Want to ask my brother how he protects my nieces from creepy stepdad

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I am so sorry this happened to you.

Is your stepfather your brother’s father?

Were you very clear on what your stepfather did to you and for how long it went on or were you vague?

If you were clear and left no misunderstandings, your brother and his wife either:

1) don’t believe you or
2) believe you and don’t care.

So I think you should stop worrying about how this will affect your relationship with them. They are vile.

The only way you will protect your nieces is to file a police report. Even that may not work, but at least you will have a clear conscious that you tried.

Op here. Stepdad is not my brothers father. Stepdad has no biological kids.

I think my brother and SIL believe me but they aren’t willing to disrupt the family relationships based on the information I gave them because that would be more work/discomfort for them.

To be clear-I actually believe my brother and SIL probably watch their kids like hawks around my mom and stepdad. I just think it would help me to hear the steps they are taking because the thought of my stepdad having access to children just makes me sick. I think if they told me the steps that they take, it would help me feel better.

I did learn today that my SIL’s parents went with my brother, SIL, and nieces for the visit to my mom and stepdad (SIL parents and my parents are friends). I don’t know if that was for purely social reasons or if it was part of a larger plan to have more eyes on my nieces.

I would talk to the other grandparents.

Before she talks to her brother?! OP, please don't do this. Don't feel that you need to disclose this trauma to your SIL's parents. You already got a lot of great language to use when approaching your brother about it, so please consider just doing that.

It's not really clear to me what "steps" you are hoping to hear about. They didn't leave their kids alone with your mother and stepfather, it sounds like. It also sounds like there was additional adult supervision in the form of the other grandparents. What if those are the only answers they have for you about what "steps" they are taking to protect their kids? Would it still be helpful just to know that it's something they're considering?

this is about protecting the kids and OP assuaging her own conscience. Not about OP protecting herself. talking to the grandparents would absolutely be a reasonable step. these kids should never be around that man, period.

SIL's parents are friends with M & SF. No one is going to change their behavior based on what OP says. And they were there to socialize, not to watch over the kids.

The family dynamic becomes almost like a cult of enabling and can even draw in outsiders, as above. Everyone is groomed to ignore instincts or to normalize bizarre and open sexual behavior that is inappropriate. This may put any kids at risk from others too, the patterns continue and predators know how to spot them.

OP I'd put at least some of your energy into lining up support for helping you process that your brother, SIL and her parents are much like your mother. A shocking number of people are. I'm so sorry. Your nieces may be harmed by SF or by someone else, I hope not, but it's not something you can control and your words have less power than the social group dynamics.

[Anonymous]

What if the answer to your question re: steps is "none?"

I think getting support to cope with that answer is going to do more than trying to change his behavior, esp given the involvement of his ILs, etc. It's not likely to change, as you acknowledge. So that anxiety that you are hoping he will sooth with words needs to be managed by you, and you know what his actions have been, to visit, stay there with kids and avoid talking to you about it.

I truly hope those children stay safe from predators, including SF. Being around SF and his behavior is grooming of everyone there, normalizing breaking of boundaries and norms. Learning that all the other adults act like it's ok. Learning not to say anything. SIL's parents are part of that group, choose to participate in the socializing.

If you do have contact with the kids at least you can impart a different message but I'm not sure you will be able to manage your anxiety around them. I'm so very sorry. You are far from alone. Unfortunately.

[Anonymous]

I don’t know if that was for purely social reasons or if it was part of a larger plan to have more eyes on my nieces.

OP, you know the answer to that. They are all friendly.

Please get some support for yourself, this all has to be hugely triggering to your PTSD. But you need to be realistic about all of these people. They normalize SF just like your mom did. B & SIL and her parents are not some eagle eyed vigilantes nor are other SIL who are groped but go there again all that different from anyone else who denies and minimizes abuse.

It may be worthwhile to consider very limited contact with those in that social group.

[Anonymous]

^ I think you know the answer to that, OP. They are all much like your mother, including B, SIL, SIL's parents and other SIL and Bs who collude and enable SF and perhaps other mal actors. It might be time to consider very limited contact with anyone in that social group. The cohesion of the group matters more to them than the safety of an individual.

I'm so sorry.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Does brother think the skeevy SF is acting normally because he was raised in a horrible home full of active molestation? My guess is his radar is way off and he may not fully grasp how families are supposed to interact, what secrets are normal, what are appropriate boundaries at all. All the posters here assume that brother is a rational person who will logically make good parenting choices, but he came out of an abusive and toxic home too

Exactly this. And something is up with SIL and her family, not that surprisingly. Her parents CHOOSE to socialize with M & SF and watch him grope their daughter.

