Low effort teens

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:As a parent of a child who is an extremely hard worker and a kid who is not, I do not think any amount of pushing will work. The kid has to want to do it.

I have seen kids in college fail without mommy. I would rather my kid fail now than as a college student.

why? how is it better to fail in HS?

Pp here. DH and I are type A high achievers. Our oldest child is just like us but better. Our middle child is naturally gifted and puts little effort like OP’s kids. He isn’t literally failing but he will get a B because he didn’t study or has missing assignments. I want him to figure this out by himself while he is in middle school.

And what if he doesn't? What if he just keeps underperforming?

I lose sleep because the kid stresses me out. Getting him to get to middle school on time is even a struggle. I accept the kid he is. I’m not going to be able to push or nag him into Harvard. I have accepted that he may go to Penn State or BU or Rutgers or some good weather school he gets into. He is very social and popular so I hope he will do ok.

You are a mess.. he might "have to go to Penn state or BU or Rutgers" ... OMG.

I am not a mess. My very smart and talented kid puts in little to no effort. My older child takes all AP classes with straight As with zero effort from the parents. It is hard to watch one kid try so hard and one kid do nothing.

Kid is doing something. Just not what you consider worthwhile. there is a happy medium between 100percent effort and 0 percent. And honestly, if things come easy to you why would you need to put in extra work?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:As a parent of a child who is an extremely hard worker and a kid who is not, I do not think any amount of pushing will work. The kid has to want to do it.

I have seen kids in college fail without mommy. I would rather my kid fail now than as a college student.

why? how is it better to fail in HS?

Pp here. DH and I are type A high achievers. Our oldest child is just like us but better. Our middle child is naturally gifted and puts little effort like OP’s kids. He isn’t literally failing but he will get a B because he didn’t study or has missing assignments. I want him to figure this out by himself while he is in middle school.

And what if he doesn't? What if he just keeps underperforming?

I lose sleep because the kid stresses me out. Getting him to get to middle school on time is even a struggle. I accept the kid he is. I’m not going to be able to push or nag him into Harvard. I have accepted that he may go to Penn State or BU or Rutgers or some good weather school he gets into. He is very social and popular so I hope he will do ok.

You are a mess.. he might "have to go to Penn state or BU or Rutgers" ... OMG.

I am not a mess. My very smart and talented kid puts in little to no effort. My older child takes all AP classes with straight As with zero effort from the parents. It is hard to watch one kid try so hard and one kid do nothing.

Kid is doing something. Just not what you consider worthwhile. there is a happy medium between 100percent effort and 0 percent. And honestly, if things come easy to you why would you need to put in extra work?

Things coming easily is a choice. Try to win an olympic medal and you will see that it's not so easy.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I was just talking to my sister about this this weekend. She was recalling a conversation she had with my dad in high school where she explained to him that she could put in low/medium effort and do pretty well (A-/B+) or put in extraordinary effort and really excel (A/A+) - but that the first choice seemed to make a lot more sense. To this, my father replied “honey, you’ve figured out the secret to life. I’m so proud.” Thirty years later “slacker” sister is doing just as well as our sibling who put in the extra effort, and arguably, is much happier.

Not going to lie, I’m still pretty inclined to push my kids but there really is a point of diminishing returns. If they’re on track to be healthy, contributing adults I wouldn’t sweat it too much.

The thing is, our children live in a different world. Your sister didn't have to compete with the pool of extremely driven, talented immigrants like our children do. You could pretty much coast to an upper middle class life. You can't count on this anymore. Maybe it will happen, maybe not - but the odds are definitively different from what they were 30 years ago.

Um there is plenty of homegrown talent. Competition is stiffer partly bc thanks to the internet, people have heard of all the really good schools that wouldn’t have geographically been on their radar several decades ago. Can’t believe you’re yelling “IMMIGRANTS!” on a post about kids

I am an immigrant myself, I am not yelling "immigrants". The fact is that there is much more competition globally and that Harvard has more than a quarter of their college filled with international students. I was one of a handful of such students many years ago, now my own kids are facing at least 10 times as many.

And even if increasing competition were merely due to homegrown talent, the points remains that it's a different world today. You can't just phone it in to an upper middle class lifestyle.

Well look around most middle class and upper middle class people went to state schools and even 2nd tier state schools.

Your an immigrant, you haven't figured this out yet?

This is not about brand schools. Sure, you can be rich and successful coming from any school. But increasingly you won't be able to do so without being really ambitious and putting in the work. The kind of work that today's kids trying for top colleges are putting. The low effort jobs won't be enough to allow the children to live the kind of life their parents did.

