Law school financial aid

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Not OP. But I'm interested in the same question. I've gleaned some knowledge from the thread, but hoping you can answer a couple of specific questions.

Assuming a kid applies to law school, intends to be a lawyer of some sort, and is going to need to pay for it themselves.

1. I understand from this thread that law school is very expensive, there is really no financial aid, but there is potentially merit.
So.
2. Students rack up a huge amount of student loans across three years.

My question is this. What is the 'typical' process for being able to pay back the loans.

Specifically, I'd heard that internships between first and second year, and between second and third year can pay very well-- enough to cover a lot of the next year's tuition. Is that right?

Is the starting salary for a typical law firm high enough to pay back the loan in 5 or so years?

I think there is some loan forgiveness if going into govt or non-profit work. Does that bring down the total cost a ton?

TIA!

"Biglaw" is loosely defined as law firms with at least 500 attorneys when combining all office locations. Biglaw tends to pay market rate salaries. Biglaw market rate salaries are usually lockstep salaries for the first 8 years. First year biglaw attorneys in major US markets earn about $225,000 base salary and an end of year bonus of $20,000. Biglaw Summer associates (interns) are paid the same weekly salary as a first year associate.

Those fortunate enough to land a biglaw associate position after finishing law school can pay back their loans of $200,000 to $350,000 in 5 years as biglaw salaries rise in a lockstep manner during one's first 8 years at most biglaw firms.

2024 Biglaw lockstep pay for first 8 years:

Year 1) Base salary of $225,000 plus possible--not guaranteed--year end bonus of $20,000

Year 2) $235,000 plus $30,000

Year 3) $260,000 plus $57,500

Year 4) $310,000 plus $75,000

Year 5) $365,000 plus $90,000

Year 6) $390,000 plus $105,000

Year 7) $420,000 plus $115,000

Year 8) $435,000 plus $115,000.

Just a question. I heard attorneys are required to bring in business - clients - when they are hired. Is this true? Or are the firms bringing in the clients to be assigned to different attorneys?

Not a requirement and not an expectation of biglaw associates during their first five or six years or longer. Biglaw firms expect partners to bring in business and clients, but typically do not expect that of associates.

Small law firms need associates who are capable of both servicing current firm clients and of bringing in new business.

This is why I keep hearing on social media about this or that person leaving law to run his or her own business, bake bread, run delivery errand business, etc. After a few years when associates are expected to bringing in new business, It's a pressure cooker.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Not OP. But I'm interested in the same question. I've gleaned some knowledge from the thread, but hoping you can answer a couple of specific questions.

Assuming a kid applies to law school, intends to be a lawyer of some sort, and is going to need to pay for it themselves.

1. I understand from this thread that law school is very expensive, there is really no financial aid, but there is potentially merit.
So.
2. Students rack up a huge amount of student loans across three years.

My question is this. What is the 'typical' process for being able to pay back the loans.

Specifically, I'd heard that internships between first and second year, and between second and third year can pay very well-- enough to cover a lot of the next year's tuition. Is that right?

Is the starting salary for a typical law firm high enough to pay back the loan in 5 or so years?

I think there is some loan forgiveness if going into govt or non-profit work. Does that bring down the total cost a ton?

TIA!

"Biglaw" is loosely defined as law firms with at least 500 attorneys when combining all office locations. Biglaw tends to pay market rate salaries. Biglaw market rate salaries are usually lockstep salaries for the first 8 years. First year biglaw attorneys in major US markets earn about $225,000 base salary and an end of year bonus of $20,000. Biglaw Summer associates (interns) are paid the same weekly salary as a first year associate.

Those fortunate enough to land a biglaw associate position after finishing law school can pay back their loans of $200,000 to $350,000 in 5 years as biglaw salaries rise in a lockstep manner during one's first 8 years at most biglaw firms.

2024 Biglaw lockstep pay for first 8 years:

Year 1) Base salary of $225,000 plus possible--not guaranteed--year end bonus of $20,000

Year 2) $235,000 plus $30,000

Year 3) $260,000 plus $57,500

Year 4) $310,000 plus $75,000

Year 5) $365,000 plus $90,000

Year 6) $390,000 plus $105,000

Year 7) $420,000 plus $115,000

Year 8) $435,000 plus $115,000.

Just remember, that not all associates can make partner. Many leave early (say after 2-3 years) because the work is boring and the hours are brutal.

Others are told over the years that they are not on partner track and they are basically given time to find their next gig and then still technically leave voluntarily.

Even after year 8, some are forced out. At BigLaw there are revenue/relationship partners that know how to land business (there really isn’t much difference between hiring Kravath or Skadden for your IPO…so it boils down to relationships) and then execution partners. The relationship partners make multiples of the execution partners.

There are areas where an introvert can do well. A friend of mine’s mom was an ERISA partner…introverted woman but landed lots of business probably because her industry counterparts were similar.

My DH started with 25 associates and he was the only one to make partner (took 8 yrs non equity and then 2 more for equity) at Big Law. All the others were either pushed out or laid off.

This thread scares me as to people accumulating debt that they don’t fully understand. I also went to law school, paid for with some merit aid, a few scholarships and private Citibank loans all in my name. It took me 8 years to pay them all off. I had about $125,000 in loans by 2000. I don’t even want to think about what that would be today

I stayed in jobs I didn’t want and passed on ones I did so I could make enough money at Biglaw to pay off the loans, pay for my wedding and eventually by a house. These loans can be crippling, depressing and feel impossible to pay unless you absolutely understand every single minute details (such as interest accrues the day your loan is funded, possibly before even your first day of class). If your DD absolutely doesn’t want to be a lawyer or thinks it would be “fun” to join a cause or make a difference (I guess that means work at a nonprofit, ngo or the fed), how will they even make enough money to LIVE much less pay off their loans to a graduate school program they took for $hits and giggles?! I’m being serious. Super serious.

At least some of those other associates left because they had other options that they preferred. I don't believe they all wanted to make partner, as every associate class has several folks gunning for in house or govt jobs after they have some experience and have paid down their loans.

You must have had a spending problem to take 8 years to pay off your loans. That's a long time on a BigLaw salary. I killed mine in just a couple of years and had more than you did to start. It's important not to increase your spending post-law school until you've made major progress on your loans or you can end up with golden handcuffs or in a rough financial spot if there's layoff.

