Why no business major at (most of) the Ivies

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:if you wanted a job in PE or IB at a top firm, you'd have better odds as a history major from Yale than a business major out of Stern

This is just objectively not true at all. Stern has tremendous placement in IB and PE.

And Yale is better. It is 100% true.

Just joining this thread. It is a clear class divider in America (and by class, I am not just using wealth as a criteria) between those who understand the value of a non-pre-professional Ivy League/top SLAC degree and those who don't. There is a mentality among some people that you are totally wasting your time if you are not doing a pre-professional degree. While I somewhat understand the need to be concerned about ROI as the cost of college rapidly increases, particularly for those for whom the cost is a large portion of their net worth, this is a very short-sighted, narrow minded perspective.

To reach the upper reaches of white collar corporate America, it is critical thinking skills that matter the most, as well as people skills. To rise through the ranks of these places, it doesn't really matter what you studied as an undergrad. It matters how you navigate your way up. You can do this as a liberal arts major, a STEM major, or anything else.

I have worked on Wall Street most of my career. I have historically preferred hiring really smart Ivy League types, regardless of their degrees, over obsessively requiring a "business degree." I am happy to hire engineers as those skills are valuable, but not required.

When I talk to people who don't get this, or who say "why would you go to Williams?" I know to adjust the conversation accordingly. They just don't get it. Yes - I am a snob. I'll own that. But when these people who know so little about the levers of power in America talk to me like I am clueless when in fact I get the joke, I find it hilarious. YMMV.

You put this very well. Thank you. I agree 100%. I guess you have to see this world to get it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My SLAC didn't/doesn't offer it, either . . . I don't think that many do. It's not part of a classic curriculum that focuses on theory and critical thinking skills, versus practical and technical skills (that most graduates from elite schools will pick up on the job).

Companies now a days want people who can hit the ground running, and that often means already having the practical/technical skills on the job. That's why internships are so important.

No I want intelligent people with critical thinking skills. I can train them in the job skills but if they don’t have the ability to think and analyze, they are of no use to me.

lol listen to yourself. So, kid graduating with an Engineering degree lacks "critical thinking skills" or the "ability to think and analyze". Stop posting this nonsense.

We’re talking about business on this thread. That’s the context. Keep up, please.

A pp was talking about critical thinking skills in relation to major, and that "liberal arts" degrees teach critical thinking skills, and "trade" majors like Engineering don't teach that.

Nope you seem confused and now you’re doubling down. See this is why those reading comprehension and critical thinking skills matter!

Here's how the thread goes:

1. SLAC Classic curriculum that focuses on theory and critical thinking skills, versus practical and technical skills (that most graduates from elite schools will pick up on the job)...

2. Companies now a days want people who can hit the ground running, and that often means already having the practical/technical skills on the job. That's why internships are so important

3. No I want intelligent people with critical thinking skills...

4. So, kid graduating with an Engineering degree (practical and technical skills) lacks "critical thinking skills" or the "ability to think and analyze"?

5....We’re talking about business on this thread. ..

6. A pp was talking about critical thinking skills in relation to major, and that "liberal arts" degrees (from their SLAC) teach critical thinking skills, insinuating that "trade" majors like Engineering don't teach that.

Critical thinking skills and reading comprehension are indeed important.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:if you wanted a job in PE or IB at a top firm, you'd have better odds as a history major from Yale than a business major out of Stern

This is just objectively not true at all. Stern has tremendous placement in IB and PE.

And Yale is better. It is 100% true.

Just joining this thread. It is a clear class divider in America (and by class, I am not just using wealth as a criteria) between those who understand the value of a non-pre-professional Ivy League/top SLAC degree and those who don't. There is a mentality among some people that you are totally wasting your time if you are not doing a pre-professional degree. While I somewhat understand the need to be concerned about ROI as the cost of college rapidly increases, particularly for those for whom the cost is a large portion of their net worth, this is a very short-sighted, narrow minded perspective.

To reach the upper reaches of white collar corporate America, it is critical thinking skills that matter the most, as well as people skills. To rise through the ranks of these places, it doesn't really matter what you studied as an undergrad. It matters how you navigate your way up. You can do this as a liberal arts major, a STEM major, or anything else.