I a lot of people here still seem to be live that the average person can have a really comfortable life, like they used to, because 30 years ago their cousin blah blah blah... I don't think this is going to be the case.

Well you are wrong.

but you can torture your child and they will have anxiety and depression from your insane parenting.

Wouldn't that make you happy, huh? Wouldn't you love for the hard working kids to be miserable, you, the, non-competitive, easy going person full of kindness?

Dp This is prime example of distorted thinking. Why would pp or anyone want 'hard working kids' to be miserable? Why is the choice is only between 'hard working' and doing nothing? There are more examples of kids who are overworked and stressed due to parental pressure. But that does not mean anyone wishes ill will on these kids. We feel for them!

I remember reading a book that dealt with this topic and it was very interesting: https://www.amazon.com/Overachievers-Secret-Lives-Driven-Kids/dp/140130902X

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:As a parent of a child who is an extremely hard worker and a kid who is not, I do not think any amount of pushing will work. The kid has to want to do it.

I have seen kids in college fail without mommy. I would rather my kid fail now than as a college student.

why? how is it better to fail in HS?

Pp here. DH and I are type A high achievers. Our oldest child is just like us but better. Our middle child is naturally gifted and puts little effort like OP’s kids. He isn’t literally failing but he will get a B because he didn’t study or has missing assignments. I want him to figure this out by himself while he is in middle school.

And what if he doesn't? What if he just keeps underperforming?

I lose sleep because the kid stresses me out. Getting him to get to middle school on time is even a struggle. I accept the kid he is. I’m not going to be able to push or nag him into Harvard. I have accepted that he may go to Penn State or BU or Rutgers or some good weather school he gets into. He is very social and popular so I hope he will do ok.

You are a mess.. he might "have to go to Penn state or BU or Rutgers" ... OMG.

I am not a mess. My very smart and talented kid puts in little to no effort. My older child takes all AP classes with straight As with zero effort from the parents. It is hard to watch one kid try so hard and one kid do nothing.

Kid is doing something. Just not what you consider worthwhile. there is a happy medium between 100percent effort and 0 percent. And honestly, if things come easy to you why would you need to put in extra work?

Things coming easily is a choice. Try to win an olympic medal and you will see that it's not so easy.

Not everyone wants to win an Olympic gold. Good for them but, I never had any desire to swim thousands of laps and miss out on life's normal pleasures! And btw, I was talking about school and grades.

[Anonymous]

I think it's important how you define success. What does that word mean to you, OP? Is a doctor, dentist, IT person, business owner etc. who went to not-highly ranked schools and are not at the top of their field still successful to you if they have happy families, are financially stable and able to live reasonably well, etc?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I was just talking to my sister about this this weekend. She was recalling a conversation she had with my dad in high school where she explained to him that she could put in low/medium effort and do pretty well (A-/B+) or put in extraordinary effort and really excel (A/A+) - but that the first choice seemed to make a lot more sense. To this, my father replied “honey, you’ve figured out the secret to life. I’m so proud.” Thirty years later “slacker” sister is doing just as well as our sibling who put in the extra effort, and arguably, is much happier.

Not going to lie, I’m still pretty inclined to push my kids but there really is a point of diminishing returns. If they’re on track to be healthy, contributing adults I wouldn’t sweat it too much.

The thing is, our children live in a different world. Your sister didn't have to compete with the pool of extremely driven, talented immigrants like our children do. You could pretty much coast to an upper middle class life. You can't count on this anymore. Maybe it will happen, maybe not - but the odds are definitively different from what they were 30 years ago.

Um there is plenty of homegrown talent. Competition is stiffer partly bc thanks to the internet, people have heard of all the really good schools that wouldn’t have geographically been on their radar several decades ago. Can’t believe you’re yelling “IMMIGRANTS!” on a post about kids

I am an immigrant myself, I am not yelling "immigrants". The fact is that there is much more competition globally and that Harvard has more than a quarter of their college filled with international students. I was one of a handful of such students many years ago, now my own kids are facing at least 10 times as many.

And even if increasing competition were merely due to homegrown talent, the points remains that it's a different world today. You can't just phone it in to an upper middle class lifestyle.

Well look around most middle class and upper middle class people went to state schools and even 2nd tier state schools.

Your an immigrant, you haven't figured this out yet?