Thanks for the snark, did that make you feel better. It took me 8 years to pay off my loans because I also put myself through understate and business school (I have an MBA/JD so 4 years grad school). Some of us don’t have parent who paid for a cent for our education.

I am very proud of paying off everything by 2008, as well as buy a car, buy a house and IVF treatments without going into debt. There is zero you can say about yourself that makes me look bad. Kisses.

You should be. Still paying off husband's law school loans although at least we're getting near the end. And yes, I know that was bad planning and now we're living with it.

I don't understand why people on this board are so mean all the time. Mean and thin-skinned at the same time.

Like what's the point of lecturing a total stranger about choices that stranger made ten years ago when you know nothing about their life? To feel superior? And then there's the thin-skinned person chiming on that those other associates weren't really laid off... Sure. They're probably all chose to live on a farm with Old Yeller, Larlo. That's what happened. You're not allowed to tell the truth about biglaw attrition because you might hurt their feelings... but they feel free to give you a snide lecture about your spending.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Law school admissions is changing and this may affect the availability of merit based scholarship awards from law schools. Some law schools are considering abandoning the LSAT and standardized testing as an admissions requirements while other law schools now accept the GRE in lieu of the LSAT.

Many law schools are refusing to supply US News with requested information. If US News stops rating & ranking law schools, then many merit based law school scholarships will disappear as merit scholarships were offered primarily to raise a particular law school's median admissions standards ( undergraduate GPA & LSAT score) in an effort to raise that law school's US News ranking.

Currently the American Bar Association requires colleges to require standardized testing. So it's not really something that schools can consider abandoning.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:A law degree is a good credential to have. She can work in government if she wants.

This is OP! Thanks for the info regarding financial aid for prof schools. I understand it better now.

And I thought giving more information would keep the comments on topic lol.

I was trying to stress that we were just thinking about the finances of it. My personal thoughts now is that I would NOT want her to become an attorney. But we wouldn’t sway our 18-year-old either way at this point. Who knows!? She should learn a lot more about herself in the next few years to more solidify her decision on what she wants for her future.

Either way, DH works in finance where people with law degrees (attorneys and not) get paid substantially for a 9 to 5 job. They are more corporate lawyers and give input on
Contracts, compliance or regulatory issues. Again, we envision our snowflake doing more…. Actually Making laws and contributing more to societal changes, but who knows!?

If your husband works in finance and can pay out of pocket for college, why wouldn't you pay for graduate/law school?

Not OP. One school of thought: Many students end up in grad schools b/c they don’t know what they want to do and continuing school is easy choice. Then they burn out or just are miserable in school or worse, become the lawyer, doctor, consultant that they don’t want to be. If paying for school themselves, they are more invested in decision of do I really want this.

This is not what OP is saying. I don't get why parents who can afford it, wouldn't. We will pay for grad school and have no where near OP money but we'll find a way to make it work. Its very hard to get jobs without a masters.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Not OP. But I'm interested in the same question. I've gleaned some knowledge from the thread, but hoping you can answer a couple of specific questions.

Assuming a kid applies to law school, intends to be a lawyer of some sort, and is going to need to pay for it themselves.

1. I understand from this thread that law school is very expensive, there is really no financial aid, but there is potentially merit.
So.
2. Students rack up a huge amount of student loans across three years.

My question is this. What is the 'typical' process for being able to pay back the loans.

Specifically, I'd heard that internships between first and second year, and between second and third year can pay very well-- enough to cover a lot of the next year's tuition. Is that right?

Is the starting salary for a typical law firm high enough to pay back the loan in 5 or so years?

I think there is some loan forgiveness if going into govt or non-profit work. Does that bring down the total cost a ton?

TIA!

"Biglaw" is loosely defined as law firms with at least 500 attorneys when combining all office locations. Biglaw tends to pay market rate salaries. Biglaw market rate salaries are usually lockstep salaries for the first 8 years. First year biglaw attorneys in major US markets earn about $225,000 base salary and an end of year bonus of $20,000. Biglaw Summer associates (interns) are paid the same weekly salary as a first year associate.

Those fortunate enough to land a biglaw associate position after finishing law school can pay back their loans of $200,000 to $350,000 in 5 years as biglaw salaries rise in a lockstep manner during one's first 8 years at most biglaw firms.

2024 Biglaw lockstep pay for first 8 years:

Year 1) Base salary of $225,000 plus possible--not guaranteed--year end bonus of $20,000

Year 2) $235,000 plus $30,000

Year 3) $260,000 plus $57,500

Year 4) $310,000 plus $75,000

Year 5) $365,000 plus $90,000

Year 6) $390,000 plus $105,000

Year 7) $420,000 plus $115,000

Year 8) $435,000 plus $115,000.

Just remember, that not all associates can make partner. Many leave early (say after 2-3 years) because the work is boring and the hours are brutal.

Others are told over the years that they are not on partner track and they are basically given time to find their next gig and then still technically leave voluntarily.

Even after year 8, some are forced out. At BigLaw there are revenue/relationship partners that know how to land business (there really isn’t much difference between hiring Kravath or Skadden for your IPO…so it boils down to relationships) and then execution partners. The relationship partners make multiples of the execution partners.

There are areas where an introvert can do well. A friend of mine’s mom was an ERISA partner…introverted woman but landed lots of business probably because her industry counterparts were similar.

My DH started with 25 associates and he was the only one to make partner (took 8 yrs non equity and then 2 more for equity) at Big Law. All the others were either pushed out or laid off.

This thread scares me as to people accumulating debt that they don’t fully understand. I also went to law school, paid for with some merit aid, a few scholarships and private Citibank loans all in my name. It took me 8 years to pay them all off. I had about $125,000 in loans by 2000. I don’t even want to think about what that would be today

I stayed in jobs I didn’t want and passed on ones I did so I could make enough money at Biglaw to pay off the loans, pay for my wedding and eventually by a house. These loans can be crippling, depressing and feel impossible to pay unless you absolutely understand every single minute details (such as interest accrues the day your loan is funded, possibly before even your first day of class). If your DD absolutely doesn’t want to be a lawyer or thinks it would be “fun” to join a cause or make a difference (I guess that means work at a nonprofit, ngo or the fed), how will they even make enough money to LIVE much less pay off their loans to a graduate school program they took for $hits and giggles?! I’m being serious. Super serious.