[Anonymous]

And mom likely had something happen to her or in her family that warped her perceptions, incest often is a multigenerational pattern in families. OP may not be the only one that SF assaulted as a child and he continues to assault and push boundaries to this day.

OP's B shows no actions consistent with breaking the family patterns, staying there with kids, etc. SIL's OWN parents are FRIENDS with SF and enabling mom.

I too, wish it was different, OP. Unfortunately you can only control yourself.

B and SIL's parents do not want to change their behavior or call out SF. So your words won't change that. And they may not keep kids or SILs. safe from him. Do what you need to do to live with that ugly truth. You may want to go low or no contact with the entire unhealthy group. It is almost impossible not to become frantic with the need to try to change the dynamic. But you don't hold the power cards in the group. It's like an enmeshed cult.

[Anonymous]

https://link.springer.com/chapter/10.1007/978-3-031-07222-2_7

SF has groomed the whole family, including ILs. Being in that environment with moms being groped and no one saying anything puts the kids at higher risk not only from SF but from any predator.

I had a coworker who married into a family where the groping of DILs took place, etc., as you describe, OP, there had also been csa in her H's family. She ended up divorced before having any kids. She told a story about the FIL getting handsy with DILs at Easter dinner, at the table, kids and elderly all present, including coworker's parents, who were angry and upset the first time. Less the second. It all desensitizes.

OP is the healthiest one.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:https://link.springer.com/chapter/10.1007/978-3-031-07222-2_7

SF has groomed the whole family, including ILs. Being in that environment with moms being groped and no one saying anything puts the kids at higher risk not only from SF but from any predator.

I had a coworker who married into a family where the groping of DILs took place, etc., as you describe, OP, there had also been csa in her H's family. She ended up divorced before having any kids. She told a story about the FIL getting handsy with DILs at Easter dinner, at the table, kids and elderly all present, including coworker's parents, who were angry and upset the first time. Less the second. It all desensitizes.

OP is the healthiest one.

That's not grooming. That's molesting. Grooming is the friendly overtures to facilitate access.

[Anonymous]

OP, is your family a member of any organized religion? I'm just getting a religious fundamentalist vibe from the descriptions of your family, in laws and the situation.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:How old are the kids? Talk to them about bodily privacy.

Tell the 9 year old that stepdad likes to touch girls’ private parts and that if he ever does that she should tell her parents or you.

In front of the parents.

You do want to stop this, right?

[Anonymous]

I find it fascinating that a society that freaks (justifiably!) about teacher/clergy/coach abuse just casually deals with family abuse. No outcry of punishment or protections. Such a double standard.

[Anonymous]

This is what CPS is for - to protect kids when the adults in their life aren’t doing it.

I would contact CPS immediately and I would also file a police report about both grandparents (I’m sure that facilitating molestation and making opportunities has to be a crime too). Probably too long ago for a criminal case but it might help CPS to keep those kids safe.

Your brother is NOT taking steps to keep his daughters safe since he still lives in that house. Period.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:How old are the kids? Talk to them about bodily privacy.

Tell the 9 year old that stepdad likes to touch girls’ private parts and that if he ever does that she should tell her parents or you.

In front of the parents.

You do want to stop this, right?

I would do this too. Not just the eldest though. I’d also tell the girls that he did it to me when I was their age.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:My stepdad sexually abused me from age 12 to age 17. My brother maintains a relationship with my mother and stepdad. My brother has 3 daughters.

Two years ago, I shared with my brother the details of the sexual abuse committed by my stepdad so he could protect his children.

I recently learned that two weeks ago, my brother and his wife took their kids to visit my parents and spent the weekend there, spending the night in my parent’s house.

I want to ask them what measures they take to keep their kids safe, but I am afraid that even raising the question might alienate them. Is there a way to ask this question without starting a huge kerfuffle?

Why haven't you reported your stepdad,? You know perfectly well that he's molesting another child. Did your mother know and do nothing?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:How old are the kids? Talk to them about bodily privacy.

Tell the 9 year old that stepdad likes to touch girls’ private parts and that if he ever does that she should tell her parents or you.

In front of the parents.

You do want to stop this, right?

I would do this too. Not just the eldest though. I’d also tell the girls that he did it to me when I was their age.

+1 I think you have to sound the alarm, which is what your heart is telling you, isn’t it? Because you know your nieces are at higher than high risk. Of course you will get attacked being the messenger, but at least you would have done your utmost to warn the girls.

You might want to seek guidance before you do, like contacting RAINN or some other hotline, to see what recourse the nieces might have if worst comes to worst.

I agree with PPs that your B does not have good judgment probably from being raised in this toxic environment.