This is not about brand schools. Sure, you can be rich and successful coming from any school. But increasingly you won't be able to do so without being really ambitious and putting in the work. The kind of work that today's kids trying for top colleges are putting. The low effort jobs won't be enough to allow the children to live the kind of life their parents did.

I a lot of people here still seem to be live that the average person can have a really comfortable life, like they used to, because 30 years ago their cousin blah blah blah... I don't think this is going to be the case.

Well you are wrong.

but you can torture your child and they will have anxiety and depression from your insane parenting.

Wouldn't that make you happy, huh? Wouldn't you love for the hard working kids to be miserable, you, the, non-competitive, easy going person full of kindness?

Dp This is prime example of distorted thinking. Why would pp or anyone want 'hard working kids' to be miserable? Why is the choice is only between 'hard working' and doing nothing? There are more examples of kids who are overworked and stressed due to parental pressure. But that does not mean anyone wishes ill will on these kids. We feel for them!

I remember reading a book that dealt with this topic and it was very interesting: https://www.amazon.com/Overachievers-Secret-Lives-Driven-Kids/dp/140130902X

A lot of people are envious and insecure of their own parenting choices. They are literally hoping that children who are pushed by their parents (as they see it - it might not even be true, as they don't really know much other kids are studying or what their parents are telling them) fail in school and careers, and/or hate their parents as adults. PP is literally hoping that my child (as they see them) will suffer from anxiety and depression because of my "insane parenting". It will validate their parenting philosophy and show that their child is the one ahead, after all.

These are the same people who preach laid back parenting based on kindness and understanding. In reality, they just want (what appear to be accomplished) kids to fail. "See, I told you, my B student is now a CEO while your valedictorian is taking medication."

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I was just talking to my sister about this this weekend. She was recalling a conversation she had with my dad in high school where she explained to him that she could put in low/medium effort and do pretty well (A-/B+) or put in extraordinary effort and really excel (A/A+) - but that the first choice seemed to make a lot more sense. To this, my father replied “honey, you’ve figured out the secret to life. I’m so proud.” Thirty years later “slacker” sister is doing just as well as our sibling who put in the extra effort, and arguably, is much happier.

Not going to lie, I’m still pretty inclined to push my kids but there really is a point of diminishing returns. If they’re on track to be healthy, contributing adults I wouldn’t sweat it too much.

The thing is, our children live in a different world. Your sister didn't have to compete with the pool of extremely driven, talented immigrants like our children do. You could pretty much coast to an upper middle class life. You can't count on this anymore. Maybe it will happen, maybe not - but the odds are definitively different from what they were 30 years ago.

Um there is plenty of homegrown talent. Competition is stiffer partly bc thanks to the internet, people have heard of all the really good schools that wouldn’t have geographically been on their radar several decades ago. Can’t believe you’re yelling “IMMIGRANTS!” on a post about kids

I am an immigrant myself, I am not yelling "immigrants". The fact is that there is much more competition globally and that Harvard has more than a quarter of their college filled with international students. I was one of a handful of such students many years ago, now my own kids are facing at least 10 times as many.

And even if increasing competition were merely due to homegrown talent, the points remains that it's a different world today. You can't just phone it in to an upper middle class lifestyle.

Well look around most middle class and upper middle class people went to state schools and even 2nd tier state schools.

Your an immigrant, you haven't figured this out yet?

This is not about brand schools. Sure, you can be rich and successful coming from any school. But increasingly you won't be able to do so without being really ambitious and putting in the work. The kind of work that today's kids trying for top colleges are putting. The low effort jobs won't be enough to allow the children to live the kind of life their parents did.

I a lot of people here still seem to be live that the average person can have a really comfortable life, like they used to, because 30 years ago their cousin blah blah blah... I don't think this is going to be the case.

Well you are wrong.

but you can torture your child and they will have anxiety and depression from your insane parenting.

Wouldn't that make you happy, huh? Wouldn't you love for the hard working kids to be miserable, you, the, non-competitive, easy going person full of kindness?

Dp This is prime example of distorted thinking. Why would pp or anyone want 'hard working kids' to be miserable? Why is the choice is only between 'hard working' and doing nothing? There are more examples of kids who are overworked and stressed due to parental pressure. But that does not mean anyone wishes ill will on these kids. We feel for them!