At least some of those other associates left because they had other options that they preferred. I don't believe they all wanted to make partner, as every associate class has several folks gunning for in house or govt jobs after they have some experience and have paid down their loans.

You must have had a spending problem to take 8 years to pay off your loans. That's a long time on a BigLaw salary. I killed mine in just a couple of years and had more than you did to start. It's important not to increase your spending post-law school until you've made major progress on your loans or you can end up with golden handcuffs or in a rough financial spot if there's layoff.

Thanks for the snark, did that make you feel better. It took me 8 years to pay off my loans because I also put myself through understate and business school (I have an MBA/JD so 4 years grad school). Some of us don’t have parent who paid for a cent for our education.

I am very proud of paying off everything by 2008, as well as buy a car, buy a house and IVF treatments without going into debt. There is zero you can say about yourself that makes me look bad. Kisses.

Whoa, hostile much? It's just bad advice to give that anyone should plan 8 years to pay off loans while in BigLaw. I had lots of friends who decided on that plan while living it up, only to get burned with an early exit. I'd never advise anyone to take that long.

And I also had plenty of loans. If you want a pissing contest, I got a JD/PhD with no parental help. Feel better? I still advise law students not to plan on 8 years in BigLaw. That's a risky bet.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Not OP. But I'm interested in the same question. I've gleaned some knowledge from the thread, but hoping you can answer a couple of specific questions.

Assuming a kid applies to law school, intends to be a lawyer of some sort, and is going to need to pay for it themselves.

1. I understand from this thread that law school is very expensive, there is really no financial aid, but there is potentially merit.
So.
2. Students rack up a huge amount of student loans across three years.

My question is this. What is the 'typical' process for being able to pay back the loans.

Specifically, I'd heard that internships between first and second year, and between second and third year can pay very well-- enough to cover a lot of the next year's tuition. Is that right?

Is the starting salary for a typical law firm high enough to pay back the loan in 5 or so years?

I think there is some loan forgiveness if going into govt or non-profit work. Does that bring down the total cost a ton?

TIA!

"Biglaw" is loosely defined as law firms with at least 500 attorneys when combining all office locations. Biglaw tends to pay market rate salaries. Biglaw market rate salaries are usually lockstep salaries for the first 8 years. First year biglaw attorneys in major US markets earn about $225,000 base salary and an end of year bonus of $20,000. Biglaw Summer associates (interns) are paid the same weekly salary as a first year associate.

Those fortunate enough to land a biglaw associate position after finishing law school can pay back their loans of $200,000 to $350,000 in 5 years as biglaw salaries rise in a lockstep manner during one's first 8 years at most biglaw firms.

2024 Biglaw lockstep pay for first 8 years:

Year 1) Base salary of $225,000 plus possible--not guaranteed--year end bonus of $20,000

Year 2) $235,000 plus $30,000

Year 3) $260,000 plus $57,500

Year 4) $310,000 plus $75,000

Year 5) $365,000 plus $90,000

Year 6) $390,000 plus $105,000

Year 7) $420,000 plus $115,000

Year 8) $435,000 plus $115,000.

Just remember, that not all associates can make partner. Many leave early (say after 2-3 years) because the work is boring and the hours are brutal.

Others are told over the years that they are not on partner track and they are basically given time to find their next gig and then still technically leave voluntarily.

Even after year 8, some are forced out. At BigLaw there are revenue/relationship partners that know how to land business (there really isn’t much difference between hiring Kravath or Skadden for your IPO…so it boils down to relationships) and then execution partners. The relationship partners make multiples of the execution partners.

There are areas where an introvert can do well. A friend of mine’s mom was an ERISA partner…introverted woman but landed lots of business probably because her industry counterparts were similar.

My DH started with 25 associates and he was the only one to make partner (took 8 yrs non equity and then 2 more for equity) at Big Law. All the others were either pushed out or laid off.

This thread scares me as to people accumulating debt that they don’t fully understand. I also went to law school, paid for with some merit aid, a few scholarships and private Citibank loans all in my name. It took me 8 years to pay them all off. I had about $125,000 in loans by 2000. I don’t even want to think about what that would be today

I stayed in jobs I didn’t want and passed on ones I did so I could make enough money at Biglaw to pay off the loans, pay for my wedding and eventually by a house. These loans can be crippling, depressing and feel impossible to pay unless you absolutely understand every single minute details (such as interest accrues the day your loan is funded, possibly before even your first day of class). If your DD absolutely doesn’t want to be a lawyer or thinks it would be “fun” to join a cause or make a difference (I guess that means work at a nonprofit, ngo or the fed), how will they even make enough money to LIVE much less pay off their loans to a graduate school program they took for $hits and giggles?! I’m being serious. Super serious.

At least some of those other associates left because they had other options that they preferred. I don't believe they all wanted to make partner, as every associate class has several folks gunning for in house or govt jobs after they have some experience and have paid down their loans.

You must have had a spending problem to take 8 years to pay off your loans. That's a long time on a BigLaw salary. I killed mine in just a couple of years and had more than you did to start. It's important not to increase your spending post-law school until you've made major progress on your loans or you can end up with golden handcuffs or in a rough financial spot if there's layoff.

Thanks for the snark, did that make you feel better. It took me 8 years to pay off my loans because I also put myself through understate and business school (I have an MBA/JD so 4 years grad school). Some of us don’t have parent who paid for a cent for our education.

I am very proud of paying off everything by 2008, as well as buy a car, buy a house and IVF treatments without going into debt. There is zero you can say about yourself that makes me look bad. Kisses.

You should be. Still paying off husband's law school loans although at least we're getting near the end. And yes, I know that was bad planning and now we're living with it.

I don't understand why people on this board are so mean all the time. Mean and thin-skinned at the same time.

Like what's the point of lecturing a total stranger about choices that stranger made ten years ago when you know nothing about their life? To feel superior? And then there's the thin-skinned person chiming on that those other associates weren't really laid off... Sure. They're probably all chose to live on a farm with Old Yeller, Larlo. That's what happened. You're not allowed to tell the truth about biglaw attrition because you might hurt their feelings... but they feel free to give you a snide lecture about your spending.