I have worked on Wall Street most of my career. I have historically preferred hiring really smart Ivy League types, regardless of their degrees, over obsessively requiring a "business degree." I am happy to hire engineers as those skills are valuable, but not required.

When I talk to people who don't get this, or who say "why would you go to Williams?" I know to adjust the conversation accordingly. They just don't get it. Yes - I am a snob. I'll own that. But when these people who know so little about the levers of power in America talk to me like I am clueless when in fact I get the joke, I find it hilarious. YMMV.

IDK... too many people from the Harvards and Yales have seriously F*UP our world. I'll take a regular "trade" school graduate over an Ivy leaguer these days.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My SLAC didn't/doesn't offer it, either . . . I don't think that many do. It's not part of a classic curriculum that focuses on theory and critical thinking skills, versus practical and technical skills (that most graduates from elite schools will pick up on the job).

Companies now a days want people who can hit the ground running, and that often means already having the practical/technical skills on the job. That's why internships are so important.

No I want intelligent people with critical thinking skills. I can train them in the job skills but if they don’t have the ability to think and analyze, they are of no use to me.

lol listen to yourself. So, kid graduating with an Engineering degree lacks "critical thinking skills" or the "ability to think and analyze". Stop posting this nonsense.

We’re talking about business on this thread. That’s the context. Keep up, please.

A pp was talking about critical thinking skills in relation to major, and that "liberal arts" degrees teach critical thinking skills, and "trade" majors like Engineering don't teach that.

Nope you seem confused and now you’re doubling down. See this is why those reading comprehension and critical thinking skills matter!

Here's how the thread goes:

1. SLAC Classic curriculum that focuses on theory and critical thinking skills, versus practical and technical skills (that most graduates from elite schools will pick up on the job)...

2. Companies now a days want people who can hit the ground running, and that often means already having the practical/technical skills on the job. That's why internships are so important

3. No I want intelligent people with critical thinking skills...

4. So, kid graduating with an Engineering degree (practical and technical skills) lacks "critical thinking skills" or the "ability to think and analyze"?

5....We’re talking about business on this thread. ..

6. A pp was talking about critical thinking skills in relation to major, and that "liberal arts" degrees (from their SLAC) teach critical thinking skills, insinuating that "trade" majors like Engineering don't teach that.

Critical thinking skills and reading comprehension are indeed important.

Thank you old wise one. Lol

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:if you wanted a job in PE or IB at a top firm, you'd have better odds as a history major from Yale than a business major out of Stern

This is just objectively not true at all. Stern has tremendous placement in IB and PE.

And Yale is better. It is 100% true.

Just joining this thread. It is a clear class divider in America (and by class, I am not just using wealth as a criteria) between those who understand the value of a non-pre-professional Ivy League/top SLAC degree and those who don't. There is a mentality among some people that you are totally wasting your time if you are not doing a pre-professional degree. While I somewhat understand the need to be concerned about ROI as the cost of college rapidly increases, particularly for those for whom the cost is a large portion of their net worth, this is a very short-sighted, narrow minded perspective.

To reach the upper reaches of white collar corporate America, it is critical thinking skills that matter the most, as well as people skills. To rise through the ranks of these places, it doesn't really matter what you studied as an undergrad. It matters how you navigate your way up. You can do this as a liberal arts major, a STEM major, or anything else.

I have worked on Wall Street most of my career. I have historically preferred hiring really smart Ivy League types, regardless of their degrees, over obsessively requiring a "business degree." I am happy to hire engineers as those skills are valuable, but not required.

When I talk to people who don't get this, or who say "why would you go to Williams?" I know to adjust the conversation accordingly. They just don't get it. Yes - I am a snob. I'll own that. But when these people who know so little about the levers of power in America talk to me like I am clueless when in fact I get the joke, I find it hilarious. YMMV.

IDK... too many people from the Harvards and Yales have seriously F*UP our world. I'll take a regular "trade" school graduate over an Ivy leaguer these days.

I think you just proved their point. Cherry picking a few bad eggs to make a broad generalization - lacking critical thinking skills and clearly not Ivy educated.