I remember reading a book that dealt with this topic and it was very interesting: https://www.amazon.com/Overachievers-Secret-Lives-Driven-Kids/dp/140130902X

A lot of people are envious and insecure of their own parenting choices. They are literally hoping that children who are pushed by their parents (as they see it - it might not even be true, as they don't really know much other kids are studying or what their parents are telling them) fail in school and careers, and/or hate their parents as adults. PP is literally hoping that my child (as they see them) will suffer from anxiety and depression because of my "insane parenting". It will validate their parenting philosophy and show that their child is the one ahead, after all.

These are the same people who preach laid back parenting based on kindness and understanding. In reality, they just want (what appear to be accomplished) kids to fail. "See, I told you, my B student is now a CEO while your valedictorian is taking medication."

You can say the same for 'hard working kids' parents to wish failure on those kids who aren't pushed by their parents to fail. See I told you have to push your kids! Billy is working at Wendy's because his parents didn't force him to get all As! So meanness goes BOTH ways!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:How could you possibly know that she is only putting 70% of effort into running. Do you go to all of her practices.

They are choosing classes probably based on teachers and counselors recommendations and what’s best for them.

You have nothing to base this on. They aren’t going to an Ivy League like most students. Let them be who they are. You’ll all be happier.

It's possible. But some kids are driven enough to demand tougher classes from teachers and counselors. The latter are not necessarily very concerned if students are sufficiently challenged.

I could have demanded AP physics when I was in school. Doesn’t mean I had any business being in that class.

OP said they were in AP classes. In her opinion they weren’t the “tough” enough. That’s just crazy.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:As a parent of a child who is an extremely hard worker and a kid who is not, I do not think any amount of pushing will work. The kid has to want to do it.

I have seen kids in college fail without mommy. I would rather my kid fail now than as a college student.

why? how is it better to fail in HS?

Pp here. DH and I are type A high achievers. Our oldest child is just like us but better. Our middle child is naturally gifted and puts little effort like OP’s kids. He isn’t literally failing but he will get a B because he didn’t study or has missing assignments. I want him to figure this out by himself while he is in middle school.

And what if he doesn't? What if he just keeps underperforming?

I lose sleep because the kid stresses me out. Getting him to get to middle school on time is even a struggle. I accept the kid he is. I’m not going to be able to push or nag him into Harvard. I have accepted that he may go to Penn State or BU or Rutgers or some good weather school he gets into. He is very social and popular so I hope he will do ok.

You are a mess.. he might "have to go to Penn state or BU or Rutgers" ... OMG.

I am not a mess. My very smart and talented kid puts in little to no effort. My older child takes all AP classes with straight As with zero effort from the parents. It is hard to watch one kid try so hard and one kid do nothing.

Kid is doing something. Just not what you consider worthwhile. there is a happy medium between 100percent effort and 0 percent. And honestly, if things come easy to you why would you need to put in extra work?

Things coming easily is a choice. Try to win an olympic medal and you will see that it's not so easy.

Your expectation is that your child put in Olympic medal level effort?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I was just talking to my sister about this this weekend. She was recalling a conversation she had with my dad in high school where she explained to him that she could put in low/medium effort and do pretty well (A-/B+) or put in extraordinary effort and really excel (A/A+) - but that the first choice seemed to make a lot more sense. To this, my father replied “honey, you’ve figured out the secret to life. I’m so proud.” Thirty years later “slacker” sister is doing just as well as our sibling who put in the extra effort, and arguably, is much happier.

Not going to lie, I’m still pretty inclined to push my kids but there really is a point of diminishing returns. If they’re on track to be healthy, contributing adults I wouldn’t sweat it too much.

The thing is, our children live in a different world. Your sister didn't have to compete with the pool of extremely driven, talented immigrants like our children do. You could pretty much coast to an upper middle class life. You can't count on this anymore. Maybe it will happen, maybe not - but the odds are definitively different from what they were 30 years ago.

Um there is plenty of homegrown talent. Competition is stiffer partly bc thanks to the internet, people have heard of all the really good schools that wouldn’t have geographically been on their radar several decades ago. Can’t believe you’re yelling “IMMIGRANTS!” on a post about kids

I am an immigrant myself, I am not yelling "immigrants". The fact is that there is much more competition globally and that Harvard has more than a quarter of their college filled with international students. I was one of a handful of such students many years ago, now my own kids are facing at least 10 times as many.

And even if increasing competition were merely due to homegrown talent, the points remains that it's a different world today. You can't just phone it in to an upper middle class lifestyle.

Well look around most middle class and upper middle class people went to state schools and even 2nd tier state schools.

Your an immigrant, you haven't figured this out yet?