Are you really posting to profess your knowledge of the legal industry based on your husband being a lawyer? There are lots of folks who start as associates in BigLaw with zero intention to make partner. They want to pivot to government or in house rolls. No layoffs involved. They don't want the lifestyle and there is other interesting work outside of BigLaw. New partners often try to convince themselves that they somehow won, when others weren't even in the race and didn't want the prize. Sure, partner comes with a big paycheck, but it also means limited time with your family and takes a big toll on your health.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:A law degree is a good credential to have. She can work in government if she wants.

This is OP! Thanks for the info regarding financial aid for prof schools. I understand it better now.

And I thought giving more information would keep the comments on topic lol.

I was trying to stress that we were just thinking about the finances of it. My personal thoughts now is that I would NOT want her to become an attorney. But we wouldn’t sway our 18-year-old either way at this point. Who knows!? She should learn a lot more about herself in the next few years to more solidify her decision on what she wants for her future.

Either way, DH works in finance where people with law degrees (attorneys and not) get paid substantially for a 9 to 5 job. They are more corporate lawyers and give input on
Contracts, compliance or regulatory issues. Again, we envision our snowflake doing more…. Actually Making laws and contributing more to societal changes, but who knows!?

If your husband works in finance and can pay out of pocket for college, why wouldn't you pay for graduate/law school?

Not OP. One school of thought: Many students end up in grad schools b/c they don’t know what they want to do and continuing school is easy choice. Then they burn out or just are miserable in school or worse, become the lawyer, doctor, consultant that they don’t want to be. If paying for school themselves, they are more invested in decision of do I really want this.

This is not what OP is saying. I don't get why parents who can afford it, wouldn't. We will pay for grad school and have no where near OP money but we'll find a way to make it work. Its very hard to get jobs without a masters.

It is not very hard to get jobs without masters. Who convinced you of this?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Not OP. But I'm interested in the same question. I've gleaned some knowledge from the thread, but hoping you can answer a couple of specific questions.

Assuming a kid applies to law school, intends to be a lawyer of some sort, and is going to need to pay for it themselves.

1. I understand from this thread that law school is very expensive, there is really no financial aid, but there is potentially merit.
So.
2. Students rack up a huge amount of student loans across three years.

My question is this. What is the 'typical' process for being able to pay back the loans.

Specifically, I'd heard that internships between first and second year, and between second and third year can pay very well-- enough to cover a lot of the next year's tuition. Is that right?

Is the starting salary for a typical law firm high enough to pay back the loan in 5 or so years?

I think there is some loan forgiveness if going into govt or non-profit work. Does that bring down the total cost a ton?

TIA!

"Biglaw" is loosely defined as law firms with at least 500 attorneys when combining all office locations. Biglaw tends to pay market rate salaries. Biglaw market rate salaries are usually lockstep salaries for the first 8 years. First year biglaw attorneys in major US markets earn about $225,000 base salary and an end of year bonus of $20,000. Biglaw Summer associates (interns) are paid the same weekly salary as a first year associate.

Those fortunate enough to land a biglaw associate position after finishing law school can pay back their loans of $200,000 to $350,000 in 5 years as biglaw salaries rise in a lockstep manner during one's first 8 years at most biglaw firms.

2024 Biglaw lockstep pay for first 8 years:

Year 1) Base salary of $225,000 plus possible--not guaranteed--year end bonus of $20,000

Year 2) $235,000 plus $30,000

Year 3) $260,000 plus $57,500

Year 4) $310,000 plus $75,000

Year 5) $365,000 plus $90,000

Year 6) $390,000 plus $105,000

Year 7) $420,000 plus $115,000

Year 8) $435,000 plus $115,000.

Just remember, that not all associates can make partner. Many leave early (say after 2-3 years) because the work is boring and the hours are brutal.

Others are told over the years that they are not on partner track and they are basically given time to find their next gig and then still technically leave voluntarily.

Even after year 8, some are forced out. At BigLaw there are revenue/relationship partners that know how to land business (there really isn’t much difference between hiring Kravath or Skadden for your IPO…so it boils down to relationships) and then execution partners. The relationship partners make multiples of the execution partners.

There are areas where an introvert can do well. A friend of mine’s mom was an ERISA partner…introverted woman but landed lots of business probably because her industry counterparts were similar.

My DH started with 25 associates and he was the only one to make partner (took 8 yrs non equity and then 2 more for equity) at Big Law. All the others were either pushed out or laid off.

This thread scares me as to people accumulating debt that they don’t fully understand. I also went to law school, paid for with some merit aid, a few scholarships and private Citibank loans all in my name. It took me 8 years to pay them all off. I had about $125,000 in loans by 2000. I don’t even want to think about what that would be today

I stayed in jobs I didn’t want and passed on ones I did so I could make enough money at Biglaw to pay off the loans, pay for my wedding and eventually by a house. These loans can be crippling, depressing and feel impossible to pay unless you absolutely understand every single minute details (such as interest accrues the day your loan is funded, possibly before even your first day of class). If your DD absolutely doesn’t want to be a lawyer or thinks it would be “fun” to join a cause or make a difference (I guess that means work at a nonprofit, ngo or the fed), how will they even make enough money to LIVE much less pay off their loans to a graduate school program they took for $hits and giggles?! I’m being serious. Super serious.

At least some of those other associates left because they had other options that they preferred. I don't believe they all wanted to make partner, as every associate class has several folks gunning for in house or govt jobs after they have some experience and have paid down their loans.

You must have had a spending problem to take 8 years to pay off your loans. That's a long time on a BigLaw salary. I killed mine in just a couple of years and had more than you did to start. It's important not to increase your spending post-law school until you've made major progress on your loans or you can end up with golden handcuffs or in a rough financial spot if there's layoff.

Thanks for the snark, did that make you feel better. It took me 8 years to pay off my loans because I also put myself through understate and business school (I have an MBA/JD so 4 years grad school). Some of us don’t have parent who paid for a cent for our education.

I am very proud of paying off everything by 2008, as well as buy a car, buy a house and IVF treatments without going into debt. There is zero you can say about yourself that makes me look bad. Kisses.