[Anonymous]

Those Ivy schools are filled with posers now. The best can be found from

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Those Ivy schools are filled with posers now. The best can be found from

a lot of other schools.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:if you wanted a job in PE or IB at a top firm, you'd have better odds as a history major from Yale than a business major out of Stern

This is just objectively not true at all. Stern has tremendous placement in IB and PE.

And Yale is better. It is 100% true.

Just joining this thread. It is a clear class divider in America (and by class, I am not just using wealth as a criteria) between those who understand the value of a non-pre-professional Ivy League/top SLAC degree and those who don't. There is a mentality among some people that you are totally wasting your time if you are not doing a pre-professional degree. While I somewhat understand the need to be concerned about ROI as the cost of college rapidly increases, particularly for those for whom the cost is a large portion of their net worth, this is a very short-sighted, narrow minded perspective.

To reach the upper reaches of white collar corporate America, it is critical thinking skills that matter the most, as well as people skills. To rise through the ranks of these places, it doesn't really matter what you studied as an undergrad. It matters how you navigate your way up. You can do this as a liberal arts major, a STEM major, or anything else.

I have worked on Wall Street most of my career. I have historically preferred hiring really smart Ivy League types, regardless of their degrees, over obsessively requiring a "business degree." I am happy to hire engineers as those skills are valuable, but not required.

When I talk to people who don't get this, or who say "why would you go to Williams?" I know to adjust the conversation accordingly. They just don't get it. Yes - I am a snob. I'll own that. But when these people who know so little about the levers of power in America talk to me like I am clueless when in fact I get the joke, I find it hilarious. YMMV.

IDK... too many people from the Harvards and Yales have seriously F*UP our world. I'll take a regular "trade" school graduate over an Ivy leaguer these days.

I think you just proved their point. Cherry picking a few bad eggs to make a broad generalization - lacking critical thinking skills and clearly not Ivy educated.

A FEW!!!!????!!!!

Check out the Supreme Court for starters.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:if you wanted a job in PE or IB at a top firm, you'd have better odds as a history major from Yale than a business major out of Stern

This is just objectively not true at all. Stern has tremendous placement in IB and PE.

And Yale is better. It is 100% true.

Just joining this thread. It is a clear class divider in America (and by class, I am not just using wealth as a criteria) between those who understand the value of a non-pre-professional Ivy League/top SLAC degree and those who don't. There is a mentality among some people that you are totally wasting your time if you are not doing a pre-professional degree. While I somewhat understand the need to be concerned about ROI as the cost of college rapidly increases, particularly for those for whom the cost is a large portion of their net worth, this is a very short-sighted, narrow minded perspective.

To reach the upper reaches of white collar corporate America, it is critical thinking skills that matter the most, as well as people skills. To rise through the ranks of these places, it doesn't really matter what you studied as an undergrad. It matters how you navigate your way up. You can do this as a liberal arts major, a STEM major, or anything else.

I have worked on Wall Street most of my career. I have historically preferred hiring really smart Ivy League types, regardless of their degrees, over obsessively requiring a "business degree." I am happy to hire engineers as those skills are valuable, but not required.

When I talk to people who don't get this, or who say "why would you go to Williams?" I know to adjust the conversation accordingly. They just don't get it. Yes - I am a snob. I'll own that. But when these people who know so little about the levers of power in America talk to me like I am clueless when in fact I get the joke, I find it hilarious. YMMV.

IDK... too many people from the Harvards and Yales have seriously F*UP our world. I'll take a regular "trade" school graduate over an Ivy leaguer these days.

I think you just proved their point. Cherry picking a few bad eggs to make a broad generalization - lacking critical thinking skills and clearly not Ivy educated.

A FEW!!!!????!!!!

Check out the Supreme Court for starters.

Fine. Don't send your kid to an Ivy. More room for my kid.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:if you wanted a job in PE or IB at a top firm, you'd have better odds as a history major from Yale than a business major out of Stern

This is just objectively not true at all. Stern has tremendous placement in IB and PE.

And Yale is better. It is 100% true.

Just joining this thread. It is a clear class divider in America (and by class, I am not just using wealth as a criteria) between those who understand the value of a non-pre-professional Ivy League/top SLAC degree and those who don't. There is a mentality among some people that you are totally wasting your time if you are not doing a pre-professional degree. While I somewhat understand the need to be concerned about ROI as the cost of college rapidly increases, particularly for those for whom the cost is a large portion of their net worth, this is a very short-sighted, narrow minded perspective.