This is not about brand schools. Sure, you can be rich and successful coming from any school. But increasingly you won't be able to do so without being really ambitious and putting in the work. The kind of work that today's kids trying for top colleges are putting. The low effort jobs won't be enough to allow the children to live the kind of life their parents did.

I a lot of people here still seem to be live that the average person can have a really comfortable life, like they used to, because 30 years ago their cousin blah blah blah... I don't think this is going to be the case.

Well you are wrong.

but you can torture your child and they will have anxiety and depression from your insane parenting.

Wouldn't that make you happy, huh? Wouldn't you love for the hard working kids to be miserable, you, the, non-competitive, easy going person full of kindness?

Dp This is prime example of distorted thinking. Why would pp or anyone want 'hard working kids' to be miserable? Why is the choice is only between 'hard working' and doing nothing? There are more examples of kids who are overworked and stressed due to parental pressure. But that does not mean anyone wishes ill will on these kids. We feel for them!

I remember reading a book that dealt with this topic and it was very interesting: https://www.amazon.com/Overachievers-Secret-Lives-Driven-Kids/dp/140130902X

A lot of people are envious and insecure of their own parenting choices. They are literally hoping that children who are pushed by their parents (as they see it - it might not even be true, as they don't really know much other kids are studying or what their parents are telling them) fail in school and careers, and/or hate their parents as adults. PP is literally hoping that my child (as they see them) will suffer from anxiety and depression because of my "insane parenting". It will validate their parenting philosophy and show that their child is the one ahead, after all.

These are the same people who preach laid back parenting based on kindness and understanding. In reality, they just want (what appear to be accomplished) kids to fail. "See, I told you, my B student is now a CEO while your valedictorian is taking medication."

Nobody hopes you kids have anxiety and depression people are literally trying to help you not push a kid so hard he has anxiety and depression. They are also explaining to you that your hard hitter and your laid back child will essentially end up with the same amount of money in the end.

You actually want to be able to parent in a way that is toxic for this specific child and your justification is that there are people in the world pushing you to be a better parent so their kid will beat your kid... do you know how insane that sounds.

My child is not in competition with your child in any way, shape or form.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I was just talking to my sister about this this weekend. She was recalling a conversation she had with my dad in high school where she explained to him that she could put in low/medium effort and do pretty well (A-/B+) or put in extraordinary effort and really excel (A/A+) - but that the first choice seemed to make a lot more sense. To this, my father replied “honey, you’ve figured out the secret to life. I’m so proud.” Thirty years later “slacker” sister is doing just as well as our sibling who put in the extra effort, and arguably, is much happier.

Not going to lie, I’m still pretty inclined to push my kids but there really is a point of diminishing returns. If they’re on track to be healthy, contributing adults I wouldn’t sweat it too much.

The thing is, our children live in a different world. Your sister didn't have to compete with the pool of extremely driven, talented immigrants like our children do. You could pretty much coast to an upper middle class life. You can't count on this anymore. Maybe it will happen, maybe not - but the odds are definitively different from what they were 30 years ago.

Um there is plenty of homegrown talent. Competition is stiffer partly bc thanks to the internet, people have heard of all the really good schools that wouldn’t have geographically been on their radar several decades ago. Can’t believe you’re yelling “IMMIGRANTS!” on a post about kids

I am an immigrant myself, I am not yelling "immigrants". The fact is that there is much more competition globally and that Harvard has more than a quarter of their college filled with international students. I was one of a handful of such students many years ago, now my own kids are facing at least 10 times as many.

And even if increasing competition were merely due to homegrown talent, the points remains that it's a different world today. You can't just phone it in to an upper middle class lifestyle.

Well look around most middle class and upper middle class people went to state schools and even 2nd tier state schools.

Your an immigrant, you haven't figured this out yet?

This is not about brand schools. Sure, you can be rich and successful coming from any school. But increasingly you won't be able to do so without being really ambitious and putting in the work. The kind of work that today's kids trying for top colleges are putting. The low effort jobs won't be enough to allow the children to live the kind of life their parents did.

I a lot of people here still seem to be live that the average person can have a really comfortable life, like they used to, because 30 years ago their cousin blah blah blah... I don't think this is going to be the case.

Well you are wrong.

but you can torture your child and they will have anxiety and depression from your insane parenting.

I’m the pp who said I had a middle child who puts in little to no effort. DH and I are HYP educated and were children of poor Asian immigrants. We have adapted the American mindset and culture. I genuinely just want my kids to be happy and healthy.

'Being happy' is hard to define. What do you mean?

lol at “what do you mean by ‘happy’?”