You should be. Still paying off husband's law school loans although at least we're getting near the end. And yes, I know that was bad planning and now we're living with it.

I don't understand why people on this board are so mean all the time. Mean and thin-skinned at the same time.

Like what's the point of lecturing a total stranger about choices that stranger made ten years ago when you know nothing about their life? To feel superior? And then there's the thin-skinned person chiming on that those other associates weren't really laid off... Sure. They're probably all chose to live on a farm with Old Yeller, Larlo. That's what happened. You're not allowed to tell the truth about biglaw attrition because you might hurt their feelings... but they feel free to give you a snide lecture about your spending.

Are you really posting to profess your knowledge of the legal industry based on your husband being a lawyer? There are lots of folks who start as associates in BigLaw with zero intention to make partner. They want to pivot to government or in house rolls. No layoffs involved. They don't want the lifestyle and there is other interesting work outside of BigLaw. New partners often try to convince themselves that they somehow won, when others weren't even in the race and didn't want the prize. Sure, partner comes with a big paycheck, but it also means limited time with your family and takes a big toll on your health.

But you didn't make partner. Otherwise, why would you be so bitter and judgmental?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Not OP. But I'm interested in the same question. I've gleaned some knowledge from the thread, but hoping you can answer a couple of specific questions.

Assuming a kid applies to law school, intends to be a lawyer of some sort, and is going to need to pay for it themselves.

1. I understand from this thread that law school is very expensive, there is really no financial aid, but there is potentially merit.
So.
2. Students rack up a huge amount of student loans across three years.

My question is this. What is the 'typical' process for being able to pay back the loans.

Specifically, I'd heard that internships between first and second year, and between second and third year can pay very well-- enough to cover a lot of the next year's tuition. Is that right?

Is the starting salary for a typical law firm high enough to pay back the loan in 5 or so years?

I think there is some loan forgiveness if going into govt or non-profit work. Does that bring down the total cost a ton?

TIA!

"Biglaw" is loosely defined as law firms with at least 500 attorneys when combining all office locations. Biglaw tends to pay market rate salaries. Biglaw market rate salaries are usually lockstep salaries for the first 8 years. First year biglaw attorneys in major US markets earn about $225,000 base salary and an end of year bonus of $20,000. Biglaw Summer associates (interns) are paid the same weekly salary as a first year associate.

Those fortunate enough to land a biglaw associate position after finishing law school can pay back their loans of $200,000 to $350,000 in 5 years as biglaw salaries rise in a lockstep manner during one's first 8 years at most biglaw firms.

2024 Biglaw lockstep pay for first 8 years:

Year 1) Base salary of $225,000 plus possible--not guaranteed--year end bonus of $20,000

Year 2) $235,000 plus $30,000

Year 3) $260,000 plus $57,500

Year 4) $310,000 plus $75,000

Year 5) $365,000 plus $90,000

Year 6) $390,000 plus $105,000

Year 7) $420,000 plus $115,000

Year 8) $435,000 plus $115,000.

Just remember, that not all associates can make partner. Many leave early (say after 2-3 years) because the work is boring and the hours are brutal.

Others are told over the years that they are not on partner track and they are basically given time to find their next gig and then still technically leave voluntarily.

Even after year 8, some are forced out. At BigLaw there are revenue/relationship partners that know how to land business (there really isn’t much difference between hiring Kravath or Skadden for your IPO…so it boils down to relationships) and then execution partners. The relationship partners make multiples of the execution partners.

There are areas where an introvert can do well. A friend of mine’s mom was an ERISA partner…introverted woman but landed lots of business probably because her industry counterparts were similar.

My DH started with 25 associates and he was the only one to make partner (took 8 yrs non equity and then 2 more for equity) at Big Law. All the others were either pushed out or laid off.

This thread scares me as to people accumulating debt that they don’t fully understand. I also went to law school, paid for with some merit aid, a few scholarships and private Citibank loans all in my name. It took me 8 years to pay them all off. I had about $125,000 in loans by 2000. I don’t even want to think about what that would be today

I stayed in jobs I didn’t want and passed on ones I did so I could make enough money at Biglaw to pay off the loans, pay for my wedding and eventually by a house. These loans can be crippling, depressing and feel impossible to pay unless you absolutely understand every single minute details (such as interest accrues the day your loan is funded, possibly before even your first day of class). If your DD absolutely doesn’t want to be a lawyer or thinks it would be “fun” to join a cause or make a difference (I guess that means work at a nonprofit, ngo or the fed), how will they even make enough money to LIVE much less pay off their loans to a graduate school program they took for $hits and giggles?! I’m being serious. Super serious.

At least some of those other associates left because they had other options that they preferred. I don't believe they all wanted to make partner, as every associate class has several folks gunning for in house or govt jobs after they have some experience and have paid down their loans.

You must have had a spending problem to take 8 years to pay off your loans. That's a long time on a BigLaw salary. I killed mine in just a couple of years and had more than you did to start. It's important not to increase your spending post-law school until you've made major progress on your loans or you can end up with golden handcuffs or in a rough financial spot if there's layoff.

Thanks for the snark, did that make you feel better. It took me 8 years to pay off my loans because I also put myself through understate and business school (I have an MBA/JD so 4 years grad school). Some of us don’t have parent who paid for a cent for our education.

I am very proud of paying off everything by 2008, as well as buy a car, buy a house and IVF treatments without going into debt. There is zero you can say about yourself that makes me look bad. Kisses.

You should be. Still paying off husband's law school loans although at least we're getting near the end. And yes, I know that was bad planning and now we're living with it.

I don't understand why people on this board are so mean all the time. Mean and thin-skinned at the same time.

Like what's the point of lecturing a total stranger about choices that stranger made ten years ago when you know nothing about their life? To feel superior? And then there's the thin-skinned person chiming on that those other associates weren't really laid off... Sure. They're probably all chose to live on a farm with Old Yeller, Larlo. That's what happened. You're not allowed to tell the truth about biglaw attrition because you might hurt their feelings... but they feel free to give you a snide lecture about your spending.