To reach the upper reaches of white collar corporate America, it is critical thinking skills that matter the most, as well as people skills. To rise through the ranks of these places, it doesn't really matter what you studied as an undergrad. It matters how you navigate your way up. You can do this as a liberal arts major, a STEM major, or anything else.

I have worked on Wall Street most of my career. I have historically preferred hiring really smart Ivy League types, regardless of their degrees, over obsessively requiring a "business degree." I am happy to hire engineers as those skills are valuable, but not required.

When I talk to people who don't get this, or who say "why would you go to Williams?" I know to adjust the conversation accordingly. They just don't get it. Yes - I am a snob. I'll own that. But when these people who know so little about the levers of power in America talk to me like I am clueless when in fact I get the joke, I find it hilarious. YMMV.

IDK... too many people from the Harvards and Yales have seriously F*UP our world. I'll take a regular "trade" school graduate over an Ivy leaguer these days.

I think you just proved their point. Cherry picking a few bad eggs to make a broad generalization - lacking critical thinking skills and clearly not Ivy educated.

A FEW!!!!????!!!!

Check out the Supreme Court for starters.

Fine. Don't send your kid to an Ivy. More room for my kid.

That's not the point. The point is that you can't have it both ways. Either you make the argument that Ivy elites have the best jobs and dominate the power structure or you say it doesn't matter.

I'm not hearing the "doesn't matter" argument on this thread, so you get to take responsibility for the many, many Ivy grads like Trump, Cruz, DeSantis, Alito, Gorsuch, Kavanaugh, Hegseth, etc. etc. that are currently driving this country into the ditch.

To say there are only "a few" shows lack of critical thinking, lol.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Back in the 70s when I was applying to colleges, Wharton was considered a backdoor into Penn. People looked down on business degrees in general- they were for kids with lower grades and scores. We definitely thought of business as more like trade school certificate than a college degree.

The fact that Penn has Wharton was why I always thought of Penn as the dumb Ivy.

[Anonymous]

MIT alum - these are trades. Dirty work. Not philosophy. Not gentleman pursuits. This is why MIT came out of nowhere. Mens et manus. Practical studies, applications and military studies (first ROTC unit in the country).

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:if you wanted a job in PE or IB at a top firm, you'd have better odds as a history major from Yale than a business major out of Stern

This is just objectively not true at all. Stern has tremendous placement in IB and PE.

And Yale is better. It is 100% true.

Just joining this thread. It is a clear class divider in America (and by class, I am not just using wealth as a criteria) between those who understand the value of a non-pre-professional Ivy League/top SLAC degree and those who don't. There is a mentality among some people that you are totally wasting your time if you are not doing a pre-professional degree. While I somewhat understand the need to be concerned about ROI as the cost of college rapidly increases, particularly for those for whom the cost is a large portion of their net worth, this is a very short-sighted, narrow minded perspective.

To reach the upper reaches of white collar corporate America, it is critical thinking skills that matter the most, as well as people skills. To rise through the ranks of these places, it doesn't really matter what you studied as an undergrad. It matters how you navigate your way up. You can do this as a liberal arts major, a STEM major, or anything else.

I have worked on Wall Street most of my career. I have historically preferred hiring really smart Ivy League types, regardless of their degrees, over obsessively requiring a "business degree." I am happy to hire engineers as those skills are valuable, but not required.

When I talk to people who don't get this, or who say "why would you go to Williams?" I know to adjust the conversation accordingly. They just don't get it. Yes - I am a snob. I'll own that. But when these people who know so little about the levers of power in America talk to me like I am clueless when in fact I get the joke, I find it hilarious. YMMV.

This is so true, as a SLAC grad myself. DC is headed to an Ivy as an English major. It's so interesting to see the reactions - to many they think it means no money and becoming a barista at Starbucks (I laugh along), but I also know that it could also lead to many other careers and there is no way I can even begin to explain that to someone who doesn't get it.

[Anonymous]

The most popular major at Harvard is Economics:

https://www.ivyscholars.com/harvards-most-and-least-popular-majors/

[Anonymous]

The three most popular majors at Harvard are economics, government (political science) and computer science.