DCUM equates happiness with prestige and money. Hence the confusion here.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:As a parent of a child who is an extremely hard worker and a kid who is not, I do not think any amount of pushing will work. The kid has to want to do it.

I have seen kids in college fail without mommy. I would rather my kid fail now than as a college student.

why? how is it better to fail in HS?

Pp here. DH and I are type A high achievers. Our oldest child is just like us but better. Our middle child is naturally gifted and puts little effort like OP’s kids. He isn’t literally failing but he will get a B because he didn’t study or has missing assignments. I want him to figure this out by himself while he is in middle school.

And what if he doesn't? What if he just keeps underperforming?

I lose sleep because the kid stresses me out. Getting him to get to middle school on time is even a struggle. I accept the kid he is. I’m not going to be able to push or nag him into Harvard. I have accepted that he may go to Penn State or BU or Rutgers or some good weather school he gets into. He is very social and popular so I hope he will do ok.

You are a mess.. he might "have to go to Penn state or BU or Rutgers" ... OMG.

I am not a mess. My very smart and talented kid puts in little to no effort. My older child takes all AP classes with straight As with zero effort from the parents. It is hard to watch one kid try so hard and one kid do nothing.

What is his talent? And what’s wrong with accepting he’s a B student?

If my youngest gets all A/Bs when she’s in high school in her regular classes I will be thrilled. She’s on the chill track not the fast track. We saved enough for college and I’ll be thrilled if she finds something she loves to do.

Not every kid is an academic super star.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I was just talking to my sister about this this weekend. She was recalling a conversation she had with my dad in high school where she explained to him that she could put in low/medium effort and do pretty well (A-/B+) or put in extraordinary effort and really excel (A/A+) - but that the first choice seemed to make a lot more sense. To this, my father replied “honey, you’ve figured out the secret to life. I’m so proud.” Thirty years later “slacker” sister is doing just as well as our sibling who put in the extra effort, and arguably, is much happier.

Not going to lie, I’m still pretty inclined to push my kids but there really is a point of diminishing returns. If they’re on track to be healthy, contributing adults I wouldn’t sweat it too much.

The thing is, our children live in a different world. Your sister didn't have to compete with the pool of extremely driven, talented immigrants like our children do. You could pretty much coast to an upper middle class life. You can't count on this anymore. Maybe it will happen, maybe not - but the odds are definitively different from what they were 30 years ago.

Um there is plenty of homegrown talent. Competition is stiffer partly bc thanks to the internet, people have heard of all the really good schools that wouldn’t have geographically been on their radar several decades ago. Can’t believe you’re yelling “IMMIGRANTS!” on a post about kids

I am an immigrant myself, I am not yelling "immigrants". The fact is that there is much more competition globally and that Harvard has more than a quarter of their college filled with international students. I was one of a handful of such students many years ago, now my own kids are facing at least 10 times as many.

And even if increasing competition were merely due to homegrown talent, the points remains that it's a different world today. You can't just phone it in to an upper middle class lifestyle.

Well look around most middle class and upper middle class people went to state schools and even 2nd tier state schools.

Your an immigrant, you haven't figured this out yet?

This is not about brand schools. Sure, you can be rich and successful coming from any school. But increasingly you won't be able to do so without being really ambitious and putting in the work. The kind of work that today's kids trying for top colleges are putting. The low effort jobs won't be enough to allow the children to live the kind of life their parents did.

I a lot of people here still seem to be live that the average person can have a really comfortable life, like they used to, because 30 years ago their cousin blah blah blah... I don't think this is going to be the case.

Well you are wrong.

but you can torture your child and they will have anxiety and depression from your insane parenting.

Wouldn't that make you happy, huh? Wouldn't you love for the hard working kids to be miserable, you, the, non-competitive, easy going person full of kindness?

Dp This is prime example of distorted thinking. Why would pp or anyone want 'hard working kids' to be miserable? Why is the choice is only between 'hard working' and doing nothing? There are more examples of kids who are overworked and stressed due to parental pressure. But that does not mean anyone wishes ill will on these kids. We feel for them!

I remember reading a book that dealt with this topic and it was very interesting: https://www.amazon.com/Overachievers-Secret-Lives-Driven-Kids/dp/140130902X

A lot of people are envious and insecure of their own parenting choices. They are literally hoping that children who are pushed by their parents (as they see it - it might not even be true, as they don't really know much other kids are studying or what their parents are telling them) fail in school and careers, and/or hate their parents as adults. PP is literally hoping that my child (as they see them) will suffer from anxiety and depression because of my "insane parenting". It will validate their parenting philosophy and show that their child is the one ahead, after all.