Are you really posting to profess your knowledge of the legal industry based on your husband being a lawyer? There are lots of folks who start as associates in BigLaw with zero intention to make partner. They want to pivot to government or in house rolls. No layoffs involved. They don't want the lifestyle and there is other interesting work outside of BigLaw. New partners often try to convince themselves that they somehow won, when others weren't even in the race and didn't want the prize. Sure, partner comes with a big paycheck, but it also means limited time with your family and takes a big toll on your health.

But you didn't make partner. Otherwise, why would you be so bitter and judgmental?

Correcting an incorrect assumption that every associate wants to make partner is bitter and judgemental?

You want an example? One of my good friends left BigLaw to go to the solicitor's office, then spent some time advising the judiciary committee, and is now on the federal bench. There are lots of paths other than partner.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Not OP. But I'm interested in the same question. I've gleaned some knowledge from the thread, but hoping you can answer a couple of specific questions.

Assuming a kid applies to law school, intends to be a lawyer of some sort, and is going to need to pay for it themselves.

1. I understand from this thread that law school is very expensive, there is really no financial aid, but there is potentially merit.
So.
2. Students rack up a huge amount of student loans across three years.

My question is this. What is the 'typical' process for being able to pay back the loans.

Specifically, I'd heard that internships between first and second year, and between second and third year can pay very well-- enough to cover a lot of the next year's tuition. Is that right?

Is the starting salary for a typical law firm high enough to pay back the loan in 5 or so years?

I think there is some loan forgiveness if going into govt or non-profit work. Does that bring down the total cost a ton?

TIA!

"Biglaw" is loosely defined as law firms with at least 500 attorneys when combining all office locations. Biglaw tends to pay market rate salaries. Biglaw market rate salaries are usually lockstep salaries for the first 8 years. First year biglaw attorneys in major US markets earn about $225,000 base salary and an end of year bonus of $20,000. Biglaw Summer associates (interns) are paid the same weekly salary as a first year associate.

Those fortunate enough to land a biglaw associate position after finishing law school can pay back their loans of $200,000 to $350,000 in 5 years as biglaw salaries rise in a lockstep manner during one's first 8 years at most biglaw firms.

2024 Biglaw lockstep pay for first 8 years:

Year 1) Base salary of $225,000 plus possible--not guaranteed--year end bonus of $20,000

Year 2) $235,000 plus $30,000

Year 3) $260,000 plus $57,500

Year 4) $310,000 plus $75,000

Year 5) $365,000 plus $90,000

Year 6) $390,000 plus $105,000

Year 7) $420,000 plus $115,000

Year 8) $435,000 plus $115,000.

Just remember, that not all associates can make partner. Many leave early (say after 2-3 years) because the work is boring and the hours are brutal.

Others are told over the years that they are not on partner track and they are basically given time to find their next gig and then still technically leave voluntarily.

Even after year 8, some are forced out. At BigLaw there are revenue/relationship partners that know how to land business (there really isn’t much difference between hiring Kravath or Skadden for your IPO…so it boils down to relationships) and then execution partners. The relationship partners make multiples of the execution partners.

There are areas where an introvert can do well. A friend of mine’s mom was an ERISA partner…introverted woman but landed lots of business probably because her industry counterparts were similar.

My DH started with 25 associates and he was the only one to make partner (took 8 yrs non equity and then 2 more for equity) at Big Law. All the others were either pushed out or laid off.

This thread scares me as to people accumulating debt that they don’t fully understand. I also went to law school, paid for with some merit aid, a few scholarships and private Citibank loans all in my name. It took me 8 years to pay them all off. I had about $125,000 in loans by 2000. I don’t even want to think about what that would be today

I stayed in jobs I didn’t want and passed on ones I did so I could make enough money at Biglaw to pay off the loans, pay for my wedding and eventually by a house. These loans can be crippling, depressing and feel impossible to pay unless you absolutely understand every single minute details (such as interest accrues the day your loan is funded, possibly before even your first day of class). If your DD absolutely doesn’t want to be a lawyer or thinks it would be “fun” to join a cause or make a difference (I guess that means work at a nonprofit, ngo or the fed), how will they even make enough money to LIVE much less pay off their loans to a graduate school program they took for $hits and giggles?! I’m being serious. Super serious.

At least some of those other associates left because they had other options that they preferred. I don't believe they all wanted to make partner, as every associate class has several folks gunning for in house or govt jobs after they have some experience and have paid down their loans.

You must have had a spending problem to take 8 years to pay off your loans. That's a long time on a BigLaw salary. I killed mine in just a couple of years and had more than you did to start. It's important not to increase your spending post-law school until you've made major progress on your loans or you can end up with golden handcuffs or in a rough financial spot if there's layoff.

Thanks for the snark, did that make you feel better. It took me 8 years to pay off my loans because I also put myself through understate and business school (I have an MBA/JD so 4 years grad school). Some of us don’t have parent who paid for a cent for our education.

I am very proud of paying off everything by 2008, as well as buy a car, buy a house and IVF treatments without going into debt. There is zero you can say about yourself that makes me look bad. Kisses.

You should be. Still paying off husband's law school loans although at least we're getting near the end. And yes, I know that was bad planning and now we're living with it.

I don't understand why people on this board are so mean all the time. Mean and thin-skinned at the same time.

Like what's the point of lecturing a total stranger about choices that stranger made ten years ago when you know nothing about their life? To feel superior? And then there's the thin-skinned person chiming on that those other associates weren't really laid off... Sure. They're probably all chose to live on a farm with Old Yeller, Larlo. That's what happened. You're not allowed to tell the truth about biglaw attrition because you might hurt their feelings... but they feel free to give you a snide lecture about your spending.

Are you really posting to profess your knowledge of the legal industry based on your husband being a lawyer? There are lots of folks who start as associates in BigLaw with zero intention to make partner. They want to pivot to government or in house rolls. No layoffs involved. They don't want the lifestyle and there is other interesting work outside of BigLaw. New partners often try to convince themselves that they somehow won, when others weren't even in the race and didn't want the prize. Sure, partner comes with a big paycheck, but it also means limited time with your family and takes a big toll on your health.

But you didn't make partner. Otherwise, why would you be so bitter and judgmental?

Correcting an incorrect assumption that every associate wants to make partner is bitter and judgemental?

You want an example? One of my good friends left BigLaw to go to the solicitor's office, then spent some time advising the judiciary committee, and is now on the federal bench. There are lots of paths other than partner.

