I'm sorry for your loss, PP. My close friend lost a child years ago, and I'm still shell-shocked. Anyway, whose to say OP's SIL won't form new friendships and get the support she needs? She won't get it with OP, will she? So there is little point in analyzing this family's dynamic. SIL must die for them. The end.

Yep, because trying to establish some boundaries after letting this abusive woman run roughshod over the entire family for years is the same as wishing her dead. Super duper equivalent.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

I'm sorry for your loss, PP. My close friend lost a child years ago, and I'm still shell-shocked. Anyway, whose to say OP's SIL won't form new friendships and get the support she needs? She won't get it with OP, will she? So there is little point in analyzing this family's dynamic. SIL must die for them. The end.

Yep, because trying to establish some boundaries after letting this abusive woman run roughshod over the entire family for years is the same as wishing her dead. Super duper equivalent.

That. You can't say the difference between distancing yourself from someone and them being dead to you is an issue of semantics. You're being over the top dramatic. It's like you know the right answer, but you don't really agree for some reason, so you're using inflammatory language to derail the conversation.

Thanks for the condolences.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:calling your SIL emotionally and physically abusive seems over the top. The comment she made while your son was hospitalized was insensitive and self centered, but not 'emotionally abusive.' I agree with the pp's that your in-laws decisions about how much money to give which children and why aren't your concern. If she were going through a bankruptcy, custody battle, or cancer would you really be criticizing the $$ or time spent by other people? I'm not sure why you feel this affects you so much, that you need to 'intervene'. If my in laws were planning a meeting like you describe, I wouldn't go near it-it's between them. I get that its annoying to be around her, I think it is true for many of us and our in laws. But you are not required to be her best friend, and you, your husband and kids aren't much affected now that you don't give them money. You seem to want to play the white knight and protect your in laws from her, but have any of them asked for your protection? Seems like mostly you just want to brag about how crazy she is and how sane you are, but that only makes you look kind of petty, given her misfortune. We all get she's not handling it well, but I don't understand why you need to worry about that so much. Ironically, you complain of her overplaying the victim, but you go to great lengths to prove you are being victimized by her, and, frankly it's not convincing. You should give yourself the advice you wish you could give her: Get a life.

So being pushed and hit is not physical abuse?

Causing a one week post partum woman to sob is not emotional abuse?

There are so really strange excuses going on in this thread.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:It sounds like your SIL essentially wished ill for your son to make things more "fair". That's way over the line. You should decline to see her again for a long time (unless she, without prodding from you, can get her act together to apologize). Stop inviting her to things. Stop attending things where she will be. See other family members in small gatherings where it won't be viewed as a purposeful "exclusion" of SIL.

I agree. I'd be done with her after what she said about your son and I'd also have told her that to her face. She's crossed the line big time. I'm furious just reading that. How disgusting of her to say something about her own nephew.

[Anonymous]

I have yet to meet a person who is struggling with infertility make such a spectacle of themselves time and time and time again. I hear about this sort of thing on DCUM but I have never encountered such a person IRL.

In fact, it's usually quite the opposite.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I have yet to meet a person who is struggling with infertility make such a spectacle of themselves time and time and time again. I hear about this sort of thing on DCUM but I have never encountered such a person IRL.

In fact, it's usually quite the opposite.

I read things on DCUM often that I have never encountered IRL, doesn't make them less true. Just makes me realize my life is not as crazy as it could be.
Just b/c you have never experienced something doesn't make it doesn't exist.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I have yet to meet a person who is struggling with infertility make such a spectacle of themselves time and time and time again. I hear about this sort of thing on DCUM but I have never encountered such a person IRL.

In fact, it's usually quite the opposite.

I read things on DCUM often that I have never encountered IRL, doesn't make them less true. Just makes me realize my life is not as crazy as it could be.
Just b/c you have never experienced something doesn't make it doesn't exist.

+1.the stuff in relationships always seems so far fetched to me because I'm happily married but that doesn't mean it's not happening in other people's lives.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I have yet to meet a person who is struggling with infertility make such a spectacle of themselves time and time and time again. I hear about this sort of thing on DCUM but I have never encountered such a person IRL.