These are the same people who preach laid back parenting based on kindness and understanding. In reality, they just want (what appear to be accomplished) kids to fail. "See, I told you, my B student is now a CEO while your valedictorian is taking medication."

Nobody hopes you kids have anxiety and depression people are literally trying to help you not push a kid so hard he has anxiety and depression. They are also explaining to you that your hard hitter and your laid back child will essentially end up with the same amount of money in the end.

You actually want to be able to parent in a way that is toxic for this specific child and your justification is that there are people in the world pushing you to be a better parent so their kid will beat your kid... do you know how insane that sounds.

My child is not in competition with your child in any way, shape or form.

You don't know my child, you have no clue how I am parenting them, and you have no clue how they are supposed to be parented. Yet here you are "helping me not have a depressed child". You just said that "I want to be able to parent in a way that is toxic for my specific child"

What do you know about me and my child? What kind of nasty idiot are you?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I was just talking to my sister about this this weekend. She was recalling a conversation she had with my dad in high school where she explained to him that she could put in low/medium effort and do pretty well (A-/B+) or put in extraordinary effort and really excel (A/A+) - but that the first choice seemed to make a lot more sense. To this, my father replied “honey, you’ve figured out the secret to life. I’m so proud.” Thirty years later “slacker” sister is doing just as well as our sibling who put in the extra effort, and arguably, is much happier.

Not going to lie, I’m still pretty inclined to push my kids but there really is a point of diminishing returns. If they’re on track to be healthy, contributing adults I wouldn’t sweat it too much.

The thing is, our children live in a different world. Your sister didn't have to compete with the pool of extremely driven, talented immigrants like our children do. You could pretty much coast to an upper middle class life. You can't count on this anymore. Maybe it will happen, maybe not - but the odds are definitively different from what they were 30 years ago.

Um there is plenty of homegrown talent. Competition is stiffer partly bc thanks to the internet, people have heard of all the really good schools that wouldn’t have geographically been on their radar several decades ago. Can’t believe you’re yelling “IMMIGRANTS!” on a post about kids

I am an immigrant myself, I am not yelling "immigrants". The fact is that there is much more competition globally and that Harvard has more than a quarter of their college filled with international students. I was one of a handful of such students many years ago, now my own kids are facing at least 10 times as many.

And even if increasing competition were merely due to homegrown talent, the points remains that it's a different world today. You can't just phone it in to an upper middle class lifestyle.

Well look around most middle class and upper middle class people went to state schools and even 2nd tier state schools.

Your an immigrant, you haven't figured this out yet?

This is not about brand schools. Sure, you can be rich and successful coming from any school. But increasingly you won't be able to do so without being really ambitious and putting in the work. The kind of work that today's kids trying for top colleges are putting. The low effort jobs won't be enough to allow the children to live the kind of life their parents did.

I a lot of people here still seem to be live that the average person can have a really comfortable life, like they used to, because 30 years ago their cousin blah blah blah... I don't think this is going to be the case.

Well you are wrong.

but you can torture your child and they will have anxiety and depression from your insane parenting.

Wouldn't that make you happy, huh? Wouldn't you love for the hard working kids to be miserable, you, the, non-competitive, easy going person full of kindness?

Dp This is prime example of distorted thinking. Why would pp or anyone want 'hard working kids' to be miserable? Why is the choice is only between 'hard working' and doing nothing? There are more examples of kids who are overworked and stressed due to parental pressure. But that does not mean anyone wishes ill will on these kids. We feel for them!

I remember reading a book that dealt with this topic and it was very interesting: https://www.amazon.com/Overachievers-Secret-Lives-Driven-Kids/dp/140130902X

A lot of people are envious and insecure of their own parenting choices. They are literally hoping that children who are pushed by their parents (as they see it - it might not even be true, as they don't really know much other kids are studying or what their parents are telling them) fail in school and careers, and/or hate their parents as adults. PP is literally hoping that my child (as they see them) will suffer from anxiety and depression because of my "insane parenting". It will validate their parenting philosophy and show that their child is the one ahead, after all.

These are the same people who preach laid back parenting based on kindness and understanding. In reality, they just want (what appear to be accomplished) kids to fail. "See, I told you, my B student is now a CEO while your valedictorian is taking medication."