But not you. You just raise your kids and lurk on message boards to tell other people they make bad financial choices.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Not OP. But I'm interested in the same question. I've gleaned some knowledge from the thread, but hoping you can answer a couple of specific questions.

Assuming a kid applies to law school, intends to be a lawyer of some sort, and is going to need to pay for it themselves.

1. I understand from this thread that law school is very expensive, there is really no financial aid, but there is potentially merit.
So.
2. Students rack up a huge amount of student loans across three years.

My question is this. What is the 'typical' process for being able to pay back the loans.

Specifically, I'd heard that internships between first and second year, and between second and third year can pay very well-- enough to cover a lot of the next year's tuition. Is that right?

Is the starting salary for a typical law firm high enough to pay back the loan in 5 or so years?

I think there is some loan forgiveness if going into govt or non-profit work. Does that bring down the total cost a ton?

TIA!

"Biglaw" is loosely defined as law firms with at least 500 attorneys when combining all office locations. Biglaw tends to pay market rate salaries. Biglaw market rate salaries are usually lockstep salaries for the first 8 years. First year biglaw attorneys in major US markets earn about $225,000 base salary and an end of year bonus of $20,000. Biglaw Summer associates (interns) are paid the same weekly salary as a first year associate.

Those fortunate enough to land a biglaw associate position after finishing law school can pay back their loans of $200,000 to $350,000 in 5 years as biglaw salaries rise in a lockstep manner during one's first 8 years at most biglaw firms.

2024 Biglaw lockstep pay for first 8 years:

Year 1) Base salary of $225,000 plus possible--not guaranteed--year end bonus of $20,000

Year 2) $235,000 plus $30,000

Year 3) $260,000 plus $57,500

Year 4) $310,000 plus $75,000

Year 5) $365,000 plus $90,000

Year 6) $390,000 plus $105,000

Year 7) $420,000 plus $115,000

Year 8) $435,000 plus $115,000.

Just remember, that not all associates can make partner. Many leave early (say after 2-3 years) because the work is boring and the hours are brutal.

Others are told over the years that they are not on partner track and they are basically given time to find their next gig and then still technically leave voluntarily.

Even after year 8, some are forced out. At BigLaw there are revenue/relationship partners that know how to land business (there really isn’t much difference between hiring Kravath or Skadden for your IPO…so it boils down to relationships) and then execution partners. The relationship partners make multiples of the execution partners.

There are areas where an introvert can do well. A friend of mine’s mom was an ERISA partner…introverted woman but landed lots of business probably because her industry counterparts were similar.

My DH started with 25 associates and he was the only one to make partner (took 8 yrs non equity and then 2 more for equity) at Big Law. All the others were either pushed out or laid off.

This thread scares me as to people accumulating debt that they don’t fully understand. I also went to law school, paid for with some merit aid, a few scholarships and private Citibank loans all in my name. It took me 8 years to pay them all off. I had about $125,000 in loans by 2000. I don’t even want to think about what that would be today

I stayed in jobs I didn’t want and passed on ones I did so I could make enough money at Biglaw to pay off the loans, pay for my wedding and eventually by a house. These loans can be crippling, depressing and feel impossible to pay unless you absolutely understand every single minute details (such as interest accrues the day your loan is funded, possibly before even your first day of class). If your DD absolutely doesn’t want to be a lawyer or thinks it would be “fun” to join a cause or make a difference (I guess that means work at a nonprofit, ngo or the fed), how will they even make enough money to LIVE much less pay off their loans to a graduate school program they took for $hits and giggles?! I’m being serious. Super serious.

At least some of those other associates left because they had other options that they preferred. I don't believe they all wanted to make partner, as every associate class has several folks gunning for in house or govt jobs after they have some experience and have paid down their loans.

You must have had a spending problem to take 8 years to pay off your loans. That's a long time on a BigLaw salary. I killed mine in just a couple of years and had more than you did to start. It's important not to increase your spending post-law school until you've made major progress on your loans or you can end up with golden handcuffs or in a rough financial spot if there's layoff.

Thanks for the snark, did that make you feel better. It took me 8 years to pay off my loans because I also put myself through understate and business school (I have an MBA/JD so 4 years grad school). Some of us don’t have parent who paid for a cent for our education.

I am very proud of paying off everything by 2008, as well as buy a car, buy a house and IVF treatments without going into debt. There is zero you can say about yourself that makes me look bad. Kisses.

You should be. Still paying off husband's law school loans although at least we're getting near the end. And yes, I know that was bad planning and now we're living with it.

I don't understand why people on this board are so mean all the time. Mean and thin-skinned at the same time.

Like what's the point of lecturing a total stranger about choices that stranger made ten years ago when you know nothing about their life? To feel superior? And then there's the thin-skinned person chiming on that those other associates weren't really laid off... Sure. They're probably all chose to live on a farm with Old Yeller, Larlo. That's what happened. You're not allowed to tell the truth about biglaw attrition because you might hurt their feelings... but they feel free to give you a snide lecture about your spending.

Are you really posting to profess your knowledge of the legal industry based on your husband being a lawyer? There are lots of folks who start as associates in BigLaw with zero intention to make partner. They want to pivot to government or in house rolls. No layoffs involved. They don't want the lifestyle and there is other interesting work outside of BigLaw. New partners often try to convince themselves that they somehow won, when others weren't even in the race and didn't want the prize. Sure, partner comes with a big paycheck, but it also means limited time with your family and takes a big toll on your health.

But you didn't make partner. Otherwise, why would you be so bitter and judgmental?

Correcting an incorrect assumption that every associate wants to make partner is bitter and judgemental?

You want an example? One of my good friends left BigLaw to go to the solicitor's office, then spent some time advising the judiciary committee, and is now on the federal bench. There are lots of paths other than partner.

But not you. You just raise your kids and lurk on message boards to tell other people they make bad financial choices.

Nah, I have an awesome in house job. It's just harder to explain why it's awesome while staying anonymous.

[Anonymous]

I know plenty of lawyers who left biglaw, btw. Despite not being a lawyer. Some work for the DoJ, it's quite common. Some did clerkships and then got Federal jobs. Also common. Some might also say, that's the easy way out. I believe I expressed envy myself for your generous benefit packages and pensions.