In fact, it's usually quite the opposite.

I read things on DCUM often that I have never encountered IRL, doesn't make them less true. Just makes me realize my life is not as crazy as it could be.
Just b/c you have never experienced something doesn't make it doesn't exist.

+1.the stuff in relationships always seems so far fetched to me because I'm happily married but that doesn't mean it's not happening in other people's lives.

Agree. I don't assume people with 7 figure incomes and multi million dollar homes don't exist just because I don't know any and god knows DCUM is filled with them!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Your family needs to recognize your SIL has a mental illness. Infertility may have been the trigger but it is not the cause. The cause, actually, doesn't matter because you need to deal with the symptoms of her illness just as you would if she were a substance abuser. You need to start with establishing boundaries. Abusive, disrespectful behavior is not to be tolerated. If her behavior makes interacting with her unpleasant/intolerable/unpredictable, don't interact with her. You can greet her at events, be civil/polite but don't engage. Don't invite her to events at your house. You can't do anything about her behavior but you have a lot of control over your own. You may not like your choices but you do have many. Disengaging is probably one of the most effective and useful. HTH.

This. Grief is ugly and tough to watch. When someone is suffering, he or she is expected to crawl under a rock and die off quietly, because it is unacceptable to inconvenience the more fortunate in any way. It is sad, but it's true.

OP, may you never be in your SIL's shoes. Meaning never have a crisis that will have your family turn away and forget about you, because you are nothing but a nuisance to them.

SIL isn't "inconveniencing" people. She's not making them "uncomfortable." She's not a "nuisance." She's been a raging bitch to everyone in her family for 15 years. She's been mean and toxic. For 15 years. She made a new mother cry because that mother had the temerity to have a baby when SIL couldn't. Her family walks on eggshells around her. It's not her grief that they object to; it's the fact that she makes a giant spectacle of it in order to make them all feel sorry for her at every possible opportunity. She makes every niece's birthday party and every nephew's broken arm about her. She wields her grief like a club against the very same people that she demands money from. She hits people. For 15 years.

Grief does not give you carte blanc to treat your family like crap for the rest of your life. This SIL needs treatment, because she's clearly suffering from some kind of mental illness or disorder. In the meantime, her family is not obligated to take her shit endlessly.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:When your SIL essentially lamented that your son was going to be OK after his accident that would have been the moment that I would have severed my relationship with her. Forever. I don't care how hurting she is from her struggles with infertility. That sort of behavior is unforgivable and using her infertility as perpetual justification for every unkind thing she says and does is an affront to the millions of women who deal with infertility with some level of humility and grace.

Yup. Wishing death on my kid would be the last straw for me. I don't know what to say about your in-laws emptying their retirement account for them. Maybe have DH have a talk with them, especially if you think yu are their fall back plan and that is not in the cards for some reason. I wouldn't lend BIL and SIL any money myself, that's for sure, because, as mentioned above, I would no longer have a relationship with them.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I have yet to meet a person who is struggling with infertility make such a spectacle of themselves time and time and time again. I hear about this sort of thing on DCUM but I have never encountered such a person IRL.

In fact, it's usually quite the opposite.

Pretty much. Sometimes people cry or make themselves recluses (including me). If I even said the least little thing, I would be attacked by my family--"well, you didn't have children early enough" or what my mother said to me "some women are just not meant to be mothers" So I keep my mouth firmly shut and see them as little as possible.

It could be that OP's SIL is just mentally ill as well as infertile?
It sounds like this is a really extreme case and that the SIL is a real bully, as well as being very hurt.

Your DH needs to talk to his parents about all the money they are giving SIL--just let them know that SIL and BIL are responsible when the parents need money, because they are taking so much of it. If everyone would get together and firmly tell her you are sympathic, but it does not mean you are not having children--and if she does anything other than cry or leave the room she will be excluded from any future events at your house. Other people have a right to do what they want.