You can say the same for 'hard working kids' parents to wish failure on those kids who aren't pushed by their parents to fail. See I told you have to push your kids! Billy is working at Wendy's because his parents didn't force him to get all As! So meanness goes BOTH ways!

Honestly, I've never seen this. But I've seen a lot of "nice" people wishing mental illness on academically accomplished teens.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I was just talking to my sister about this this weekend. She was recalling a conversation she had with my dad in high school where she explained to him that she could put in low/medium effort and do pretty well (A-/B+) or put in extraordinary effort and really excel (A/A+) - but that the first choice seemed to make a lot more sense. To this, my father replied “honey, you’ve figured out the secret to life. I’m so proud.” Thirty years later “slacker” sister is doing just as well as our sibling who put in the extra effort, and arguably, is much happier.

Not going to lie, I’m still pretty inclined to push my kids but there really is a point of diminishing returns. If they’re on track to be healthy, contributing adults I wouldn’t sweat it too much.

The thing is, our children live in a different world. Your sister didn't have to compete with the pool of extremely driven, talented immigrants like our children do. You could pretty much coast to an upper middle class life. You can't count on this anymore. Maybe it will happen, maybe not - but the odds are definitively different from what they were 30 years ago.

Um there is plenty of homegrown talent. Competition is stiffer partly bc thanks to the internet, people have heard of all the really good schools that wouldn’t have geographically been on their radar several decades ago. Can’t believe you’re yelling “IMMIGRANTS!” on a post about kids

I am an immigrant myself, I am not yelling "immigrants". The fact is that there is much more competition globally and that Harvard has more than a quarter of their college filled with international students. I was one of a handful of such students many years ago, now my own kids are facing at least 10 times as many.

And even if increasing competition were merely due to homegrown talent, the points remains that it's a different world today. You can't just phone it in to an upper middle class lifestyle.

Well look around most middle class and upper middle class people went to state schools and even 2nd tier state schools.

Your an immigrant, you haven't figured this out yet?

This is not about brand schools. Sure, you can be rich and successful coming from any school. But increasingly you won't be able to do so without being really ambitious and putting in the work. The kind of work that today's kids trying for top colleges are putting. The low effort jobs won't be enough to allow the children to live the kind of life their parents did.

I a lot of people here still seem to be live that the average person can have a really comfortable life, like they used to, because 30 years ago their cousin blah blah blah... I don't think this is going to be the case.

Well you are wrong.

but you can torture your child and they will have anxiety and depression from your insane parenting.

Wouldn't that make you happy, huh? Wouldn't you love for the hard working kids to be miserable, you, the, non-competitive, easy going person full of kindness?

Dp This is prime example of distorted thinking. Why would pp or anyone want 'hard working kids' to be miserable? Why is the choice is only between 'hard working' and doing nothing? There are more examples of kids who are overworked and stressed due to parental pressure. But that does not mean anyone wishes ill will on these kids. We feel for them!

I remember reading a book that dealt with this topic and it was very interesting: https://www.amazon.com/Overachievers-Secret-Lives-Driven-Kids/dp/140130902X

A lot of people are envious and insecure of their own parenting choices. They are literally hoping that children who are pushed by their parents (as they see it - it might not even be true, as they don't really know much other kids are studying or what their parents are telling them) fail in school and careers, and/or hate their parents as adults. PP is literally hoping that my child (as they see them) will suffer from anxiety and depression because of my "insane parenting". It will validate their parenting philosophy and show that their child is the one ahead, after all.

These are the same people who preach laid back parenting based on kindness and understanding. In reality, they just want (what appear to be accomplished) kids to fail. "See, I told you, my B student is now a CEO while your valedictorian is taking medication."

Nobody hopes you kids have anxiety and depression people are literally trying to help you not push a kid so hard he has anxiety and depression. They are also explaining to you that your hard hitter and your laid back child will essentially end up with the same amount of money in the end.

You actually want to be able to parent in a way that is toxic for this specific child and your justification is that there are people in the world pushing you to be a better parent so their kid will beat your kid... do you know how insane that sounds.

My child is not in competition with your child in any way, shape or form.

You don't know my child, you have no clue how I am parenting them, and you have no clue how they are supposed to be parented. Yet here you are "helping me not have a depressed child". You just said that "I want to be able to parent in a way that is toxic for my specific child"

What do you know about me and my child? What kind of nasty idiot are you?

Your responses are more and more unhinged every single time you post.

You really need a family therapist to help you with this. It’s way beyond something that can be explained on a form like this.

Good luck, you need it.