There are plenty of more "small law" jobs that are also fairly chill, plenty of people who question whether biglaw was ever worth it at all.

I would say no.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Not OP. But I'm interested in the same question. I've gleaned some knowledge from the thread, but hoping you can answer a couple of specific questions.

Assuming a kid applies to law school, intends to be a lawyer of some sort, and is going to need to pay for it themselves.

1. I understand from this thread that law school is very expensive, there is really no financial aid, but there is potentially merit.
So.
2. Students rack up a huge amount of student loans across three years.

My question is this. What is the 'typical' process for being able to pay back the loans.

Specifically, I'd heard that internships between first and second year, and between second and third year can pay very well-- enough to cover a lot of the next year's tuition. Is that right?

Is the starting salary for a typical law firm high enough to pay back the loan in 5 or so years?

I think there is some loan forgiveness if going into govt or non-profit work. Does that bring down the total cost a ton?

TIA!

"Biglaw" is loosely defined as law firms with at least 500 attorneys when combining all office locations. Biglaw tends to pay market rate salaries. Biglaw market rate salaries are usually lockstep salaries for the first 8 years. First year biglaw attorneys in major US markets earn about $225,000 base salary and an end of year bonus of $20,000. Biglaw Summer associates (interns) are paid the same weekly salary as a first year associate.

Those fortunate enough to land a biglaw associate position after finishing law school can pay back their loans of $200,000 to $350,000 in 5 years as biglaw salaries rise in a lockstep manner during one's first 8 years at most biglaw firms.

2024 Biglaw lockstep pay for first 8 years:

Year 1) Base salary of $225,000 plus possible--not guaranteed--year end bonus of $20,000

Year 2) $235,000 plus $30,000

Year 3) $260,000 plus $57,500

Year 4) $310,000 plus $75,000

Year 5) $365,000 plus $90,000

Year 6) $390,000 plus $105,000

Year 7) $420,000 plus $115,000

Year 8) $435,000 plus $115,000.

Just remember, that not all associates can make partner. Many leave early (say after 2-3 years) because the work is boring and the hours are brutal.

Others are told over the years that they are not on partner track and they are basically given time to find their next gig and then still technically leave voluntarily.

Even after year 8, some are forced out. At BigLaw there are revenue/relationship partners that know how to land business (there really isn’t much difference between hiring Kravath or Skadden for your IPO…so it boils down to relationships) and then execution partners. The relationship partners make multiples of the execution partners.

There are areas where an introvert can do well. A friend of mine’s mom was an ERISA partner…introverted woman but landed lots of business probably because her industry counterparts were similar.

My DH started with 25 associates and he was the only one to make partner (took 8 yrs non equity and then 2 more for equity) at Big Law. All the others were either pushed out or laid off.

This thread scares me as to people accumulating debt that they don’t fully understand. I also went to law school, paid for with some merit aid, a few scholarships and private Citibank loans all in my name. It took me 8 years to pay them all off. I had about $125,000 in loans by 2000. I don’t even want to think about what that would be today

I stayed in jobs I didn’t want and passed on ones I did so I could make enough money at Biglaw to pay off the loans, pay for my wedding and eventually by a house. These loans can be crippling, depressing and feel impossible to pay unless you absolutely understand every single minute details (such as interest accrues the day your loan is funded, possibly before even your first day of class). If your DD absolutely doesn’t want to be a lawyer or thinks it would be “fun” to join a cause or make a difference (I guess that means work at a nonprofit, ngo or the fed), how will they even make enough money to LIVE much less pay off their loans to a graduate school program they took for $hits and giggles?! I’m being serious. Super serious.

At least some of those other associates left because they had other options that they preferred. I don't believe they all wanted to make partner, as every associate class has several folks gunning for in house or govt jobs after they have some experience and have paid down their loans.

You must have had a spending problem to take 8 years to pay off your loans. That's a long time on a BigLaw salary. I killed mine in just a couple of years and had more than you did to start. It's important not to increase your spending post-law school until you've made major progress on your loans or you can end up with golden handcuffs or in a rough financial spot if there's layoff.

Thanks for the snark, did that make you feel better. It took me 8 years to pay off my loans because I also put myself through understate and business school (I have an MBA/JD so 4 years grad school). Some of us don’t have parent who paid for a cent for our education.

I am very proud of paying off everything by 2008, as well as buy a car, buy a house and IVF treatments without going into debt. There is zero you can say about yourself that makes me look bad. Kisses.

You should be. Still paying off husband's law school loans although at least we're getting near the end. And yes, I know that was bad planning and now we're living with it.

I don't understand why people on this board are so mean all the time. Mean and thin-skinned at the same time.

Like what's the point of lecturing a total stranger about choices that stranger made ten years ago when you know nothing about their life? To feel superior? And then there's the thin-skinned person chiming on that those other associates weren't really laid off... Sure. They're probably all chose to live on a farm with Old Yeller, Larlo. That's what happened. You're not allowed to tell the truth about biglaw attrition because you might hurt their feelings... but they feel free to give you a snide lecture about your spending.

Are you really posting to profess your knowledge of the legal industry based on your husband being a lawyer? There are lots of folks who start as associates in BigLaw with zero intention to make partner. They want to pivot to government or in house rolls. No layoffs involved. They don't want the lifestyle and there is other interesting work outside of BigLaw. New partners often try to convince themselves that they somehow won, when others weren't even in the race and didn't want the prize. Sure, partner comes with a big paycheck, but it also means limited time with your family and takes a big toll on your health.

But you didn't make partner. Otherwise, why would you be so bitter and judgmental?

Correcting an incorrect assumption that every associate wants to make partner is bitter and judgemental?

You want an example? One of my good friends left BigLaw to go to the solicitor's office, then spent some time advising the judiciary committee, and is now on the federal bench. There are lots of paths other than partner.

But not you. You just raise your kids and lurk on message boards to tell other people they make bad financial choices.

Nah, I have an awesome in house job. It's just harder to explain why it's awesome while staying anonymous.

Well, that does explain all your free time.

[Anonymous]

And, like I said, you didn't make partner.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:And, like I said, you didn't make partner.

Nope, thank goodness. I love seeing my kids and husband. I'm much happier as the client.